Pro Preference Model Irons

[shuttle1]

Pics and reviews

Had a great day with many "testers" trying out the Irons listed here. The Irons were hit from the fairway of the #1 Hole at Sunbrook Golf Course on to the Green. We used a Bushnell range finder and marked off 120 yards, 150 yards and 170 yards to the green. Everyone hitting balls plays a good game and are good ball strikers. Titleist ProV1's were the only Golf balls that were hit. I have 2 shag bags full that I have been saving that have all played aprox. 18 holes. All still in good shape. Only down side is it was on the cold side, about 48*. The fairway was cut short and quite firm. The green was quite firm as well.

The main Iron being tested was the Pro Preference Model. We were most interested in these because it is the newest and most unique of the Irons.

Bottom line, this club is a Winner. Everyone, without exception fell in love with these Irons. The grind may have been the final reason as it does seem to excell from the firm ground. I'm not convinced that it will not excell from all ground conditions.


The Irons tested were:

Pro Preference Model
Epon
Tourstage
Nike
Miura
and TM

All Blades, all winners.

If there is such a thing as a Forgiving Blade the winner in this Group went to:
Epon AF Tours

The best Feeling Iron:
When hit flush was dang near a toss up. All feel fantastic when hit flush. It just comes down to the feel and sound you prefer. The quietest went to the PPM's. I think that is in part due to the fact they seem to glide through the turf easier. I swear there were times when you could barely hear the ball being struck.

Best Looking:
Flip a coin, at address they all look great. My Favorite, I think... was the Tourstage 901's. Thin top line, very compact. Just seemed to sit right.(for me)

The overall winner.
WE decided it was the Pro Preference Model. It did everything right. But the bottom line is the bottom of the club. The grind on these is what sets them apart. They are just simply more versatile making any shot you want to hit, easier.

I'm not saying any of these clubs are the best, they are all great clubs. Some Irons fit the eye better than others even though they are very similar. There were times you had to pick the club up and look at it to make sure you knew which one you had. We really only had one dissappointed person. He was bummed that he had actually found that he prefered the PPM's and Miura's over his beloved Nike's.

My camara is having issues with the auto focus. I had to delete many of the pics taken and will try and get more when the new camera arrives.












Again, this mini review was all for fun. It was not meant to try and determine that one Iron is better than another one. It was to compare some of the excellent Irons out there to see if any stand out above another. What made the PPM's stand out is the grind. They were all a pleasure to hit and felt fantastic. There were a lot of big smiles.

[cbm]

Thanks for the review! Great looking (and sounds like preforming clubs) What shaft was in the head KBS tours? Is it me or just the camera angle- Is the heel big on these?

[Asleep]

How much do the PPs cost for 3-PW?

[cbm]

$1899 shafted w/ KBS tours from what I've seen.

[shuttle1]

$1899 shafted w/ KBS tours from what I've seen.

 

Yes, that is the retail price.

 

They come standard with the KBS Tours, your choice of flex.

The KBS Tours are already my shaft of choice and paired with these babies I would have a hard time believing any other shaft could be a better match. But, you can also get them with just about any other shaft of your choice.

 

I'm sure between the Japanese Forged heads and the custom hand grinding by the legend of legend grinders, Shinagawa, and a true Limited set, it is what drives the price of these up.

 

The quality and craftsmanship is unquestionable.

[apocalypsem3]

any comparison pics of the irons you tested?? Those PPM are gorgeous.

[varsityhacker]

I wonder if that notch is something that could be done to an exsiting blade by some like a Joe Kwok? I have seen some of his custom grinds on this website and he does excellent work.

 

I would love to hit them to see how they feel through impact and various lies. Can you comment on how the grind compares to the other irons besides the obvious notch?

 

Must say they are really nice looking better than I thought they would look, you can tell they are a very high quality stick.

[joey3108]

I wonder if that notch is something that could be done to an exsiting blade by some like a Joe Kwok? I have seen some of his custom grinds on this website and he does excellent work.

