Country Club type service?

[Thrillhouse]

[quote name='wholeinwon ' timestamp='1332112000' post='4531701']
[quote name='Thrillhouse' timestamp='1332111758' post='4531683']
[quote name='wholeinwon ' timestamp='1332111408' post='4531647']
Pad that post count...you get a reward the more you post.
[b]I'm a pretty popular poster around here, a lot of people find me pretty funny, thanks for noticing![/b]

I'm not mad because you don't agree with me, I'm mad because you make generalizations about people in my industry.
[b]Yeah, generalizatons that are true![/b]

Say it's comical for me to call you names yet you keep calling me a stoner...
[b]If you are not one then you are the most pro marijuana non smoker I have ever met. [/b]
[/quote]
[/quote]


[/quote]


Ha ha, thats another win for thrillhouse!

[wholeinwon]

[quote name='Thrillhouse' timestamp='1332112070' post='4531707']



Ha ha, thats another win for thrillhouse!
[/quote]

I mean now that I get it, I do find it funny...

Just want to clear 2 things up:

1. I don't smoke weed, but I am pro weed, I have nothing against it...but I DO NOT smoke it
2. Internet arguments are pointless

[Thrillhouse]

Ha ha, thats another win for thrillhouse!

 

I mean now that I get it, I do find it funny...

 

Just want to clear 2 things up:

 

1. I don't smoke weed, but I am pro weed, I have nothing against it...but I DO NOT smoke it

2. Internet arguments are pointless

 

LOL, if thats the case then no hard feelings and ill let this be!

 

[drpino]

[b]Thrillhouse, please temper your posting rate PER THE FORUM
RULES. Keep in mind that just because you may be "popular" with some members, that does not exempt you from the rule barring the "running" of topics. [/b]

Methinks some of the time and effort devoted to debating this topic would be better spent on more important things.

[tElihu]

[quote name='Pepperturbo' timestamp='1331924844' post='4520691']
[quote name='tElihu' timestamp='1331902184' post='4518757']
[quote name='Thrillhouse' timestamp='1331837772' post='4514329']
After paying $100 to play a round of golf i'm supposed to pay some goofball kid just to leave me alone AND I can't leave a styrofoam cup and an empty sleeve of balls in a cart for him to throw out?

I always knew these kids thought it was their job to stand around doing nothing and looking pretty, I just didn't think so many of their customers agreed with them.
[/quote]

I think you've generalized a bit too much here. There's a level of common sense that needs to come into play. If you leave a coffee cup and/or an empty sleeve of balls in the cart, I don't think that's a big deal and you "owe" them nothing. But if you completely trash the cart, I think you could be a little considerate to those who have to clean after your mess. They're paid to be cart attendants, not janitors.

Also, I don't think anyone here is saying you are required to pay them to leave you alone. It's a tip, and it's up to the discretion of the person giving it. Personally I do it because it is MY choice.(yes, I know you didn't quote me, but I am guilty of the act that you seem to find egregious).

But to me it's interesting that after spending $100 on a round of golf, that $1 all of a sudden makes the overall cost exorbitant.
[/quote]

You have to be theorizing based upon your view. If I were you, I'd talk to club management about what's expected of cart attendants. I was on the member board of a corporate owned club and the board of equity club and intermittently play with Club General managers. At my last two clubs, part of the attendants job was to keep all the carts clean, that includes trash after every use, plus insure the battery is charged. They normally take turns with club attendants working the bag drop and cleaning clubs when golfers walk off 18 is typically reserved for upscale clubs. They are paid a minimum salary - tips are optional.

Whether someone willingly puts their trash in a can is optional. No different from movie theater attendants that clean up after patrons watched a movie. IMO - Tipping Is egregious when someone, out of social guilt, tips, for a service or job they either didn't request or was poor service. Like tipping a server for poor service at a restaurant... they don't deserve a tip. If more people would not tip for poor service some of the lazy entitlement minds might get the idea their work is unsatisfactory, and improve. Take the guy that wipes down the car after a car wash; it has to be done. We car owners don't get an opportunity to say, don't need it. If someone doesn't need it, they use the drive through car wash at the gas station. If the car attendant does a poor job, he gets nothing from me, if he does an exemplary job, he gets more.

To an extent, you prove my point in your last sentence suggesting "expectation". Just because someone spends 100 or 300 on a rd of golf, doesn't suggest they should tip, much less for poor service, or tip for unwanted services. In fact, doing suggests poor fiscal judgment. I drive expensive cars - because I can afford them doesn't mean I should throw money around to undeserving workers.
As a related note, in SOCA I watch people tip for things they shouldn't tip for, and many tip way too much. I watched a bartender tip 30% over an above for a simple haircut. Its these types of people that have moderate incomes, and many are struggling due to the economy. I've got it to burn" poor judgment, so lets give it away - that line of thinking overlaps into other areas of their life too. Its not $1 or 2... its much more many times per year. Typically, those same people have no savings, and own nothing; makes no prudent sense.
[/quote]


I don't disagree with too much of what you said (mainly because you really didn't address my points), with the exception that I'm "theorizing". My background in golf is every bit as accomplished and experienced as yours, if not more. I just don't spend every post reminding everyone of that fact in the most self-aggrandizing way imaginable.

