The PowerBilt Project

[Bella Woods]

These Are Not Your Daddy's PowerBilts

Forgive me for the lengthy post, but I would like to put this subject "out there".

I have wanted to experiment with this subject for quite sometime, and the time is now.
I have wondered for a long time how persimmon woods (In this case a Driver, 3 Wood
& 5 Wood) would perform with a state of the art modern shaft, and the modern ball.
I consider myself a traditionalist, but this question has bothered me for a long time.

I have always thought that the ball and shaft make up most of the difference between
the older/classic (persimmon) clubs and the newer/modern ones as far as distance goes,
in particular with the driver. I say this with more than 40 years experience in playing golf.
I have had some unshafted/prefinished PowerBilt wood heads (purchased from Golfworks
and laying around for ten years or more) and finally have the chance to put them to the test.

I recently shafted the PowerBilt heads with some new technology Fujikura Motore Speeder
VC 6.0 (Stiff) graphite shafts. The technology behind these shafts is a seven ply cross axis
design that is supposed to promote a stable shaft throughout the swing, and an increased
"kick". It is basically a blend of their legendary Speeder model, and the more recent Rombax
model. I will be using the Titeist Pro V1 and Pro V1x balls in this experiment. I use the Pro V1x
with my modern clubs anyway, but wonder what the spin effect would be with the Pro V1 and
these persimmons.

I have attached some pictures of the clubs as they exist now, basically a demo version (to
determine the optimal club lengths, club weights and swingweights) of what they will become
when they are finished. After hitting them in this state, I have determined that I can hit and
control a 44 3/4" Driver, a 43" 3 Wood and a 42" 5 Wood the best based on several practice
sessions. The Fujikura shafts are very stable at these lengths (actually these shafts are
awesome in these woods). I was ripping the Driver and 5 Wood when testing them on the course.

Prior to shafting these clubs, I contacted Fujikura about the effect of putting these shafts in
persimmon woods (Re: what the effect would be on the tip stiffness and shaft flex as advertised by
them). Their response was that there should be no effect on the tip stiffness (3.5 in this case) by
putting these shafts in a persimmon wood. But for every inch that the shaft went down into the hosel
more than a "normal club", the shaft flex would change by about one half a flex. The depth of the bore
in all three of the PowerBilt heads is three inches. So the stiff flex has become closer to an X flex shaft,
which is the reason I believe I can hit them at the extra length. I will be interested to
see what they end up at CPM wise, I would think 260 to 265, which should be about right for me.

The original specs:

Driver Head - 10.5 degree - 197 grams (good driver weight/loft)
3 Wood Head - 13.5 degree - 200 grams (about 13 to 14 grams to light, loft to strong)
5 Wood Head - 19 degree - 224 grams (good 5 Wood weight/loft)

All shafts 66.5 grams in weight.

After shafting the clubs to the lenghts above and adding 52 gram grips:

Driver - C-9.5 Swingweight, 319 Grams total weight (OK)
3 Wood - C-2 Swingweight. 320 Grams (I knew there was a weight problem)
5 Wood - D-0 Swingweight, 336 Grams total weight (OK)

(I added lead tape to the Driver and 5 Wood (to get to D-1) to test hit them. Didn't
bother with the three wood until refinish)

I will be adding lead weight under the soleplate (on the center bottom, spread out) when
I refinish them to get the Driver to D-3, the 3 Wood to D-4, and the 5 Wood to D-4 or D-5.

I have decided to refinish them as follows:

Deep cherry stain, the same color as my recent post of the 1957 Citation (its why I have
the red/white rings on them that kind of look out of place right now.)

I will recreate the same decal as on the 1957 Citation as well, gold PowerBilt and a white
thunderbolt - my favorite decal of the PowerBilts.

Grip Master burgundy leather perforated grips.

White/Brick Red/White fiber inserts.

When finished, I plan on taking them to the launch monitor and measuring them against
my modern set of clubs.