 

I would love to hit them to see how they feel through impact and various lies. Can you comment on how the grind compares to the other irons besides the obvious notch?

 

Must say they are really nice looking better than I thought they would look, you can tell they are a very high quality stick.

I'll be straight forward here...I'm NOT gonna recommend this pre-worn or cave in sole on an iron where you mostly do a full swing on your shots. You will have a very inconsistent ball flight and worst distance control.

 

To me it's gimmicky. I don't see any advantage, in fact i see more disadvantage having it on an iron. It's totally different purposes compare to a wedges. It looks like somebody running out of idea or desperate looking for a sales pitch idea IMO. At least cosmetically that spot will have a very quick worn out chrome spot. Trapped all those sands which act like a sand paper.

 

my 2 cents!

 

Joe

[Ezgolfer]

Agree with what JK said .

 

It will be hard to glide this thing through thick rough ...

How about trapping small rocks in the pocket .. You want the sole to be smooth...

[shuttle1]

I wonder if that notch is something that could be done to an exsiting blade by some like a Joe Kwok? I have seen some of his custom grinds on this website and he does excellent work.

 

I would love to hit them to see how they feel through impact and various lies. Can you comment on how the grind compares to the other irons besides the obvious notch?

 

Must say they are really nice looking better than I thought they would look, you can tell they are a very high quality stick.

I'll be straight forward here...I'm NOT gonna recommend this pre-worn or cave in sole on an iron where you mostly do a full swing on your shots. You will have a very inconsistent ball flight and worst distance control.

 

To me it's gimmicky. I don't see any advantage, in fact i see more disadvantage having it on an iron. It's totally different purposes compare to a wedges. It looks like somebody running out of idea or desperate looking for a sales pitch idea IMO. At least cosmetically that spot will have a very quick worn out chrome spot. Trapped all those sands which act like a sand paper.

 

my 2 cents!

 

Joe

 

Open mouth, insert foot.

 

How can you comment on something you have never tried and know nothing about?

 

The master grinder Shinagawa san has been grinding clubs longer than you've been alive. Time to show some respect for the Master that has paved the way for the likes of people like yourself.

 

Just my 2 cents!

[Southside Striker]

Open mouth, insert foot.

 

How can you comment on something you have never tried and know nothing about?

 

The master grinder Shinagawa san has been grinding clubs longer than you've been alive. Time to show some respect for the Master that has paved the way for the likes of people like yourself.

 

Just my 2 cents!

 

 

I don't know much about grinds, but I know that your post is very disrespectful.

 

just my 2 cents!!

[joey3108]

I wonder if that notch is something that could be done to an exsiting blade by some like a Joe Kwok? I have seen some of his custom grinds on this website and he does excellent work.

 

I would love to hit them to see how they feel through impact and various lies. Can you comment on how the grind compares to the other irons besides the obvious notch?

 

Must say they are really nice looking better than I thought they would look, you can tell they are a very high quality stick.

I'll be straight forward here...I'm NOT gonna recommend this pre-worn or cave in sole on an iron where you mostly do a full swing on your shots. You will have a very inconsistent ball flight and worst distance control.

 

To me it's gimmicky. I don't see any advantage, in fact i see more disadvantage having it on an iron. It's totally different purposes compare to a wedges. It looks like somebody running out of idea or desperate looking for a sales pitch idea IMO. At least cosmetically that spot will have a very quick worn out chrome spot. Trapped all those sands which act like a sand paper.

 

my 2 cents!

 

Joe

 

Open mouth, insert foot.

 

How can you comment on something you have never tried and know nothing about?

 

The master grinder Shinagawa san has been grinding clubs longer than you've been alive. Time to show some respect for the Master that has paved the way for the likes of people like yourself.

 

Just my 2 cents!

I've met the guy and know exactly what is going on. Let's just leave it there.

 

You might want to check out the mirror yourself, then you understand respect and learn to except what other opinions and expertise.

 

Trust me! I've only show a small portion of it.

