www.TourTempo.com

[jeffinflorida]

This I feel is not the be all end all book on tempo in the golf swing. What it is is a very interesting perspective on swing tempo by Mr. Novosel. His study or the tempos of successful golfers has merit but the drills included in the accompanying cd are not going to work for all individuals. The drills are based on the tempos 21/7 24/8 and 27/9. It is very possible for a very good player to have a tempo that does not match up to these 3 base tempos. As the author himself acknowledged many pros have other tempos such as 24/9. Players such as Ernie Els, Jerry Kelly, Vijay Singh. That is also my swing tempo and I found the drills on the cd impossible to use. That being said this is a interesting book and the knowledge I gained was well worth the price I payed.

[psquared]

I picked up the tour tempo book on Monday and I have to say I am quite impressed so far. Since my wife and I had our first child in January, my time golfing has dwindled down from typical 1-2 week from a NJ golf season to a total of only 10 rounds this whole year so far. During the season, I do get to spend some time out on the range during lunch (helps to have a range down the street from my office), but it really isn't same as being out on the course. In any case, without playing much, I did notice that rhythm on the course is always the hardest thing to find, outside (or part of) a short game.

After I picked up this book, I did drills in my basement listening to the tunes provided. I do have to say that I found 21/7 to be my preferred tempo and simply spent 30 minutes the past couple of nights in the basement hitting to that tempo. Well, I played a round today and shot one of my best rounds in a long time (+2) with a -4 back nine with four 3-putts. I don't know if it was just the novelty of the concepts or just having a really good day at the course.

I am interested to see how tour tempo will work in the long run, but after this round I'm going to look more into it. It really is ashame that the golf season in NJ is coming to end.

The big change in my game as a result of tour tempo was incorporating the tempo concepts to my pre-shot routine and address-to-swing. Basically, I kept my mechanical pre-shot routine concentrating on swing points and ALL of the typical analytical points --- wrists, arms, elbows, etc. (ala Ben Hogan). But as soon as I address the ball, I just replay the pre-shot 21/7 rhythm in my head and just swing to the beats. I really can't say how close I was to hitting exactly at that tempo, but I can say that I was hitting the ball freaking clean [14/18 greens in regulation].

[stevestrike]

This is great timing for this topic to come up (hehe, pun intended) for me because today at the course, I hit some terrific (for me) 3-woods. Then, later in the round they weren't going nearly as well. My playing partner/friend said to me, "You know, I don't know what you are doing differently, but your tempo seems off--it's not smooth like it was earlier"

I've been thinking the same thing, so here we are. I'm going to check out a few tracks on iTunes.

What are the tracks on iTunes called, or what are they filed under?

EDIT: One more thing, what does the "Swing, set, through" mean? Swing would be start of the backswing? Set is the transition? Through is downswing or impact? Help!

[willamette]

[quote name='stevestrike' post='798602' date='Nov 21 2007, 10:58 PM']This is great timing for this topic to come up (hehe, pun intended) for me because today at the course, I hit some terrific (for me) 3-woods. Then, later in the round they weren't going nearly as well. My playing partner/friend said to me, "You know, I don't know what you are doing differently, but your tempo seems off--it's not smooth like it was earlier"

I've been thinking the same thing, so here we are. I'm going to check out a few tracks on iTunes.

What are the tracks on iTunes called, or what are they filed under?

EDIT: One more thing, what does the "Swing, set, through" mean? Swing would be start of the backswing? Set is the transition? Through is downswing or impact? Help![/quote]

I would use the three beep track rather than the Swing, Set, through track....MUCH less annoying than that monotone voice..yes, Swing = begin swing, Set = top of backswing/begin downswing, through = impact. Also, one important thing is to NOT anticipate the beeps....just try to get your swing timed so it naturally corresponds with the beeps/words. By not anticipating the beeps, this means especially for the 2nd beep/"set," don't go into the backswing waiting for it to happen, because you run the risk of taking too long or small a backswing if your natural speed is too slow/fast. Just try to work on matching a free flowing natural swing to the beeps.

