Cough it up, please .... (Mr. Hogan re-gripping?)

[Fade]

Cough it up, please ....

 

.... the 'secret' of Mr. Hogan re-gripping at the top of his backswing, as mentioned in this post:

 

http://www.golfwrx.c...40#entry6004251

 

Please post or link to a video that shows this clearly.

 

Thank you in advance.

 

(I am not yet allowed to participate in this forum, due to my low-post count, but strangely enough I can start a new topic here! And I do think this topic is worthy of its own thread.)

[Ben Hogan Swing Project]

Fade, sorry about the low post count, but glad you can be a thread starter. My definition of regrip is probably not in line with the common definition.

"During the first round of the 2001 Nedbank Golf challenge, in Sun City, South Africa, the young Spaniard [sergio Garcia] was faced with a second shot across water to the green. After 60 - yes, 60 - re-grips, he eventually backed away from the shot, screaming: 'Hit the [ef-ing] ball!' before throwing his two-iron back in his bag. Moments later, he whipped out his wedge and laid up instead. After his round, his father, former European Tour professional Victor García, took Sergio straight to the driving range, where he was made to practice with his hands taped to the club."

A common definition of regrip might be "removing the fingers and/or hands from the club then putting them back on, in the same place as originally gripped, or in different place."

When I mentioned my idea of Hogan regripping, I was referring to his right palm coming off the club at the top of his swing. My original thinking of the golf grip was that when you gripped the club at address, it stayed that way throughout the entire swing. And the guys that could get the club waaaaaaay around their necks had some type of extra terrestrial wrist flexion ability. I no longer think this is the case after seeing the right palms come off the grip. Sadlowski, Couples, John Daly, Bobby Jones, Hogan, etc. I'll put together a video training guide for a visual. I do think some folks have an increased range of wrist/hand/finger flexion, but for the person that does not have as much, they just need to "create it," although I don't mean "create" in an intentional sense.

And there are no golf secrets. There are secrets in David Copperfields and other magicians acts. The secret happens when they raise the black cape to momentarily hide the woman being cut in half. No black capes in golf swings, although many illusions exist.

So, for those that want to have fun experimenting with this, take your usual grip at address. Notice how your fingers and palms are attached to the club. Then swing to the top. Hold. Look up at your right palm. Is it still glued to the club as it was at address? When i do this, mine is still glued, because when i used to read golf magazines, I was told "the grip is the most important part of your swing. You must get a comfortable grip and keep it that way. If you lose your grip, you lose your swing." Now unglue the right palm from club. Unglue it a little, or unglue it a lot. While your glue is failing, whats your clubhead doing? Yeeeeeeaww....you're a magician and you didn't even know it!!

[Ben Hogan Swing Project]

A friend corrected me via PM. I was not accurate in my description. The right palm separates from left thumb at the top. Because right palm is not technically on the shaft.

[ej002]

CLEAR pictures or it didn't happen.

[Crab Daddy]

Is this what you're talking about?

http://youtu.be/xwgHqORknxU
(First :30 is all you need)

[Crab Daddy]

#*$&#! Double post.

[PingG10guy]

[quote name='ej002' timestamp='1356979634' post='6144025']
CLEAR pictures or it didn't happen.
[/quote]

Thought I told you before? Search Hogan perfect swing on YouTube and watch from 1:45

[PingG10guy]

[quote name='Crab Daddy' timestamp='1357053609' post='6147687']
#*$&#! Double post.
[/quote]

We're talking about right. He said left. He laying off the club and getting steeper (shaft in ds). Hogan was layed off but flattened the shaft layer.

Although the thought of doing the right hand and left hand like that makes it seem like the club "feels" like its falling out of the hands during the entire downswing

[dairic]

[quote name='Crab Daddy' timestamp='1357053595' post='6147685']
Is this what you're talking about?

http://youtu.be/xwgHqORknxU
(First :30 is all you need)
[/quote]

Vary grip pressure to shape shots. Start at 1:30

http://youtube.com/watch?v=fjZfnvOayNw

[PingG10guy]

http://youtu.be/no1JgdM6q4Y?t=1m45s

[PingG10guy]

[attachment=1471567:Hogan P4ish.jpg]

[tembolo1284]

So any of the coaches around here convinced?

