Pickup...who's got them

southpaw72 · August 16, 2016

Personally the aluminum on the new fords is a deal breaker for me.

Just out of curiosity, why would that be a deal breaker? It has shown to be more resilient to damage than the older stamped steel body panels, it is lighter which will offer fuel savings and performance gains for a comparable truck with a heavier body. I've heard people say that, but no one has ever been able to articulate why it would be a deal breaker aside from some hang up on older steel body trucks.

I don't buy into it being as strong as a steel bed. I've seen some videos and some damaged beds in person. Plus I've heard the body work costs are much higher and more complicated should any damage occur. Again most of this is speculation but I'm skeptical of aluminum in place of steel for a truck bed that will see use. Personally I wouldn't buy one but I've been wrong before and I'm certainly not an engineer. I'm interested in seeing how they incorporate the aluminum into the super dutys.

bigred90gt · August 16, 2016

I would be careful with the gas mileage thing. It depends on the type of driving you will be doing. If you do a lot of stop and go driving, the Ford is going to get better gas mileage but if you do more highway or cruising type driving, the RAM will have better mileage. The reason being is the Ford has a turbo connected to 6 cylinders so the turbo is only useful during acceleration. The RAM deactivates 4 cyliners at cruising speeds making it a 4 cylinder truck at that point.

Also, I know a lot of guys that use 87 octane in their RAMs. The onboard computer just adjusts the timing automatically. The 89 is recommended for optimal performance.
The navigation on the RAM is terrible just fyi. You are better off getting a Garman.

Oh one last thing, before you sign the papers, tell them you want the truck filled up with gas. If they refuse, you might want to look for another dealer. If they break a deal over less than 60 bucks, how are they going to treat you if you need warranty service?

The MDS (multi-displacement system) in the Ram is the number 1 reason (only reason actually) that I wont buy one. It is one more electronic engine control system that has the opportunity to fail. Of course, the 2.7L F150s also have an auto start/stop feature that would prevent me from getting one of them, which is why they get better city mileage. The 3.5L EB engine is a hoss, and I've considered buying one with that engine, but for some reason, I always migrate back to a V8 in a truck.

City driving in a turbo vehicle, especially one as large as a F150 with an engine that small, would actually require the engine to be in boost more often, resulting in worse city MPG. Being in boost requires additional fuel consumption to keep the air/fuel ratio something useable to the engine. The more air you can feed the engine, the more power you can make. That larger amount of air from a forced induction engine requires more fuel. Once at cruising speeds on the highway, you are no longer in boost until you start ascending hills or are towing a heavy load, and they do great on the highway in unloaded conditions. Gas mileage (along with towing capacity) was one of Fords big selling points for the 3.5 EB engine when they put it in the trucks, but the reality is that for city driving, the 5.0 and the non-turbo 3.7 got better city MPG than the TT 3.5. Once cruising on the highway at a steady speed, that's when the EB shined in mileage, but for most people, that's just not their typical driving habits.

Regarding 2wd vs 4wd, that really depends on where you live and what you use your truck for. I live on the gulf coast in Texas, I don't hunt (so no deer lease dirt roads for me), I never got into the whole offroading/mudding scene, and we only get a couple inches of snow once every 10 years or so. I prefer trucks simply for the comfort of the seating arrangement vs a car, as I'm not a particularly small guy. Of the 13 or so trucks I've owned, I've never had a 4wd and never regretted not having one. I've been stuck exactly once, on a beach, in an 88 Ranger 2wd with mud tires on it. I got pulled out, and that was that. So, in 20 years of driving, and 13 different trucks, I have once in my life wished I had 4wd for about 10 seconds. If you live in a climate that sees a lot of snow, or if you do a lot of hunting or camping, a 4wd could be beneficial to you. If you're like me, and prefer trucks because they are generally more comfortable, you would only be hurting your gas mileage and wallet (more expensive to purchase a comparably equipped 4wd, and not by just a little usually).

bigred90gt · August 16, 2016

Personally the aluminum on the new fords is a deal breaker for me.