[ripsid]

Does anyone still have the mp3's? I'm deffinately looking into this! My buddy who's an unbelievable striker of the ball suggested it and even he's benefitted from it... he shot a 76 with a back 9 32 using the methods.

Thanks

[randy6675]

"What are the tracks on iTunes called, or what are they filed under?"

I am also interested in where to find these. I admit I am a complete novice at itunes (golf too ), but I can't find anything using the search for tour tempo.

Thanks.

[def]

I purchased the book and it came with a CD including the tempo tracks. I then put them on my iPod. I haven't seen them on iTunes. You may want to check the TourTempo website to see if you can purchase and download them there.

[Serenity05]

Just wanted to add my two cents:)

I purchased the tour tempo digital music player. I've been to the range several times and the result were evident. I was peppering the flags from all distances! I am really excited to practice more with the tour tempo to really ingrain the 3:1 swing ratio!

[roger davis]

Hello all

1st post!!! i've just purchased 'TourTempo" and i need some advice, i seem to be the only person whose backswing

is too fast and i need to slow down, anyone else find this? having said this i really do struggle with 'casting' the club

and have seen in the book that one of the pupils/examples also found this, i've found 24/8 is probably the best for me,

any thoughts/advice would be appreciated

many thanks

rgds

Roger (UK)

[Mala]

In the book it suggests starting off with using just the 2 beep track of the CD to start with. The first beep to initiate the swing and the second for the top of the backswing. (the "swing - set" tracks)

 

This might enable you to just concentrate on the backswing and get that right first.

[Navyplayer]

Hello all

1st post!!! i've just purchased 'TourTempo" and i need some advice, i seem to be the only person whose backswing

is too fast and i need to slow down, anyone else find this? having said this i really do struggle with 'casting' the club

and have seen in the book that one of the pupils/examples also found this, i've found 24/8 is probably the best for me,

any thoughts/advice would be appreciated

many thanks

rgds

Roger (UK)

 

 

I've been using TT which I downloaded to my MP3 player for over a year now. When I’m a little off with my timing I always go back to listening to it before I play or when I’m on the practice range. I get positive compliments on my tempo all the time.

As far as your casting, a little casting in itself is not all that bad and sometimes enables a player to widen the arch of their downswing. The problem as I see it comes when the club get’s ahead of the hands through the impact zone. Tom Watson has a slight cast to initiate his swing but get’s his hands in front of the club head on the way down. As far as trying to get rid of it altogether you may want to try and keep the "L" for a fraction of a second longer on your down swing. Just holding it and naturally allowing your wrist to unhinge naturally from waist level down should help. I believe there is a “L” drill for this in the book. You probably already know that this will enable you to lag the club longer which in turn will create more head speed through the impact zone. To help with that you may want to try using the slower tempo’s until you get a feel for the beats. The longer pause at the top should help because the slower beats will allow you not to anticipate the “through” beat which may be leading your casting movement. Good luck….

[happyroman]

I have read this book several times, and totally agree with the author's premise regarding the tempo of the golf swing. However, being a former musician, I found it difficult to use the CD which is included with the book. If you follow the instructions, you must wait until you actually hear the first tone to begin the backswing, responding to, but not anticipating, the sound to begin the swing.

 

In order to compensate for the slight delay caused by waiting to hear the sound, they added a little extra time between the first and second tones, which really drove me crazy (the an@l retentive musician in me). So I figured out what the tempo would be for each swing ratio (24/8, 27/9, etc.) in terms of breats per minute and simply use a standard metronome, matching the swing positions to the rythem of the metronome. I start with a slower tempo than what is ideal for me, gradually moving the tempo up in speed until I start to feel a little out of control, and then back off to the ideal tempo (for me).

 

When I practice in this manner, it really helps me quiet the mind. I can't worry about all of the mental checklists that can interfere with the swing. I just try and swing smoothly in time with the beat. FWIW, here is a table with the metronome tempos for the various swing ratios (in BPM).

