The distance of Ben Hogan?

[MattBarbier13]

I have searched far and low to try and find some inkling of information on the average distance Mr. Hogan could knock it around with each club. Anyone have any information?

[Kathy Marie]

Hi, Matt,

I have never managed to lay hands on a copy of _Power Golf_ but Terry Koehler has and posted about Hogan's distances on the Scor Golf Blog:

[url="http://blog.scorgolf.com/2014/07/11/some-thoughts-about-distance-and-control/"]http://blog.scorgolf.com/2014/07/11/some-thoughts-about-distance-and-control/[/url]

[MattBarbier13]

Thank you!

[rebby]

From Power Golf. 9-iron in my Precisions is 48' BTW, 4' gaps across the set from there. I believe the irons were shorter too, 37.75" 4-iron with 1/2" gaps maybe? I could be wrong on the length but that should be in the ballpark. Basically Hogan's "5-iron" is roughly 1-2' weaker than a "modern" 6-iron and, perhaps, as much as 1/2" shorter.

[rebby]

Sorry for the quality and orientation of the above photo. Posting from the iPad tonight.

[MattBarbier13]

Thank you! It really do appreciate your info.

['53 Precision]

Just a note...when Power Golf was written/published Mr. Hogan would have been playing MacGregor Irons, comparable loft and length but drastically different head shape and design, especially in how the weight was distributed. As a statement to the difference in design, there are, to my limited knowledge, no irons currently on the market which remotely resemble the Macs from the late 1940's, while a large portion of latest Taylor Made lineup closely resembles the Precision design, as have numerous Mizuno and various other manufacturers offerings over the last 60+ years. An observation which I find interesting.

[rebby]

[quote name=''53 Precision' timestamp='1431315838' post='11536024']
Just a note...when Power Golf was written/published Mr. Hogan would have been playing MacGregor Irons, comparable loft and length but drastically different head shape and design, especially in how the weight was distributed. As a statement to the difference in design, there are, to my limited knowledge, no irons currently on the market which remotely resemble the Macs from the late 1940's, while a large portion of latest Taylor Made lineup closely resembles the Precision design, as have numerous Mizuno and various other manufacturers offerings over the last 60+ years. An observation which I find interesting.
[/quote]correct on all points. I should have mentioned the fact that Hogan was not yet playing the Precisions, I was simply trying to show the contrast between irons of then vs today. My statement could have been misleading though so thanks for adding the clarification.

[stevemcgee99]

I think the analysis from the Score article in the link is very important.
(I also feel it is harder to try with cavity backs).

[scomac2002]

[quote name='stevemcgee99' timestamp='1431376449' post='11540034']
I think the analysis from the Score article in the link is very important.
(I also feel it is harder to try with cavity backs).
[/quote]

Why do you think so? I hit less than full shots with cavity backs on a regular basis. An iron head whether forged or cast, whether cavity back or blade is just a hunk of metal that weights about 250 gm attached to a stick. Its design makes no difference as to how much force you deliver to the ball. That part is up to you.

[MattBarbier13]

I think that that argument would bring the whole "frying pan vs hammer" metaphor into discussion.

[scomac2002]

[quote name='MattBarbier13' timestamp='1431396088' post='11542118']
I think that that argument would bring the whole "frying pan vs hammer" metaphor into discussion.
[/quote]

You could attempt to bring that into the debate, but it doesn't change the fact that regardless of what club you're using, you still have to vary the input to the shaft in order to get a differing result in ballflight/carry. Which club is the most efficient to achieve that end is irrelevant.

[stevemcgee99]

I agree that of course the physics of hitting the ball at different speeds will have the same effect on forged, cast, blade or cavity.

The difference would only be in feeling, and over time a sense. It was by using a forged pitching wedge that I became attracted to old irons.

[scomac2002]

[quote name='stevemcgee99' timestamp='1431414605' post='11543444']
I agree that of course the physics of hitting the ball at different speeds will have the same effect on forged, cast, blade or cavity.

The difference would only be in feeling, and over time a sense. It was by using a forged pitching wedge that I became attracted to old irons.
[/quote]

OK. I understand what you are saying and I will agree that older clubs with less "helpful features" seem to be easier to manipulate than modern designs.

[XYB34A]

I am a long time Hogan iron player. Since 1985, I have owned 11 sets of Hogan irons. I have played every set till the short irons had rusty spots in the middle of the face. I personally think if you can hit the center of the club face then it matters not one bit whether you play forged blades or the mostly ugly cavity backs in the world.

