Does trail hip move fluidly and effortlessly into proper position at top of backswing and does it feel tense once it's there?

[Reflections]

Assuming you're in the correct position at top of backswing with pressure into lead ball of foot and trail inside heel:

 

1) Is the trail hip getting into the correct position to achieve this pressure a fluid motion or is there tension that you feel in your trail glute/hip to get it there? 

2) Once it's in the correct position, is there a build up of tension that you can feel in your glute/hip? Or should it feel say the same as if you were just standing upright facing forward? Or should you feel more strained to sit there in that position? 

Assume we're talking about a younger golfer with average hip mobility and flexibility

 

Thanks in advance!

 

 

Edited August 4, 2023 by Reflections

[getitdaily]

I don't think you'll feel anything in the hip itself. The more you resist hip turn the more you should feel pressure in the lower back. The less you resist rotation the more you'll feel pressure in your trail side thigh to knee.

Edited August 4, 2023 by getitdaily

[MPStrat]

It should feel like you’re turning your zipper into your right front pants pocket. Should feel some pressure in your right glute. The important thing is that you don’t over-rotate by spinning your butt or spinning your pelvis. What this means is that you don’t want to driver your backswing with butt rotation or pelvis spinning.
 

If you look at tour players, pretty much across the board, they don’t move their belt buckle a ton in the backswing. It’s also good to lose some flex in the trail leg, but not too much and definitely not locked out. 

[Shawshanks]

2 hours ago, MPStrat said:

It should feel like you’re turning your zipper into your right front pants pocket. Should feel some pressure in your right glute. The important thing is that you don’t over-rotate by spinning your butt or spinning your pelvis. What this means is that you don’t want to driver your backswing with butt rotation or pelvis spinning.
 

If you look at tour players, pretty much across the board, they don’t move their belt buckle a ton in the backswing. It’s also good to lose some flex in the trail leg, but not too much and definitely not locked out. 

I’ve only just recently learned that I’d been locking out my trail leg when trying to add hip rotation. Never knew it was even a thing before, I feel it’s not spoken about enough. I need to work proper hip rotation but it seems what I “feel” is not real 

[Zitlow]

The hips don't turn on their own volition. As you extend (not lock) the right leg the right hip rocks up which establishes support  and balance on your right leg and hip.

 

That motion is closely followed by the upper body rotating which turns the right hip. The right hip turn pulls the left hip and knee and pulls the left heel up.

 

He's stepping onto his right foot, his upper body turns which turns his right hip which pulls his left hip, knee and heel up off the ground. 

 

[MPStrat]

4 minutes ago, Zitlow said:

The hips don't turn on their own volition. As you extend (not lock) the right leg the right hip rocks up which establishes support  and balance on your right leg and hip.

 

That motion is closely followed by the upper body rotating which turns the right hip. The right hip turn pulls the left hip and knee and pulls the left heel up.

 

He's stepping onto his right foot, his upper body turns which turns his right hip which pulls his left hip, knee and heel up off the ground. 

 

Yes, intentionally “turning the hips” which in reality means spinning the pelvis is a bad concept in both the backswing and the downswing IMO.
 

The upper body turns the lower body in the backswing. It shouldn’t happen in reverse. 

 

Just don’t make the grave mistake of standing flat footed and starting the golf swing clubhead first. The golf swing starts with a shift into the right instep before anything else happens. 

[RoyalTroon]

Jackie Burke appears to be more lower body minded overall, especially on chips.  It doesn't take much to get momentum on its way I guess would be the point here, and a lower lead can be  effective and a good change of pace for some, but I prefer having the lower respond for all things full but not on chip shots.

 

 

[MPStrat]

57 minutes ago, Shawshanks said:

I’ve only just recently learned that I’d been locking out my trail leg when trying to add hip rotation. Never knew it was even a thing before, I feel it’s not spoken about enough. I need to work proper hip rotation but it seems what I “feel” is not real 

I agree. Locking out the trail leg and over rotating the hips is not spoken about enough. It stems from many teacher’s emotional bias against players “restricting their hips” which was taught a long time ago and I would guess virtually no one does intentionally anymore.
 