 

Tour Tempo Ratio BPM

21:7 193

24:8 169

27:9 150

30:10 135

33:11 123

I use these in a waltz tempo, feeling the swing as 1-2-3, 1-2-3, etc., with the first beat ocurring at the beginning of the swing and the second beat at the impact position. Think of a pendulum swinging back and forth, passing the low point on the first beat of each three beat grouping. I use this for everything from putting to chipping to pitching to full swings with every club in the bag. Hope this helps.

[Largechris]

Was sceptical but gave it a go last night, listened to the rythym (24/8) in the car on the way to the course this morning and just had my best round of the year (gross 75).

 

We all instinctively know what good and bad tempo looks and feels like, but upto now no-one has defined good tempo in a simple way which we can practice and use on the course.

 

Quick tip - for some reason the website www.cdbaby has lengthy legitimate previews of the music tracks, including the mysterious 'alpha wave' tracks.

 

Being musical, I find the music tracks 3 1 beat easier to think about over the shot than the green box beeping noises.

 

I wouldn't say I hit the ball brilliantly this morning, what I did do for the first time in a long time was not hit any card wrecking shots.

 

This system will not make up for poor mechanics, but maybe for me defined tempo is the missing link - the true test as for all training aids will be my scores in 6 months time.

 

For what it is, the complete system is vastly overpriced - trouble is it seems to work. Could say the same about a tour burner as well I suppose.

[sambocaesar]

I got this book, but when I checked the accompanying cd, there were only audio tracks for the 3 tone sets. There are supposed to be video lesson tracks also. Did I get a first edition blooper? I just sent an email to www.tourtempo.com, but no response as of yet ... weekend.

[type-Verplank-one]

I'm a little confused of the diff. number ratios like 24/7, 24/8, etc.

[sambocaesar]

I got this book, but when I checked the accompanying cd, there were only audio tracks for the 3 tone sets. There are supposed to be video lesson tracks also. Did I get a first edition blooper? I just sent an email to www.tourtempo.com, but no response as of yet ... weekend.

 

Apparently, Vista only sees the audio files (.cda) and nothing else. When I opened the cd on an xp computer, the video files were there. I guess Vista is not backward compatible with CDSF type cd's.

[ZombieDave]

FWIW, here is a table with the metronome tempos for the various swing ratios (in BPM).

 

Tour Tempo Ratio BPM

21:7 193

24:8 169

27:9 150

30:10 135

33:11 123

I use these in a waltz tempo, feeling the swing as 1-2-3, 1-2-3, etc., with the first beat ocurring at the beginning of the swing and the second beat at the impact position. Think of a pendulum swinging back and forth, passing the low point on the first beat of each three beat grouping. I use this for everything from putting to chipping to pitching to full swings with every club in the bag. Hope this helps.

 

I have limited musical knowledge, and I've only listened to the free samples on the website, but I work the BPMs out as approximately:

 

161.5 bpm for 21:7

144 bpm for 24:8

129.5 bpm for 27:9

 

It's a 4-4 pattern, with "swing" on the first beat, "set" on the third, and "through" on the fourth.

 

Shouldn't be difficult to make your own track, or even just listen to electronic tracks with those bpms.

 

Is this right? Or am I missing something?

[naxos41]

I am a novice golfer but an experienced musician. I first discovered Tour Tempo from their YouTube infomercial. I then went to their web page, figured that there must be mp3 tracks available. I google searched for "tour tempo mp3", which lead me to this forum. (Many thanks to willamette's condensed version). For those looking for mp3 tracks on the internet, they are available at emusic dot com. So, I basically obtained the mp3 tracks without reading the book, but with the information from this page and YouTube video.

 

The 27/9 tracks I downloaded confused me a bit. I was expecting that they would contain a set of three signal tones that were separated by 3:1. What I found was the three tones separated by 2:1 (a 4-4 pattern in which swing-set-through on the 1st-3rd-4th beat, that's 2:1) . If I "time" my three swing points (swing, set, through) "on" the signal tones, I would be swinging with a 2/1 tempo.