[Pepperturbo]

[quote name='tElihu' timestamp='1332165480' post='4535153']
I don't disagree with too much of what you said (mainly because you really didn't address my points), with the exception that I'm "theorizing". My background in golf is every bit as accomplished and experienced as yours, if not more. I just don't spend every post reminding everyone of that fact in the most self-aggrandizing way imaginable.
[/quote]

Are we not suppose to be civil here??? I didn't address your points because you made none. I dont' argue over baloney, theory or conjecture, just what experience has taught me. Now, you claim comparable experiences, maybe more; yet offer none in support, and follow with an underhanded insult. Great social skills... and for what, so you can feel the bigger man... I hope you feel better; obviously you need it.

Appreciate my post content / style or not, I've been in a variety of leadership rolls, where my vantage point offers real life perspectives and experience that's not commonly shared here. What's sad is, some posters like yourself opt to argue over conjecture, and when they run out of conjecture, they do what you did; opt for insult... good luck with that example.

[MileHi]

What a train-wreck of a thread.

I'll give the kid a few bucks if they clean my clubs off. Probably don't deserve it, but it's not much money to me and it probably is to them, and I was in a similar spot many years ago and I appreciated it. Only thing that annoys me is if they give me that look like they expect a tip for just picking your clubs off the ground and putting them on the cart, or taking them off.

[tElihu]

[quote name='Pepperturbo' timestamp='1332172484' post='4535929']
[quote name='tElihu' timestamp='1332165480' post='4535153']
I don't disagree with too much of what you said (mainly because you really didn't address my points), with the exception that I'm "theorizing". My background in golf is every bit as accomplished and experienced as yours, if not more. I just don't spend every post reminding everyone of that fact in the most self-aggrandizing way imaginable.
[/quote]

Are we not suppose to be civil here??? I didn't address your points because you made none. I dont' argue over baloney, theory or conjecture, just what experience has taught me. Now, you claim comparable experiences, maybe more; yet offer none in support, and follow with an underhanded insult. Great social skills... and for what, so you can feel the bigger man... I hope you feel better; obviously you need it.

Appreciate my post content / style or not, I've been in a variety of leadership rolls, where my vantage point offers real life perspectives and experience that's not commonly shared here. What's sad is, some posters like yourself opt to argue over conjecture, and when they run out of conjecture, they do what you did; opt for insult... good luck with that example.
[/quote]

I apologize. Usually I find your Ron Burgundy shtick to be entertaining. This time I just felt the need to respond:

[b][url="http://www.imdb.com/name/nm0002071/"]Ron Burgundy[/url][/b]: I don't know how to put this but I'm kind of a big deal.
[b][url="http://www.imdb.com/name/nm0000775/"]Veronica Corningstone[/url][/b]: Really.
[b][url="http://www.imdb.com/name/nm0002071/"]Ron Burgundy[/url][/b]: People know me.
[b][url="http://www.imdb.com/name/nm0000775/"]Veronica Corningstone[/url][/b]: Well, I'm very happy for you.
[b][url="http://www.imdb.com/name/nm0002071/"]Ron Burgundy[/url][/b]: I'm very important. I have many leather-bound books and my apartment smells of rich mahogany.

By the way though, if you're not going to address my points because, as you say, I made none, then don't quote me next time.

[Pepperturbo]

[quote name='tElihu' timestamp='1332247842' post='4542042']
[quote name='Pepperturbo' timestamp='1332172484' post='4535929']
[quote name='tElihu' timestamp='1332165480' post='4535153']
I don't disagree with too much of what you said (mainly because you really didn't address my points), with the exception that I'm "theorizing". My background in golf is every bit as accomplished and experienced as yours, if not more. I just don't spend every post reminding everyone of that fact in the most self-aggrandizing way imaginable.
[/quote]

Are we not suppose to be civil here??? I didn't address your points because you made none. I dont' argue over baloney, theory or conjecture, just what experience has taught me. Now, you claim comparable experiences, maybe more; yet offer none in support, and follow with an underhanded insult. Great social skills... and for what, so you can feel the bigger man... I hope you feel better; obviously you need it.

Appreciate my post content / style or not, I've been in a variety of leadership rolls, where my vantage point offers real life perspectives and experience that's not commonly shared here. What's sad is, some posters like yourself opt to argue over conjecture, and when they run out of conjecture, they do what you did; opt for insult... good luck with that example.
[/quote]

I apologize. Usually I find your Ron Burgundy shtick to be entertaining. This time I just felt the need to respond:

[b][url="http://www.imdb.com/name/nm0002071/"]Ron Burgundy[/url][/b]: I don't know how to put this but I'm kind of a big deal.
[b][url="http://www.imdb.com/name/nm0000775/"]Veronica Corningstone[/url][/b]: Really.
[b][url="http://www.imdb.com/name/nm0002071/"]Ron Burgundy[/url][/b]: People know me.
[b][url="http://www.imdb.com/name/nm0000775/"]Veronica Corningstone[/url][/b]: Well, I'm very happy for you.
[b][url="http://www.imdb.com/name/nm0002071/"]Ron Burgundy[/url][/b]: I'm very important. I have many leather-bound books and my apartment smells of rich mahogany.