[Ben Hogan Swing Project]

[quote name='tembolo1284' timestamp='1357142903' post='6153307']
So any of the coaches around here convinced?
[/quote]

To all coaches:

If you only saw real-speed video or in-person swings of Phil and Vijay, would you have believed that their hand was coming off the club around impact? I remember watching a Tour event that they were playing in and the announcers mentioned this was happening. I said "no stinkin way thier hand can come off the club....they wouldn't be accurate...they wouldn't be on the pro tour....tour players probably have the most solid/sound grips of any golfer."

Then they played the slomo vid. My bottom lip dropped.

I wonder if Phil and Vijay knew their hand was coming off the club around impact until they saw it on video? I wonder if they both "feel" their grip is solid all the way from address to finish, and doesn't deviate/change?

[tembolo1284]

This isn't at impact you are talking about with Hogan though right?

[tembolo1284]

Here's Vijay after hitting ball. Pretty crazy.

[attachment=1472775:vijayHandOff.jpg]

[Ben Hogan Swing Project]

[quote name='tembolo1284' timestamp='1357143552' post='6153397']
This isn't at impact you are talking about with Hogan though right?
[/quote]

Correct. Talking about Hogan at the top near or behind the head. And I don't categorize this as any major thing, its just something I saw during my study. Happens in some players swings.

[MizunoJoe]

[quote name='tembolo1284' timestamp='1357143652' post='6153417']
Here's Vijay after hitting ball. Pretty crazy.

[attachment=1472775:vijayHandOff.jpg]
[/quote]

VJ said he didn't know that was happening!!!

[tembolo1284]

[quote name='Ben Hogan Swing Project' timestamp='1357145370' post='6153579']
[quote name='tembolo1284' timestamp='1357143552' post='6153397']
This isn't at impact you are talking about with Hogan though right?
[/quote]

Correct. Talking about Hogan at the top near or behind the head. And I don't categorize this as any major thing, its just something I saw during my study. Happens in some players swings.
[/quote]

For all that is holy please don't try doing this when you do your own impersonation of Hogan. You could end up castrating yourself by slinging the club accidentally right at the boys.

[PingG10guy]

[quote name='Ben Hogan Swing Project' timestamp='1357145370' post='6153579']
[quote name='tembolo1284' timestamp='1357143552' post='6153397']
This isn't at impact you are talking about with Hogan though right?
[/quote]

Correct. Talking about Hogan at the top near or behind the head. And I don't categorize this as any major thing, its just something I saw during my study. Happens in some players swings.
[/quote]

That lifeline stays off all the way on the right hand. At impact its kinda hooded over the left hand but the RH pressure is just pp3 area. Its noticeable in most HD impact photos

[Ben Hogan Swing Project]

[quote name='tembolo1284' timestamp='1357160523' post='6155109']
[quote name='Ben Hogan Swing Project' timestamp='1357145370' post='6153579']
[quote name='tembolo1284' timestamp='1357143552' post='6153397']
This isn't at impact you are talking about with Hogan though right?
[/quote]

Correct. Talking about Hogan at the top near or behind the head. And I don't categorize this as any major thing, its just something I saw during my study. Happens in some players swings.
[/quote]

For all that is holy please don't try doing this when you do your own impersonation of Hogan. You could end up castrating yourself by slinging the club accidentally right at the boys.
[/quote]

Its on my list of things to do, but nowhere near thinkin about that right now. It's funny that people who have been following me from the beginning say my swing is progressing. And I have that feeling sometimes too, but when I look at my swing, this first thing I always say is "Danm..!! Look at the takeaway. It is just waaaaay off!" Then I grab a club and start running through takeaway drills again. It never ends. And Kim reminded me yesterday. She said "um, you know it is another year now?? It's 2013.....you done with this golf stuff yet?!?!?!?!?!?!?!?!?!?!?!?!?!!?!?!?!?!?!?!!?!?!?!?!?"

