Cameron Custom Shop - Destroy grip when putter shaft shortened?

[subrosa]

I sent my putter into Scotty, which I thought would be a nice way to customize a putter my parents gave me as a gift.

 

I selected my options, initials on the face, shorten the shaft, change weights, and put one of those silly shaft bands on it.

 

It donned on me a bit later I didn't specify a grip, but I figured I didn't need too, but I emailed the custom shop anyway...

 

What happened next was a bit odd...."if we are shortening you putter, we will have to install a new grip as the current grip will be destroyed when removed."

 

So I guess the new 2012 pistolero grips can't be removed safely and reinstalled? That seems rather silly to me, the grip was only a few months old, I would have removed it myself (well paid a shop to do it) had I know this was the standard behavior for the shop. What I found odd is that now that I look, "reuse old grip" is an option, but again that wasn't presented as an option when I emailed.

 

I made a mistake of not realizing this fact when customizing the putter, but honestly I feel like I am being nickel and dimed over a 300+ dollar putter sent in for very simple work (which was overpriced as it is). I would have rather spent the 16 dollars on something else, but alas Don didn't see it that way.

 

Needless to say, I doubt I will ever been sending another putter their way...

[mnplayer]

How are you being nickel and dimed? Haha, just call them back and see if they've cut off the old grip yet. If not ask them to reuse it, if they've cut it off odds are they already put something on there.

[subrosa]

[quote name='mnplayer' timestamp='1342164960' post='5266916']
How are you being nickel and dimed? Haha, just call them back and see if they've cut off the old grip yet. If not ask them to reuse it, if they've cut it off odds are they already put something on there.
[/quote]

This email exchanged happened a day after the putter got to the shop, no work had been done on it yet. I just find it odd, would they have sent it back without a grip?

Here is the exact email I sent them:

[quote]I realized I didn't select "reuse" old grip, I thought it was default.
Can I please change this to "reuse" old grip (the grip hasn't been
used much at all, and I would hate to waste it).
[/quote]

Which followed by:

[quote][size="2"]I see the desired length on your putter in 33.5. Are we adjusting the length at all or leaving it as is? If the length is not being changed, we will not touch the current grip. if we are shortening you putter, we will have to install a new grip as the current grip will be destroyed when removed. If we are removing length, please let me know what grip you would like installed.[/size] [/quote]

[Frank_Dux]

[quote name='subrosa' timestamp='1342164396' post='5266904']
I sent my putter into Scotty, which I thought would be a nice way to customize a putter my parents gave me as a gift.

I selected my options, initials on the face, shorten the shaft, change weights, and put one of those silly shaft bands on it.

It donned on me a bit later I didn't specify a grip, but I figured I didn't need too, but I emailed the custom shop anyway...

What happened next was a bit odd...."[size=2]if we are shortening you putter, we will have to install a new grip as the current grip will be destroyed when removed."[/size]

So I guess the new 2012 pistolero grips can't be removed safely and reinstalled? That seems rather silly to me, the grip was only a few months old, I would have removed it myself (well paid a shop to do it) had I know this was the standard behavior for the shop. What I found odd is that now that I look, "reuse old grip" is an option, but again that wasn't presented as an option when I emailed.

I made a mistake of not realizing this fact when customizing the putter, but honestly I feel like I am being nickel and dimed over a 300+ dollar putter sent in for very simple work (which was overpriced as it is). I would have rather spent the 16 dollars on something else, but alas Don didn't see it that way.

Needless to say, I doubt I will ever been sending another putter their way...
[/quote]

What a coincidence. I just removed my pistolero grip from my cameron select last night. Just a little tape solution and it comes off very easy but takes time. Benefit of the doubt, with Scotty's high volume of requests, maybe it's faster for them to just cut the grip, shorten it and then put a new one...

Knowing Scotty, sounds also like another excuse for them to charge you more...

[rafal]

You sent your putter to "Cameron custom shop," $16 shouldn't be threadworthy.