 

BTW, I didn't give opinion on his ability to grind...I only give opinion how it effect the play...or may be I'm missing something that someone trying to mislead here to make $.

 

Southside Striker,

 

That is OK, ignorant can lead people to say something out of line.

[Spoon]

joe,

 

no disrespect to you or others but may i ask why you think the sole grind is a gimmick or a desperate attempt for a sale's pitch? from your initial comment it seems you are totally dismissing the idea without actually having first hand knowledge or experience on the matter? reason why i say this is i have have been using wedges with the same sole grind to great success, from chikara etc etc and it does indeed have a positive effect. i also have had the privildge to hit mr shinagawas raw irons with the same sole grind and find them a joy to use. i have not notcied any inconsistent ball flight but i will agree with you that the sole shows more signs of wear but that is expected.

 

I've met the guy and know exactly what is going on. Let's just leave it there.

 

i am up to date with your work and am very impressed and have actually purchased some of your assembled clubs but you seem to have some issue with shinagawa san you are not telling us?you mentioned you know all about him? if so please enlighten us and please dont leave it there. if you think its something you cant discuss openly kindly pm me i would like to know.

 

just my 02 cents.

[joey3108]

joe,

 

no disrespect to you or others but may i ask why you think the sole grind is a gimmick or a desperate attempt for a sale's pitch? from your initial comment it seems you are totally dismissing the idea without actually having first hand knowledge or experience on the matter? reason why i say this is i have have been using wedges with the same sole grind to great success, from chikara etc etc and it does indeed have a positive effect. i also have had the privildge to hit mr shinagawas raw irons with the same sole grind and find them a joy to use. i have not notcied any inconsistent ball flight but i will agree with you that the sole shows more signs of wear but that is expected.

 

I've met the guy and know exactly what is going on. Let's just leave it there.

 

i am up to date with your work and am very impressed and have actually purchased some of your assembled clubs but you seem to have some issue with shinagawa san you are not telling us?you mentioned you know all about him? if so please enlighten us and please dont leave it there. if you think its something you cant discuss openly kindly pm me i would like to know.

 

just my 02 cents.

First thank you for giving me a compliment about my work, so you should at least have some experience about my quality work. NO disrespect to you too, Read my comment again carefully about wedges are being different in this case, remember I'm one of the guy who grind a P and M on a lot of wedges ( post #64 : http://www.golfwrx.com/forums/index.php?sh...22167&st=40 ). What make you so sure that I have no first hand knowledge or experience? Do you think I'm careless enough to give an opinion without base or at least experience it? Again my opinions are purely opinions base on my knowledge and experiences. Plus you are implying that i have some issue w/ Mr shinagawa...even suppose I do have some issue, that is between me and him, to bad that is not the case. I can see that this is just some of us a little over sensitive over my opinions. I have no problem apologizing if some people can't take my opinions, but my opinions are my opinions base on honesty.

 

Stirring the pot that are already full of misunderstanding is not a good thing to do. I'm not the only one who have/gave an opinions and agreed with it, that proves it that I'm not talking nonsense. Any body can agree or disagree on this subjective matter. IMO If you said NO DISRESPECT to me, then you should respect my opinions...right? Of course, I will do the same if you do give us your opinions too.

 

Again I would like to focus on opinions about the performance of this iron. The purpose of a P grind ( Pre worn )is to have a second bounce. For chipping or pitching, the leading edge will be closer to the ground for cleaner contact, for full shot is to trap the turf and dirt/soil in the cavity to act like a second bounce...so it won't dig and lift the ball up. Imagine if the ground condition is not consistent, It will give an inconsistent ball flight...thus it'll be harder to control for full shots IMO. A great iron player should know that controlling the trajectory of your iron shot is very important.

 

Cheers!

 

Joe

[jaskanski]

Hmm...

The grind on the Pro Preferrence may have worked for you, Shuttle, but the test is not really conclusive under a limited type of course conditions.

I am familiar with the P grind and I agree with Joe, it's not really a versatile sole and is designed to give more bounce on full shots - something you don't always want. It is probably the least popular Vokey grind.