[tembolo1284]

[quote name='Ben Hogan Swing Project' timestamp='1357162516' post='6155315']
[quote name='tembolo1284' timestamp='1357160523' post='6155109']
[quote name='Ben Hogan Swing Project' timestamp='1357145370' post='6153579']
[quote name='tembolo1284' timestamp='1357143552' post='6153397']
This isn't at impact you are talking about with Hogan though right?
[/quote]

Correct. Talking about Hogan at the top near or behind the head. And I don't categorize this as any major thing, its just something I saw during my study. Happens in some players swings.
[/quote]

For all that is holy please don't try doing this when you do your own impersonation of Hogan. You could end up castrating yourself by slinging the club accidentally right at the boys.
[/quote]

Its on my list of things to do, but nowhere near thinkin about that right now. It's funny that people who have been following me from the beginning say my swing is progressing. And I have that feeling sometimes too, but when I look at my swing, this first thing I always say is "Danm..!! Look at the takeaway. It is just waaaaay off!" Then I grab a club and start running through takeaway drills again. It never ends. And Kim reminded me yesterday. She said "um, you know it is another year now?? It's 2013.....you done with this golf stuff yet?!?!?!?!?!?!?!?!?!?!?!?!?!!?!?!?!?!?!?!!?!?!?!?!?"
[/quote]

You tell her it's only just begun!!!!!

New year...new ball flight right? Where is it? Show ME!

[PingG10guy]

[attachment=1473413:Hogan P5ish.jpg]

Still see that shadow. Cameras werent the best back then but the shadow stays for a long time.

Now consider how weak his right hand was at address. Look at it here. I know Im mixing swings/years. But you can see.

[attachment=1473415:hogan446.jpg]
[attachment=1473417:Hoggie P7ish.jpg]

[PingG10guy]

[quote name='tembolo1284' timestamp='1357143652' post='6153417']
Here's Vijay after hitting ball. Pretty crazy.

[attachment=1472775:vijayHandOff.jpg]
[/quote]

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=tXDnQ_3SvCU

He didnt do it from the top though. Looks like he is inducing his lead wrist roll through impact by just peeling the lifeline off. Different. Hogan's seems to be set at the top of the swing and then everything else is a reaction. Vijay really looks like he is doing that on purpose. "looks". Never studied Vijay like that.

[ej002]

Right hand is still very weak in that picture, look how open the face is. The LH is attempting to bow.

[Fade]

Woohoo! I have 75 posts, so I can post here now. For starters: [b]Thank you[/b] for the replies so far!

[PingG10guy]

[quote name='ej002' timestamp='1357168069' post='6155829']
Right hand is still very weak in that picture, look how open the face is. The LH is attempting to bow.
[/quote]

Think in 3d. Look at how his left thumb is exposed and the right hand looks peeled off to a certain extent. It's obvious. If you cant see it from that pic there's a lot of other things you dont see in the swing imo. No offense.

[ej002]

No offense taken, I just don't agree. I see what you are referring too. But I can make a five lesson's grip and get the same look at that angle in a mirror. It looks like the face can be anywhere from 20-45* open right there. The right hand didn't cover the ball yet, IMO you will always see a bit of thumb from that perspective.

[tembolo1284]

ya, i'm not convinced. My grip is pretty strong and you can still see some thumb from that angle.

Vijay takes his hand officially off the grip. Hogan i'm not seeing it as such a clear case.

I think even with bobby jones it's clear he re-grip at the top of the swing. I think sam snead or someone
called it playing the flute.

[hoganfan924]

People trying to interpret shadows and camera artifacts into some "new discovery." Bunch of nonsense, IMO. Go study a few hundred films of great players (even with high speed HD video) and you'll see much the same look. The fact that Hogan didn't wear a glove makes it even more difficult to delineate what is his left thumb, what is the meaty pad of the right thumb, what are the middle two finger of the right hand and what is a shadow.

Even this super slow-mo of Tiger (with hand close-up in transition) looks similar (with no "regrip"):

[media=]http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=8EA592NK3yY[/media]

[Ben Hogan Swing Project]

[indent=1]Hfan, I too agree about TIger. And here's a closeup. No regrip there. I've never categorized him in this topic.[/indent]

[indent=1][url="http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=cuPHQrjX_gY"]http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=cuPHQrjX_gY[/url][/indent]

[indent=1]The regrip (or right palm coming off left thumb) is most prominent in players that go beyond parallel.[/indent]