What is the one rule you wish could be changed

[Mr. Bean]

> @LICC said:

> > @davep043 said:

> > > @LICC said:

> >

> > > Still not making sense. You can’t go to the bottom of a pond to play your ball just like you can’t go off the property to play your ball. In both cases you hit a wayward shot. In one, you get credit for the distance you were able to keep in play and only get penalized one shot. In the other, distance penalty, effectively two shots. Illogical. And not all OB is off property. Sometimes you just hit it into unplayable terrain. There is no reason to have inconsistent application of penalties.

> > If it makes sense to you to treat a ball that is in a specific hazard ON the golf course the same as a ball that is completely OFF the golf course, your idea of "logic" will always differ from mine. Fortunately for me, for the last 250 years the Ruling Bodies have seen it the same way I do. And when faced with an opportunity just last year to move towards your view of "logical", they refused.

>

> Explain why it should be treated differently. Why two shots that each went wayward and landed where they cannot be played or retrieved should be treated differently.

 

I give one more shot then I give up and I hope others will do the same.

 

When your ball is in a Penalty Area you MAY play it if you can but you MAY choose not to and take relief with one PS, very similar to unplayable ball. When your ball is somewhere else than on the course you may NOT play it even it it was playable. So, in the case of a PA you have a CHOICE but when your ball is OB you do NOT have a choice.

[LICC]

> @Newby said:

> PAs are on the course by intent. They are designed to make you thing about how you play and where you aim. They have a particular purpose in the game. Bunkers are similar but not the same.

> OOB simply defines the limit of the area in which the game is to be played. It has no purpose in the game

> Snakes and ladders can be played with your token on a snake but not when your token is off the board.

> If when playing chess, you accidentally knock your piece off the board, you replace it where it was. If you move it to a new position, you suffer the potential consequences if you moved it to a poor position.

> The only difference with golf is that you pay a penalty to get readmission to the course.

 

> @"Mr. Bean" said:

> > @LICC said:

> > > @davep043 said:

> > > > @LICC said:

> > >

> > > > Still not making sense. You can’t go to the bottom of a pond to play your ball just like you can’t go off the property to play your ball. In both cases you hit a wayward shot. In one, you get credit for the distance you were able to keep in play and only get penalized one shot. In the other, distance penalty, effectively two shots. Illogical. And not all OB is off property. Sometimes you just hit it into unplayable terrain. There is no reason to have inconsistent application of penalties.

> > > If it makes sense to you to treat a ball that is in a specific hazard ON the golf course the same as a ball that is completely OFF the golf course, your idea of "logic" will always differ from mine. Fortunately for me, for the last 250 years the Ruling Bodies have seen it the same way I do. And when faced with an opportunity just last year to move towards your view of "logical", they refused.

> >

> > Explain why it should be treated differently. Why two shots that each went wayward and landed where they cannot be played or retrieved should be treated differently.

>

> I give one more shot then I give up and I hope others will do the same.

>

> When your ball is in a Penalty Area you MAY play it if you can but you MAY choose not to and take relief with one PS, very similar to unplayable ball. When your ball is somewhere else than on the course you may NOT play it even it it was playable. So, in the case of a PA you have a CHOICE but when your ball is OB you do NOT have a choice.

 

Thank you both for providing responses with some substantial reasoning. I still disagree with the rule. Your reasoning may have made more sense back when golf was only played on British and Scottish links that didn’t have deep ponds in the course. There were streams and burns but not so many ponds. In reality, you may not hit a ball that went to the bottom of a pond because it is physically impossible. And course boundary lines aren’t absent from the design strategy of the course. Holes are routed specifically in certain places for the purpose of incorporating the boundary. Some courses also have internal OB.

And fundamentally, if for example you hit a ball 220 yards in bounds and it bounces OB, why aren’t you getting any credit for the 220 yards you hit it in bounds? I’m not saying you should get away free- you should get a one stroke penalty for the drop. Why get doubly penalized?

[LICC]

> @Halebopp said:

> > @LICC said:

> > > @Vindog said:

> > > Fine, I'll bite.

> > >

> > >

> > > One is IN BOUNDS

> > > One is OUT OF BOUNDS

> > >

> > > It really is that simple.

> >

> > So you have no answer. No idea. Nothing to add. Got it.

>

> There are consequences in all sports for sending the ball off the playing field. Do you think it's unfair a player loses the point in tennis if s/he hits the ball out of bounds or that you lose possession of the ball if you send the ball off the pitch in football?

 

 

Your analogy helps my argument. The player loses one point in tennis (and not even that on the first serve). This rule is like the player would lose two points in tennis for one OB stroke

[Halebopp]

> @LICC said:

> > @Halebopp said:

> > > @LICC said:

> > > > @Vindog said:

> > > > Fine, I'll bite.

> > > >

> > > >

> > > > One is IN BOUNDS

> > > > One is OUT OF BOUNDS

> > > >

> > > > It really is that simple.

> > >

> > > So you have no answer. No idea. Nothing to add. Got it.

> >

> > There are consequences in all sports for sending the ball off the playing field. Do you think it's unfair a player loses the point in tennis if s/he hits the ball out of bounds or that you lose possession of the ball if you send the ball off the pitch in football?

>

>

> Your analogy helps my argument. The player loses one point in tennis (and not even that on the first serve). This rule is like the player would lose two points in tennis for one OB stroke

 

No it doesn't, there's a one-stroke penalty, not two. The ball didn't fly OB on its own no matter how much you want to avoid the responsibility for the stroke.

 

You chose the club, the swing and the aim and then tried to execute the shot. It was you and only you who sent the ball OB and you're penalized one stroke for such an awful shot.

[LICC]

> @Halebopp said:

> > @LICC said:

> > > @Halebopp said:

> > > > @LICC said:

> > > > > @Vindog said:

> > > > > Fine, I'll bite.

> > > > >

> > > > >

> > > > > One is IN BOUNDS

> > > > > One is OUT OF BOUNDS

> > > > >

> > > > > It really is that simple.

> > > >

> > > > So you have no answer. No idea. Nothing to add. Got it.

> > >

> > > There are consequences in all sports for sending the ball off the playing field. Do you think it's unfair a player loses the point in tennis if s/he hits the ball out of bounds or that you lose possession of the ball if you send the ball off the pitch in football?