Most putter grips I can take off without destroying them, but it takes work. For a CCS employee to take it off would cost more than $16 in labor cost.

[gxDD]

Yah...I got to agree with rafal here. I'd much rather have SCCS insist on a new grip then add any more turn around time to the hundreds of orders he's probably got on hand. That was my first thought. My second thought was...why would someone be complaining about a new putter grip, especially a Cameron?

For the record, I don't game Cameron putters, their out of my price range, and cost never equates to performance (shafts being an exception). That said, there's no questioning the quality and beauty of his products.

-Paul

[KILLEDBYASHANKEDWEDGE]

Before I sent them a 2.6 I had my local guy remove the brand new grip. Sold it for $15.

[grantc]

No offense, but your first mistake was sending it there at all. The entire Custom Shop model is based on "nickel and diming" for every little thing. From Cameron's point of view, I understand that model because there's thousands of devotees that will shell out the cash no matter the charge without blinking an eye. Why should he worry about the exorbitant charges when people pay them without hesitation? From your point of view, however, I also completely understand the frustration and refusal to send anything there again. I think this is an excellent reason to learn how to do this sort of work yourself.

[Dizz]

Personally I'd pay the $15 and have a new grip put on. You likely already spent enough money that $15 shouldn't make or break anything. I like a lot of Cameron putters but I refuse to give the Custom Shop another dime of mine. They really screwed up an order for me and did absolutely nothing to want me to come back.

[gopherguts]

[quote name='rafal' timestamp='1342220826' post='5270942']
[b]For a CCS employee to take it off would cost more than $16 in labor cost.[/b]
[/quote]
[quote name='Delman' timestamp='1342221876' post='5270986']
Yah...I got to agree with rafal here. I'd much rather have SCCS insist on a new grip then [b]add any more turn around time[/b] to the hundreds of orders he's probably got on hand.
-Paul
[/quote]

Wha-a-a-a-a-at ???

I've purchased [u][b]several[/b][/u] putters from Edwin Watts' Ft Lauderdale store and asked them to shorten it and re-use the grip.

10 minutes later they handed it to me and told me not to use it for at least 1/2 hour,,,,,,,

[Dizz]

[quote name='gopherguts' timestamp='1342231572' post='5271814']
[quote name='rafal' timestamp='1342220826' post='5270942']
[b]For a CCS employee to take it off would cost more than $16 in labor cost.[/b]
[/quote]
[quote name='Delman' timestamp='1342221876' post='5270986']
Yah...I got to agree with rafal here. I'd much rather have SCCS insist on a new grip then [b]add any more turn around time[/b] to the hundreds of orders he's probably got on hand.
-Paul
[/quote]

Wha-a-a-a-a-at ???

I've purchased [u][b]several[/b][/u] putters from Edwin Watts' Ft Lauderdale store and asked them to shorten it and re-use the grip.

10 minutes later they handed it to me and told me not to use it for at least 1/2 hour,,,,,,,
[/quote]

I think you missed his point. 95% of the employees at your Edwin Watts are making $8 an hour, likely the guy that did the work for you too. Certainly doesn't mean he's not capable of doing it but there is nobody working in the Custom Shop making that. Factoring in the hundreds of putters to be worked on daily with people paying premium pricing the time it takes to cut a grip off versus pull a grip and re-install is worth time and money.

[KILLEDBYASHANKEDWEDGE]

[quote name='grantc' timestamp='1342230730' post='5271754']
No offense, but your first mistake was sending it there at all. The entire Custom Shop model is based on "nickel and diming" for every little thing. From Cameron's point of view, [u]I understand that model because there's thousands of devotees that will shell out the cash no matter the charge without blinking an eye.[/u] Why should he worry about the exorbitant charges when people pay them without hesitation? From your point of view, however, I also completely understand the frustration and refusal to send anything there again. I think this is an excellent reason to learn how to do this sort of work yourself.
[/quote]

Don't forget they send it back in a super cool yellow box!

[gxDD]

Thanks J.W.