I have owned one set of ping's in my life. I bought a new set of ISI's as they were supposed to be "blade like". I played them for about 3 and 1/2 months about 18 years ago or so. They let my swing fall apart, as you can get away with to much SLOP. While a good set of blades, a couple of three mishits and you know its time to get back to the fundamentals and practice.

That being said. I am recovered from having 4 pins put in my wrist to repair a ligament that I tore in late 2012. So I bought from ebay a 3-pw set of Tommy Armour 845's for 20 dollars. They were tour issue, 25 years ago. I can tell by the v-groove marked on the club. Clubs from that era, all had to be marked v-groove, due to the ping ruling on the eye 2 that happen just about the same time.

So I take my trusty Hogan Redlines, and the "new" 845's to the driving range 5 days in a row. I find that I hit the ball much higher with the 845's, and the ball just about goes straight. I can bend the ball left or right, high or low with my Redlines. I use the same two plane swing that I was taught by a former touring pro in 1985. Take it back straight drop it under and swing a little right. Nice draw or swing a lot right and you hit a big sweeping hook. You do the same think to hit a fade., just do it opposite.

I did play a round with the 845's. I shot 77, not to bad for the first this year an I had one round last year. Will I keep playing the cavity backs. NO NO NO.

For all you scientist out there, some things defy the law of physics. That 4 inch space, 5 or 6 for some that is between your ears, can make things happen that a mechanical swing {Iron Byron} wont do.

How many of you have heard of humans doing things that are physically impossible. Like picking the front end of a car up, when someone was hurt underneath one. Saw that in 1977.

So yes I will say, if you have the swing, the right frame of mind, the will power to totally concentrate for about 3 seconds. Then a blade will do many things that a cavity back wont do.

And if you say, that under pressure the cavity back will perform better, then read the line above again a few times.

[HoganApexBlades]

[quote name='justaman5' timestamp='1431432894' post='11543884']
I am a long time Hogan iron player. Since 1985, I have owned 11 sets of Hogan irons. I have played every set till the short irons had rusty spots in the middle of the face. I personally think if you can hit the center of the club face then it matters not one bit whether you play forged blades or the mostly ugly cavity backs in the world.

I have owned one set of ping's in my life. I bought a new set of ISI's as they were supposed to be "blade like". I played them for about 3 and 1/2 months about 18 years ago or so. They let my swing fall apart, as you can get away with to much SLOP. While a good set of blades, a couple of three mishits and you know its time to get back to the fundamentals and practice.

That being said. I am recovered from having 4 pins put in my wrist to repair a ligament that I tore in late 2012. So I bought from ebay a 3-pw set of Tommy Armour 845's for 20 dollars. They were tour issue, 25 years ago. I can tell by the v-groove marked on the club. Clubs from that era, all had to be marked v-groove, due to the ping ruling on the eye 2 that happen just about the same time.

So I take my trusty Hogan Redlines, and the "new" 845's to the driving range 5 days in a row. I find that I hit the ball much higher with the 845's, and the ball just about goes straight. I can bend the ball left or right, high or low with my Redlines. I use the same two plane swing that I was taught by a former touring pro in 1985. Take it back straight drop it under and swing a little right. Nice draw or swing a lot right and you hit a big sweeping hook. You do the same think to hit a fade., just do it opposite.

I did play a round with the 845's. I shot 77, not to bad for the first this year an I had one round last year. Will I keep playing the cavity backs. NO NO NO.

For all you scientist out there, some things defy the law of physics. That 4 inch space, 5 or 6 for some that is between your ears, can make things happen that a mechanical swing {Iron Byron} wont do.

How many of you have heard of humans doing things that are physically impossible. Like picking the front end of a car up, when someone was hurt underneath one. Saw that in 1977.

So yes I will say, if you have the swing, the right frame of mind, the will power to totally concentrate for about 3 seconds. Then a blade will do many things that a cavity back wont do.

And if you say, that under pressure the cavity back will perform better, then read the line above again a few times.
[/quote]

EXCELLENT POST! Thank you!

[stevemcgee99]

When I had a beginner's luck streak of nailing putt after putt, off the green, super-crazy lines, etc., I didn't know how I did it.
I joked to my friend "I use the 'force'".

I was tagging greens with my PC set at the time, too.

My "thinking" might have hijacked my swing?

[XYB34A]

there are a few, very few films of Mr Hogan hitting golf balls. The sound on them of him hitting balls is totally different than anyone else. Very Very few on this site, have actually played 18 holes with balata golf balls. I mean brand new ones straight out of the box. NOT ones that have been lying in a bucket for 15 years. I am 54, I actually met a man in South Carolina that caddied for Mr. Hogan when I was 24. He was a boy, well teen ager at the time. He worked in the caddy yard at a club in Fla. He said that when Mr. Hogan hit a golf ball, you could tell it was him, even standing around the corner of the caddie barn.