Just out of curiosity, why would that be a deal breaker? It has shown to be more resilient to damage than the older stamped steel body panels, it is lighter which will offer fuel savings and performance gains for a comparable truck with a heavier body. I've heard people say that, but no one has ever been able to articulate why it would be a deal breaker aside from some hang up on older steel body trucks.
I don't buy into it being as strong as a steel bed. I've seen some videos and some damaged beds in person. Plus I've heard the body work costs are much higher should any damage occur. Again most of this is speculation but I'm skeptical of aluminum in place of steel for a truck bed that will see use. Personally I wouldn't buy one but I've been wrong before and I'm certainly not an engineer. I'm interested in seeing how they incorporate the aluminum into the super dutys.

Repairs are a bit more expensive, but they are more resilient to damage. This video does show that they are indeed more expensive (significantly in some cases), but try hitting a steel body panel with a sledge hammer like this, twice, and compare the damage. Either way, I'm not trying to convince anyone to buy any particular truck for one reason or another, I was just curious why someone would avoid a particular truck because of the aluminum.

Personally, repair costs would not be much of a factor for me, as I would have full coverage insurance so it would only cost as much as my deductible (at most), or nothing if someone else's insurance were paying for it. I also don't tend to keep vehicles long enough to worry about fixing little dents and dings over the life of one. Typically, 1-3 years tops for me.

Also, and this is pure speculation on my part, but once more and more vehicles are made from aluminum bodies, and more and more body shops are tooled up and trained in repairing them, the cost will come down a bit. It may not come down to the cost associated with a steel body panel repair, but it will come down. Even when Ford first started selling the '15 F150 (when they went to the aluminum body), not all ford dealer repair centers were equipped or trained to work on the aluminum.

southpaw72 · August 16, 2016

Personally the aluminum on the new fords is a deal breaker for me.

Just out of curiosity, why would that be a deal breaker? It has shown to be more resilient to damage than the older stamped steel body panels, it is lighter which will offer fuel savings and performance gains for a comparable truck with a heavier body. I've heard people say that, but no one has ever been able to articulate why it would be a deal breaker aside from some hang up on older steel body trucks.
I don't buy into it being as strong as a steel bed. I've seen some videos and some damaged beds in person. Plus I've heard the body work costs are much higher should any damage occur. Again most of this is speculation but I'm skeptical of aluminum in place of steel for a truck bed that will see use. Personally I wouldn't buy one but I've been wrong before and I'm certainly not an engineer. I'm interested in seeing how they incorporate the aluminum into the super dutys.

Repairs are a bit more expensive, but they are more resilient to damage. This video does show that they are indeed more expensive (significantly in some cases), but try hitting a steel body panel with a sledge hammer like this, twice, and compare the damage. Either way, I'm not trying to convince anyone to buy any particular truck for one reason or another, I was just curious why someone would avoid a particular truck because of the aluminum.

Personally, repair costs would be much of a factor for me, as I would have full coverage insurance so it would only cost as much as my deductible (at most), or nothing if someone else's insurance were paying for it. I also don't tend to keep vehicles long enough to worry about fixing little dents and dings over the life of one. Typically, 1-3 years tops for me.

Also, and this is pure speculation on my part, but once more and more vehicles are made from aluminum bodies, and more and more body shops are tooled up and trained in repairing them, the cost will come down a bit. It may not come down to the cost associated with a steel body panel repair, but it will come down. Even when Ford first started selling the '15 F150 (when they went to the aluminum body), not all ford dealer repair centers were equipped or trained to work on the aluminum.

I agree. I think ford knows what there doing and the fact that they waited a few model years to incorporate the aluminum into there heavy duty trucks shows there taking there time to get it right. Maybe I come off ignorant but something about an aluminum work truck makes be wonder

LouieLouie · August 16, 2016

I would be careful with the gas mileage thing. It depends on the type of driving you will be doing. If you do a lot of stop and go driving, the Ford is going to get better gas mileage but if you do more highway or cruising type driving, the RAM will have better mileage. The reason being is the Ford has a turbo connected to 6 cylinders so the turbo is only useful during acceleration. The RAM deactivates 4 cyliners at cruising speeds making it a 4 cylinder truck at that point.