 

Then, I stopped by at Barnes and Noble and read the key chapter on this issue. The author actually once created the three tones at 0, 0.90 s, and 1.20 s (three tones separated by 3:1 and the total elapsed time corresponding to 27/9), and tried them on his kids who are low handicappers. With this rhythm, the kids had to "anticipate" the tones and time their action on the beat, but they had difficulty doing so. From my own experience, it is easy to anticipate the first note and start the back swing (provided that there are continuous background beats), but it is not always easy to time the "set" position at a tone. I think it is the nature of the set position (which doubles as the end of backswing and the beginning of downswing) that causes this difficulty.

 

Therefore, the creation of the current version of the three tone sets. The author instructs that players need to react to (but should not anticipate) the first and second beats. Then, the moment of impact must be timed ON the third beat (this is easy). The three beats on my 27/9 tracks come at 0, 0.90, and 1.35 second. Because there should be the same amount of delay (which must be 0.10-0.15 second for the most people) in our reaction to the first and second beats, the actual swing tempo would become close to 0.90-0.30. That's my interpretation.

[stevestrike]

FWIW, here is a table with the metronome tempos for the various swing ratios (in BPM).

 

Tour Tempo Ratio BPM

21:7 193

24:8 169

27:9 150

30:10 135

33:11 123

I use these in a waltz tempo, feeling the swing as 1-2-3, 1-2-3, etc., with the first beat ocurring at the beginning of the swing and the second beat at the impact position. Think of a pendulum swinging back and forth, passing the low point on the first beat of each three beat grouping. I use this for everything from putting to chipping to pitching to full swings with every club in the bag. Hope this helps.

 

I have limited musical knowledge, and I've only listened to the free samples on the website, but I work the BPMs out as approximately:

 

161.5 bpm for 21:7

144 bpm for 24:8

129.5 bpm for 27:9

 

It's a 4-4 pattern, with "swing" on the first beat, "set" on the third, and "through" on the fourth.

 

Shouldn't be difficult to make your own track, or even just listen to electronic tracks with those bpms.

 

Is this right? Or am I missing something?

 

You're close.

 

21-7 is 80 BPM (not 160!)

24-8 is 72 BPM

27-9 is 64.5 BPM

 

But the answer to your question is yes, you could easily make your own tracks at those same tempos, OR shift those tempos to match your own. Personally, I've found that swinging using the TourTempo tracks gets me way too rushed on my backswing. I don't see how I can get the club going away slowly, when the next sound I hear in my head is "SET-THROUGH!"

[donmcd]

FWIW, here is a table with the metronome tempos for the various swing ratios (in BPM).

 

Tour Tempo Ratio BPM

21:7 193

24:8 169

27:9 150

30:10 135

33:11 [/size]123

I use these in a waltz tempo, feeling the swing as 1-2-3, 1-2-3, etc., with the first beat ocurring at the beginning of the swing and the second beat at the impact position. Think of a pendulum swinging back and forth, passing the low point on the first beat of each three beat grouping. I use this for everything from putting to chipping to pitching to full swings with every club in the bag. Hope this helps.

 

I have limited musical knowledge, and I've only listened to the free samples on the website, but I work the BPMs out as approximately:

 

161.5 bpm for 21:7

144 bpm for 24:8

129.5 bpm for 27:9

 

It's a 4-4 pattern, with "swing" on the first beat, "set" on the third, and "through" on the fourth.

 

Shouldn't be difficult to make your own track, or even just listen to electronic tracks with those bpms.

 

Is this right? Or am I missing something?

 

You're close.

 

21-7 is 80 BPM (not 160!)

24-8 is 72 BPM

27-9 is 64.5 BPM

 

But the answer to your question is yes, you could easily make your own tracks at those same tempos, OR shift those tempos to match your own. Personally, I've found that swinging using the TourTempo tracks gets me way too rushed on my backswing. I don't see how I can get the club going away slowly, when the next sound I hear in my head is "SET-THROUGH!"