[Maxwell]

[size="4"][color="#8b0000"]Hmmm..... I have helped Mr. Baird(Jack) re-shaft a set of M/T M85's and M/T M43's with parrallel tip True Temper or TT Lites. Learning to calculate swing weights "on my own" and correctly is not something I can do yet which any confidence so I'll just read what you guys are doing and ask Jack to explain. Thanks for sharing. I've got lots to learn!
Max[/color][/size]

[persimmonpal]

Hey Wally~
As for the weight problem.. I am wondering how feasible it would be to remove the soleplate and put lead tape underneath. To increase that 3 wood you are going to need quite a bit of tape. How about Tungsten powder?? In the past, what I have done is drill a slot under the soleplate with a "paddle" drill bit (not sure of the correct name for that bit).. then I weighed out the correct amount of Tungsten powder I needed, mixed it together with epoxy and poured it in..
Looks like a cool project.. would love to know how they feel.. The red shaft looks good along with the burgundy heads!
You said you are recreating the decals.. do you not have the correct ones??? If you need them, shoot me an email, I have them and can send them in that well-traveled piece of cardboard lol..
Good luck & thanks for posting!

[Bella Woods]

John:

I am going to swingweight the clubs using lead ("parted out" from old clubs I have collected) under
the soleplate when I refinish and generally get the clubs to the specs I want.
I only put lead tape on the driver and 5 wood to take them to the course and hit them.

Its funny because I think I know what you mean by "paddle" bit (real name Brad Point Wood Bits),
I use them too. Normally I just drill the required hold in the bottom of the club, hammer the lead into
the shape of the hole and lightly epoxy it in. I knew the three wood was going to need some due to
the lower raw weight of the head. It won't take that much lead to get it to D-4, and I will spread it
out on the bottom center of the club. Very minor lead swingweighting under the sole plates for the
driver and 5 wood. The driver actually was C - 9.5 (not the C - 8 in my post - I changed).

The other option to add a little weight to the raw club heads would have been to soak them in boiled
linseed oil ("oil harden"), but these heads have already been "acrylic hardened" by the manufacturer.

[u]That piece of cardboard has more frequent flyer miles than both of us put together[/u]! I have the PowerBilt
decal that has the white PowerBilt lettering with a gold thunderbolt, but not the old (1950s style) gold
PowerBilt lettering with the white thunderbolt. Do you have the 1950s style one? I would be interested.

John, the feel of the clubs surprised me to some extent. I have had graphite Fujikura (Speeder) shafts in
persimmon clubs before (driver only in all three cases), but these shafts are very stable/solid. I am very
impressed with how they feel and perform. Several drives I hit reminded me of how I used to hit the
ball say, fifteen/twenty years ago (hard/solid etc).

[freddiec]

I've found hitting persimmon woods with Graphite to be much easier. I recently picked up a nice WB driver with a really strange "Boron Graphite" shaft and it performs really well and so easy to swing. Baby's crying, gotta go. lol

Ok, I'm back. Bella thanks for sharing the info. IMO Graphite and Persimmon is an excellent combo, combining the classic head with new technology. I still prefer hitting professionals only because the Pro V's just provide the right feel for me.

Your Powerbilt driver in that pic looks really sweet. Nice and deep.

[RobotDoctor]

I would think that the combination of persimmon and a graphite shaft would be outstanding. <Please forgive me> I just might look into getting a classic MacGregor driver and getting it reshafted with some high kick stiff flex shaft to see how it goes. Who knows.

[olegolfer]

Interesting experiment. What kind of ball flight do you get with the driver ?

[Bella Woods]

[quote name='olegolfer' date='11 May 2010 - 11:10 PM' timestamp='1273633811' post='2436213']
Interesting experiment. What kind of ball flight do you get with the driver ?
[/quote]

olegolfer:

It was a higher ball flight on the driver compared with the True Temper steel shafts (DG S300) that I
am used to, even with the Pro V-1x. No problem getting the 5 wood up off the ground either,
hit a par 5 green from 215 out into about a 15 mph wind.

I think it may be because the shafts are basically mid flex point, as compared to the high bend
point of the DG steel, plus the driver is much lighter (at least 60 grams).

[belmullet]

If I had the expertise, I would like to try and re-shaft a number of vintage woods with graphite shafts. I have been playing persimmons since last October and keep migrating back to my newer ones (Louisville Golf and Honma) with graphite shafts because they perform better for me. I love the feel of persimmon but am not looking to deliberately disadvantage myself- in other words, I would like to play blades and persimmons and still be competitive. So I think your experiment is a great one. The woods like terrific, by the way.

