Macgregor irons

[windowsurfer]

Howdy,I recently got a set of near-mint Macgregor Jack Nicklaus Contender forged muscleback 3-PW irons. (eBay, $55 plus shipping) I have played 3 rounds with them and absolutely love them. I'm curious about the date of mfr. Serial number SL2J28. The have "Tour Step" "light weight" steel shafts. I removed the Macgregor grips and lengthened the shafts just a bit. Note that the faces have countersunk holes (not diamonds) beside the grooves and they are infilled with a brass color or maybe that is the color beneath the chrome plate (?). Age and any info on them would be great.

I'd love a matching SW if there's one out there.

These macs replaced my Toney Penna Original XQ9s which served me well but were pretty chewed up. Cheers and long live Macgregor (on eBay and Craigslist, I guess.)

[drewspin]

Not sure, but my guess is that they were a department store model during the later years when Brunswick owned MacGregor (1967-1979). Circa mid-1970s would be my guess.

[freddiec]

I agree with Drew. I looked through my Mac History Catalog which shows the models that were available through Pro Shops and didn't see these. I think by looking at the style of design early to mid 70s.

[Sid Vicious]

Those look near-mint. Are there any identifying marks on the shafts? Shaft quality might give you some insight into their value.

Too bad there isn't a clearinghouse for all the info on classic clubs. I bet it would be real popular with this group.

[chrisbellaire]

Above posters are correct. The Kaplan MacGregor book only goes up to 1970, and only shows a "retail" catalog for 1969. In this retail catalog there is a very similar Nicklaus Champion model, so to narrow down the OP's irons I'd say late 60's to early 70's.

For those unaware, in the old days major manufacturers had two catalogs......."professional" and "retail". To generalize, "professional" equipment was only sold to green-grass pro shops with a PGA professional, and "retail" went everywhere else such as department stores, sporting goods stores, big tire chain stores, etc. Multiple lawsuits in the early to mid 70's blurred this distinction and pro line equipment became more generally available, and the manufacturers gradually discontinued the two separate catalogs.

[honketyhank]

[quote name='chrisbellaire' post='2156429' date='Jan 2 2010, 11:29 AM']Above posters are correct. The Kaplan MacGregor book only goes up to 1970, and only shows a "retail" catalog for 1969. In this retail catalog there is a very similar Nicklaus Champion model, so to narrow down the OP's irons I'd say late 60's to early 70's.

For those unaware, in the old days major manufacturers had two catalogs......."professional" and "retail". To generalize, "professional" equipment was only sold to green-grass pro shops with a PGA professional, and "retail" went everywhere else such as department stores, sporting goods stores, big tire chain stores, etc. Multiple lawsuits in the early to mid 70's blurred this distinction and pro line equipment became more generally available, and the manufacturers gradually discontinued the two separate catalogs.[/quote]

Chris, I didn't know about the two catalog system. Very interesting. Now I know why there seem to be so many odd MacGregors that are not in Kaplan's book. By the way, there is a second edition of Kaplan's MacGregor catalog history. It covers on through about 1999 or 2000. Print quality is poor, but at least it extends the book farther. It's worth looking out for on eBay or wherever.

[windowsurfer]

[quote name='glenntwo' post='2156092' date='Jan 2 2010, 11:08 AM']Those look near-mint. Are there any identifying marks on the shafts? Shaft quality might give you some insight into their value.[/quote]Yeah, the shafts are "MacGregor Tour Step LIGHTWEIGHT." They came with nice branded MacGregor grips, which I replaced (they were toast). They are in great shape but not mint - a few dings and the 3i looks/performs like it has been de-lofted by a long session on an unforgiving mat or a temper tantrum. I would not be surprised if these were more mid-range, but they are solid, feel soft and let me do some shot shaping (curved a 4i around a tree today) so I am OK with that. I love'em. Serial numbers and gold colored hosels made me wonder if they were a higher end set, but maybe that was a way to position the set as upscale, without spending much. They are smallish (just a hair larger than my Toney Penna XQ9s), forged, with no offset. I'd say the shafts are firm, but could be wrong.Thx to all MacGregor brainiacs for replies!

[Sid Vicious]

[quote name='windowsurfer' post='2157753' date='Jan 3 2010, 02:22 AM'][quote name='glenntwo' post='2156092' date='Jan 2 2010, 11:08 AM']Those look near-mint. Are there any identifying marks on the shafts? Shaft quality might give you some insight into their value.[/quote] Yeah, the shafts are "MacGregor Tour Step LIGHTWEIGHT." They came with nice branded MacGregor grips, which I replaced (they were toast). They are in great shape but not mint - a few dings and the 3i looks/performs like it has been de-lofted by a long session on an unforgiving mat or a temper tantrum. I would not be surprised if these were more mid-range, but they are solid, feel soft and let me do some shot shaping (curved a 4i around a tree today) so I am OK with that. I love'em. Serial numbers and gold colored hosels made me wonder if they were a higher end set, but maybe that was a way to position the set as upscale, without spending much. They are smallish (just a hair larger than my Toney Penna XQ9s), forged, with no offset. I'd say the shafts are firm, but could be wrong. Thx to all MacGregor brainiacs for replies!
[/quote]

Hmmm...they may have been ultralights. For those of you that don't know that was a trend in the late 70s-early 80s to make super light clubs. Anyone remember if they made forged utralights?

[windowsurfer]

Hey MacGurus!This ad suggests your 1970 speculation is correct. The ad is from 1970 and my clubheads look to have closely predated or followed this forging (it is a forging, yes?). My club has more weight towards the toe than the one in the image, and mine are stamped Contender on the blade back, above the muscle.[attachment=518547:mac_ad_1970.jpg][url="http://cgi.ebay.com/1970-Jack-Nicklaus-MacGregor-Golf-Clubs-Wood,-Irons-AD_W0QQitemZ250553781714QQcmdZViewItemQQimsxZ20091226?IMSfp=TL091226206004r28309"]http://cgi.ebay.com/1970-Jack-Nicklaus-Mac...226206004r28309[/url]Wonder where I would find a MacGregor "Contender" sand wedge?

