Playing Hickory Golf

[jonnygrouville]

I used the electrician's tape and the grips slipped. Too nervous to use pins so had some success with one thin strip of conventional grip tape on top of the electrical stuff. Not that much of a pain on the ones I have removed.

 

Jealous about the Welsh trip. Only ever played in the English down at Rye and the R&A match at Walton Heath. Not a lot of time for competitive golf...

 

[Jiggered]

After the trials and tribulations of ebay, I think I've got enough clubs for a starting point.

 

I've finally sourced some double sided hockey tape in the UK so once that's delivered and I've got some epoxy I'm good to start restoring in earnest.

 

Club pictures and names are below, in bold are those I favour at the moment, after hitting them this may change!

That will give me eight play clubs which is my target at the moment but may go out to nine if the woods play with enough variation to make it worth carrying three of them.

 

Irons:

1 iron - Saville Rustless

2 iron - T Stewart

Jigger - Propeller cleek, Brunswick?

Long faced mashie - Gibson

Mashie - St Andrews Golf (Ladies)

Mashie niblick - Bear cleek, Leyland Birmingham Rubber?

Niblick - Kinghorn Golf Co

 

Putters:

Can't make out the wording

Halley Pyramid

A Harris Glasgow

No name (very short but putts the best of the four)

 

 

Woods:

R Montgomery

James Paxton

Geo Duncan

WH Davies

GW Pegler

[Bella Woods]

What is the loft of the wood on the far right of the last two pictures? Is it a bulldog?

[Jiggered]

What is the loft of the wood on the far right of the last two pictures? Is it a bulldog?

 

Sorry I don't know what the loft is.

I'm not sure what a bulldog is but this is quite a light club and doesn't fit my picture of a bulldog, it does have loft though as can be seen.

 

Brass sole plate. Head size is roughly 3.5 inches long by 1.5 inches high.

[ebeer]

Helluva nice lot to start from! Looks to me like you've got some real play potential there. Don't fall in love with any thing before you hit it, seems to be my curse. Instead fall in love with whatever plays best, regardless of how it looks in the shop ;)

 

And yep, Bear is Leyland and Propeller is Brunswick. Keep posting progress pics, excited to see how these turn out.

[Blade Junkie]

Jiggered - where are you based in the UK ?

 

Looks like you have some firm foundations for a decent play set there, but will require some tweaking for sure. On cursory inspection, the long irons look a bit short (they can be lengthened), all the grips need redoing, and the woods, if too light and the shaft can handle it, can always be reweighted to your preferred swingweight.

 

Erik's advice to hit them all first is good, but don't hit anything which is loose at the hosel, or any woods with whipping awry ...

 

Geo Duncan woods are usually good players. The bulldog was a stubby headed fairway/"rescue" wood with a curved sole that makes it particularly effective out of light rough. Good asset to have in the bag, and refurbished ones always sell for a heathy premium

[Jiggered]

Helluva nice lot to start from! Looks to me like you've got some real play potential there. Don't fall in love with any thing before you hit it, seems to be my curse. Instead fall in love with whatever plays best, regardless of how it looks in the shop ;)

 

And yep, Bear is Leyland and Propeller is Brunswick. Keep posting progress pics, excited to see how these turn out.

 

Thanks, some clubs are love at first sight though and will have to play really badly to get dropped, I'll be gutted of the Stewart doesn't play well.

 

Jiggered - where are you based in the UK ?

 

Looks like you have some firm foundations for a decent play set there, but will require some tweaking for sure. On cursory inspection, the long irons look a bit short (they can be lengthened), all the grips need redoing, and the woods, if too light and the shaft can handle it, can always be reweighted to your preferred swingweight.

 

Erik's advice to hit them all first is good, but don't hit anything which is loose at the hosel, or any woods with whipping awry ...