[Bella Woods]

[quote name='belmullet' date='12 May 2010 - 07:43 PM' timestamp='1273707822' post='2438016']
If I had the expertise, I would like to try and re-shaft a number of vintage woods with graphite shafts. I have been playing persimmons since last October and keep migrating back to my newer ones (Louisville Golf and Honma) with graphite shafts because they perform better for me. I love the feel of persimmon but am not looking to deliberately disadvantage myself- in other words, I would like to play blades and persimmons and still be competitive. So I think your experiment is a great one. The woods like terrific, by the way.
[/quote]

belmullet:

[b]You have hit it right on the nose as to my original purpose for doing this in the first place[/b].

[u]I too love (miss) the feel of persimmon, but do not particularly want to disadvantage myself.[/u] I would like to be competitive in the
approximately 15 tournaments I play per year without having to "give it up". I am hoping I can do this with these clubs.

To be honest with you, I am hoping that these clubs can put me in a position (distance/playability wise) that I used to
enjoy when I was younger with the same clubs (persimmon minus the heavier steel shaft). I am a lot smarter than I used
to be, I am going to "tweek" them for me. It works for the seniors now with the modern clubs, why not with these, even if it is on a lessor scale. Look at Hale Irwin's driving distance stats between the old days and the recent past. He was never a long hitter but hits much longer now than when he was younger. I honestly don't think the main reason is the clubface, I think it is mostly the shaft and the ball.

A lot of talk is about the sweet spot, and miss hits, when people compare the "old' persimmon clubs to the modern heads. But the fact of the matter is, there is only one sweet spot on any club in my opinion. Its only the definition that has changed. I have never been the greatest ball striker out there, not even close. But I do not have (and never have had) a problem hitting a persimmon wood decently (for the most part solidly). A miss hit is a miss hit, no matter what club you are playing.

My goal is to have the woods ready to play (and have had time to practice playing with them) in an "official" Michigan Publinx golf tournament on July 18th.

[Bella Woods]

[u][b]Update on the PowerBilt Project:[/b][/u]

All of the woods have been stripped of the finish, the ABS plastic inserts removed, and the soleplates have
been removed as well. There were several surprises when removing the soleplates.

I have refinished many of these Maltby PowerBilt heads, but check out the three wood. The normal hole is
drilled in the bottom center of the club with the plastic liner, but no cork etc. (an empty hole). No wonder it was
way to light. Also, the five wood was swingweighted using lead powder, also not the norm.

First two pictures, Driver, 3 Wood & 5 Wood. Third picture Driver with the usual cork swing weighting.
Fourth picture Driver, 3 Wood & 5 Wood. Fifth and sixth pictures 5 Wood and 3 Wood.

Next step is installation of the fiber inserts prior to initial swing weighting to my specs.

The fiber inserts will weigh more than the ABS plastic inserts that were in these woods, affecting my
final swing weight adjustments.

[attachment=595145:PowerBilt Project Update.jpg]

[attachment=595146:PowerBilt Project Update (2)jpg.jpg]

[attachment=595148:PowerBilt Project Update (3).jpg]

[attachment=595147:PowerBilt Project Update (4).jpg]

[attachment=595149:PowerBilt Project Update (5).jpg]

[attachment=595150:PowerBilt Project Update (6)jpg.jpg]

[persimmonpal]

nice work Wally.. Looking good!

[eafiii]

What a great project. Kudos to you. I wish I had the tools, skills and patience to do a project like that. I bet the work you put into it feels pretty good when your done. Craftsmanship used to be a much, much bigger part of the club industry.

[professor_doom]

This sounds like a great idea. Any updates? I'm really interested in finding out how persimmon fairway woods with modern shafts stack up against metal woods of the same loft, because I'm thinking about going a similar route with my 3-wood. Would you mind posting the loft specifications of the clubs and providing a distance comparison?

[Bella Woods]

professor_doom:

Thanks, I will have an update coming shortly. I got set back a bit because I
actually had to get some work done!

I will post all specs when I complete the project (some prior to completion).

BTW, the 5 wood prior to tearing it apart, was the equivalent of my modern club
in "performance".