[ChristianMc]

Hi,

These irons are very similar to the Jack Nicklaus Golden Bear line of 1986, the difference is the muscle back weight on the rear is a little extended from the mid-bottom of the toe to the top whereas in the contender irons it stops then reaches downwards towards the bottom of the toe. Likewise the MT Tourney 433 irons of 1973 have a similar distribution of muscle weight but this appears in an arc from top of the heel, around the bottom and then up to the top of the toe. This info comes from looking through the second edition of the Kaplan Mac catalog book. The MCX of 1986 also come very close to the design on the contenders (probably the closest I have seen)- these used investment castings techniques which were by then established. Apart from these models I can't see any other close similarities - as others have said much was left out of the catalog books.

Here's a pic of an 86 Golden Bear iron:

The shafts of these models were the Mutli-step lightweight steel shafts and the hosel design seems similar to the contenders from what I can make out of the black and white catalog pics! Maybe a similar time period to this then rather than 70's??

[belmullet]

Hi all,

 

I asked on another MacGregor thread if anyone could tell me anything about these irons picked up on Ebay. There were no replies but I thought I would try one more time. They have alumninum shafts- does that date them to the 70s? I have the first Kaplan book but it ends in 1970. Thanks for your help.

 

 

[ChristianMc]

Hi,
Have not checked Kaplan yet but it may well be the case that they are 1988 when Jack got the golfer of the century award (think it was 88'?)and Mac made some limited century stamped Nicklaus irons. Saying that the 'by Macgregor' stamp looks very like the one's used on the MT tourney's of the early 70's (copies of the VIP's) and aluminium shafts did come out in late 60's early 70's - sorry can't seem to help!

[windowsurfer]

Hi,

These irons are very similar to the Jack Nicklaus Golden Bear line of 1986, the difference is the muscle back weight on the rear is a little extended from the mid-bottom of the toe to the top whereas in the contender irons it stops then reaches downwards towards the bottom of the toe. Likewise the MT Tourney 433 irons of 1973 have a similar distribution of muscle weight but this appears in an arc from top of the heel, around the bottom and then up to the top of the toe. This info comes from looking through the second edition of the Kaplan Mac catalog book. The MCX of 1986 also come very close to the design on the contenders (probably the closest I have seen)- these used investment castings techniques which were by then established. Apart from these models I can't see any other close similarities - as others have said much was left out of the catalog books.

Here's a pic of an 86 Golden Bear iron:

The shafts of these models were the Mutli-step lightweight steel shafts and the hosel design seems similar to the contenders from what I can make out of the black and white catalog pics! Maybe a similar time period to this then rather than 70's??

 

I appreciate your trouble, thanks! What does the face look like on the 86 GB irons? Does it have the little holes beside the grooves? This feature looks to my untrained eye like a 70's vintage design element (these holes or more often diamonds were most popular in the 50's + 60's and hung around into the 70's, right?). I could be wrong. Cheers. -- Mitch

 

(coulda golfed today - pesky work!)

[windowsurfer]

[attachment=519056:_B_e2s5g...kgg___12.jpg]

Also, in the continuing arcane minutia department, the bottom of the grips have a little plastic retainer (see pic), which I painstakingly re-used, making my new GripTecs fit perfectly to the spot where these retainers are epoxied onto the shaft. Do these plastic keepers not indicate that these clubs were factory gripped in [b]leather[/b]? That would be indicative of age, maybe?

Also, as a bonus for your mac-patience, here r pix of some cool Macs (from an entirely unrelated, different set of clubs) with [b]crowns [/b]stamped in next to the grooves, instead of holes or diamonds or triangles. I suspect these are well-known to you guys, but I thought they were kinda unique and typical of the era.

[attachment=519055:Nicklaus_TSL.jpg]
[attachment=519054:Nicklaus_TSL_MB.jpg]

[url="http://www.proxibid.com/asp/LotDetail.asp?ahid=1266&aid=21206&lid=5896532#topoflot"]http://www.proxibid.com/asp/LotDetail.asp?...896532#topoflot[/url]

[drewspin]

They used those little grip retainer rings for both leather and rubber back in the day.

I believe the crowns were from the Brunswick era (as part of the Brunswick logo inside the B there was a little crown).

[ksteven]

The forging is almost identical to the early 70s VIP models. My Maltby club identification book goes back to 1950 and the 1973 VIP model looks to be the same. As some of the earlier posters stated, they appear to be a store model, but the registration numbers are confusing. I don't remember store line having these numbers

[windowsurfer]

[quote name='drewspin' post='2167601' date='Jan 7 2010, 06:10 PM']I believe the crowns were from the Brunswick era (as part of the Brunswick logo inside the B there was a little crown).[/quote]
[attachment=519310:brunswic...ecard_1_.jpg]

And around the neck of the pins. I like it.

[varsityhacker]

Can anyone tell me anything about a set of Mac's Jack Nicklaus Gold crown irons? They have the Brunswick B on them and oddly the number 334 stamped on them, thanks and take care. They also have a tru-flexion shaft.

[infoblues]

[quote name='ChristianMc' timestamp='1262859863' post='2166509']
....... these used investment castings techniques which were by then established....
[/quote]

Does that mean that these are cast heads and not forged?

[robert horneman]

I noticed in The Maltby book that the 1967 vip's had brown ferrules. I think all future irons had black.

I agree with Drew these are probably department store models. So, these might be 1967 models.