Dynamic Lie on Trackman Impact Location

[LEO MODE]

So I saw Dynamic Lie parameter on new Trackman's Impact Location update.

 

On GC2+HMT or GC Quad there is Static Lie or Lie Angle which is really good for fitting. Because it is just like having a lie board and shows either your iron is 2 degree upright or flat.

 

Now, how will this Dynamic Lie play in terms of fitting? On irons and drivers it looks like it's like 50-60 degrees. I can't see how you can use this parameter for fitting/play improvement purposes.

 

Thanks.

[larrybud]

So what is it measuring? I googled it, but have found no info on it. You say it's 50-60 degrees, relative to what?

 

I would presume a dynamic lie value would be the lie of the club at impact. So if you're 5 degrees left, then you know the club is 5 degrees too upright (for a righty). The value of knowing that is why the ball might be starting to the left.

[LEO MODE]

I have no idea that’s why I was asking.

 

So I talked to one of the instructors who uses GC2+HMT and he said that the Lie Angle HMT measures is a Dynamic Lie. However the numbers are always in the single digit. And for drivers mine is always like +5.0 and above while my irons were -2. So this is just like hitting on a lie board and I know I need to bend my irons 2 degree upright.

 

But with this Trackman Impact Location, it is saying +60 degree. That wouldn’t mean I have to bend my irons 60 degrees or even 6 degrees! I never heard that number! This guy hit it really well in the photo so it can’t mean he has to bend it 6 degrees upright or flat for sure.

 

https://mobile.twitter.com/TrackManGolf/status/956185970621272064/photo/1

 

I want to know how we need to interpret this so this can be used for fitting or play improvement!

[iteachgolf]

I have no idea that’s why I was asking.

 

So I talked to one of the instructors who uses GC2+HMT and he said that the Lie Angle HMT measures is a Dynamic Lie. However the numbers are always in the single digit. And for drivers mine is always like +5.0 and above while my irons were -2. So this is just like hitting on a lie board and I know I need to bend my irons 2 degree upright.

 

But with this Trackman Impact Location, it is saying +60 degree. That wouldn’t mean I have to bend my irons 60 degrees or even 6 degrees! I never heard that number! This guy hit it really well in the photo so it can’t mean he has to bend it 6 degrees upright or flat for sure.

 

https://mobile.twitter.com/TrackManGolf/status/956185970621272064/photo/1

 

I want to know how we need to interpret this so this can be used for fitting or play improvement!

 

It’d be the actual dynamic lie angle of the club you’re hitting. So if it said 61.5* that’s the lie angle you’d use for that club. So for a 6 iron that’s be about standard to 1* flat depending on the manufacturer

[LEO MODE]

I have no idea that’s why I was asking.

 

So I talked to one of the instructors who uses GC2+HMT and he said that the Lie Angle HMT measures is a Dynamic Lie. However the numbers are always in the single digit. And for drivers mine is always like +5.0 and above while my irons were -2. So this is just like hitting on a lie board and I know I need to bend my irons 2 degree upright.

 

But with this Trackman Impact Location, it is saying +60 degree. That wouldn’t mean I have to bend my irons 60 degrees or even 6 degrees! I never heard that number! This guy hit it really well in the photo so it can’t mean he has to bend it 6 degrees upright or flat for sure.

 

https://mobile.twitter.com/TrackManGolf/status/956185970621272064/photo/1

 

I want to know how we need to interpret this so this can be used for fitting or play improvement!

 

It’d be the actual dynamic lie angle of the club you’re hitting. So if it said 60* that’s the lie angle you’d use for that club. So for a 5 iron that’s be about standard to 1* flat depending on the manufacturer

 

Interesting. So vs HMT, Trackman’s data will be more towards the parameter rather than focusing on the current club that I just used?

 

For instance if I am club-head fitting, if I get a 60 degree Dynamic Lie, I need to now look for club heads that matches that Dynamic Lie, versus where HMT can just tell me I can simply bend my irons to get a better impact?

 

Or depending on what club head I used then I can know by going back to that particular club head’s lie angle information and bend it depending on the info?

 

Overall I just think HMT’s Lie Angle is more intuitive and easier to understand! Not every fitter will know exact lie angle dimensions for all manufacturers for instance!

 

Lastly which word should I look for when I go to club manufacturer’s homepage for looking at that dynamic lie for each club? Titleist for instance just shows Lie for each iron but if I hit a 61.5 degree on a 6 iron and I see AP3’s 6 iron lie being 62.5 what does it tell me? Is my question. It just feels like Dynamic Loft to me which varies all the time.

[iteachgolf]

I have no idea that’s why I was asking.

 

So I talked to one of the instructors who uses GC2+HMT and he said that the Lie Angle HMT measures is a Dynamic Lie. However the numbers are always in the single digit. And for drivers mine is always like +5.0 and above while my irons were -2. So this is just like hitting on a lie board and I know I need to bend my irons 2 degree upright.