 

 

 

actually he was correct. 21-7 is around 162. I'm not sure what the precise number is but I'll do some math..

[JackB1]

 

Tour Tempo Ratio BPM

21:7 193

24:8 169

27:9 150

30:10 135

33:11 [/size]123

 

I dont think this table is correct. I played a sample of the 27-9 track is it was quite slower than 150 bpm. It was more like 129-130 bpm. And 24-8 was 144. You can check yourself at http://webmetronome.com/ and the samples are online at cdbaby.com

 

Also, if there are 4 beats per measure, aren't you starting on 1 and impact on 3?

Some else said you are starting on 1 and impact on 4? Thar seems to slow.

[JackB1]

You're close.

 

21-7 is 80 BPM (not 160!)

24-8 is 72 BPM

27-9 is 64.5 BPM

 

But the answer to your question is yes, you could easily make your own tracks at those same tempos, OR shift those tempos to match your own. Personally, I've found that swinging using the TourTempo tracks gets me way too rushed on my backswing. I don't see how I can get the club going away slowly, when the next sound I hear in my head is "SET-THROUGH!"

 

He was right. You are dividing the number in half for some reason???

 

I donwloaded a few samples and put them on my cell phone and listened at the course today, in between shots and hit more solid shots than I normally do. I shot a 90 which is about 7 below the norm. I used a 24/8 tempo all the way thru and found that it cleared my head of all other swing thoughts and had me hitting the ball much better. But I think I may try 27/9 next time, as I felt a little rushed on 24/8. I could stay with the tempo, but I felt like it didn't give me enough time to get a full shoulder turn. But I was encouraged with the results. I think the key is to find the tempo that suits you and ALWAYS swing at that tempo.

 

Question.......should I use this tempo for chips and also putting?

[stevestrike]

You guys are listening to the music tracks correct? Are any of you actually musicians? Those tracks are NOT 160+ BPM! People do not play at that rhythm. Check out Dave Pelz's stuff, it's all around 70 BPM.

[JackB1]

You guys are listening to the music tracks correct? Are any of you actually musicians? Those tracks are NOT 160+ BPM! People do not play at that rhythm. Check out Dave Pelz's stuff, it's all around 70 BPM.

 

check yourself at http://webmetronome.com/

play the metronome along with any of the tracks.

You realize 60 bmp is one beat per second? That is very slow.

There are 4 beats per measure...not 2.

 

Even on this page, it says most rock songs are 100-130 BPM

http://www.visionmusic.com/metronome/

 

All these country songs are 130 BPM, which is the same as 27/9. In theory, you could use these for your swing tempo also...

http://www.bonanzafitnessmusic.com/shopexd.asp?id=1

 

This is a great website...you can search for 130 BPM and find songs you can download on itunes to swing to..

http://www.technosweat.com/bpm/Workout_Songs_view.php

[Mward2002]

I used to play the piano for 6 years and cared mostly for the 24/8 tempo. I figured it to be right around 144-146 BPM. You can double check it to an online metronome if you want but that's the tempo.

 

Whoever posted the half numbers ,you still have it, you just have to imagine it as a 2/2 instead of a 4/4. Beat 1, take it up to the top, beat 2, be at impact. If that works for you, do it, but to me personally it would feel rushed.

[JackB1]

Whoever posted the half numbers ,you still have it, you just have to imagine it as a 2/2 instead of a 4/4. Beat 1, take it up to the top, beat 2, be at impact. If that works for you, do it, but to me personally it would feel rushed.

 

Isn't impact at "3" if you are counting 4 beats per measure?

1 > start takeaway

2 > top

3 > impact

4> ------

 

They said the swing is 3 parts in total and 1 part is impact.

[Tempoman]

DXP Tech LLC (dxptech.com) offers a set of golf swing training tones called CoreTempo Tones.

Unlike other training tones that provide beeps embedded in music for the start of the backswing,

start of the downswing, and impact, CoreTempo provides a continuous audio tone (based on a model

of a perfect swing) that guides the golfer throughout the entire swing.