> >

> >

> > Your analogy helps my argument. The player loses one point in tennis (and not even that on the first serve). This rule is like the player would lose two points in tennis for one OB stroke

>

> No it doesn't, there's a one-stroke penalty, not two. The ball didn't fly OB on its own no matter how much you want to avoid the responsibility for the stroke.

>

> You chose the club, the swing and the aim and then tried to execute the shot. It was you and only you who sent the ball OB and you're penalized one stroke for such an awful shot.

 

Stroke AND distance. That is a two stroke penalty. The new local rule that lets you place the ball on the fairway requires a TWO stroke penalty. You are now hitting 4. Let’s not be distorting the discussion

[Vindog]

There is no ball in play on the course, so there is no distance to get credit for.

 

The local rule exists only to speed up play, and it presumes that your next ball would be hitting from where the shot was previously made in order to preserve scoring history (so they said). It amounts to 2 strokes of course but there is actually only 1 penalty stroke in the stroke and distance procedure.

[Halebopp]

> @LICC said:

> > @Halebopp said:

> > > @LICC said:

> > > > @Halebopp said:

> > > > > @LICC said:

> > > > > > @Vindog said:

> > > > > > Fine, I'll bite.

> > > > > >

> > > > > >

> > > > > > One is IN BOUNDS

> > > > > > One is OUT OF BOUNDS

> > > > > >

> > > > > > It really is that simple.

> > > > >

> > > > > So you have no answer. No idea. Nothing to add. Got it.

> > > >

> > > > There are consequences in all sports for sending the ball off the playing field. Do you think it's unfair a player loses the point in tennis if s/he hits the ball out of bounds or that you lose possession of the ball if you send the ball off the pitch in football?

> > >

> > >

> > > Your analogy helps my argument. The player loses one point in tennis (and not even that on the first serve). This rule is like the player would lose two points in tennis for one OB stroke

> >

> > No it doesn't, there's a one-stroke penalty, not two. The ball didn't fly OB on its own no matter how much you want to avoid the responsibility for the stroke.

> >

> > You chose the club, the swing and the aim and then tried to execute the shot. It was you and only you who sent the ball OB and you're penalized one stroke for such an awful shot.

>

> Stroke AND distance. That is a two stroke penalty. The new local rule that lets you place the ball on the fairway requires a TWO stroke penalty. You are now hitting 4. Let’s not be distorting the discussion

 

Like you said it is Stroke and Distance, not Two Strokes and Distance.

 

You hit your tee shot OB but hit the fairway with your second try. You're now lying three on the fairway, not four. You've made two strokes at the ball and have had to add one penalty stroke to your score, not two.

[LICC]

> @Halebopp said:

> > @LICC said:

> > > @Halebopp said:

> > > > @LICC said:

> > > > > @Halebopp said:

> > > > > > @LICC said:

> > > > > > > @Vindog said:

> > > > > > > Fine, I'll bite.

> > > > > > >

> > > > > > >

> > > > > > > One is IN BOUNDS

> > > > > > > One is OUT OF BOUNDS

> > > > > > >

> > > > > > > It really is that simple.

> > > > > >

> > > > > > So you have no answer. No idea. Nothing to add. Got it.

> > > > >

> > > > > There are consequences in all sports for sending the ball off the playing field. Do you think it's unfair a player loses the point in tennis if s/he hits the ball out of bounds or that you lose possession of the ball if you send the ball off the pitch in football?

> > > >

> > > >

> > > > Your analogy helps my argument. The player loses one point in tennis (and not even that on the first serve). This rule is like the player would lose two points in tennis for one OB stroke

> > >

> > > No it doesn't, there's a one-stroke penalty, not two. The ball didn't fly OB on its own no matter how much you want to avoid the responsibility for the stroke.

> > >

> > > You chose the club, the swing and the aim and then tried to execute the shot. It was you and only you who sent the ball OB and you're penalized one stroke for such an awful shot.

> >

> > Stroke AND distance. That is a two stroke penalty. The new local rule that lets you place the ball on the fairway requires a TWO stroke penalty. You are now hitting 4. Let’s not be distorting the discussion

>

> Like you said it is Stroke and Distance, not Two Strokes and Distance.

>

> You hit your tee shot OB but hit the fairway with your second try. You're now lying three on the fairway, not four. You've made two strokes at the ball and have had to add one penalty stroke to your score, not two.

 

This is silly. Please stop with this. There is a stroke penalty and a distance penalty. If you hit in the water, you take a one penalty stroke drop at the point it went in. No distance penalty. If you hit it out of bounds, you take a stroke penalty and by re-teeing, you take a distance penalty.

[sui generis]

> @LICC said:

> > @Halebopp said:

> > > @LICC said:

> > > > @Halebopp said:

> > > > > @LICC said:

> > > > > > @Halebopp said:

> > > > > > > @LICC said:

> > > > > > > > @Vindog said:

> > > > > > > > Fine, I'll bite.

> > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > One is IN BOUNDS

> > > > > > > > One is OUT OF BOUNDS

> > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > It really is that simple.

> > > > > > >

> > > > > > > So you have no answer. No idea. Nothing to add. Got it.

> > > > > >

> > > > > > There are consequences in all sports for sending the ball off the playing field. Do you think it's unfair a player loses the point in tennis if s/he hits the ball out of bounds or that you lose possession of the ball if you send the ball off the pitch in football?

> > > > >

> > > > >

> > > > > Your analogy helps my argument. The player loses one point in tennis (and not even that on the first serve). This rule is like the player would lose two points in tennis for one OB stroke

> > > >

> > > > No it doesn't, there's a one-stroke penalty, not two. The ball didn't fly OB on its own no matter how much you want to avoid the responsibility for the stroke.

> > > >

> > > > You chose the club, the swing and the aim and then tried to execute the shot. It was you and only you who sent the ball OB and you're penalized one stroke for such an awful shot.

> > >

> > > Stroke AND distance. That is a two stroke penalty. The new local rule that lets you place the ball on the fairway requires a TWO stroke penalty. You are now hitting 4. Let’s not be distorting the discussion

> >

> > Like you said it is Stroke and Distance, not Two Strokes and Distance.

> >

> > You hit your tee shot OB but hit the fairway with your second try. You're now lying three on the fairway, not four. You've made two strokes at the ball and have had to add one penalty stroke to your score, not two.

>

> This is silly.

 

Yes, it is silly . . . and your trolling is the cause of the silliness.