Comparing your local golf shop to a major OEM, or large restoration company, is apples to oranges. Unless of course your local golf shop has hundreds of club modifications on hand daily. When you're mass producing... the "8 minutes" adds up quick. If you had 50 employees, all adding 8 minutes of re-gripping to every order...everyday...every week...every month...every year...you'd want to cut that expense immediately, once you saw just how much time and money is wasted on re-gripping.

[grantc]

[quote name='KILLEDBYASHANKEDWEDGE' timestamp='1342233246' post='5271954']
[quote name='grantc' timestamp='1342230730' post='5271754']
No offense, but your first mistake was sending it there at all. The entire Custom Shop model is based on "nickel and diming" for every little thing. From Cameron's point of view, [u]I understand that model because there's thousands of devotees that will shell out the cash no matter the charge without blinking an eye.[/u] Why should he worry about the exorbitant charges when people pay them without hesitation? From your point of view, however, I also completely understand the frustration and refusal to send anything there again. I think this is an excellent reason to learn how to do this sort of work yourself.
[/quote]

Don't forget they send it back in a super cool yellow box!
[/quote]

Haha, yep I forgot about that. Why pay less for a drab, beige box when Yellow is so much more exciting?

[TPDawnPatrol]

Easy to remove Pistoleros with some solvent and an air compressor. But it does take a little time. $16 isn't too bad a price for a new Scotty grip considering the ridiculous prices some of his grips go for.

[Instant Offense]

[quote name='rafal' timestamp='1342220826' post='5270942']
You sent your putter to "Cameron custom shop," $16 shouldn't be threadworthy.

Most putter grips I can take off without destroying them, but it takes work. For a CCS employee to take it off would cost more than $16 in labor cost.
[/quote]
Lol. $16 dollars in labor cost???? I can take a Pistolero off in literally 3 minutes. So unless those guys are making a couple hundred bucks an hour it cost them as little as a dollar or two labor cost.

[rafal]

[quote name='Instant Offense' timestamp='1342289104' post='5274856']
[quote name='rafal' timestamp='1342220826' post='5270942']
You sent your putter to "Cameron custom shop," $16 shouldn't be threadworthy.

Most putter grips I can take off without destroying them, but it takes work. For a CCS employee to take it off would cost more than $16 in labor cost.
[/quote]
Lol. $16 dollars in labor cost???? I can take a Pistolero off in literally 3 minutes. So unless those guys are making a couple hundred bucks an hour it cost them as little as a dollar or two labor cost.
[/quote]

OK, since you don't know how that works in a business model....first, it takes more than 3 minutes, 2nd, you have to then keep the old grip handy, 3rd there's bound to be complications every n-th case, leading to decisions having to be made by shop workers/supervisors....basically what works in out garage with out own stuff isn't something that necessarily is workable in a business model.

Besides everything else, if they CAN charge $16 AND make their life easier (that means better bottom line) why WOULDN'T they charge $16? I can hardly think of a business that further from charity than Kameron Kustom Shop.

[Instant Offense]

[quote name='rafal' timestamp='1342294725' post='5275306']
[quote name='Instant Offense' timestamp='1342289104' post='5274856']
[quote name='rafal' timestamp='1342220826' post='5270942']
You sent your putter to "Cameron custom shop," $16 shouldn't be threadworthy.

Most putter grips I can take off without destroying them, but it takes work. For a CCS employee to take it off would cost more than $16 in labor cost.
[/quote]
Lol. $16 dollars in labor cost???? I can take a Pistolero off in literally 3 minutes. So unless those guys are making a couple hundred bucks an hour it cost them as little as a dollar or two labor cost.
[/quote]

OK, since you don't know how that works in a business model....first, it takes more than 3 minutes, 2nd, you have to then keep the old grip handy, 3rd there's bound to be complications every n-th case, leading to decisions having to be made by shop workers/supervisors....basically what works in out garage with out own stuff isn't something that necessarily is workable in a business model.

