Jim Hardy - The Plane Truth for Golfers

[robwai]

Has anyone read Jim Hardy - The Plane Truth for Golfers? What did you think, any useful stuff in it?

 

Rob

[taylormadefan]

Has anyone read Jim Hardy - The Plane Truth for Golfers? What did you think, any useful stuff in it?

 

Rob

 

Read the book? Forwards and backwards. I haven't seen the DVD yet, although I'm saving for it right now.

 

My only two swing coaches are Hardy associates, and I've spent the last year transitioning fully to the Hardy one plane swing.

 

I can tell you the fact that what I THOUGHT was the Hardy one plane swing, and what I've found to actually be the Hardy one plane swing are two very different things.

 

There's no way I could have gotten to the one plane swing based on the book alone (although it is a VERY valuable reference and I frequently find myself going back and re-reading certain sections). You really need proper instruction to get there (at least I did).

 

Any more questions, feel free to drop me a PM.

[Asleep]

Read the book? Forwards and backwards. I haven't seen the DVD yet, although I'm saving for it right now.

 

My only two swing coaches are Hardy associates, and I've spent the last year transitioning fully to the Hardy one plane swing.

 

I can tell you the fact that what I THOUGHT was the Hardy one plane swing, and what I've found to actually be the Hardy one plane swing are two very different things.

 

There's no way I could have gotten to the one plane swing based on the book alone (although it is a VERY valuable reference and I frequently find myself going back and re-reading certain sections). You really need proper instruction to get there (at least I did).

 

Any more questions, feel free to drop me a PM.

Ditto. :drinks:

 

K, PM your address and I'll send some DVDs.

[oldpalchamp]

I would agree with Taylormadefan. I started with a new instructor in January and we transitioned to a one plane swing. I went out and purchased the book, too. The book is a terrific reference tool with some excellent drills, but if you want to make the change, it is best to seek out a qualified one plane instructor. Jim Hardy's web site has a listing of instructors who have attended his teaching seminars. It is important to find an instructor who has learned from Hardy, because he goes into much more detail at his seminars than he does in the book.

[jeffy]

I agree 100% with Taylormade and oldpal. Before the book was published, I learned all the Hardy one-plane basics from a long-time associate of Jim's, and found the book to be a little disappointing when it came out. My expectation is that the DVD set (available very soon, hopefully) and his next book (scheduled for year end publication) will be more complete.

 

In the meantime, seek out a Hardy-trained instructor. There are a couple of reasons, beyond the obvious, that make this is a good idea. First, I've seen three of them and they all deliver a consistent message, so Jim clearly has thoroughly communicated to each of them what his theories are (and, just as important, they buy into them). Second, each of the teachers that I've seen is a CONVERT to Jim's one-plane swing, so they have experienced, and are continuing to experience, the learning process that their students are going through. Third, I've yet to encounter any instructor (in-person or on a forum) that really understands Jim's theories if they haven't worked with him. These self-styled experts quite often spread a ton of misinformation (usually while promoting their own theories), though I'd say slicefixer is a notable exception.

 

Jeff

[Putt4doh]

As someone who's read the book through and through, I've been close to buying the DVD's. But I'd prefer to find an instructor who can truly teach the one plane swing.

 

I've been struggling with it for nearly a year now and have reached the point of total frustration. I didn't really know where to turn until reading this post....I'm going to find a local Hardy instructor!

 

BTW, I'd love to read a review of the DVD's!

 

Thanks all.

[taylormadefan]

As someone who's read the book through and through, I've been close to buying the DVD's. But I'd prefer to find an instructor who can truly teach the one plane swing.

 

I've been struggling with it for nearly a year now and have reached the point of total frustration. I didn't really know where to turn until reading this post....I'm going to find a local Hardy instructor!

 

BTW, I'd love to read a review of the DVD's!

 

Thanks all.

 

Here's a good list of instructors who are associates or have attended Hardy seminars:

http://www.jimhardygolf.com/Default.aspx?tabid=54

 

Any instructor on this list would be a great place to start.

[Putt4doh]

As someone who's read the book through and through, I've been close to buying the DVD's. But I'd prefer to find an instructor who can truly teach the one plane swing.

 

I've been struggling with it for nearly a year now and have reached the point of total frustration. I didn't really know where to turn until reading this post....I'm going to find a local Hardy instructor!

 

BTW, I'd love to read a review of the DVD's!

 

Thanks all.

 

Here's a good list of instructors who are associates or have attended Hardy seminars:

http://www.jimhardygolf.com/Default.aspx?tabid=54

 

Any instructor on this list would be a great place to start.

 

 

Found it!