 

Geo Duncan woods are usually good players. The bulldog was a stubby headed fairway/"rescue" wood with a curved sole that makes it particularly effective out of light rough. Good asset to have in the bag, and refurbished ones always sell for a heathy premium

 

I'm in Leicestershire.

Long irons aren't too bad and are certainly playable for now, 2 iron is 38.25" and jigger 37.5"

 

I'm removing and re-gluing all heads on the irons, re-whipping the woods and re-gripping all clubs apart from the putters.

 

None of the woods have much weight to them and are all on the short side, longest is 41.5", but hopefully that will give me more control over them. The Duncan has a small head and looks like it might be a ladies club but feels nice.

[Blade Junkie]

I'm in Leicestershire.

Long irons aren't too bad and are certainly playable for now, 2 iron is 38.25" and jigger 37.5"

 

I'm removing and re-gluing all heads on the irons, re-whipping the woods and re-gripping all clubs apart from the putters.

 

None of the woods have much weight to them and are all on the short side, longest is 41.5", but hopefully that will give me more control over them. The Duncan has a small head and looks like it might be a ladies club but feels nice.

 

2-iron is OK for length, as is the Jigger. That pic is odd as your short irons look the same length as those ones :) Possible the shorter ones have been lengthened or re-shafted by someone to increase the swingweight ?

 

As a rule of thumb (but this is hickory so there aren't really any "standards", just observed lengths) 1-iron/Driving Iron 39", 2-iron/Mid Iron 38.5", 3-iron/Jigger 38", 4-iron/Mashie 37.5", Spade Mashie 37", Mashie Niblick 36.5" and Niblick 36". Swingweights usually perfectly playable if between C4 and D6.

 

Your woods do sound short to me. Driver 43", Brassie 42.5", Spoon 42", Cleek/Bulldog 41.5" would be my aspiration.

 

Well done for taking on the maintenance work yourself. As a total DIY novice, I go down down the "send to the expert" route myself, at about £25 for irons, £40-60 for woods, depending on what needs doing, and £5 for a re-grip :)

[Jiggered]

Cheers BJ, I think it's the picture angle that has made them all look similar lengths. The 1 iron is short at 36.75" but the Gibson mashie has a decent 37.5 and the niblick is 36"".

 

Swing weights for irons, by the crude balance method, are C5 to D4, apart from the ladies mashie which is A1!

Woods go from A0 to B6 so some thought needed there.

 

If I do look at lengthening shafts, where do I find extension pieces? Is it a simple as buying a duff club and salvaging the shaft in sections?

[Blade Junkie]

Stixman (and others) probably best placed to comment on the intricacies of shaft lengthening. Splice technique is probably th ebest joint, and some will tell you that lengthening by an inch is the most that should be attempted, though Chris did one for me that was a 5" extension and the club plays fine and seems strong enough.

 

If the shaft is decent on that ladies mashie, and the diameter matches etc, I'd use that as your source for shaft extension materials. An A1 swingweight clubhead is probably better suited for making into a bottle opener than for any serious golf :)

[ebeer]

Weight is easily added on the woods. Lead tape on the bottom is a quick fix, or drill under the bottom plate to add weight and cover back up. Lengthening a shaft with simple end joint is fairly straight forward and good for up to 1.5" or so (longer than that I'd either replace the shaft entirely or go with a splice joint). You add roughly 3 swingweights for each half inch, so taking that 41.5" brassie to 42.5" would go a long way in creating a heavier feel without making it excessively long.

 

End joint with epoxy or tight bond wood glue has worked very well for me. Hickory dowel or a length of old shaft with a hardwood pin to join the two makes a sturdy joint.

 

 

[Jiggered]

Thanks ebeer, that doesn't sound too complicated.

[Jiggered]

Made a start on refurbishing a couple of irons tonight, taking it steady and just looking to remove the heads and clean up the shaft and inside of the hosel.

 

A couple of questions straight away!

