Has anyone removed/replaced an odyssey insert?

[huwwill22]

Just wondered if it is possible to remove the insert from an odyssey putter with out damaging it? Has anyone attempted this or have any experience with such a procedure?

[Wolsey]

I have removed one and inserted an ali insert. Could be tricky not to damage it as i had to pry the back out, are you looking to replace the insert?

[huwwill22]

yes looking to replace it. When you say ali insert what exactly to you mean? Also how did you go about getting a good fit? Thanks.

[RookieBlue7]

Search for Deerslayer's post. He has done it, has a step by step and sells replacement inserts.

[wentorf11]

[quote name='RookieBlue7' post='2003414' date='Oct 13 2009, 09:22 AM']Search for Deerslayer's post. He has done it, has a step by step and sells replacement inserts.[/quote]

Deerslayer's replacement inserts look really nice. I think that this is something that Lamont also does, but I could be wrong...

[Wolsey]

I removed old insert, made an aluminium one based on the template of the old insert and fitted it, gives a more firm feel to the club, the person i did it for plays off 2 and prefers the distance control from having the solid/firm face.

[honketyhank]

I just did it about two weeks ago and was very happy with the result. If you are not handy with basic hand tools or just don't enjoy doing this kind of thing, buy the insert from somebody like Deerslayer. That having been said, I had fun doing it.

One thing I will note in addition is that the original insert is quite lightweight. Replacing it will change the swingweight of the putter. I used brass, so the difference was quite noticeable. If you don't want a heavier putter, you may have to devise a way to mill out a cavity in the back of the insert before final installation.

[b]Following is step by step description of what I did:[/b]

Materials:

metal bar stock, 0.25 x 0.75 x 3.25 (inches) [I used brass.]
epoxy
sandpaper: 60 grit, (100, 220, 400, 600 grit optional)
denatured alcohol
paper towels

Tools:

standard shop file, 1" x 12" (or whatever dimensions, not critical)
vise
vise jaw protectors
hacksaw
propane torch or heatgun
pick: icepick, awl, whatever pointy kind of thing
q-tip
scribing tool (I use the tip of a needle file, could be an awl or just a pencil)
Caliper (dial guage is very convenient, but you know, this isn't terribly critical)

Procedure:

1. Remove insert: Apply mild heat from a propane torch or heat gun to putter head near insert and behind. Stick pick into edge of insert and pull the insert out of the putter face. Try to err on the "not enough heat" side. The insert is held in place by some kind of double side tape or contact cement, not epoxy, so not much heat is required. YOu want to preserve the insert to use as a template when making the new insert, so try not to distort (or burn) it a lot.

2. Clean insert recess: Use Goo-Gone or whatever and a q-tip to clean out the recess of the putter after removing the insert.

3. After removing the glue from the putter recess, use the caliper to determine how thick the insert is. If possible, determine how deep is the recess. In my project, the insert was 0.20", the recess was from 0.21 to 0.22. I presume the difference was to allow for the adhesive. But in my later steps, I used 0.22 as a preliminary thickness for the insert. It is easy to take more off. You can't add it back if you take too much off, though.

4. Use hacksaw to cut the barstock to approximate length.

5. Put piece in vise with flat face of the bar stock up and file off the 0.03" or so to get the stock to the proper thichness (in my example, to 0.22"). Note that filing is not the only way to do this. I also used plain old sanding with 60 grit (using a sanding block). And it would be a lot quicker if I had access to a machine shop to just mill it down to thickness. I made sure to work only one side of the bar stock, so there was always the other side that was very flat. Not sure how important this was -- I think it depends on how good you are at filing a flat surface.

6. Draw outline of template on bar stock: Place the old insert against the metal bar stock, then trace its outline on the bar stock with the scribing tool. The outline will be slightly bigger than the insert, which is OK because you are going to file and sand to fit from there and it gives you a bit of leeway for error.

7, Use shop file to shape the piece to the scribed outline. The calipers help here also as you will be shaping to just inside that outline and you can get a much better idea of just where you are when you use the calipers on the old insert and compare to the new insert.

8. Fit to putter recess: Final fitting is done with light work with the 60 grit sandpaper and block or with the shop file. You want the insert to fit into the recess fairly snugly but without having to force it. There is a minute amount of 'slop': excess epoxy must be able to escape, but you don't want a significant gap all around the insert.

9, Hopefully, when you drop the insert into the recess, there will be a slight to non-eistant protrusion of the insert from the putter face. Do your final filing and/or sanding with 60 grit on the face of the insert (NOT while it is in the putter face), to bring it to flush with the face on all sides of the insert.