 

 

[LICC]

> @"sui generis" said:

> > @LICC said:

> > > @Halebopp said:

> > > > @LICC said:

> > > > > @Halebopp said:

> > > > > > @LICC said:

> > > > > > > @Halebopp said:

> > > > > > > > @LICC said:

> > > > > > > > > @Vindog said:

> > > > > > > > > Fine, I'll bite.

> > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > One is IN BOUNDS

> > > > > > > > > One is OUT OF BOUNDS

> > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > It really is that simple.

> > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > So you have no answer. No idea. Nothing to add. Got it.

> > > > > > >

> > > > > > > There are consequences in all sports for sending the ball off the playing field. Do you think it's unfair a player loses the point in tennis if s/he hits the ball out of bounds or that you lose possession of the ball if you send the ball off the pitch in football?

> > > > > >

> > > > > >

> > > > > > Your analogy helps my argument. The player loses one point in tennis (and not even that on the first serve). This rule is like the player would lose two points in tennis for one OB stroke

> > > > >

> > > > > No it doesn't, there's a one-stroke penalty, not two. The ball didn't fly OB on its own no matter how much you want to avoid the responsibility for the stroke.

> > > > >

> > > > > You chose the club, the swing and the aim and then tried to execute the shot. It was you and only you who sent the ball OB and you're penalized one stroke for such an awful shot.

> > > >

> > > > Stroke AND distance. That is a two stroke penalty. The new local rule that lets you place the ball on the fairway requires a TWO stroke penalty. You are now hitting 4. Let’s not be distorting the discussion

> > >

> > > Like you said it is Stroke and Distance, not Two Strokes and Distance.

> > >

> > > You hit your tee shot OB but hit the fairway with your second try. You're now lying three on the fairway, not four. You've made two strokes at the ball and have had to add one penalty stroke to your score, not two.

> >

> > This is silly.

>

> Yes, it is silly . . . and your trolling is the cause of the silliness.

>

>

 

Discussing the merits of a rule, which is the topic of the OP, is trolling to you. Sure.

[Vindog]

> @LICC said:

> > @Halebopp said:

> > > @LICC said:

> > > > @Halebopp said:

> > > > > @LICC said:

> > > > > > @Halebopp said:

> > > > > > > @LICC said:

> > > > > > > > @Vindog said:

> > > > > > > > Fine, I'll bite.

> > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > One is IN BOUNDS

> > > > > > > > One is OUT OF BOUNDS

> > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > It really is that simple.

> > > > > > >

> > > > > > > So you have no answer. No idea. Nothing to add. Got it.

> > > > > >

> > > > > > There are consequences in all sports for sending the ball off the playing field. Do you think it's unfair a player loses the point in tennis if s/he hits the ball out of bounds or that you lose possession of the ball if you send the ball off the pitch in football?

> > > > >

> > > > >

> > > > > Your analogy helps my argument. The player loses one point in tennis (and not even that on the first serve). This rule is like the player would lose two points in tennis for one OB stroke

> > > >

> > > > No it doesn't, there's a one-stroke penalty, not two. The ball didn't fly OB on its own no matter how much you want to avoid the responsibility for the stroke.

> > > >

> > > > You chose the club, the swing and the aim and then tried to execute the shot. It was you and only you who sent the ball OB and you're penalized one stroke for such an awful shot.

> > >

> > > Stroke AND distance. That is a two stroke penalty. The new local rule that lets you place the ball on the fairway requires a TWO stroke penalty. You are now hitting 4. Let’s not be distorting the discussion

> >

> > Like you said it is Stroke and Distance, not Two Strokes and Distance.

> >

> > You hit your tee shot OB but hit the fairway with your second try. You're now lying three on the fairway, not four. You've made two strokes at the ball and have had to add one penalty stroke to your score, not two.

>

> This is silly. Please stop with this. There is a stroke penalty and a distance penalty.

 

Right.

One penalty stroke

And you have to re-hit which isn't a penalty stroke, it's just another stroke at the ball.

[LICC]

> @Vindog said:

> > @LICC said:

> > > @Halebopp said:

> > > > @LICC said:

> > > > > @Halebopp said:

> > > > > > @LICC said:

> > > > > > > @Halebopp said:

> > > > > > > > @LICC said:

> > > > > > > > > @Vindog said:

> > > > > > > > > Fine, I'll bite.

> > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > One is IN BOUNDS

> > > > > > > > > One is OUT OF BOUNDS

> > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > It really is that simple.

> > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > So you have no answer. No idea. Nothing to add. Got it.

> > > > > > >

> > > > > > > There are consequences in all sports for sending the ball off the playing field. Do you think it's unfair a player loses the point in tennis if s/he hits the ball out of bounds or that you lose possession of the ball if you send the ball off the pitch in football?

> > > > > >

> > > > > >

> > > > > > Your analogy helps my argument. The player loses one point in tennis (and not even that on the first serve). This rule is like the player would lose two points in tennis for one OB stroke

> > > > >

> > > > > No it doesn't, there's a one-stroke penalty, not two. The ball didn't fly OB on its own no matter how much you want to avoid the responsibility for the stroke.

> > > > >

> > > > > You chose the club, the swing and the aim and then tried to execute the shot. It was you and only you who sent the ball OB and you're penalized one stroke for such an awful shot.

> > > >

> > > > Stroke AND distance. That is a two stroke penalty. The new local rule that lets you place the ball on the fairway requires a TWO stroke penalty. You are now hitting 4. Let’s not be distorting the discussion

> > >

> > > Like you said it is Stroke and Distance, not Two Strokes and Distance.

> > >

> > > You hit your tee shot OB but hit the fairway with your second try. You're now lying three on the fairway, not four. You've made two strokes at the ball and have had to add one penalty stroke to your score, not two.

> >

> > This is silly. Please stop with this. There is a stroke penalty and a distance penalty.

>

> Right.

> One penalty stroke

> And you have to re-hit which isn't a penalty stroke, it's just another stroke at the ball.

 

One stroke plus one stroke equals two strokes. Thus, a two-stroke penalty. If it weren’t, the local rule wouldn’t be hitting 4 from the fairway.

[Roadking2003]

> @Vindog said:

> Right.

> One penalty stroke

> And you have to re-hit which isn't a penalty stroke, it's just another stroke at the ball.

 

But you have to admit that OB is the equivalent of a two-stroke penalty. Let's be realistic.