 

 

1 - The first club I looked at was a putter because the pin was easy to see, a different metal to the iron head, maybe aluminium? Anyway, I got my pin punch and started to knock the pin out but it didn't move, on the side I was punching the pin sank in a little but no movement on the other side, I thought that the pin might be bending in the shaft so stopped.

 

What should I do here? just hammer away? Try drilling the pin out? Any suggestions welcome.

 

 

 

2 - The pin on the other head came out no problem and head was removed. Question now is, what are peoples opinions on how to clean the inside of the hosel?

 

I've found two YouTube videos demonstrating this but they're quite different when it comes to hosel cleaning.

hickorygolfworkshop.com use a wire brush drill but that fits inside the hosel and get right down to bright metal.

woodshaftgolf.com/re-pin-and-epoxy-wood-shaft-golf-clubs/ on the other hand don't appear to clean the inside at all, or even the end of the wood shaft!

 

Bright metal looks great and is likely to give the best result but I don't have such a wire brush drill bit, just a collection of needle files which made little visible difference. My question is, is it necessary to get to bright metal inside the hosel or will a good clean be enough?

[HoldenCornfield]

I'm sure someone more knowledgeable will chime in but as far as cleaning the hosel, I just take a Q tip and mineral spirits and clean as well as I can. Haven't had any issues with epoxy not bonding.

[ebeer]

Jiggered;

 

Regarding #1, if you're sure you're on the pin then all you need is some not so gentle persuasion. I've had to use some real oomph with a hammer to drive that pin through, they can be obstinate little SOB's !!

 

Regarding number two, I've never done anything more than knock the surface rust off then inside....polishing is probably over kill. A wire brush on drill would work wonders, but I've never used more than a round file....and on that topic, here's a great article including the use of Rat and a Bastar(d)...sorry Mods won't allow for cursing even though I'm not ;) http://www.hickorygolf.com/restoring-irons.html

[Jiggered]

as far as cleaning the hosel, I just take a Q tip and mineral spirits and clean as well as I can. Haven't had any issues with epoxy not bonding.

Jiggered;

 

Regarding #1, if you're sure you're on the pin then all you need is some not so gentle persuasion. I've had to use some real oomph with a hammer to drive that pin through, they can be obstinate little SOB's !!

 

Regarding number two, I've never done anything more than knock the surface rust off then inside....polishing is probably over kill. A wire brush on drill would work wonders, but I've never used more than a round file....and on that topic, here's a great article including the use of Rat and a Bastar(d)...sorry Mods won't allow for cursing even though I'm not ;) http://www.hickorygolf.com/restoring-irons.html

 

Thanks chaps, that's good enough for me.

[Jiggered]

I'm making steady progress with iron head resetting but have come to a bit of a brick wall on one club, hopefully this will be addressed in the future in the "Iron head removal and re-gluing" thread to appear in the proposed Hickory Club Building and Restoration Forum/Sub Forum!

 

The problem is that I can't find where the pin is on one of the hosels, I've made a search on the classics forum and found blue dye penetrant suggested as a crack finder as used in engineering but I don’t have any of this.

 

How do you go about finding the pin when it’s invisible?

[ebeer]

On occasion the pins are nearly unidentifiable. I use magnifying glass which almost always gives it away, especially if you roll the club to catch light at different angles. If you still can't find the pin, take a hammer and pound on the hosel where you think it should be. Tap hard enough to expose the pin outlines, but not so hard that you create flat spots. These old steel hosels are tough, I've wailed on them pretty good without damage and it will expose the pin line.

 

This is one of the main reasons I use brass pins, makes future work easier... :)

[stixman]

This is one of the main reasons I use brass pins, makes future work easier..

 

You are a really nice guy!

Me, as a doff of the cap to the old timers I try to hide them, but not as well as they did!

