Rules Violations Compensation

[Charlie_Foxtrot]

for establishing a handicap

I am currently trying to establish a GHIN handicap and so I am a stickler about following the rules.

However, occasionally something happens on the course that makes strict compliance with the rules impractical. The most common example (for me) is a lost ball. On a public course, it's not practical to walk all the way back to the tee box and re hit a shot after I've searched for and been unable to find my ball. (Obviously, if I'd realized how bad the shot was, I would have hit a provisional, but every now and then I hit one that I am certain I will be able to find, but then can't). There is no way I am going to make the group behind me suffer for my poor play.

I remember hearing that the proper procedure (for handicap purposes) is to give yourself the score you would most likely have received if you had followed the rules. In my case, for the above example, I give myself a 2 stroke penalty and hit from the crappy lie I probably would have had if I had been able to find my ball.

So I have 2 questions:

(1) can anyone find written authority for the "give yourself the score you would have most likely received" rule; and

(2) for the lost ball scenario (by far the most common rules breach for me), do you think the "2 stroke and play from the lost area" is the appropriate remedy for complying with the rule in #1?

Thanks.

[ApexGrind]

I don't believe there is any such thing as "score what you would have made". There is a stipulation for scoring holes you didn't finish. It's your handicaped score on each hole...which you don't have :beruo:. Oh well. What to do if you don't finish holes and don't have a handicap? Scratch for those holes? seems kind of harsh.

 

I think taking a 2 stroke penalty and dropping a ball where you thought you would find the original ball is very equitable in that situation. I don't think this should happen enough to significantly skew your handicap. It's going to be close, but any undue effect would be to raise your handicap above where it should be. If you were to re-hit, some of those would be good shots to the fairway or green and you'd be hitting your next shot from a good position/lie. If you score a 2 stroke penalty and drop where it's likely to be lost you will more often than not be in a not so good spot.

 

I think that's a great local rule for not so serious club tournaments to speed play when someone doesn't hit a provisional.

Technically, without a local rule to that effect, you don't post the round. Somewhere in between would be to post (keep track of) the untainted 9 hole score (if it only happened on one 9) to use with your next 9 hole score for posting?

[Shaitan]

Generally in hcap terms, in Australia anyways, when going for a hcap the handicapping system doesn't take into consideration anything over double bogey so when going for handicap and you find yourself really hacking it and you want to speed up play just give yourself a score that is +2 or worse and it won't affect your overall handicap. This depends though on your maximum handicap limit. Ours is 27, therefore the real worse score you can get is +2, but if you can get a hcap over 36 then it would be +3.

[Charlie_Foxtrot]

I don't believe there is any such thing as "score what you would have made". There is a stipulation for scoring holes you didn't finish.

 

That must be what I was thinking of.

 

It's going to be close, but any undue effect would be to raise your handicap above where it should be.

 

I'm going to be the max handicap anyway. (and I'm not going to be playing for money anytime soon, so no need to worry about sandbagging.) I'm just trying to make sure I understand and follow all the rules.

 

If you were to re-hit, some of those would be good shots to the fairway or green and you'd be hitting your next shot from a good position/lie.

 

Ahhhhh, clearly you haven't see me play! :beruo:

 

 

Technically, without a local rule to that effect, you don't post the round. Somewhere in between would be to post (keep track of) the untainted 9 hole score (if it only happened on one 9) to use with your next 9 hole score for posting?

 

I think you are right.

 

From now on, I'm trying to remember to hit provisional balls if there is even the slightest chance that I may not be able to find my ball.

[Charlie_Foxtrot]

Generally in hcap terms, in Australia anyways, when going for a hcap the handicapping system doesn't take into consideration anything over double bogey so when going for handicap and you find yourself really hacking it and you want to speed up play just give yourself a score that is +2 or worse and it won't affect your overall handicap. This depends though on your maximum handicap limit. Ours is 27, therefore the real worse score you can get is +2, but if you can get a hcap over 36 then it would be +3.