[Halebopp]

> @LICC said:

> > @Halebopp said:

> > > @LICC said:

> > > > @Halebopp said:

> > > > > @LICC said:

> > > > > > @Halebopp said:

> > > > > > > @LICC said:

> > > > > > > > @Vindog said:

> > > > > > > > Fine, I'll bite.

> > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > One is IN BOUNDS

> > > > > > > > One is OUT OF BOUNDS

> > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > It really is that simple.

> > > > > > >

> > > > > > > So you have no answer. No idea. Nothing to add. Got it.

> > > > > >

> > > > > > There are consequences in all sports for sending the ball off the playing field. Do you think it's unfair a player loses the point in tennis if s/he hits the ball out of bounds or that you lose possession of the ball if you send the ball off the pitch in football?

> > > > >

> > > > >

> > > > > Your analogy helps my argument. The player loses one point in tennis (and not even that on the first serve). This rule is like the player would lose two points in tennis for one OB stroke

> > > >

> > > > No it doesn't, there's a one-stroke penalty, not two. The ball didn't fly OB on its own no matter how much you want to avoid the responsibility for the stroke.

> > > >

> > > > You chose the club, the swing and the aim and then tried to execute the shot. It was you and only you who sent the ball OB and you're penalized one stroke for such an awful shot.

> > >

> > > Stroke AND distance. That is a two stroke penalty. The new local rule that lets you place the ball on the fairway requires a TWO stroke penalty. You are now hitting 4. Let’s not be distorting the discussion

> >

> > Like you said it is Stroke and Distance, not Two Strokes and Distance.

> >

> > You hit your tee shot OB but hit the fairway with your second try. You're now lying three on the fairway, not four. You've made two strokes at the ball and have had to add one penalty stroke to your score, not two.

>

> This is silly. Please stop with this. There is a stroke penalty and a distance penalty. If you hit in the water, you take a one penalty stroke drop at the point it went in. No distance penalty. If you hit it out of bounds, you take a stroke penalty and by re-teeing, you take a distance penalty.

 

If I hit a 200-yard shot into a penalty area but the ball crossed into the PA 5 yards in front of the spot from which I made the stroke, I'm losing 195 yards despite there being no distance penalty. If I skull my 20-yard lob shot 60 yards over the green and OB, I've gained 40 yards with the distance penalty.

[Vindog]

> @LICC said:

> > @Vindog said:

> > > @LICC said:

> > > > @Halebopp said:

> > > > > @LICC said:

> > > > > > @Halebopp said:

> > > > > > > @LICC said:

> > > > > > > > @Halebopp said:

> > > > > > > > > @LICC said:

> > > > > > > > > > @Vindog said:

> > > > > > > > > > Fine, I'll bite.

> > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > > One is IN BOUNDS

> > > > > > > > > > One is OUT OF BOUNDS

> > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > > It really is that simple.

> > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > So you have no answer. No idea. Nothing to add. Got it.

> > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > There are consequences in all sports for sending the ball off the playing field. Do you think it's unfair a player loses the point in tennis if s/he hits the ball out of bounds or that you lose possession of the ball if you send the ball off the pitch in football?

> > > > > > >

> > > > > > >

> > > > > > > Your analogy helps my argument. The player loses one point in tennis (and not even that on the first serve). This rule is like the player would lose two points in tennis for one OB stroke

> > > > > >

> > > > > > No it doesn't, there's a one-stroke penalty, not two. The ball didn't fly OB on its own no matter how much you want to avoid the responsibility for the stroke.

> > > > > >

> > > > > > You chose the club, the swing and the aim and then tried to execute the shot. It was you and only you who sent the ball OB and you're penalized one stroke for such an awful shot.

> > > > >

> > > > > Stroke AND distance. That is a two stroke penalty. The new local rule that lets you place the ball on the fairway requires a TWO stroke penalty. You are now hitting 4. Let’s not be distorting the discussion

> > > >

> > > > Like you said it is Stroke and Distance, not Two Strokes and Distance.

> > > >

> > > > You hit your tee shot OB but hit the fairway with your second try. You're now lying three on the fairway, not four. You've made two strokes at the ball and have had to add one penalty stroke to your score, not two.

> > >

> > > This is silly. Please stop with this. There is a stroke penalty and a distance penalty.

> >

> > Right.

> > One penalty stroke

> > And you have to re-hit which isn't a penalty stroke, it's just another stroke at the ball.

>

> One stroke plus one stroke equals two strokes. Thus, a two-stroke penalty. If it weren’t, the local rule wouldn’t be hitting 4 from the fairway.

 

In an above post I tried to explain the reasoning behind the additional 2 stroke under the local rule. That was paraphrased from the USGA texts. Technically there is only 1 penalty stroke under S&D under the rules.

 

Reality is it amounts to 2 more but it makes a difference depending on how you keep your score. Some people add up the strokes, then add penalty strokes. Some people add up the penalty strokes as they count along. But there is only one penalty stroke. The other stroke it at a ball in play and is not a penalty stroke, even though it might seem like it.

[LICC]

> @Halebopp said:

> > @LICC said:

> > > @Halebopp said:

> > > > @LICC said:

> > > > > @Halebopp said:

> > > > > > @LICC said:

> > > > > > > @Halebopp said:

> > > > > > > > @LICC said:

> > > > > > > > > @Vindog said:

> > > > > > > > > Fine, I'll bite.

> > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > One is IN BOUNDS

> > > > > > > > > One is OUT OF BOUNDS

> > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > It really is that simple.

> > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > So you have no answer. No idea. Nothing to add. Got it.

> > > > > > >

> > > > > > > There are consequences in all sports for sending the ball off the playing field. Do you think it's unfair a player loses the point in tennis if s/he hits the ball out of bounds or that you lose possession of the ball if you send the ball off the pitch in football?

> > > > > >

> > > > > >

> > > > > > Your analogy helps my argument. The player loses one point in tennis (and not even that on the first serve). This rule is like the player would lose two points in tennis for one OB stroke

> > > > >

> > > > > No it doesn't, there's a one-stroke penalty, not two. The ball didn't fly OB on its own no matter how much you want to avoid the responsibility for the stroke.

> > > > >

> > > > > You chose the club, the swing and the aim and then tried to execute the shot. It was you and only you who sent the ball OB and you're penalized one stroke for such an awful shot.

