VJ on 17th Hole Today

QuickFeet · December 21, 2008

Rule 13-2

Today at the Chevron World Challenge, VJ was off the 17th green but before he played his second shot he fixed several ball marks on the green.......must have been on his line of play? Rule 13-2 does not allow improving the line of play, basically through the green. Something similar happened to one of the Bryant brothers (Bart I think) earlier this year and he was penalized. Maybe my understanding of Rule 13 is not correct?? Rule experts, can you clarify please?

Tmiller72 · December 21, 2008

If the ball marks were on the green, I'm pretty sure he can fix those. If they were on the fringe, he couldn't.

Edit: Rule 16-1c

The player may repair an old hole plug or damage to the putting green caused by the impact of a ball, whether or not the player's ball lies on the putting green.

hef63303 · December 21, 2008

You can repair ball marks on the green at any time. The Bryant issue concerned a ball mark in the fringe, I think, that was repaired by his playing partner.

Tmiller72 · December 21, 2008

There actually is a time when you can fix a ball mark on the fringe. First correct answer wins a prize.

Kreth · December 21, 2008

There actually is a time when you can fix a ball mark on the fringe. First correct answer wins a prize.

When it's your own and the ball comes to rest in it?

Tmiller72 · December 21, 2008

There actually is a time when you can fix a ball mark on the fringe. First correct answer wins a prize.
When it's your own and the ball comes to rest in it?

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=1ytCEuuW2_A

soberguy16 · December 21, 2008

There actually is a time when you can fix a ball mark on the fringe. First correct answer wins a prize.

after you hole out

Back9 · December 21, 2008

I believe you can fix a ball mark on your line of play if it is created by a ball that landed after your ball had come to rest. You are entitled to the lie you had when your ball stopped so you can fix/remove objects that were not present when your ball originally came to rest. This does not include your own ball mark if not on the green.

Tmiller72 · December 21, 2008

I believe you can fix a ball mark on your line of play if it is created by a ball that landed after your ball had come to rest. You are entitled to the lie you had when your ball stopped so you can fix/remove objects that were not present when your ball originally came to rest. This does not include your own ball mark if not on the green.

We have a winner!!

Back9 · December 21, 2008

and the prize?

Tmiller72 · December 21, 2008

There actually is a time when you can fix a ball mark on the fringe. First correct answer wins a prize.
after you hole out

Technically you are right since you can do a lot of things after you have holed out. I was actually looking for the answer for when the ball is in play. I don't want to get sued, so I'll send you a prize too. :)

Tmiller72 · December 21, 2008

and the prize?

I have a couple of Titleist stickers if you want one. Back9 and Soberguy, PM me your addresses.

QuickFeet · December 21, 2008

Tmiller72 & hef63303 thank you for the help.

I checked on the Bryant ruling, it was a pitch mark on the fringe; BMW Championship.

Laird’s tee shot on the par 3 landed on the fringe and rolled to 3 feet. Bryant’s shot came up just short in the rough, some 50 feet from the flag.

As they approached the green, Laird noticed the pitch mark left by his tee shot and went to tamp it down.

“I said, ‘Is this in your line?”’ Laird said after a long and troublesome day.

As the rookie from Scotland punched down the grass with his club, Bryant told him that indeed, it was in his line between the ball and the flag. It did not affect the shot because Bryant’s play was to chip well over the mark.

No matter.

Slugger White, the PGA TOUR's vice president of rules and competition, said a decision related to Rule 1-2 does not allow Laird to improve a competitor’s line. That ordinarily would be a two-shot penalty – disqualification in this case, because Laird already had signed his card – but he was not penalized because the USGA deemed that he did not intend to help Bryant.

Bryant did not get off so easily.

He was guilty of Rule 13-2, which covers improve the lie, area of intended swing or stance or line of play. The rules says a player cannot improve the line “or allow” it to be improved.

By agreeing that the mark was in his line – a simple “Yes” was all it took – Bryant was assessed two shots. That turned a bogey into a triple bogey, turning a 66 into a 68.