What you’ll also find is that many teachers in the social media era will tell you what moves and the amount it should move, but many if not most are guessing at how, why or when something should move. 

[Zitlow]

1 hour ago, MPStrat said:

Yes, intentionally “turning the hips” which in reality means spinning the pelvis is a bad concept in both the backswing and the downswing IMO.
 

The upper body turns the lower body in the backswing. It shouldn’t happen in reverse. 

 

Just don’t make the grave mistake of standing flat footed and starting the golf swing clubhead first. The golf swing starts with a shift into the right instep before anything else happens. 

 

I've seen clubhead first taught here. Look at Sam, his clubhead is last to leave. 

[Tanner25]

On 8/4/2023 at 6:43 PM, Zitlow said:

The hips don't turn on their own volition. As you extend (not lock) the right leg the right hip rocks up which establishes support  and balance on your right leg and hip.

 

That motion is closely followed by the upper body rotating which turns the right hip. The right hip turn pulls the left hip and knee and pulls the left heel up.

 

He's stepping onto his right foot, his upper body turns which turns his right hip which pulls his left hip, knee and heel up off the ground. 

 

 

Does that mean on the downswing, it is a step to the left foot (toe), then iniate the lower body? Is it step, then upper and step then lower?

[Zitlow]

5 hours ago, Tanner25 said:

 

Does that mean on the downswing, it is a step to the left foot (toe), then iniate the lower body? Is it step, then upper and step then lower?

 

Lower body leads the upper body. He sets up the left post and the right gate swings around it. Happens really quick. 

 

 

 

 

[me05501]

On 8/4/2023 at 9:01 PM, Zitlow said:

 

I've seen clubhead first taught here. Look at Sam, his clubhead is last to leave. 

 

 

I think we have to be careful when comparing modern swings to Snead, Hogan, Bobby Jones and anyone else who played before the era of super stiff and stable graphite shafts.

 

The shafts they played back then required some compensations that maybe aren't that relevant today. 

 

Those guys learned to swing the clubhead like it was attached to the end of a rope. I'm not saying that's a bad concept...it would probably help a lot of us to think that way. But today's pros don't have to worry nearly as much about the clubhead lagging too far behind the shaft. 

[MPStrat]

3 minutes ago, me05501 said:

 

 

I think we have to be careful when comparing modern swings to Snead, Hogan, Bobby Jones and anyone else who played before the era of super stiff and stable graphite shafts.

 

The shafts they played back then required some compensations that maybe aren't that relevant today. 

 

Those guys learned to swing the clubhead like it was attached to the end of a rope. I'm not saying that's a bad concept...it would probably help a lot of us to think that way. But today's pros don't have to worry nearly as much about the clubhead lagging too far behind the shaft. 

If you watch any of Kwon or AMG’s stuff about pressure movement, they do not teach clubhead first. They teach a shift to the right before the hands move the clubhead. I haven’t seen anyone that understands pressure movement teach clubhead first.

[me05501]

13 minutes ago, MPStrat said:

If you watch any of Kwon or AMG’s stuff about pressure movement, they do not teach clubhead first. They teach a shift to the right before the hands move the clubhead. I haven’t seen anyone that understands pressure movement teach clubhead first.

 

Right. But it's also true that no one is teaching clubhead last. 

[MPStrat]

1 minute ago, me05501 said:

 

Right. But it's also true that no one is teaching clubhead last. 

Jason Kokrak who is a very long and straight driver of the ball does a version of that. It’s certainly better than clubhead first.
 

I’m personally not a fan of the exaggeration Kokrak does for myself, but the bigger point is that standing flat footed and moving the clubhead first is much worse. 

[Zitlow]

I took lessons from Mike Austin and Mike Dunaway, the club head was the last thing to move with their drivers. Everything went back together with the shift when they hit irons. 

 

 

 

 

 

[Zitlow]

59 minutes ago, MPStrat said:

the bigger point is that standing flat footed and moving the clubhead first is much worse. 

 

Gets them and the club out of balance and out of sync.