> > > >

> > > > Stroke AND distance. That is a two stroke penalty. The new local rule that lets you place the ball on the fairway requires a TWO stroke penalty. You are now hitting 4. Let’s not be distorting the discussion

> > >

> > > Like you said it is Stroke and Distance, not Two Strokes and Distance.

> > >

> > > You hit your tee shot OB but hit the fairway with your second try. You're now lying three on the fairway, not four. You've made two strokes at the ball and have had to add one penalty stroke to your score, not two.

> >

> > This is silly. Please stop with this. There is a stroke penalty and a distance penalty. If you hit in the water, you take a one penalty stroke drop at the point it went in. No distance penalty. If you hit it out of bounds, you take a stroke penalty and by re-teeing, you take a distance penalty.

>

> If I hit a 200-yard shot into a penalty area but the ball crossed into the PA 5 yards in front of the spot from which I made the stroke, I'm losing 195 yards despite there being no distance penalty. If I skull my 20-yard lob shot 60 yards over the green and OB, I've gained 40 yards with the distance penalty.

 

Please show me this 200 yard PA that starts 5 yards from your shot

[davep043]

> @LICC said:

> > @Halebopp said:

> > If I hit a 200-yard shot into a penalty area but the ball crossed into the PA 5 yards in front of the spot from which I made the stroke, I'm losing 195 yards despite there being no distance penalty. If I skull my 20-yard lob shot 60 yards over the green and OB, I've gained 40 yards with the distance penalty.

>

> Please show me this 200 yard PA that starts 5 yards from your shot

 

18th at the Players Championship? 18th at Pebble? There are tons of places like that.

[Vindog]

> @LICC said:

> > @Halebopp said:

> > > @LICC said:

> > > > @Halebopp said:

> > > > > @LICC said:

> > > > > > @Halebopp said:

> > > > > > > @LICC said:

> > > > > > > > @Halebopp said:

> > > > > > > > > @LICC said:

> > > > > > > > > > @Vindog said:

> > > > > > > > > > Fine, I'll bite.

> > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > > One is IN BOUNDS

> > > > > > > > > > One is OUT OF BOUNDS

> > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > > It really is that simple.

> > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > So you have no answer. No idea. Nothing to add. Got it.

> > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > There are consequences in all sports for sending the ball off the playing field. Do you think it's unfair a player loses the point in tennis if s/he hits the ball out of bounds or that you lose possession of the ball if you send the ball off the pitch in football?

> > > > > > >

> > > > > > >

> > > > > > > Your analogy helps my argument. The player loses one point in tennis (and not even that on the first serve). This rule is like the player would lose two points in tennis for one OB stroke

> > > > > >

> > > > > > No it doesn't, there's a one-stroke penalty, not two. The ball didn't fly OB on its own no matter how much you want to avoid the responsibility for the stroke.

> > > > > >

> > > > > > You chose the club, the swing and the aim and then tried to execute the shot. It was you and only you who sent the ball OB and you're penalized one stroke for such an awful shot.

> > > > >

> > > > > Stroke AND distance. That is a two stroke penalty. The new local rule that lets you place the ball on the fairway requires a TWO stroke penalty. You are now hitting 4. Let’s not be distorting the discussion

> > > >

> > > > Like you said it is Stroke and Distance, not Two Strokes and Distance.

> > > >

> > > > You hit your tee shot OB but hit the fairway with your second try. You're now lying three on the fairway, not four. You've made two strokes at the ball and have had to add one penalty stroke to your score, not two.

> > >

> > > This is silly. Please stop with this. There is a stroke penalty and a distance penalty. If you hit in the water, you take a one penalty stroke drop at the point it went in. No distance penalty. If you hit it out of bounds, you take a stroke penalty and by re-teeing, you take a distance penalty.

> >

> > If I hit a 200-yard shot into a penalty area but the ball crossed into the PA 5 yards in front of the spot from which I made the stroke, I'm losing 195 yards despite there being no distance penalty. If I skull my 20-yard lob shot 60 yards over the green and OB, I've gained 40 yards with the distance penalty.

>

> Please show me this 200 yard PA that starts 5 yards from your shot

 

The Par5 3rd hole at what used to be Bar Harbor Golf Course in Trenton, ME. The Jordan River is all along the right side and it is very possible to shank or block one into the PA very close to the tee box. What's worse is that if you want to drop it's in some crappy lies. Nine time out of ten it's better to he hit from the tee.

 

And add a penalty stroke. Just one that is.

 

 

[LICC]

> @davep043 said:

> > @LICC said:

> > > @Halebopp said:

> > > If I hit a 200-yard shot into a penalty area but the ball crossed into the PA 5 yards in front of the spot from which I made the stroke, I'm losing 195 yards despite there being no distance penalty. If I skull my 20-yard lob shot 60 yards over the green and OB, I've gained 40 yards with the distance penalty.

> >

> > Please show me this 200 yard PA that starts 5 yards from your shot

>

> 18th at the Players Championship? 18th at Pebble? There are tons of places like that.

 

I’ve played both. Neither are as described. Pebble 18 plays as a cape. 18 at Sawgrass the water is to your left for most of your drive. You would have to hit a massive pull or be aiming terribly to cross it early, and even then we are not talking close to 5 yards on either

[Halebopp]

> @LICC said:

> > @Halebopp said:

> > > @LICC said:

> > > > @Halebopp said:

> > > > > @LICC said:

> > > > > > @Halebopp said:

> > > > > > > @LICC said:

> > > > > > > > @Halebopp said:

> > > > > > > > > @LICC said:

> > > > > > > > > > @Vindog said:

> > > > > > > > > > Fine, I'll bite.

> > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > > One is IN BOUNDS

> > > > > > > > > > One is OUT OF BOUNDS

> > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > > It really is that simple.

> > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > So you have no answer. No idea. Nothing to add. Got it.

> > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > There are consequences in all sports for sending the ball off the playing field. Do you think it's unfair a player loses the point in tennis if s/he hits the ball out of bounds or that you lose possession of the ball if you send the ball off the pitch in football?

> > > > > > >

> > > > > > >

> > > > > > > Your analogy helps my argument. The player loses one point in tennis (and not even that on the first serve). This rule is like the player would lose two points in tennis for one OB stroke

> > > > > >

> > > > > > No it doesn't, there's a one-stroke penalty, not two. The ball didn't fly OB on its own no matter how much you want to avoid the responsibility for the stroke.