CoreTempo Tones sound like a golf swing.

 

John Novosel (tourtempo.com) claims that all professionals swing with a 3:1 ratio of backswing to

downswing to impact.

However, DXP Tech has determined that most professionals on tour have swing ratios that range

from 2.2 to 3.2. Video analysis of numerous professionals confirms this. For instance,

Phil Mickelson has a swing ratio of 2.3 for a wedge, 2.4 for an 8-iron, and 2.8 for his driver.

 

Dxp Tech has created a series of mp3 files that cover 12 tempos from 72bpm to 129bpm, each with

a separate mp3 covering 2.1 to 3.2 swing ratios in .1 increments. These files are precisely

engineered models of a perfect golf swing that cover a much wider range of tempos and swing

ratios than any other product of its kind. Instead of specifying the number of 29.97fps NTSC

frames for the tempo, Dxp Tech uses Beats Per Minute coupled with a Swing Ratio number.

For instance, 112BPM/2.4 is Phil Mickelson's CoreTempo for an 8-iron.

 

CoreTempo Tones come in three sets: Senior, Mid, and Pro and cost $19.95/set.

Each set consists of 72 mp3 files.

 

For Putting Tempo, don's use a Metronome, use the Puttronome set. Puttronome Tones

emulate a perfect pendulum putting stroke.

 

see dxptech.com for more information and videos of PGA Tour Pros swinging with their

CoreTempo Tone in background.

contact [email protected] for more information or go to dxptech.com

[JackB1]

interesting......

 

wish there was some sample mp3's I could download and try out before springing for the whole thing.

[DavidT]

has anyone tried the new Micro Player, comes pre loaded with the tones ... how's it fit, how's it's durability ?

[Tempoman]

Just to elaborate a little on full swing tempo (I've studied this is detail for the past 5 years):

 

Tour Tempo is based on time increments of .033 seconds which is the period of a standard NTSC video. When you listen to the 24/8 tone, it consists of 24 frames for the backswing and 8 frames from the top to impact. That would be .8 sec for the backswing and .267 sec from the top to impact. So, if you tried to use a metronome to match up with the start, top of backswing, and impact, it would need to be set for a tick every .267 sec! That would be 225 bpm! Tick-for the start, tick, tick, tick, to the top, and tick at impact. If you wanted to slow it down where it's discernable, choose the start of takeaway and impact as your two swing points. For 24/8, that would be 32 frames or 1.066sec, or 56bpm. However, with this mode, you don't know where the top of the backswing is.

 

Tour Tempo also "advances" the start and top of backswing by .2 seconds to account for human reaction time, so that's why it's hard to match a metronome to it. Tour Tempo's slowest full swing tempo is 27/9. I've found that many on tour like David Toms and Vaughn Taylor have slower tempos than the minimum Tour Tempo Tone. There are many amateurs that can't swing as fast as the pros on tour.

 

In addition, I've found that the fixed 3:1 ratio built in to Tour Tempo doesn't apply to most pros. Tiger's is ~2.6. Phil's is ~2.4-2.8. For short irons, the swing ratio is typically 2.3-2.5. For a driver, it's 2.7-2.9. There are some on tour like Ryan Moore and Colt Knost whose swing ratios are 4:1. But the majority on tour have swing ratios of 2.3-2.7.

 

Instead of using video frames for the units of tempo, I use beats per minute based on the downswing to impact * 2. That's because the downswing to impact is half of a full downswing. The most critical part of any swing is downswing to impact. So, a 24/8 Tour Tempo would be 112bpm. 27/9 would be 100bpm(60/(2*9*.0333). David Toms and Vaughn Taylor are 90 bpm and would correspond to a Tour Tempo of 30/10 which isn't provided in the microPlayer.

 

There's a video at dxptech.com that explains tempo for full swings and putts and shows the measured tempo of many pros on tour with a corresponding CoreTempo Tone played in background. There are three sample CoreTempo Tones that you can listen to that are 72bpm, 90bpm, and 112bpm, all with swing ratios of 2.5.