[Jiggered]

On occasion the pins are nearly unidentifiable. I use magnifying glass which almost always gives it away, especially if you roll the club to catch light at different angles. If you still can't find the pin, take a hammer and pound on the hosel where you think it should be. Tap hard enough to expose the pin outlines, but not so hard that you create flat spots. These old steel hosels are tough, I've wailed on them pretty good without damage and it will expose the pin line.

 

This is one of the main reasons I use brass pins, makes future work easier... :)

 

Cheers ebeer, I've gone over it with a strong magnifying glass at different lighting angles but can't find a thing.

 

I'm a bit worried about taking the hammer to it as this is my favourite iron but it looks like the only hope I have.

 

 

While on the subject of pinning, do you guys hammer over the pin after the glue has set or just file it level and allow the glue to do all the holding?

[ebeer]

I set the shaft to hosel with epoxy and place the pin at the same time. After set time I trim the pin to around 1/16" on each side, hammer the pin so it will bulge a bit and fill out any gaps in the hole, then file down by hand. You probably don't really need to do much peening, as modern epoxy is really strong, cut and file is probably good enough. In fact I know guys who don't pin at all and rely on the epoxy alone, but I feel better with a pin in there ;)

[Jiggered]

Thanks again ebeer.

It's the strong epoxy that's got me thinking, I did put the pin in when I glued the head in place and now I imagine that the pin is positioned in the hole but with a thin layer of glue between it and the hole in some places, when I hammer it to expand it into the hole a little I'm worried that this might crack the epoxy.

 

Maybe I'm overthinking it (nothing new there), I'll probably just file level and see how it looks.

 

 

On a positive, I think I might have found the pin I've been searching for. I put black marker pen on the shaft and a little methylated spirits (denatured alcohol in the US) in the hope that it would behave like a penetrative crack finder, looking again under the magnifying glass I did see a feint half circle in roughly the right place and gave it a tap with the pin punch last night and it seems to have gown in definition but it was too late at night to carry on.

 

I'll give it a proper tap this evening and fingers crossed I'll be rolling again.

[MattBarbier13]

Is it possible to bend the lofts on hickories with a modern loft/lie machine, or could the shafts crack from the stress? I have a Wilsonian mashie that measures at roughly 26* and it is gapped to close to my mid iron!

[MattBarbier13]

Is it possible to bend the lofts on hickories with a modern loft/lie machine, or could the shafts crack from the stress? I have a Wilsonian mashie that measures at roughly 26* and it is gapped to close to my mid iron!

[ebeer]

Is it possible to bend the lofts on hickories with a modern loft/lie machine, or could the shafts crack from the stress? I have a Wilsonian mashie that measures at roughly 26* and it is gapped to close to my mid iron!

 

Sure they bend. I've had some of mine tweaked in a machine...or just in a vice with bending bar. I like a mashie 34-36*....not sure I'd go that far. 26* seems more mashie-iron?

[stixman]

The hickory irons that I use in my playing sets, even though they are blades, they have 'bounce' and are selected so they don't dig as much.

Decreasing loft on skinny blades may turn them into Cat 1 Diggers.

[Bella Woods]

The hickory irons that I use in my playing sets, even though they are blades, they have 'bounce' and are selected so they don't dig as much.

Decreasing loft on skinny blades may turn them into Cat 1 Diggers.

 

+1 stixman....... I had a spade mashie about 15 years ago that had such a dig sole it would have taken a Lee Trevino

size divot out of a black asphalt driveway.

[Blade Junkie]

The 2nd English Hickory Open will be held at The Buckinghamshire Club on Tuesday 16th May.

 

I'll advise further details as I get them !

 

This was a great event last year, and I for one will definitely be going again :)

[stixman]

The 2nd English Hickory Open will be held at The Buckinghamshire Club on Tuesday 16th May.

 

I'll advise further details as I get them !

 

This was a great event last year, and I for one will definitely be going again :)

 

Me too!

[Jiggered]

Looks good, I hope to play in it too.