> > > > > >

> > > > > > You chose the club, the swing and the aim and then tried to execute the shot. It was you and only you who sent the ball OB and you're penalized one stroke for such an awful shot.

> > > > >

> > > > > Stroke AND distance. That is a two stroke penalty. The new local rule that lets you place the ball on the fairway requires a TWO stroke penalty. You are now hitting 4. Let’s not be distorting the discussion

> > > >

> > > > Like you said it is Stroke and Distance, not Two Strokes and Distance.

> > > >

> > > > You hit your tee shot OB but hit the fairway with your second try. You're now lying three on the fairway, not four. You've made two strokes at the ball and have had to add one penalty stroke to your score, not two.

> > >

> > > This is silly. Please stop with this. There is a stroke penalty and a distance penalty. If you hit in the water, you take a one penalty stroke drop at the point it went in. No distance penalty. If you hit it out of bounds, you take a stroke penalty and by re-teeing, you take a distance penalty.

> >

> > If I hit a 200-yard shot into a penalty area but the ball crossed into the PA 5 yards in front of the spot from which I made the stroke, I'm losing 195 yards despite there being no distance penalty. If I skull my 20-yard lob shot 60 yards over the green and OB, I've gained 40 yards with the distance penalty.

>

> Please show me this 200 yard PA that starts 5 yards from your shot

 

Here are two pictures from my home club from one single hole.

 

 

[LICC]

> @Halebopp said:

> > @LICC said:

> > > @Halebopp said:

> > > > @LICC said:

> > > > > @Halebopp said:

> > > > > > @LICC said:

> > > > > > > @Halebopp said:

> > > > > > > > @LICC said:

> > > > > > > > > @Halebopp said:

> > > > > > > > > > @LICC said:

> > > > > > > > > > > @Vindog said:

> > > > > > > > > > > Fine, I'll bite.

> > > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > > > One is IN BOUNDS

> > > > > > > > > > > One is OUT OF BOUNDS

> > > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > > > It really is that simple.

> > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > > So you have no answer. No idea. Nothing to add. Got it.

> > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > There are consequences in all sports for sending the ball off the playing field. Do you think it's unfair a player loses the point in tennis if s/he hits the ball out of bounds or that you lose possession of the ball if you send the ball off the pitch in football?

> > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > Your analogy helps my argument. The player loses one point in tennis (and not even that on the first serve). This rule is like the player would lose two points in tennis for one OB stroke

> > > > > > >

> > > > > > > No it doesn't, there's a one-stroke penalty, not two. The ball didn't fly OB on its own no matter how much you want to avoid the responsibility for the stroke.

> > > > > > >

> > > > > > > You chose the club, the swing and the aim and then tried to execute the shot. It was you and only you who sent the ball OB and you're penalized one stroke for such an awful shot.

> > > > > >

> > > > > > Stroke AND distance. That is a two stroke penalty. The new local rule that lets you place the ball on the fairway requires a TWO stroke penalty. You are now hitting 4. Let’s not be distorting the discussion

> > > > >

> > > > > Like you said it is Stroke and Distance, not Two Strokes and Distance.

> > > > >

> > > > > You hit your tee shot OB but hit the fairway with your second try. You're now lying three on the fairway, not four. You've made two strokes at the ball and have had to add one penalty stroke to your score, not two.

> > > >

> > > > This is silly. Please stop with this. There is a stroke penalty and a distance penalty. If you hit in the water, you take a one penalty stroke drop at the point it went in. No distance penalty. If you hit it out of bounds, you take a stroke penalty and by re-teeing, you take a distance penalty.

> > >

> > > If I hit a 200-yard shot into a penalty area but the ball crossed into the PA 5 yards in front of the spot from which I made the stroke, I'm losing 195 yards despite there being no distance penalty. If I skull my 20-yard lob shot 60 yards over the green and OB, I've gained 40 yards with the distance penalty.

> >

> > Please show me this 200 yard PA that starts 5 yards from your shot

>

> Here are two pictures from my home club from one single hole.

>

>

 

I can’t make out what that is showing. Where is the tee box?

[Halebopp]

> @LICC said:

> > @Halebopp said:

> > > @LICC said:

> > > > @Halebopp said:

> > > > > @LICC said:

> > > > > > @Halebopp said:

> > > > > > > @LICC said:

> > > > > > > > @Halebopp said:

> > > > > > > > > @LICC said:

> > > > > > > > > > @Halebopp said:

> > > > > > > > > > > @LICC said:

> > > > > > > > > > > > @Vindog said:

> > > > > > > > > > > > Fine, I'll bite.

> > > > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > > > > One is IN BOUNDS

> > > > > > > > > > > > One is OUT OF BOUNDS

> > > > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > > > > It really is that simple.

> > > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > > > So you have no answer. No idea. Nothing to add. Got it.

> > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > > There are consequences in all sports for sending the ball off the playing field. Do you think it's unfair a player loses the point in tennis if s/he hits the ball out of bounds or that you lose possession of the ball if you send the ball off the pitch in football?

> > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > Your analogy helps my argument. The player loses one point in tennis (and not even that on the first serve). This rule is like the player would lose two points in tennis for one OB stroke

> > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > No it doesn't, there's a one-stroke penalty, not two. The ball didn't fly OB on its own no matter how much you want to avoid the responsibility for the stroke.

> > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > You chose the club, the swing and the aim and then tried to execute the shot. It was you and only you who sent the ball OB and you're penalized one stroke for such an awful shot.

> > > > > > >

> > > > > > > Stroke AND distance. That is a two stroke penalty. The new local rule that lets you place the ball on the fairway requires a TWO stroke penalty. You are now hitting 4. Let’s not be distorting the discussion

> > > > > >

> > > > > > Like you said it is Stroke and Distance, not Two Strokes and Distance.

> > > > > >

> > > > > > You hit your tee shot OB but hit the fairway with your second try. You're now lying three on the fairway, not four. You've made two strokes at the ball and have had to add one penalty stroke to your score, not two.

> > > > >

> > > > > This is silly. Please stop with this. There is a stroke penalty and a distance penalty. If you hit in the water, you take a one penalty stroke drop at the point it went in. No distance penalty. If you hit it out of bounds, you take a stroke penalty and by re-teeing, you take a distance penalty.