 

But with this Trackman Impact Location, it is saying +60 degree. That wouldn’t mean I have to bend my irons 60 degrees or even 6 degrees! I never heard that number! This guy hit it really well in the photo so it can’t mean he has to bend it 6 degrees upright or flat for sure.

 

https://mobile.twitter.com/TrackManGolf/status/956185970621272064/photo/1

 

I want to know how we need to interpret this so this can be used for fitting or play improvement!

 

It’d be the actual dynamic lie angle of the club you’re hitting. So if it said 60* that’s the lie angle you’d use for that club. So for a 5 iron that’s be about standard to 1* flat depending on the manufacturer

 

Interesting. So vs HMT, Trackman’s data will be more towards the parameter rather than focusing on the current club that I just used?

 

For instance if I am club-head fitting, if I get a 60 degree Dynamic Lie, I need to now look for club heads that matches that Dynamic Lie, versus where HMT can just tell me I can simply bend my irons to get a better impact?

 

Or depending on what club head I used then I can know by going back to that particular club head’s lie angle information and bend it depending on the info?

 

Overall I just think HMT’s Lie Angle is more intuitive and easier to understand! Not every fitter will know exact lie angle dimensions for all manufacturers for instance!

 

Lastly which word should I look for when I go to club manufacturer’s homepage for looking at that dynamic lie for each club? Titleist for instance just shows Lie for each iron but if I hit a 61.5 degree on a 6 iron and I see AP3’s 6 iron lie being 62.5 what does it tell me? Is my question.

 

How are you not understanding? If it says the dynamic lie is 60*. You bend the club to 60*.

 

You’d bend the AP3 to 61.5 or in other words 1* flat. I don’t see how you’re not understanding and trying to make something that is painfully simple this complicated.

 

It’s not any harder or less intuitive than HMT. If a club fitter doesn’t know he lie angle of the club he is having a player hit than I’d say he’s a terrible fitter. And before bending any iron you’d measure it first. Dynamic lie angle is the lie angle of the club at impact. You match your static lie angle to the dynamic lie angle.

 

I don’t understand how you can own and use a TM4 and not understand lie angles on golf clubs. I would strongly suggest not charging anyone for a clubfitting until you learn a lot more and understand basic golf club design and what you’re actually fitting.

[LEO MODE]

I have no idea that’s why I was asking.

 

So I talked to one of the instructors who uses GC2+HMT and he said that the Lie Angle HMT measures is a Dynamic Lie. However the numbers are always in the single digit. And for drivers mine is always like +5.0 and above while my irons were -2. So this is just like hitting on a lie board and I know I need to bend my irons 2 degree upright.

 

But with this Trackman Impact Location, it is saying +60 degree. That wouldn’t mean I have to bend my irons 60 degrees or even 6 degrees! I never heard that number! This guy hit it really well in the photo so it can’t mean he has to bend it 6 degrees upright or flat for sure.

 

https://mobile.twitter.com/TrackManGolf/status/956185970621272064/photo/1

 

I want to know how we need to interpret this so this can be used for fitting or play improvement!

 

It’d be the actual dynamic lie angle of the club you’re hitting. So if it said 60* that’s the lie angle you’d use for that club. So for a 5 iron that’s be about standard to 1* flat depending on the manufacturer

 

Interesting. So vs HMT, Trackman’s data will be more towards the parameter rather than focusing on the current club that I just used?

 

For instance if I am club-head fitting, if I get a 60 degree Dynamic Lie, I need to now look for club heads that matches that Dynamic Lie, versus where HMT can just tell me I can simply bend my irons to get a better impact?

 

Or depending on what club head I used then I can know by going back to that particular club head’s lie angle information and bend it depending on the info?

 

Overall I just think HMT’s Lie Angle is more intuitive and easier to understand! Not every fitter will know exact lie angle dimensions for all manufacturers for instance!

 

Lastly which word should I look for when I go to club manufacturer’s homepage for looking at that dynamic lie for each club? Titleist for instance just shows Lie for each iron but if I hit a 61.5 degree on a 6 iron and I see AP3’s 6 iron lie being 62.5 what does it tell me? Is my question.

 

How are you not understanding? If it says the dynamic lie is 60*. You bend the club to 60*.

 

You’d bend the AP3 to 61.5 or in other words 1* flat. I don’t see how you’re not understanding and trying to make something that is painfully simple this complicated.

 

It’s not any harder or less intuitive than HMT. If a club fitter doesn’t know he lie angle of the club he is having a player hit than I’d say he’s a terrible fitter. And before bending any iron you’d measure it first. Dynamic lie angle is the lie angle of the club at impact. You match your static lie angle to the dynamic lie angle.

 

I don’t understand how you can own and use a TM4 and not understand lie angles on golf clubs. I would strongly suggest not charging anyone for a clubfitting until you learn a lot more and understand basic golf club design and what you’re actually fitting.

 

I am not a fitter but a simple casual player who is interested in data which got me into Trackman Certified level 1. Nowhere in my post said I own a fitting shop. Thanks for educating me but I don’t understand why you say you don’t understand some people just because they don’t know the things you know. I probably know crap tons more stuff in real life about non-golf numbers than you but that doesn’t make me a better guy and I never go on as rude as you.