Also, I know a lot of guys that use 87 octane in their RAMs. The onboard computer just adjusts the timing automatically. The 89 is recommended for optimal performance.
The navigation on the RAM is terrible just fyi. You are better off getting a Garman.

Oh one last thing, before you sign the papers, tell them you want the truck filled up with gas. If they refuse, you might want to look for another dealer. If they break a deal over less than 60 bucks, how are they going to treat you if you need warranty service?

The MDS (multi-displacement system) in the Ram is the number 1 reason (only reason actually) that I wont buy one. It is one more electronic engine control system that has the opportunity to fail. Of course, the 2.7L F150s also have an auto start/stop feature that would prevent me from getting one of them, which is why they get better city mileage. The 3.5L EB engine is a hoss, and I've considered buying one with that engine, but for some reason, I always migrate back to a V8 in a truck.

City driving in a turbo vehicle, especially one as large as a F150 with an engine that small, would actually require the engine to be in boost more often, resulting in worse city MPG. Being in boost requires additional fuel consumption to keep the air/fuel ratio something useable to the engine. The more air you can feed the engine, the more power you can make. That larger amount of air from a forced induction engine requires more fuel. Once at cruising speeds on the highway, you are no longer in boost until you start ascending hills or are towing a heavy load, and they do great on the highway in unloaded conditions. Gas mileage (along with towing capacity) was one of Fords big selling points for the 3.5 EB engine when they put it in the trucks, but the reality is that for city driving, the 5.0 and the non-turbo 3.7 got better city MPG than the TT 3.5. Once cruising on the highway at a steady speed, that's when the EB shined in mileage, but for most people, that's just not their typical driving habits.

Regarding 2wd vs 4wd, that really depends on where you live and what you use your truck for. I live on the gulf coast in Texas, I don't hunt (so no deer lease dirt roads for me), I never got into the whole offroading/mudding scene, and we only get a couple inches of snow once every 10 years or so. I prefer trucks simply for the comfort of the seating arrangement vs a car, as I'm not a particularly small guy. Of the 13 or so trucks I've owned, I've never had a 4wd and never regretted not having one. I've been stuck exactly once, on a beach, in an 88 Ranger 2wd with mud tires on it. I got pulled out, and that was that. So, in 20 years of driving, and 13 different trucks, I have once in my life wished I had 4wd for about 10 seconds. If you live in a climate that sees a lot of snow, or if you do a lot of hunting or camping, a 4wd could be beneficial to you. If you're like me, and prefer trucks because they are generally more comfortable, you would only be hurting your gas mileage and wallet (more expensive to purchase a comparably equipped 4wd, and not by just a little usually).

Interesting, I always thought it was the other way around. My apologies to the OP. I always thought that having the turbo activated was when the truck used less gas to get more torque. So in accelerating circumstances it was better to have a V6 turbo than a V8. Then alternatively at cruising speeds the turbo was deactivated causing the engine to use more gas than say a 4 cylinder engine.

EDIT

I just found this article on turbos. Explains exactly how it works. Good read. Thanks again to bigred90gt for educating me.

http://autoweek.com/article/car-news/mpg-or-performance-its-trade-turbos

Subsonic · August 16, 2016

I have owned them all at one point or another.

Toyota's have been the best in my experience.

I had a Tundra, but was too much of a pain in the a** in the city. Great Truck! Think of it as a heavy half ton.

I now own two Tacomas. a 2001 4wd extended cab and a 2015 TRD Off Road Quad cab. Both great trucks.

12tamale · August 16, 2016

I'm definitely a truck guy. My current DD is a 2013 Silverado crew cab, 2wd, 5.3 and 1LT. Bought it new and it has been flawless other than 3 3rd brake light lenses that cracked from the screw holes out and got replaced under warranty. When I bought this truck I traded a 2005 Powerstroke and a 2008 Civic Mugen in an attempt to get a good compromise of the two in one vehicle. I wanted something comfortable with lots of room, rode like a car, and got good mileage. My clubs stay in the bed on a plastic liner with a trifold leather cover over them. Finally gonna get the windows tinted next month and other future plans are a 3/5 drop with 22" chrome all terrain replicas, some more color matching and eventually some performance goodies.