[NRJyzr]

[quote name='justaman5' timestamp='1431538603' post='11552846']
Very Very few on this site, have actually played 18 holes with balata golf balls. I mean brand new ones straight out of the box. NOT ones that have been lying in a bucket for 15 years.
[/quote]


I'm 51 years old, didn't start playing golf until 1999, and *I've* played full rounds of 18 with balata balls, taken new from the box. I'm on the younger side of the bell curve for this corner of WRX, I can't imagine there aren't many others who've done the same.

If you're talking the entirety of WRX in general, I would go with that; there are a lot of younguns visiting the WRX forums.

[rebby]

[quote name='NRJyzr' timestamp='1431540551' post='11553064']
[quote name='justaman5' timestamp='1431538603' post='11552846']
Very Very few on this site, have actually played 18 holes with balata golf balls. I mean brand new ones straight out of the box. NOT ones that have been lying in a bucket for 15 years.
[/quote]


I'm 51 years old, didn't start playing golf until 1999, and *I've* played full rounds of 18 with balata balls, taken new from the box. I'm on the younger side of the bell curve for this corner of WRX, I can't imagine there aren't many others who've done the same.

If you're talking the entirety of WRX in general, I would go with that; there are a lot of younguns visiting the WRX forums.
[/quote]

Balata balls aren't quite that antiquated, not yet anyway. I'm 35 and I grew up playing wound balata balls. I remember hoarding away a stash of Titleist Tour Balata 90's when the Titleist Professional first came out. I was pretty skeptical about moving over to the new ball. Nothing has changed though, I'm just now looking at replacing the 2010 TaylorMade Penta with something new.

[NRJyzr]

[quote name='rebby' timestamp='1431541631' post='11553174']
Balata balls aren't quite that antiquated, not yet anyway. I'm 35 and I grew up playing wound balata balls. I remember hoarding away a stash of Titleist Tour Balata 90's when the Titleist Professional first came out. I was pretty skeptical about moving over to the new ball. Nothing has changed though, I'm just now looking at replacing the 2010 TaylorMade Penta with something new.
[/quote]


They may still be manufactured in some parts of the world, or so they appear to have been until relatively recently. A few years ago, I happened across a stash of Maxfli HT90s being sold by 2nd Swing. I'd picked up a few dozen from a guy on ebay, so thought I'd supplement with a couple dozen of these, as well.

The ones I got from 2nd Swing read "balata" on the cover, instead of "urethane." And I managed to put a smile in one on an egregiously bad thin shot, something you can't do with the urethane version.

It was hinted to me these were from the Asian marketplace, and reasonably recent vintage.

I'm not sure how they wound up at 2nd Swing, especially with them now being only in MN, instead of across the US as they once were. But there they were. And vanished fairly quickly.

[mocokid]

Just read a book by Mike Towle based on quotes from those who knew or played with BH. George Archer talked of playing with BH, Arnie. They all hit tee balls on a certain hole at Augusta, but Archer chose 3 wood and of course first ball on fairway was his. Both BH and Arnie walked up to the longest ball, and BH gave Arnie the "look", and told Arnie he was hitting next. This was in the 60's but Hogan still could turn it on at will. Different story, Rocky Thompson at BH exhibition in Abilene, states his shots drew 2 yards to the left, and then fell away to the right about 5 yds, a net fade of 9 feet. After BH had hit several drivers, some yahoo said, OK now it a hard one. BH put his right foot about 4-5 inches further to the right and really drilled one. "Greatest ballstriker of all time"- Rocky Thompson.

[mocokid]

[quote name='justaman5' timestamp='1431538603' post='11552846']
there are a few, very few films of Mr Hogan hitting golf balls. The sound on them of him hitting balls is totally different than anyone else. Very Very few on this site, have actually played 18 holes with balata golf balls. I mean brand new ones straight out of the box. NOT ones that have been lying in a bucket for 15 years. I am 54, I actually met a man in South Carolina that caddied for Mr. Hogan when I was 24. He was a boy, well teen ager at the time. He worked in the caddy yard at a club in Fla. He said that when Mr. Hogan hit a golf ball, you could tell it was him, even standing around the corner of the caddie barn.
[/quote]

That's what Jody Vasquez stated in his Hogan book, he was BH shag guy for 2 years at Shady Oaks, it was like a gun being fired.