> > > >

> > > > If I hit a 200-yard shot into a penalty area but the ball crossed into the PA 5 yards in front of the spot from which I made the stroke, I'm losing 195 yards despite there being no distance penalty. If I skull my 20-yard lob shot 60 yards over the green and OB, I've gained 40 yards with the distance penalty.

> > >

> > > Please show me this 200 yard PA that starts 5 yards from your shot

> >

> > Here are two pictures from my home club from one single hole.

> >

> >

>

> I can’t make out what that is showing. Where is the tee box?

 

The white dot in the first picture. Most players lay up their tee shots to around where the white dot is in the second picture because there's long hay and bushes to the right of the fairway and if you miss slightly left (like the line in the first picture), it's atleast a 230-meter carry over the water.

[gioguy21]

> @Halebopp said:

> > @LICC said:

> > > @Halebopp said:

> > > > @LICC said:

> > > > > @Halebopp said:

> > > > > > @LICC said:

> > > > > > > @Halebopp said:

> > > > > > > > @LICC said:

> > > > > > > > > @Halebopp said:

> > > > > > > > > > @LICC said:

> > > > > > > > > > > @Halebopp said:

> > > > > > > > > > > > @LICC said:

> > > > > > > > > > > > > @Vindog said:

> > > > > > > > > > > > > Fine, I'll bite.

> > > > > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > > > > > One is IN BOUNDS

> > > > > > > > > > > > > One is OUT OF BOUNDS

> > > > > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > > > > > It really is that simple.

> > > > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > > > > So you have no answer. No idea. Nothing to add. Got it.

> > > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > > > There are consequences in all sports for sending the ball off the playing field. Do you think it's unfair a player loses the point in tennis if s/he hits the ball out of bounds or that you lose possession of the ball if you send the ball off the pitch in football?

> > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > > Your analogy helps my argument. The player loses one point in tennis (and not even that on the first serve). This rule is like the player would lose two points in tennis for one OB stroke

> > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > No it doesn't, there's a one-stroke penalty, not two. The ball didn't fly OB on its own no matter how much you want to avoid the responsibility for the stroke.

> > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > You chose the club, the swing and the aim and then tried to execute the shot. It was you and only you who sent the ball OB and you're penalized one stroke for such an awful shot.

> > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > Stroke AND distance. That is a two stroke penalty. The new local rule that lets you place the ball on the fairway requires a TWO stroke penalty. You are now hitting 4. Let’s not be distorting the discussion

> > > > > > >

> > > > > > > Like you said it is Stroke and Distance, not Two Strokes and Distance.

> > > > > > >

> > > > > > > You hit your tee shot OB but hit the fairway with your second try. You're now lying three on the fairway, not four. You've made two strokes at the ball and have had to add one penalty stroke to your score, not two.

> > > > > >

> > > > > > This is silly. Please stop with this. There is a stroke penalty and a distance penalty. If you hit in the water, you take a one penalty stroke drop at the point it went in. No distance penalty. If you hit it out of bounds, you take a stroke penalty and by re-teeing, you take a distance penalty.

> > > > >

> > > > > If I hit a 200-yard shot into a penalty area but the ball crossed into the PA 5 yards in front of the spot from which I made the stroke, I'm losing 195 yards despite there being no distance penalty. If I skull my 20-yard lob shot 60 yards over the green and OB, I've gained 40 yards with the distance penalty.

> > > >

> > > > Please show me this 200 yard PA that starts 5 yards from your shot

> > >

> > > Here are two pictures from my home club from one single hole.

> > >

> > >

> >

> > I can’t make out what that is showing. Where is the tee box?

>

> The white dot in the first picture. Most players lay up their tee shots to around where the white dot is in the second picture because there's long hay and bushes to the right of the fairway and if you miss slightly left (like the line in the first picture), it's atleast a 230-meter carry over the water.

 

...learn to hit it further with accuracy? or play a different box? not sure what to tell you man, that fairway looks wide enough you could hit it further up the right side where the left elbow begins.

[Halebopp]

> @gioguy21 said:

> > @Halebopp said:

> > > @LICC said:

> > > > @Halebopp said:

> > > > > @LICC said:

> > > > > > @Halebopp said:

> > > > > > > @LICC said:

> > > > > > > > @Halebopp said:

> > > > > > > > > @LICC said:

> > > > > > > > > > @Halebopp said:

> > > > > > > > > > > @LICC said:

> > > > > > > > > > > > @Halebopp said:

> > > > > > > > > > > > > @LICC said:

> > > > > > > > > > > > > > @Vindog said:

> > > > > > > > > > > > > > Fine, I'll bite.

> > > > > > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > > > > > > One is IN BOUNDS

> > > > > > > > > > > > > > One is OUT OF BOUNDS

> > > > > > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > > > > > > It really is that simple.

> > > > > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > > > > > So you have no answer. No idea. Nothing to add. Got it.

> > > > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > > > > There are consequences in all sports for sending the ball off the playing field. Do you think it's unfair a player loses the point in tennis if s/he hits the ball out of bounds or that you lose possession of the ball if you send the ball off the pitch in football?

> > > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > > > Your analogy helps my argument. The player loses one point in tennis (and not even that on the first serve). This rule is like the player would lose two points in tennis for one OB stroke

> > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > > No it doesn't, there's a one-stroke penalty, not two. The ball didn't fly OB on its own no matter how much you want to avoid the responsibility for the stroke.

> > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > > You chose the club, the swing and the aim and then tried to execute the shot. It was you and only you who sent the ball OB and you're penalized one stroke for such an awful shot.

> > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > Stroke AND distance. That is a two stroke penalty. The new local rule that lets you place the ball on the fairway requires a TWO stroke penalty. You are now hitting 4. Let’s not be distorting the discussion

> > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > Like you said it is Stroke and Distance, not Two Strokes and Distance.

> > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > You hit your tee shot OB but hit the fairway with your second try. You're now lying three on the fairway, not four. You've made two strokes at the ball and have had to add one penalty stroke to your score, not two.

> > > > > > >

> > > > > > > This is silly. Please stop with this. There is a stroke penalty and a distance penalty. If you hit in the water, you take a one penalty stroke drop at the point it went in. No distance penalty. If you hit it out of bounds, you take a stroke penalty and by re-teeing, you take a distance penalty.