10. If desired, use progressively finer grit sand paper on the face of the insert to produce a better finish. Then,use a buffing wheel if you are really looking for a fine finish.

11. Make sure you have some kind of soft vise jaw protectors. I use a couple of pieces of thin plywood/perspex.

11. Clean the insert (and the putter recess) to ensure good adhesion.

12. Mix the epoxy and apply generously in the putter recess and back of the new insert (sides too, if you are paranoid).

13. Drop the insert into the putter face recess. Put the putter head into the vise with face against one jaw, with protectors in place. Tighten the vice. You should see epoxy squeezed out. That's good. If you don't, that's not good.

14. Loosen the vice. Remove the putter. Use alcohol and paper towels to clean up any epoxy mess (there should be some, a lot is good, too).

15. Put putter aside for 24 hours.

16. Putt away.

[Wolsey]

Thanks, saved me writing it.

[wentorf11]

Do you guys have pics?

[Wolsey]

Will post later

[honketyhank]

[quote name='wentorf11' post='2003525' date='Oct 13 2009, 08:26 AM']Do you guys have pics?[/quote]

Sorry no. Except for this one of the final product:

[attachment=478552:IMG_0231.JPG]

Was playing with a friend yesterday and he liked it so much he made me an offer I couldn't refuse. So now I am shopping for another one to do up pretty much the same way.

[chatfieldgolf08]

oh man, thats sweet looking!!

[Peter McHugh]

It was my putter that Wolsey worked on last week. Thanks again Warren. The feel is absolutely fantastic. I had been chasing deerslayer for months but could never get a reply. I live in Belfast and stumbled across Warren through wrx. In my case the whole idea of removing the insert was to replace it so I couldn't have cared less if it was damaged but Warren can chip in to indicate if it can be removed without damage. If you live in the UK I could not recommend Warren enough...... brilliant job.

[Wolsey]

Here's the one i did

 

excuse the messy front room, the boy was playing star wars and i was darth vader ( and yes i did enjoy it too )

 

 

[wentorf11]

Those look great Honkey & Wolsey, with people doing this after market you'd think Odyssey would start to offer a line of custom inserts.

Anyways great work

[asiangolfer76]

Honkety that putter looks great! Did you make the insert yourself or did you get it somewhere else?

[honketyhank]

[quote name='asiangolfer76' post='2004109' date='Oct 13 2009, 12:53 PM']Honkety that putter looks great! Did you make the insert yourself or did you get it somewhere else?[/quote]

thanks. made it myself. see a few posts above the photo for instructions.

[Wolsey]

I have just ordered some copper and aliminium lengths, if people want them made up, drop me a PM.

[Tupperwolf]

Just pulled the insert out of my White Hot Tour #9 because I figured it could use a makeover.

I'm going to try a brass or copper insert - whatever I can find. Maybe it will get back in the bag for a while. It's a great putter but hasn't been used often since I got my Mills Huey.

[honketyhank]

[quote name='QWKDTSN' post='2108376' date='Dec 6 2009, 06:45 PM']Just pulled the insert out of my White Hot Tour #9 because I figured it could use a makeover.

I'm going to try a brass or copper insert - whatever I can find. Maybe it will get back in the bag for a while. It's a great putter but hasn't been used often since I got my Mills Huey.[/quote]

Be aware that the brass insert will add significant weight. Probably also true with the Aluminum but to lesser extent. I didn't do a before and after on my XG-9, but I am guessing as much as 50 gms. You will notice the difference.

[Tupperwolf]

Thanks very much Hank. I can do aluminum very easily (have tons of the stuff in different thicknesses at work) and doubt it will add too much weight over the stock insert, though it would be easy to weigh and compare. I don't know if there's anywhere local that will sell a piece of brass or copper stock that will work, though that's what I'd prefer to try.

The WH Tour has the weight ports in the bottom that may be able to be removed or modified, although it will change the COG of the putter, possibly for the worse.

Do you think you'd be able to post another picture of your putter? I see you posted one earlier in this thread, but it's been removed by now (the thread is old, I know.)

[rockwallraider]

my aluminum insert turned out like this. head weighed 350 with new insert

[attachment=505332:JMBB4.jpg][attachment=505333:JMBB1.jpg]

[Tupperwolf]

Nice one! I'll probably be giving aluminum a try as a first step to see if I like the feel. But it sure won't look as professional as that, with the mill marks and button back (is that functional, BTW?)