Any regrets on the 2wd? I am in the market for a truck and have thought about it..... Just having mental issues getting over buying 2wd. Living in the south, my Jeep has seen 4wd on the road maybe 5 times in nearly 10 years, yet I still fear not having it.
When I bought my truck I settled for 2wd drive because it's near impossible to find a 2nd gen ram dually with the Cummins in 5 speed and 4x4. It's the one thing I would change about the truck and will probably be the biggest reason I decide to upgrade. I wish I would have been more patient but nonetheless I got a great truck at a fair price and other than getting stuck a couple times it hasn't let me down. I don't know what you're buying situation is but I would really consider not settle for a 2wd. Better to have it and not need it than need it and not have it.

I think the second generation Ram had a six speed, there awesome. Things got so much power, you can skip 1-3-5 and just use 2-4-6 and get over 20 mpg. Amazing engine the Cummins. I've maintained one a buddy's got, since it went out of warranty, over 10 years, and over 650,000 miles. Other then a transfer case failure, and a set of injectors, it's been a great truck.

I see way lower maintenance cost though on diesel 2wds, and some really never use 4wd.

Of course around here lake effect snow can be tough, and you pretty much need something 4wd if you want to get out some days.

I've been stuck in my 2wd ram a few times. Sucks

southpaw72 · August 17, 2016

I'm definitely a truck guy. My current DD is a 2013 Silverado crew cab, 2wd, 5.3 and 1LT. Bought it new and it has been flawless other than 3 3rd brake light lenses that cracked from the screw holes out and got replaced under warranty. When I bought this truck I traded a 2005 Powerstroke and a 2008 Civic Mugen in an attempt to get a good compromise of the two in one vehicle. I wanted something comfortable with lots of room, rode like a car, and got good mileage. My clubs stay in the bed on a plastic liner with a trifold leather cover over them. Finally gonna get the windows tinted next month and other future plans are a 3/5 drop with 22" chrome all terrain replicas, some more color matching and eventually some performance goodies.

Any regrets on the 2wd? I am in the market for a truck and have thought about it..... Just having mental issues getting over buying 2wd. Living in the south, my Jeep has seen 4wd on the road maybe 5 times in nearly 10 years, yet I still fear not having it.
When I bought my truck I settled for 2wd drive because it's near impossible to find a 2nd gen ram dually with the Cummins in 5 speed and 4x4. It's the one thing I would change about the truck and will probably be the biggest reason I decide to upgrade. I wish I would have been more patient but nonetheless I got a great truck at a fair price and other than getting stuck a couple times it hasn't let me down. I don't know what you're buying situation is but I would really consider not settle for a 2wd. Better to have it and not need it than need it and not have it.
I think the second generation Ram had a six speed, there awesome. Things got so much power, you can skip 1-3-5 and just use 2-4-6 and get over 20 mpg. Amazing engine the Cummins. I've maintained one a buddy's got, since it went out of warranty, over 10 years, and over 650,000 miles. Other then a transfer case failure, and a set of injectors, it's been a great truck.
I see way lower maintenance cost though on diesel 2wds, and some really never use 4wd.
Of course around here lake effect snow can be tough, and you pretty much need something 4wd if you want to get out some days.
I've been stuck in my 2wd ram a few times. Sucks

LOL I'm fairly certain the truck I own is a 5 speed. Until 98.5 the nv4500 was the only option (for manual) and then in the 24 valves the 6 speed nv5600 became available. Kinda confusing when the "second generation" spans so many years and two different motors.

Boogs2 · August 17, 2016

Personally the aluminum on the new fords is a deal breaker for me.

Just out of curiosity, why would that be a deal breaker? It has shown to be more resilient to damage than the older stamped steel body panels, it is lighter which will offer fuel savings and performance gains for a comparable truck with a heavier body. I've heard people say that, but no one has ever been able to articulate why it would be a deal breaker aside from some hang up on older steel body trucks.
I don't buy into it being as strong as a steel bed. I've seen some videos and some damaged beds in person. Plus I've heard the body work costs are much higher should any damage occur. Again most of this is speculation but I'm skeptical of aluminum in place of steel for a truck bed that will see use. Personally I wouldn't buy one but I've been wrong before and I'm certainly not an engineer. I'm interested in seeing how they incorporate the aluminum into the super dutys.