Anyway, with the relatively small amount of grind displayed on these irons, it seems more like a trademark gimmick to set their irons apart from others. Therefore purely cosmetic rather than functional.

I am not putting Mr. Shinagawa's (who?)expertise into question; I'm sure the quality of the forging is tip top - it should be at that price.

If there really was something in the P grind on irons, I think the major OEM's would have jumped on it a long time ago. Just my 2 cents.

[shuttle1]

The bottom line here is anyone and everyone is entitled to thier own opinion.

 

HOWEVER, until you have first hand experience with something your opinion holds no water.

If you haven't played this club, your opinion is worthless.

 

Get 7-8 guys together and hit the PPM and the Miura 5003 side by side out of and off of several different lies. Let me know the results.

 

This grind is an expense the major OEM's are not willing to take on. They have to make their clubs as cheap as possible to make as much as possible.

 

I could go on... but I'm not here to argue with anyone, Jaskanski. It's just a shame that you and others that haven't tried something are so quick to put it down without first hand knowledge. When you buy 10-20 sets of clubs a year for no other reason than to just hit them to compare to the rest... then come talk to me.

[Mekeni]

I am actually a huge fan of that controversial sole grind. All started with a set of old Daiwa chairman set with Kevlar shafts and a set of same handmade jdm handmade raw heads mentioned. I find it alot easier to pick the ball cleanly without digging too deeply specially under wet conditions or even in thick rough. Heck even my cameron gamer has that grind.

:D

 

Anyway. Sorry for the threadjack. Thanks for the review. Thought it was informative!

[Entrada]

Back to the irons. Have the you seen the black ones on eBay with KBS Tour shafts? Even more beautiful!

[rymail00]

I wonder if that notch is something that could be done to an exsiting blade by some like a Joe Kwok? I have seen some of his custom grinds on this website and he does excellent work.

 

I would love to hit them to see how they feel through impact and various lies. Can you comment on how the grind compares to the other irons besides the obvious notch?

 

Must say they are really nice looking better than I thought they would look, you can tell they are a very high quality stick.

I'll be straight forward here...I'm NOT gonna recommend this pre-worn or cave in sole on an iron where you mostly do a full swing on your shots. You will have a very inconsistent ball flight and worst distance control.

 

To me it's gimmicky. I don't see any advantage, in fact i see more disadvantage having it on an iron. It's totally different purposes compare to a wedges. It looks like somebody running out of idea or desperate looking for a sales pitch idea IMO. At least cosmetically that spot will have a very quick worn out chrome spot. Trapped all those sands which act like a sand paper.

 

my 2 cents!

 

Joe

 

Open mouth, insert foot.

 

How can you comment on something you have never tried and know nothing about?

 

The master grinder Shinagawa san has been grinding clubs longer than you've been alive. Time to show some respect for the Master that has paved the way for the likes of people like yourself.

 

Just my 2 cents!

 

 

WOW uncalled for for! :vava: :nono:

[cbm]

I'll leave the "Pre worn groove grind" discussion the the clubmaking experts. And as I certainly respect that everyone is entitled to their opinion (which is what makes these forums great) You can NOT argue that the PPM is a beatiful looking club. Time (and further testing) well tell us weather or not these clubs are a fad.

 

In this day and age of triangular head shape drivers, 46 1/4 inch long "stock" shaft lengths for woods, crazy graphics and wild color schemes I think calling them gimmicky or just trying to make a dollar maybe a little unfair.

[TheCheat]

Oops, I just spilled some Kool-Aid on myself!

 

Why does this sound like sales pitch for a set of $1900 wedges, I mean irons, that a shady JDM site sells?

 

Last time I was on the Big Island I was told that Shinagawa was not doing ANY of the grind work himself. Just overseeing the process these days.

 

I'll stick with my cheaper Miura's.

[shuttle1]

Who are you calling shady? The JDM site that has had nothing but many happy customers? Repeated over and over again here on this website?