Besides everything else, if they CAN charge $16 AND make their life easier (that means better bottom line) why WOULDN'T they charge $16? I can hardly think of a business that further from charity than Kameron Kustom Shop.
[/quote]
Thanks for the condescending reply. I wasn't aware that you knew the inter-workings of the Custom Shop. My apologies. Im sure you know their business model in and out. Is it not possible that whoever removes the grip can cut the shaft and then reapply the grip? That would take all of 5 or 6 minutes then. It's another money racket that's all. It wouldn't be costing them any money besides the new grip sale.

[Dizz]

It amazes me the number of people that just don't "get it."

[KILLEDBYASHANKEDWEDGE]

You get a putter back with a recycled grip that has a few bumps because of residual tape left from the first fitting you are going to be upset. It doesn't make sense to do it any other way than the current procedure at CCS.

[tangojay]

Let me see if I get it:

I send a putter to a shop which we all agree is supposed to be "the" place to have any work done on a Scotty Cameron putter. They will charge you for a new grip because they don't have the time to remove a grip which has been proven by many members here it takes a mere 8 minutes,,, if that shop does not have the time to perform a service I want for which I am paying premium prices for,,, why do I want to do business with them?

If you go to a steak house and order a well done steak and get a rare steak, are you going to say "The chef/cook must be busy must of not have enough time to cook it the way I want it" or "it makes better sense to have it under cooked than over cooked"

[Thrillhouse]

[quote name='tangojay' timestamp='1342336354' post='5278308']
Let me see if I get it:

I send a putter to a shop which we all agree is supposed to be "the" place to have any work done on a Scotty Cameron putter. They will charge you for a new grip because they don't have the time to remove a grip which has been proven by many members here it takes a mere 8 minutes,,, if that shop does not have the time to perform a service I want for which I am paying premium prices for,,, why do I want to do business with them?

If you go to a steak house and order a well done steak and get a rare steak, are you going to say "The chef/cook must be busy must of not have enough time to cook it the way I want it" or "it makes better sense to have it under cooked than over cooked"
[/quote]

If I went to a steak house with my own filet that I bought from a grocery store and tried to get them to cook it and take $16 off my tab I would expect that they would refuse that request also.

[svs]

Just another way for them to take your money.

If Scotty could polish a turd and call it a tour issued paper weight, I'm sure he would! Oh and you better believe it will have a circle T stamp and cost $2,500.

[Sean25rp]

[quote name='svs' timestamp='1342339475' post='5278358']
Just another way for them to take your money.

If Scotty could polish a turd and call it a tour issued paper weight, I'm sure he would! Oh and you better believe it will have a circle T stamp and cost $2,500.
[/quote]

Hahaha!

[subrosa]

A lot of insight I had no idea about, I agree that I wouldn't be happy if the grip came back bumpy from a shoddy removal. The cost isn't bad, I just would have liked to throw the other pistolero on my Pro Platinum to have a similar feeling backup putter. I personally have never tried to do any grip work myself, I usually leave that up to shops.

As this is my first time using the "Custom" shop, I was just a bit bewildered about my options, and why they seem so limited.

I agree that the whole Cameron thing is a bit over the top, but I will say I do love the Monterey and I doubt I will carry any other putter. Now, if only I could buy the silly weights after-market. I would love to try some different 20+ gram weights, but I have never seen a shop that has a weight fitting kit for these putters.

[moonshine]

I agree it is a rip off. I agree most don't get it. I agree it takes LESS than 8 minutes. I agree Scotty putters are mediocre at best. Why if they are so great would you ever worry about a less than stellar result from putting a grip on...my four year old can do it!

I won't link it, but need to point some here in the direction of SSB.

[Marlockey]

You Guy's are Missing The Point here, If the Custom Shop offers the service of re-using the Old Grip on the Menu, why could the OP not rectify his order,
Also the equipment they would have for removing grips in the Custom Shop would be the same as the Tour van, it would take them seconds to remove,
I would certainly ask them to include the "cut off grip" with my putter on return to make sure it didn't find it's way on to Ebay ( could be a nice business selling supposedly cut off Scotty grips)
Take a look on Ebay at the many sellers who remove the Custom Shop grips from their putters without syringing and then sell them on Ebay, making a nice profit, so it's not just the Custom Shop here that are supposedly ripping people off, but i think the OP had a good point, he is after all the customer and should be treated with the utmost respect, because without the customer there is no business.