 

 

Good points.

 

I'm still trying to understand equitable stroke control. Not how it works, but if the software I use for my GHIN will automatically calculate the ESC, or if I need to do it manually before I enter my scores.

 

(right now I'm using a free, unofficial handicap service. But as soon as I have enough qualifying rounds, I'm going to move all the data over to an official GHIN service.)

[ApexGrind]

Good idea. Which will lead to the next quandry :beruo: You have to be able to distinguish between your first and second (or third) ball. There seems to be some tendency at this stage of the game to miraculously replicate the first bad shot perfectly. So you're going through your sleeves of balls that you meticulously marked when you bought them. You get out there and find two #3's with your mark sitting within a couple of yards of each other... been there, done that. My friends said I was DQ'd but you're actually allowed to select either ball and play it as your provisional ball.

[Shaitan]

That's why when you hit a provisional you hit a different number :beruo:, or a different type of ball. Eg prov1 & prov1x

[onkelbenz]

From now on, I'm trying to remember to hit provisional balls if there is even the slightest chance that I may not be able to find my ball.

 

This is the most reasonable thing to do, for several reasons:

 

a. most obviously, you'll always have a second ball to play with, correctly according to the rules.

b. even if the 2nd shot is shorter than where you think your first one ended up, you can go on playing it provisionally, unless you've passed your first one accidentally (that has never happened to me so far, I have a pair of trained and functional eyes...)

c. you really don't lose much time

d. you get to hit practice shots completely within the rules :beruo:

 

If a ball might be lost, because it's obviously not in the fairway, semi-rough, water hazard or bunker, I'll hit a provisional. Unless it's a casual practice round that I don't keep score of (rare). If it's not lost, the whole procedure of hitting another one and picking it up again (even if I have to look for that one in the end) costs me a few seconds to less than a minute. I usually use not-so-good balls for the 2nd so if I don't find it within a minute I give it up.

 

OB

[onkelbenz]

That's why when you hit a provisional you hit a different number :beruo:, or a different type of ball. Eg prov1 & prov1x

 

It's perfectly sufficient and within the rules to mark both balls individually with a sharpie. As long as they're distinguishable, e.g. 1 dot vs. 2 dots etc. Just put one in your bag, and make it a habit to use it everytime...

OB

[BEND OF THE RIVER GC]

Occasionally I run into this problem myself. I have been seeing more and more golf courses marking holes where you used to see OB Lateral (red). This makes solving this scenario easy. I also hate slowing down play for everyone else on the course.

 

I guess you could announce a provisional each and every time you might think you hit one out.

[Joe Schmoe]

Hit a provisional. It will give you some extra practice and is within the rules. I'll even hit a provisional on a blind tee shot if I have any doubt that it's in the fairway.

 

When i buy a box of balls i open up all the sleeves, and mix them up so i make sure i don't have two balls of the same number in any one sleeve. Additionally as someone else mentioned, you make your balls differently to distinguish which is the original and which is the provisional.

[Charlie_Foxtrot]

I submitted my question to the USGA and this is the response I received:

 

Dear Charlie-

In regard to your earlier question regarding your "lost ball" for handicap posting purposes you would record your "Most Likely Score" for that hole, since you started the hole but did not finish it - assuming you picked up or moved on to keep up with the Pace of Play.

 

If you don't start/play the hole then for handicap posting purposes you record Par plus any handicap strokes you are entitled to for your score on that hole.

 

I would suggest reviewing Section 5 - Scores in the USGA Handicap System manual which is available online at www.USGA.org under the Handicap page.

 

Thank you.

 

So I guess the correct procedure is to abandon the hole and then record my "most likely score". Unfortunately, with my erratic play - who knows what that is. I would play the hole per my previous procedure to estimate my "most likely score", but now it looks like by doing that, I am violating the "no practice strokes during a round in stroke play" rule. Arrrggg!