By the way though, if you're not going to address my points because, as you say, I made none, then don't quote me next time.
[/quote]

Sorry you chose to ignore my points in lieu of rudeness and name calling. But, now I understand... quoting what Ron Burgundy says to another character speaks volumes.

[tElihu]

I did not ignore your points (unlike you I shall refrain from the weak, petty argument that you made none), but as of now I am ignoring you and your condescension. (Apparently you fail to recall that you first replied to me in your typical haughty, condescending tone).

My character is what it is. I really couldn't care less about your dime-store prognosis of it. Not to mention my view of your character is equally as damning. (Sorry friend but you don't corner the market on superior judgment.)

Good day.

[jli2636]

I had been reading this thread but havent posted anything until now. I worked at a course for 4 years that was semi private and not all that busy, but we certainly had our busy days. Alot of stuff for job descriptions is unstated. It comes with the territory, especially if you already are a golfer before you start working in a pro shop. You already know how other people trash carts, and no matter how high and mighty you seem, you probably have trashed a cart yourself. I am guilty of it, especially when Im at a course other than the one I worked at. I figure, I get paid to clean it out when Im on the clock, someone else should here. ITS PART OF THE JOB. I also never expected a tip out of ANYONE. I even changed a flat tire for a member while he was in the locker room getting ready for his round. He did end up tipping me because he was very persistent but I wouldnt accept it at first. I felt it was part of the job and just something that needed to be done. PERIOD. There is such a sense of entitlement these days that it makes me sick. If you go above and beyond you MIGHT get a tip from me, but if you do the status quo or below forget about it.

also, most of these kids you say that are "struggling" to live off tips are still living with mom and dad and dont have to pay rent, bills, food, insurance, tuition, etc. Yes I realize there are a few(myself included) who were older than high school age, but my golf course job was a secondary job and I used it mainly for the free golf. Any paycheck was just kind of a bonus.

[Pepperturbo]

[quote name='jli2636' timestamp='1332386051' post='4554310']
I had been reading this thread but havent posted anything until now. I worked at a course for 4 years that was semi private and not all that busy, but we certainly had our busy days. Alot of stuff for job descriptions is unstated. It comes with the territory, especially if you already are a golfer before you start working in a pro shop. You already know how other people trash carts, and no matter how high and mighty you seem, you probably have trashed a cart yourself. I am guilty of it, especially when Im at a course other than the one I worked at. I figure, I get paid to clean it out when Im on the clock, someone else should here. ITS PART OF THE JOB. I also never expected a tip out of ANYONE. I even changed a flat tire for a member while he was in the locker room getting ready for his round. He did end up tipping me because he was very persistent but I wouldnt accept it at first. I felt it was part of the job and just something that needed to be done. PERIOD. There is such a sense of entitlement these days that it makes me sick. If you go above and beyond you MIGHT get a tip from me, but if you do the status quo or below forget about it.

also, most of these kids you say that are "struggling" to live off tips are still living with mom and dad and dont have to pay rent, bills, food, insurance, tuition, etc. Yes I realize there are a few(myself included) who were older than high school age, but my golf course job was a secondary job and I used it mainly for the free golf. Any paycheck was just kind of a bonus.

[/quote]

Just wanted to say thank you for presenting reality and being what sounds like a good person and employee. Eighty-five percent of our members owned custom carts, myself included. Our attendants, without prompting, willingly cleaned our carts while we were in the grill room after 18 holes. They'd even ask if we wanted our carts washed. There were a few occasions when my cart was used by an attendant to get home and back the next day (gated community) And, like you, they would change our tires and remind us if our tires were low, even drive it into the cart barn and re-inflate tires before a round. None of our attendants were struggling either. As you said most lived at home, and most were destine for college.

At my last club tipping wasn't allowed, and cart and barn attendants were paid hourly. Most of them worked PT while in HS and FT during summers and got free golf, lessons and some other benefits. At the end of the year all members chipped in to a pool to be dived up among all attendants. We did the same for all other dept employees too. They got some really nice year end surprises. A reward for not being entitled jerks. The best part, none of our cart attendants, or for that matter club employees, exhibited attitudes like those exhibited here. If they did, they wouldn't have a job, plain and simple.

All of our members were very successful executives, business owners and professionals. As an unexpected benefit later on, some of those attendants ended up getting much better paying jobs from members, and some got help when they went off to college. Why .. because they showed initiative and manners. We even sponsored a few to attend PGA schools. Yes, cleaning carts is part of the job. The smart ones figured that and knew which side their bread is buttered on. Sounds like you had and have the right attitude.