 

Of the 2 instructors in my area, one is MIA and the other is at a rather exclusive private club. Any experience on taking lessons from the head pro of a private club where I'm NOT a member?

 

 

Also, on JH's website there's a terrific forum dedicated to Jim's teaching.

[Texsport]

Has anyone who is struggling with the one plane swing consisdered the possibility that it's not the best type swing for them.

 

Hardy spends some time discussing in his book that if you are using the correct style, you should get immediate improvement.

 

Texsport

[dorfblee]

Have any of you checked out www.oneplanegolfswing.com it's Chuck Quinton. He has his own ideas about the one plane golf swing and dissects Jim Hardy's principles a bit.

 

One thing that pops up in the discussions over there is that Hardy seems to exaggerate the set up and some motions because what a player feels and actually does is quite different (might be what taylormadefan experienced). For instance the 45* spine angle is pretty much the max you would want it at (he shows it at address in his book, but none of his PGA players set up like it in real life- Peter Jacobson). I think Hardy recommends up to a 45* spine angle, but anywhere past 30* is okay- that whole 48" past the ball for you shoulder line to point at guide of his.

 

Aaron Baddeley has a one plane swing via a Hardy associate Mike something (I think), but his set up is around 35* spine angle.

 

Eh, there's a lot of stuff over there in the forum. I don't claim to be a teacher or claim to know all the ins and outs fo the one plane swing- I just read that site and am reiterating some of the information I've gleaned from over there.

[Putt4doh]

Has anyone who is struggling with the one plane swing consisdered the possibility that it's not the best type swing for them.

 

Hardy spends some time discussing in his book that if you are using the correct style, you should get immediate improvement.

 

Texsport

 

 

Good point. But for me, I need to commit to one swing model. When movements/positions creep in from another swing is when I have problems. Mainly it's a consistency thing. One round I shoot an effortless 75, the next round I'm killing my self to shoot 85...and this is due soley to my short game.

 

I feel like I need someone who knows what I'm trying to do to tell when things get screwey. That being said...

 

Has anyone out there had success with just the book? How about just the DVD's?

[taylormadefan]

Have any of you checked out www.oneplanegolfswing.com it's Chuck Quinton. He has his own ideas about the one plane golf swing and dissects Jim Hardy's principles a bit.

 

One thing that pops up in the discussions over there is that Hardy seems to exaggerate the set up and some motions because what a player feels and actually does is quite different (might be what taylormadefan experienced). For instance the 45* spine angle is pretty much the max you would want it at (he shows it at address in his book, but none of his PGA players set up like it in real life- Peter Jacobson). I think Hardy recommends up to a 45* spine angle, but anywhere past 30* is okay- that whole 48" past the ball for you shoulder line to point at guide of his.

 

Aaron Baddeley has a one plane swing via a Hardy associate Mike something (I think), but his set up is around 35* spine angle.

 

Eh, there's a lot of stuff over there in the forum. I don't claim to be a teacher or claim to know all the ins and outs fo the one plane swing- I just read that site and am reiterating some of the information I've gleaned from over there.

 

I really can't say I agree with a lot of the things said here.

 

I'd definately say that ALL of Mr. Hardy's students have one thing in common. Posture. It's the key to the one plane swing. One of the Hardy death moves is "lifting up" coming out of your spine angle. I don't get out a protractor and measure spine angles, but I'd definately say McCarron, Pernice, Pooley, and Jacobsen all have a very bent over posture. I guess we can agree to disagree, but why would a teacher emphasize something so much if it was okay for his students to disregard it?

 

As far as Chuck Quinton, I don't think it's fair to bring him into a discussion of Hardy theories. He's got his own theories about the golf swing, and to the best of my knowedge, he's in no way associated with (or even attended) teachings of Mr. Hardy.

 

I feel like I need someone who knows what I'm trying to do to tell when things get screwey. That being said...

 

Has anyone out there had success with just the book? How about just the DVD's?

 

Putt4doh, there are some very complicated feelings that the Hardy one plane swing entails, especially with the tying the hands in close to the body and the right arm and getting "palm down" at impact while the right elbow remains up. Mr. Hardy didn't even address these concepts in the book (although it appears he has in the DVD's) because they're so damn complicated.

 

Just to give you a little glimpse, this is a great explanation of the "hands close / palm down" feelings from his forum, but it's still a bit on the esoteric side:

http://www.jimhardygolf.com/Forums/tabid/5...ic/Default.aspx

 

Instruction really is the best bet here.

[jeffy]

FYI, it is impossible to review the DVD yet because it hasn't shipped, but rumor has it that they will begin shipping Monday the 17th. From what I've heard, it is going to be VERY good.