Repairs are a bit more expensive, but they are more resilient to damage. This video does show that they are indeed more expensive (significantly in some cases), but try hitting a steel body panel with a sledge hammer like this, twice, and compare the damage. Either way, I'm not trying to convince anyone to buy any particular truck for one reason or another, I was just curious why someone would avoid a particular truck because of the aluminum.

Personally, repair costs would be much of a factor for me, as I would have full coverage insurance so it would only cost as much as my deductible (at most), or nothing if someone else's insurance were paying for it. I also don't tend to keep vehicles long enough to worry about fixing little dents and dings over the life of one. Typically, 1-3 years tops for me.

Also, and this is pure speculation on my part, but once more and more vehicles are made from aluminum bodies, and more and more body shops are tooled up and trained in repairing them, the cost will come down a bit. It may not come down to the cost associated with a steel body panel repair, but it will come down. Even when Ford first started selling the '15 F150 (when they went to the aluminum body), not all ford dealer repair centers were equipped or trained to work on the aluminum.
I agree. I think ford knows what there doing and the fact that they waited a few model years to incorporate the aluminum into there heavy duty trucks shows there taking there time to get it right. Maybe I come off ignorant but something about an aluminum work truck makes be wonder

I saw an article where GM is going to an all-aluminum truck as well soon. Kinda makes me think how they're going to address their current commercial about how aluminum trucks take on too much damage lol.

This is not to start a brand war or anything. It'll be interesting to see the trend with pick ups in the next 5-10 years.

This is my venture outside of a Japanese (mainly Honda) brand with the F150 so I'm still in the skeptical phase in terms of reliability. So far so good, though the truck only has 6800 miles so it's still brand new lol.

Beavs17 · September 12, 2016

Here is mine. '04 F250 Crew Cab....clubs are on the floor in the back, always.

Well, I am no longer a pickup truck owner. I needed a new toy to mess with, and ended up with a '14 Wrangler Unlimited. I foresee this being an expensive hobby...these things are like the AR15 of vehicles. Way too many accessories available.....

puttingmatt · September 14, 2016

2009 GMC Sierra crew cab, 4x4,

Sticks ride in the bed, 2x4 across the bed at tailgate keeps them still

The Mad Bomber · September 15, 2016

Now this is my kind of 19th hole thread!

2009 Chev 3500 DirtyMax, levelled and chipped to the teeth

2015 GMC 3500 DirtyMax, Levelled and still EPA compliant.

The sticks go across the backseat until fall when rifle opens up. After that, the seats go up, I stand them up, buckle them in an throw the guns and gear in the back seat with them. Also, sometimes little people invade the back seat and move my clubs and guns into the house.

southpaw72 · September 15, 2016

Now this is my kind of 19th hole thread!
2009 Chev 3500 DirtyMax, levelled and chipped to the teeth
2015 GMC 3500 DirtyMax, Levelled and still EPA compliant.

The sticks go across the backseat until fall when rifle opens up. After that, the seats go up, I stand them up, buckle them in an throw the guns and gear in the back seat with them. Also, sometimes little people invade the back seat and move my clubs and guns into the house.

Never been a fan of the Isuzu but hauled a load of fat cattle in a 13 and was impressed. Good looking pickup though.

kstorm · September 16, 2016

2013 F150 I love my truck

The Mad Bomber · September 18, 2016

Now this is my kind of 19th hole thread!
2009 Chev 3500 DirtyMax, levelled and chipped to the teeth
2015 GMC 3500 DirtyMax, Levelled and still EPA compliant.

The sticks go across the backseat until fall when rifle opens up. After that, the seats go up, I stand them up, buckle them in an throw the guns and gear in the back seat with them. Also, sometimes little people invade the back seat and move my clubs and guns into the house.
Never been a fan of the Isuzu but hauled a load of fat cattle in a 13 and was impressed. Good looking pickup though.

I've been lucky. The '15 is my 3rd Dmax/Alli and maintenance has been pretty much zip on any of them besides oil changes and routing stuff. Knock on wood. The truck around the drive train is a different story, but that can't be helped where I work.