 

The last time I was in Hawaii is was told I could jump off the cliff and the wind would hold me up from falling....

 

So everyone knows:

 

I do not sell Golf equipment of any kind unless thinning out some of my many, many sets.

I buy Golf (a lot) equipment for know other reason than to hit it, to compare it to the other clubs out there.

I am a Golf Ho, it's what I love and my passion and am blessed with the income to do it.

 

And as I said in my original post:

 

"Again, this mini review was all for fun. It was not meant to try and determine that one Iron is better than another one. It was to compare some of the excellent Irons out there to see if any stand out above another. What made the PPM's stand out is the grind. They were all a pleasure to hit and felt fantastic. There were a lot of big smiles."

[jaskanski]

So why are trying to force people into your way of thinking?

Just because someone's opinion differs from your own, that is no reason to bad mouth them. If pro preferrence irons are really that good, then they can stand up to any criticism brought againsnt them.

They and we, do not need you to get on your soapbox and sing their praises to anyone who'll listen.

I've never owned a Buick, but I know I don't like them. Same with your beloved irons I guess.

Stop brow-beating the public.

[shuttle1]

So why are trying to force people into your way of thinking?

Just because someone's opinion differs from your own, that is no reason to bad mouth them. If pro preferrence irons are really that good, then they can stand up to any criticism brought againsnt them.

They and we, do not need you to get on your soapbox and sing their praises to anyone who'll listen.

I've never owned a Buick, but I know I don't like them. Same with your beloved irons I guess.

Stop brow-beating the public.

 

Obviosly, you can't read. There is no "brow-beating" here. You have no reason to respond in this thread except to be an antagonist.

You're very good at it.

[jaskanski]

Thanks, shuttle - I'll take that as a compliment.

:tongue:

[cbm]

Anymore reviews? or anyone gaming these? Love the(my) AF tours BUT these still look/interest me?

[shuttle1]

They're in the bag full time right now. There is something about the grind on these that makes them just a bit more versatile. But, it wouldn't hurt my feelings to put the AF Tours back in the bag at any time.

 

How are they treating you??

[cbm]

I just updated my review on the AF tours-Really got them dialed in now after 8 rounds or so.Super solid,soft great feel NOT clicky at all which I thought- could maybe the case w/ endo forged irons (did endo forge some of the Titleist blades a while back ?) I like the irons so much I'm looking at the Epon fairway wood!

 

I gotta admit the PPM's are very pretty !!

[elwhippy]

Those Miuras look 20 years out of date, like some late 80s throwbacks. The obsession with Japanese boutique blades is baffling. Wedges yes, a great wedge can make a real difference but a set of thin edged blades is a museum piece in waiting. I see this as a bit like the watch market. A Rolex, Omega or Breitling is as good as it gets it terms of engineering, quality and reliability yet some people pay £50000 for a pimped, trashy looking designer watch and think it is superior. Same with putters. Ping, Cameron, Odyssey, Bettinardi. That is as far as you need to go. Gold's Factory putters won't cure a bad stroke or a bad read!

[tongt]

Here is my review on PPM. When i first try this iron ( #6) I did not know what model/brand it was, I went into the proshop for a grip change and the proshop had this iron as a tester for the client along with epon etc. I thought that while I wait I just wanted to swing a few balls. When I first hit this club the feel of the club is really soft and it stood out and to my surprise it is one of the easier club to hit. I eventually purchased a set to try. I do not know about any of the above issue but with this club the ball can be pick off easily and clean. When in the rough, I had no trouble getting it out. I have tried/owned many other foreign brand i.e Fourteen 1000 tb, miura Cb 1005,2006, 201(old US spec), Zodia blade and Gold factory (Cavity back) etc... I think this club ranks up there with the miura interms of feel (soft). But may be due to it being muscle back, it is more solid imo. I am just an avg. golfer (10-12 handicap) and I put in Nspro 950 R shaft and still loving it. No regrets what so ever. By the way I have seen this type of sole in Honma and mizuno before but it was really really old model.