 

As far as Quinton and his site goes, my opinion is that he is a complete fraud. He saw Hardy on the Golf Channel and had the sleazy, but clever, idea of snatching up the "oneplanegolfswing.com" url before Hardy did and putting up a site promoting himself as a "one-plane" expert. Well, his friend Adrian Wadey spent a day with Hardy a couple of years ago and Quinton has read Hardy's book and watched some video from Jim's seminars, but, IMHO, he doesn't know squat about Hardy's theories. What he promotes is something quite different from Jim's and doesn't really require a one-plane backswing position to be successful. In my view, he is just trying to free-ride on the publicity Jim's thirty years of hard work has generated. This guy just turned thirty, has no teaching or playing record to speak of, and advocates "turn-turn with passive arms", an approach that has been around for decades but, except for John Redman, Paul Azinger's early teacher, hasn't been embraced by any other notable players or teachers that I know of. Why would anyone serious listen to someone like him when it comes to Hardy? It's like a grade school math student critiquing Einstein's work.

 

As others have mentioned, the forum at Jim's site is where you'll find reliable information on the Hardy method. Several of Jim's colleagues post there, including LPGA Hall of Famer Carol Mann (screen name "lpgahf9"). Look forward to seeing you all there!

 

Jeff

[dorfblee]

eeeeck! Didn't realize this was such a hot button issues. Again, I'm just a casual observer- read Hardy's book, saw him on TGC, randomly found Quinton's site and read a little over there. There was some interesting conversations and swing picture breakdowns (with those fancy lines and junk) over there.

 

And I'm not a proponent or user of either methodology.

[jeffy]

FYI, the DVD has shipped; I got mine yesterday: it is fantastic! A lot more detail, great visuals and useful demonstrations of "bad" moves. Answers, as far as I can tell, just about every question I've seen posted about his method. Adds quite a few drills and some exercises. A must have for anyone interested in his cutting edge theories; far superior to the book.

 

Jeff

[Ducky]

Well I have decided I would like to purchase the DVD set. However, I tried to order from the website and it only allows shipping to U.S/Canada. Does anyone know a store that would deliver to Australia?

[Furrankee]

Well I've read it and implemented its techniques. My ball flight is definitely lower than before, but I get a more boring trajectory. My main problem is that I lift up out of my initial posture.

[taylormadefan]

Anyone else have a review for the DVD? I am thinking of purchasing it.

 

Ducky,

 

I hate to say it, but you may want to hold off a month or so.

 

Right now, according to Mr. Hardy's forums, people in Europe are being quoted shipping charges in the $60 range, so I'd imagine when enough people start complaining the shipping prices will drop.

[Ducky]

$60.00 to ship a DVD? That is ridiculous.

 

Do they have any plans to outsource stock to stores like Amazon?

[jeffy]

 

....One thing that pops up in the discussions over there is that Hardy seems to exaggerate the set up and some motions because what a player feels and actually does is quite different (might be what taylormadefan experienced). For instance the 45* spine angle is pretty much the max you would want it at (he shows it at address in his book, but none of his PGA players set up like it in real life- Peter Jacobson). I think Hardy recommends up to a 45* spine angle, but anywhere past 30* is okay- that whole 48" past the ball for you shoulder line to point at guide of his.

 

Aaron Baddeley has a one plane swing via a Hardy associate Mike something (I think), but his set up is around 35* spine angle.

 

 

Hardy discusses posture in the DVD, naturally, and addresses this issue of how some of his students stand more erect at address than he recommends (I'm not sure Jake does, though: there is a down-the-line shot of him on Brady Riggs site where the spine angle is measured at something like 51*!). The speculation on Quinton's site that Jim is "exaggerating" in this case is nonsense and further demonstrates how little CQ and many of his forum members understand Hardy's theachings.

 

Jim says that, like Hogan, these players (McCarron and Pernice) INCREASE the spine angle during the swing, so that they are sufficiently bent over at impact. His point is, however, why complicate things during the swing and why not just set up with sufficient spine angle at address? One reality, though, is that it requires strength and flexibility to achieve and hold that spine angle, so many aspiring one-plane players can't/don't do it. Sadly, they should either start working with a trainer (as I did) or stick with a two-plane swing.

 

BTW, I don't think Badd's teacher is an "associate" of Jim's, but Jim has acknowledged on his forum that he thinks he/they've done a great job with his swing.

 

Jeff

[glcoach]

Badds is working with some ex-associates of Mac O'Grady. They are currently working with a number of players on tour.