 

Some people think they are just smart because they know more stuff than others. Be modest. This forum is not only filled up with PGA pros.

[iteachgolf]

You literally asked what’d you do if you were giving a clubfitting. You keep taking about clubfitting. If you aren’t the one doing the clubfitting than you don’t need to know any of the data. Again this is simple. It’s literaly giving you the exact number you bend the lie angle to. HMT is using a dynamic lie angle. When you hit off a lie board you are finding the dynamic lie angle. If it says 61.5* you bend the club to 61.5*. Not sure they could make it any simpler.

 

I didn’t say anything rude. I literally don’t understand how you’re confused. I don’t expect you do to know what I know. But the question was already answered in the simplest possible way. I did not and still do not understand where your confusion comes from.

[LEO MODE]

I won’t go far on this since you seem like you are adamant about your stance. Again thanks for letting me know on this.

 

If you are a teacher like your ID states, obviously teacher might not be a good occupation for you if you get emotional, not understanding where people come from and talking down on people like this. Perhaps you don’t do it like this offline since they will pay you for living.

[iteachgolf]

I won’t go far on this since you seem like you are adamant about your stance. Again thanks for letting me know on this.

 

If you are a teacher like your ID states, obviously teacher might not be a good occupation for you if you get emotional, not understanding where people come from and talking down on people like this. Perhaps you don’t do it like this offline since they will pay you for living.

 

I think you’re confused. I’m literally trying to help you and asking where your confusion is coming from. What “stance” am I adamant about? Lie angle is what it is. The club has a lie angle. When you hit a ball you produce a dynamic lie angle. To get club flat on ground at impact you bend the club to match the dynamic lie angle. This is identical using ANY system. TM just gives you the exact number to bend it to.

 

I’m not being emotional at all and I didn’t talk down to you. I literally just said that I don’t understand how you’re confused. And I still don’t because you won’t elaborate on what exactly it is you don’t understand.

[LEO MODE]

I do appreciate your help. I didn’t understand the difference vs HMT because HMT just showed Lie Angle being -2, -3, +2 degrees so it was easier for me to see that I just have to look at that single digit to see if I need to bend that iron -2 or -3 degrees or even different irons if I keep seeing -2 on all default lied irons for instance. But Trackman was showing 60 degrees so 1) i wasnt sure if HMT was showing static lie or dynamic lie and 2) why trackman wasnt showing the way HMT was showing. Because if I were to fit my own club, I wouldn’t know each lie angle for each club in the industry so it looked more complex than HMT to me if I were to find the right default club head that has the lie for my swing which will take longer time.

 

I hope this is clear.

[stingreye]

Leo mode, I think Iteach is telling you they measure the same thing. Hmt could convert to lie angle if they wanted and trackman could convert to +\- upright/flat. It’s just how they choose display the data. To be honest it’s that that different than side spin/backspin and showing spin axis. They both are trying to show the same thing.

[LEO MODE]

So here is one example from the actual Trackman reading with the impact location I tested out on the range with a hard Callaway Practice range ball. This shot belongs to me.

I am using a 63 degree static lie angle 7 iron. In this data it shows that my dynamic lie angle was 64.9. So I’m assuming I need to make this iron 1.9 degree flat to make a solid contact in the sweetspot? I noticed that I was keep hitting on the bottom of the club slightly on the toe side. Swing Plane is about 60 degree on this as well.

 

I remember I was fit by a Titleist 3 months ago and he told me that I need to bend my irons 2 degree upright, but since then my swing has changed dramatically due to the lesson by a new teacher. So I don’t know if my Trackman number is now telling me I need to flat it out or upright it.

 

Any insight on my swing will be great. Thanks.

[iteachgolf]

No you’d need to make it upright. Youd need to make the lie angle 65*. 65* is more upright than 65*. Won’t necessarily make you hit it in the sweet spot but would help.

[LEO MODE]

No you'd need to make it upright. Youd need to make the lie angle 65*. 65* is more upright than 65*. Won't necessarily make you hit it in the sweet spot but would help.

 

Gotcha. So simply put, if my static lie is 63 and dynamic lie is 65, 2 degree upright. if static is 63 and dynamic is 61, then 2 degree flat.

I guess even with my swing change I am still hitting it 2 degree flat on my current irons.

 

This really helps. Thanks a lot.

[kywldcts1225]

I know this is kind of old, but I think I see the confusion. Trackman is measuring the dynamic lie by the actual lie angle number. So your club has a 63* static lie angle, but Trackman is saying you’re delivering it at 65* dynamically then it should probably be bent which will help both sweetspot contact and face angle.

 

Foresight is giving single degree numbers (like +2* or -1*) because it’s measuring dynamic lie by degrees toe up or toe down at impact. So you’d need to take your static lie number, say 63*, and add or subtract the degrees toe up or down number to get your dynamic lie angle number.

 

It’s the same measurement, just represented differently.