[tremendous_slouch]

[quote name='Thrillhouse' timestamp='1342337003' post='5278322']
[quote name='tangojay' timestamp='1342336354' post='5278308']
Let me see if I get it:

I send a putter to a shop which we all agree is supposed to be "the" place to have any work done on a Scotty Cameron putter. They will charge you for a new grip because they don't have the time to remove a grip which has been proven by many members here it takes a mere 8 minutes,,, if that shop does not have the time to perform a service I want for which I am paying premium prices for,,, why do I want to do business with them?

If you go to a steak house and order a well done steak and get a rare steak, are you going to say "The chef/cook must be busy must of not have enough time to cook it the way I want it" or "it makes better sense to have it under cooked than over cooked"
[/quote]

If I went to a steak house with my own filet that I bought from a grocery store and tried to get them to cook it and take $16 off my tab I would expect that they would refuse that request also.
[/quote]

My only problem with this is that comparing your scenario to that of the OP, the grocery store (golf shop) would have originally bought the filet from the steak house (SC), and so the steak house would make its profit either way. It's not like he's taking a Bettinardi putter or another brand, he's bringing a Scotty Cameron putter back to Scotty Cameron to make it more suitable for him. Scotty has already made a profit from the original sale, whereas in your situation, the steak house hasn't.

[Tee Time!]

[quote name='gopherguts' timestamp='1342231572' post='5271814']
[quote name='rafal' timestamp='1342220826' post='5270942']
[b]For a CCS employee to take it off would cost more than $16 in labor cost.[/b]
[/quote]
[quote name='Delman' timestamp='1342221876' post='5270986']
Yah...I got to agree with rafal here. I'd much rather have SCCS insist on a new grip then [b]add any more turn around time[/b] to the hundreds of orders he's probably got on hand.
-Paul
[/quote]

Wha-a-a-a-a-at ???

I've purchased [u][b]several[/b][/u] putters from Edwin Watts' Ft Lauderdale store and asked them to shorten it and re-use the grip.

10 minutes later they handed it to me and told me not to use it for at least 1/2 hour,,,,,,,
[/quote]
Yes, but SCCS has literally a thousand putters on hand at any given time. There's a "line" that your putter has to wait in.

[tremendous_slouch]

From Scotty's Custom site:

[color=#000000][size=3]"Loft and lie adjustments are free with any order of $45 or more. Length adjustments do incur additional charges on non-Restoration, Custom work-only orders. If you are requesting that we shorten your putter's length, we cannot reuse your original grip (we do not save grips) and you must purchase a grip. If you are having us lengthen your putter, we must Reshaft your putter ($45.00). An original grip is included in this service price, and you may choose to upgrade to a different grip if you like for an additional charge. Please see our Grips menu for details. Regarding our "Desired Length" text box: Please keep in mind that we measure a putter's length from the sole, directly below the sweet spot, in a straight line to the butt end of the grip."[/size][/color]

[size=4][color=#000000]I take from this that reducing the length of your putter is free, all you pay for is the grip (lengthening the putter of course requires a new shaft, and the grip is included). Given this, it's not really a bad deal since while your shop will keep your original grip, they will charge you for shortening your shaft. Also, it specifically states here that "we do not save your original grips", so why are you complaining after the fact? This is straight from the SC Custom Shop site. You should have checked this information before you sent the putter, then it would not be an issue.[/color][/size]

[color=#000000]I'm not judging whether it's legitimate or not, I'm just saying that it states this on the SC site, so it shouldn't be an issue. How much does your local fitter charge for cutting your shaft? Maybe they keep your same grip, but charge you $15 to cut the shaft. SC cuts it for free, but charges you for a new grip. 6 of one, half a dozen of the other, if you ask me.[/color]