New Phone apps. Non-Conforming ?

[ronbo]

Players DQ for using them in tournament

I just heard that a bunch of amateurs using iPhone app(s) at the PGA Tour Superstore World Am Handicap Championships were disqualified b/c smart phones were ruled non-conforming.

One of my friends sent me this link and thought I would pass it on. I guess I won't be bringing my iphone to any events next year. Have been a Big Skycaddie Guy anyway, love my iphone, but not for golf.
I guess if you load an app. that is on your phone,ie green reader, the USGA will DQ you even if you don't intend to use it. Makes sense, just like the laser units that are non-Conforming that use slope. You can't even have it in your bag, turned off.

What do you think of that?

http://www.thesunnews.com/217/story/105141...ylink=mirelated

[Peter_b]

That is what I wrote in the Golfshot section. as long as the Software Devs do not send their Apps to the R&A they are non conforming and DQ is completely understandable. So better use an R&A approoved Laser if Rangefinders are alowed.

[stage1350]

Anything that keeps phones off the golf course is a good thing.

Did they tweet about their disappointment?

[TM_HOYER]

[quote name='ronbo' post='1951067' date='Sep 14 2009, 10:03 PM']I just heard that a bunch of amateurs using iPhone app(s) at the PGA Tour Superstore World Am Handicap Championships were disqualified b/c smart phones were ruled non-conforming.

One of my friends sent me this link and thought I would pass it on. I guess I won't be bringing my iphone to any events next year. Have been a Big Skycaddie Guy anyway, love my iphone, but not for golf.
I guess if you load an app. that is on your phone,ie green reader, the USGA will DQ you even if you don't intend to use it. Makes sense, just like the laser units that are non-Conforming that use slope. You can't even have it in your bag, turned off.

What do you think of that?

[url="http://www.thesunnews.com/217/story/1051413.html?storylink=mirelated"]http://www.thesunnews.com/217/story/105141...ylink=mirelated[/url][/quote]

The story did not say the USGA has ruled the phone GPS apps as non-conforming. All it said was that the World Am implemented a local rule stating the phone GPS apps could not be used. They decided they did not have the ability right now to prevent the use of non-conforming phone apps. My Stanley bubble level app is illegal for use (could be used for the break of the green) and they would not have a way to monitor that I would not use it.

When the USGA ruled rangefinders could be used for handicap rounds, our club still had approve a local rule to allow use of the rangefinders.

[ronbo]

I guess my point and feeling is that the USGA in Jan. will make all smart phones Illegal and Non-Conforming and will keep the ruling on units like skycaddie and others the same. It would be impossible to police all smart phones and this should be an easy call by the USGA.

[TM_HOYER]

The rules are clear on what is allowed and not allowed. I would not expect smartphone GPS apps to be ruled as non-conforming as long as they do not tell you the break of the green, wind direction, or slope to the green. What I would expect is an update to the Decisions on the Rules of Golf. This will define what is acceptable and not acceptable along with the penalty for breaking the rules.

[ronbo]

I agree with you on what is in place this year. But my opinion for next year is that they will rule against them (smart phones) The fact the phones have the ability to give you illegal information while playing is what your missing. That's why the Bushnell laser with slope is a non-conforming unit. It has the ability to be used at any given time but doesn't mean you will use it. That's why you can't even have it in your bag turned off, because at any given time you have a chance to reach in your bag and turn it on.

Let give credit where credit is do and that most golfers have the integrity to not cheat, but there's always a few that spoil it for the rest of us.

[phil75070]

[quote name='TM_HOYER' post='1953318' date='Sep 15 2009, 08:55 PM']The rules are clear on what is allowed and not allowed. I would not expect smartphone GPS apps to be ruled as non-conforming as long as they do not tell you the break of the green, wind direction, or slope to the green. What I would expect is an update to the Decisions on the Rules of Golf. This will define what is acceptable and not acceptable along with the penalty for breaking the rules.[/quote]

As Ronbo points out, it is not the fact that the specific apps like GolfLogix or Golfshots for the smartphones don't give you the break, wind direction or velocity, etc. it is the fact that there are apps that do that can easily be downloaded to a smartphone and used. His example of the laser rangefinder with slope function is the perfect example.

[ijuswanagolf]

[quote name='phil75070' post='1953980' date='Sep 16 2009, 08:23 AM'][quote name='TM_HOYER' post='1953318' date='Sep 15 2009, 08:55 PM']The rules are clear on what is allowed and not allowed. I would not expect smartphone GPS apps to be ruled as non-conforming as long as they do not tell you the break of the green, wind direction, or slope to the green. What I would expect is an update to the Decisions on the Rules of Golf. This will define what is acceptable and not acceptable along with the penalty for breaking the rules.[/quote]

As Ronbo points out, it is not the fact that the specific apps like GolfLogix or Golfshots for the smartphones don't give you the break, wind direction or velocity, etc. it is the fact that there are apps that do that can easily be downloaded to a smartphone and used. His example of the laser rangefinder with slope function is the perfect example.
[/quote]

We don't rule a sand wedge non-conforming because it "could" be grounded in a bunker and I think the same logic needs to be used here. Don't throw the baby out with the bath water. Rule against and disqualify the player that lays his iPhone down on the green with the level program running to measure the slope - that's the rule breaker not the GolfLogix or GolfShot user!

[phil75070]

[quote name='ijuswanagolf ' post='1995100' date='Oct 8 2009, 04:07 PM'][quote name='phil75070' post='1953980' date='Sep 16 2009, 08:23 AM'][quote name='TM_HOYER' post='1953318' date='Sep 15 2009, 08:55 PM']The rules are clear on what is allowed and not allowed. I would not expect smartphone GPS apps to be ruled as non-conforming as long as they do not tell you the break of the green, wind direction, or slope to the green. What I would expect is an update to the Decisions on the Rules of Golf. This will define what is acceptable and not acceptable along with the penalty for breaking the rules.[/quote]

As Ronbo points out, it is not the fact that the specific apps like GolfLogix or Golfshots for the smartphones don't give you the break, wind direction or velocity, etc. it is the fact that there are apps that do that can easily be downloaded to a smartphone and used. His example of the laser rangefinder with slope function is the perfect example.
[/quote]

We don't rule a sand wedge non-conforming because it "could" be grounded in a bunker and I think the same logic needs to be used here. Don't throw the baby out with the bath water. Rule against and disqualify the player that lays his iPhone down on the green with the level program running to measure the slope - that's the rule breaker not the GolfLogix or GolfShot user!
[/quote]

But, by the same token, laser rangefinders with slope function, even if turned off, have been ruled illegal because it "could" be used. You can't tell by the way the way it is being used if the slope function is being used or not. Placing the iPhone on the ground to measure the degree of break is one thing, but how would you know if the player is looking at his iPhone to get other information as opposed to just getting yardage unless you were looking over his shoulder? We'll just have to wait and see what the USGA eventually says.

People were using GPS and laser devices in non-competitive golf long before the USGA changed 14-3 to specifically allow them if there is a local rule. I have no doubt that many would still use the iPhone and these apps even if the USGA rules them illegal. Despite claims otherwise, there is no way A-GPS as used in smartphones is anywhere near accurate enough for me (testing shows a median accuracy of 8m).

[Pepperturbo]

I can't believe golfers aware of all the rules, take it upon themselves to use iPhones golf GPS functionality. Glad they all got DQ'd. Lesson learned, maybe...

[ronbo]

At least one person understands my point.