[honketyhank]

[quote name='QWKDTSN' post='2108724' date='Dec 6 2009, 09:53 PM']Do you think you'd be able to post another picture of your putter? I see you posted one earlier in this thread, but it's been removed by now (the thread is old, I know.) [/quote]

dunno what happened to the previous version. older pix are still there. somebody in the server farm must have hiccupped.

I subsequently did a friend's XG-1. That model has a bigger insert. I milled a fair amount out of the back of the insert using a drill press and a 3/8" bit. When all was said and done, the finished weight of the XG-1 was 549 grams, 58 grams above its weight with the white insert.

Rock: now THAT looks like professional work. Good job.

[attachment=505344:OdysseyFace.jpg]

[rockwallraider]

i did not do my own, wish I did but god did not bless me with such skill.

[Tupperwolf]

Thanks for the pic Hank! I'm going to pull the head from this putter so I have a base weight to work with. I'd like to keep the weight around the same if possible. I'll post pics of my progress when I make some.

[honketyhank]

An update --

I am now in the process of making an aluminum insert for an Odyssey #4 "White hot". This is an older model, note there is no "XG".

Differences from prior instructions:

The insert is of a different material. Looks like High Density Polyethylene (HDPE) to me. But the face is covered with a white tape-like covering with the words "White Hot" near the hosel. Glue for the insert into the putter seems different, but heat does the trick, even if the insert ends up a bit scorched.

It looks to me like this putter is some kind of precision casting. The XG putters I have done appear to have insert cavities that have been milled out.

The insert cavity is very close to 0.250" in depth. The XG series putters' cavities seem to be about 0.20 to 0.21" deep. This is good if you buy quarter inch bar stock to make the insert -- not much work to bring it down to proper thickness.

Aluminum is more difficult to work with than the brass I used before. It is soft, but it clogs files and grinding wheels. I think the genuine official metallurgical terminology is that aluminum "galls". Hey, I don't have a degree in metallurgy for nothing. Even if I forget stuff.

I chose aluminum because the brass inserts I did previously were fairly heavy and I ended up grinding a lot of material out of the back of the inserts to try to keep the weight down. They still ended up on the heavy half of the spectrum.

I'll post a photo when it is done and a report on how I like it.

[RookieBlue7]

My copper bar stock came in today for the XG #9 experiment I'm gonna do. We'll see I suppose.

Edit:

So I've pulled the old insert and everything off of the putter by way of badging (the XG badge and the Odyssey badge in the cavity). I began cutting the bar stock, but it was very noisy, and though it wasn't that loud inside the house, I'm sure my neighbors didn't appreciate all of the noise I was making (I'm using a different type of tool than described above to cut it, no hacksaw, and nothing manual. Power tools are noisy. I also didn't want to risk waking the now 1 year old in the house because he had a rough day including getting 4 shots at the doc's office.). I'll work on it more tomorrow, and hopefully have some time to put a different tool to work on the bar stock at work.

That said, it's going to be a bear to finish out this copper and have it looking how I want it to look. I'm seriously thinking about getting the insert in oversized and taking it to a local machine shop and having them mill the face smooth. I'm also not sure about how I'll be attaching it yet. If I epoxy it in, I'll have to hand smooth it instead of having it milled smooth because I think it'd break out. I'm considering some machine screws with hex heads and making a button-back type attachment method. It'll mean drilling and tapping holes in the insert, which would be tricky, but hey, you don't get things done by thinking and being afraid to experiment.

[TaylorMadeGolfer21]

I'm considering some machine screws with hex heads and making a button-back type attachment method. It'll mean drilling and tapping holes in the insert, which would be tricky, but hey, you don't get things done by thinking and being afraid to experiment.

 

Good luck with your experiment, and be sure to post pictures when you are done! I just wanted to show you what your finished product may look like (if i am getting your idea right)...here is my custom XG #9 buttonback done by Deerslayer...i will give this disclaimer now, i did not do any of this work (Deerslayer did it all) so i am not sure exactly how it was done, however it looks great, and i am very happy to be the proud owner of the piece and thought i would share with you what yours maaaay look like! Note the area around the hex screws is painted (also looks great bare) but it is painted on the vertical sidewalls around the screws. Enjoy the pictures (more can be found in my WITB)!

 

 

 

 

 

...and one of the insert for good measure!

 

[RookieBlue7]

I've seen some of Deerslayer's work before, maybe it was even your putter. I think Mr. Slighter has done some as well. The only problem I potentially can see is finding machine screws with short enough thread runs.

It's not my putter, yet. A friend doesn't use it and knew I'd been looking for one to tinker with and he offered his up. Said we'd figure out a price later unless he liked it then he'd keep it any pay me for the work and material.