[Noncenx]

I finally got around to watching the DVD (been too busy with other things) and I have to say it was an eye opener. I've seen him on the Golf Channel, read the magazine articles and his book but it's not the same as the details he goes into on the DVD.

 

I've been playing for 2 yrs now and pretty much self taught with the exception of one lesson from a club pro and my friends suggestions. Last spring things started working pretty well, really gained a lot of distance and narrowed my dispersion pattern. I thought I had this thing figured out. Well, after a couple of injuries to my ankle and knee I had to lay off for a month and I'm back to square one. I couldn't figure out what was different but I was trying all the drills trying to get it back. But each one seemed to make things worse. Finally I quit trying what worked for others and went back to what seemed right for me. Voilla!!! I'm back on track again.

 

How does this relate to Jim Hardy's DVD? Everything that works for me clearly says I have a one plane swing but all the drills I was trying was for a 2 plane swing. Jim clearly explains the difference between the two without pushing one over the other. He also explains why mixing the two theorys is disastrous. His style is easy to understand without seeming like he's talking down to you. No matter what type of swing you have, you can have a more complete understanding of why it works and what to watch out for. This is one of those videos that you'll watch and then come back to every few weeks for a "refresher course". This is well worth the price.

[matthewk]

..... Everything that works for me clearly says I have a one plane swing but all the drills I was trying was for a 2 plane swing. Jim clearly explains the difference between the two without pushing one over the other. He also explains why mixing the two theorys is disastrous. His style is easy to understand without seeming like he's talking down to you. No matter what type of swing you have, you can have a more complete understanding of why it works and what to watch out for. This is one of those videos that you'll watch and then come back to every few weeks for a "refresher course". This is well worth the price.....

 

 

2nd, that alone was worth the price of the DVD's..

[spk74]

I purchased the book and was let down...to the point that I don't think I'm going to purchase the DVD's....or any more of his books. Perhaps the point of the book was to seed some awareness that there are two sets of fundamentals...and he purposefully did a poor job of communicating in the book so you'd have to buy the DVD's or the next book, etc.

 

My biggest problem with the book was the organization and layout...how he divided it up by specific aspects of the swing (like stance, posture or backswing) ...and he'd highlight the fundamentals for each type of swing within that section/chapter (first for the 1-plane and then immediately the 2-plane). He'd jump back and forth describing the differences....

 

To me, it seemed that the format he chose is good if you only want to identify the different aspects of your current swing (whether they are 1-plane or 2-plane fundamentals)...but it is extremely inconvenient and repetative if you're trying to learn or apply one set of fundamentals.

 

I'd much much much rather have it divided into two sections: first completely describe the one-plane...and then completely describe the 2-plane. That way you can let your mind absorb everything, and you don't have to jump back and forth like a crackhead with ADD.

[toddnt]

The DVD's are the best that Ive seen and it will make a difference the first time you hit the range after watching them.

[Ducky]

My biggest problem with the book was the organization and layout...how he divided it up by specific aspects of the swing (like stance, posture or backswing) ...and he'd highlight the fundamentals for each type of swing within that section/chapter...

Its exactly the same in the DVD set. His justification for doing this is that it benefits the player more if he can identify what to do, and what not to do.

[Schleeman]

spk74

 

Have you taken a look at my book yet (The Secret of Hogan's Swing)? They should have some copies at the Easton Mall in Columbus. Also I'll be there over Thanksgiving I'm trying to set up a book signing at the Barnes and Noble. It's worth a look.

 

Tom Bertrand

[Asleep]

Have you taken a look at my book yet (...Hogan...)? They should have some copies at the Easton Mall in Columbus. Also I'll be there over Thanksgiving I'm trying to set up a book signing at the Barnes and Noble. It's worth a look.

 

Tom Bertrand

This thread is titled "Jim Hardy - The Plane Truth for Golfers".....let's keep it on topic. :drinks:

[Diesel]

so without getting the DVD's, how can you decide if you are a 1 planer or 2...?

 

what's the fundamental difference between the 2...?

[taylormadefan]

so without getting the DVD's, how can you decide if you are a 1 planer or 2...?

 

what's the fundamental difference between the 2...?

 

This will be a good primer for you:

http://www.golfdigest.com/instruction/inde...wingplane1.html

 

I'd also consider picking up the book Plane Truth for Golfers.

 

That will help you get a fundamental knowledge of the differences between a 1 planer vs. a 2 planer.

 

One planers tend to be more bent over in posture, at the top of the swing, have shoulder and arm planes that are parallel, this is a position swing.

 

Two planers are more upright in posture, have a flatter shoulder plane and steeper arm plane, and is more of a tempo, rhythm and timing based swing.

 

Hope that helps.