> > > > > >

> > > > > > If I hit a 200-yard shot into a penalty area but the ball crossed into the PA 5 yards in front of the spot from which I made the stroke, I'm losing 195 yards despite there being no distance penalty. If I skull my 20-yard lob shot 60 yards over the green and OB, I've gained 40 yards with the distance penalty.

> > > > >

> > > > > Please show me this 200 yard PA that starts 5 yards from your shot

> > > >

> > > > Here are two pictures from my home club from one single hole.

> > > >

> > > >

> > >

> > > I can’t make out what that is showing. Where is the tee box?

> >

> > The white dot in the first picture. Most players lay up their tee shots to around where the white dot is in the second picture because there's long hay and bushes to the right of the fairway and if you miss slightly left (like the line in the first picture), it's atleast a 230-meter carry over the water.

>

> ...learn to hit it further with accuracy? or play a different box? not sure what to tell you man, that fairway looks wide enough you could hit it further up the right side where the left elbow begins.

 

You're completely missing the point of this discussion.

[gioguy21]

> @Halebopp said:

> > @gioguy21 said:

> > > @Halebopp said:

> > > > @LICC said:

> > > > > @Halebopp said:

> > > > > > @LICC said:

> > > > > > > @Halebopp said:

> > > > > > > > @LICC said:

> > > > > > > > > @Halebopp said:

> > > > > > > > > > @LICC said:

> > > > > > > > > > > @Halebopp said:

> > > > > > > > > > > > @LICC said:

> > > > > > > > > > > > > @Halebopp said:

> > > > > > > > > > > > > > @LICC said:

> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > @Vindog said:

> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Fine, I'll bite.

> > > > > > > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > One is IN BOUNDS

> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > One is OUT OF BOUNDS

> > > > > > > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > It really is that simple.

> > > > > > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > > > > > > So you have no answer. No idea. Nothing to add. Got it.

> > > > > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > > > > > There are consequences in all sports for sending the ball off the playing field. Do you think it's unfair a player loses the point in tennis if s/he hits the ball out of bounds or that you lose possession of the ball if you send the ball off the pitch in football?

> > > > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > > > > Your analogy helps my argument. The player loses one point in tennis (and not even that on the first serve). This rule is like the player would lose two points in tennis for one OB stroke

> > > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > > > No it doesn't, there's a one-stroke penalty, not two. The ball didn't fly OB on its own no matter how much you want to avoid the responsibility for the stroke.

> > > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > > > You chose the club, the swing and the aim and then tried to execute the shot. It was you and only you who sent the ball OB and you're penalized one stroke for such an awful shot.

> > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > > Stroke AND distance. That is a two stroke penalty. The new local rule that lets you place the ball on the fairway requires a TWO stroke penalty. You are now hitting 4. Let’s not be distorting the discussion

> > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > Like you said it is Stroke and Distance, not Two Strokes and Distance.

> > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > You hit your tee shot OB but hit the fairway with your second try. You're now lying three on the fairway, not four. You've made two strokes at the ball and have had to add one penalty stroke to your score, not two.

> > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > This is silly. Please stop with this. There is a stroke penalty and a distance penalty. If you hit in the water, you take a one penalty stroke drop at the point it went in. No distance penalty. If you hit it out of bounds, you take a stroke penalty and by re-teeing, you take a distance penalty.

> > > > > > >

> > > > > > > If I hit a 200-yard shot into a penalty area but the ball crossed into the PA 5 yards in front of the spot from which I made the stroke, I'm losing 195 yards despite there being no distance penalty. If I skull my 20-yard lob shot 60 yards over the green and OB, I've gained 40 yards with the distance penalty.

> > > > > >

> > > > > > Please show me this 200 yard PA that starts 5 yards from your shot

> > > > >

> > > > > Here are two pictures from my home club from one single hole.

> > > > >

> > > > >

> > > >

> > > > I can’t make out what that is showing. Where is the tee box?

> > >

> > > The white dot in the first picture. Most players lay up their tee shots to around where the white dot is in the second picture because there's long hay and bushes to the right of the fairway and if you miss slightly left (like the line in the first picture), it's atleast a 230-meter carry over the water.

> >

> > ...learn to hit it further with accuracy? or play a different box? not sure what to tell you man, that fairway looks wide enough you could hit it further up the right side where the left elbow begins.

>

> You're completely missing the point of this discussion.

 

am i tho?

[Vindog]

> @gioguy21 said:

> > @Halebopp said:

> > > @gioguy21 said:

> > > > @Halebopp said:

> > > > > @LICC said:

> > > > > > @Halebopp said:

> > > > > > > @LICC said:

> > > > > > > > @Halebopp said:

> > > > > > > > > @LICC said:

> > > > > > > > > > @Halebopp said:

> > > > > > > > > > > @LICC said:

> > > > > > > > > > > > @Halebopp said:

> > > > > > > > > > > > > @LICC said:

> > > > > > > > > > > > > > @Halebopp said:

> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > @LICC said:

> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > @Vindog said:

> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Fine, I'll bite.

> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > One is IN BOUNDS

> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > One is OUT OF BOUNDS

> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > It really is that simple.

> > > > > > > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > So you have no answer. No idea. Nothing to add. Got it.

> > > > > > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > > > > > > There are consequences in all sports for sending the ball off the playing field. Do you think it's unfair a player loses the point in tennis if s/he hits the ball out of bounds or that you lose possession of the ball if you send the ball off the pitch in football?

> > > > > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > > > > > Your analogy helps my argument. The player loses one point in tennis (and not even that on the first serve). This rule is like the player would lose two points in tennis for one OB stroke

> > > > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > > > > No it doesn't, there's a one-stroke penalty, not two. The ball didn't fly OB on its own no matter how much you want to avoid the responsibility for the stroke.

> > > > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > > > > You chose the club, the swing and the aim and then tried to execute the shot. It was you and only you who sent the ball OB and you're penalized one stroke for such an awful shot.

> > > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > > > Stroke AND distance. That is a two stroke penalty. The new local rule that lets you place the ball on the fairway requires a TWO stroke penalty. You are now hitting 4. Let’s not be distorting the discussion

> > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > > Like you said it is Stroke and Distance, not Two Strokes and Distance.

> > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > > You hit your tee shot OB but hit the fairway with your second try. You're now lying three on the fairway, not four. You've made two strokes at the ball and have had to add one penalty stroke to your score, not two.

> > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > This is silly. Please stop with this. There is a stroke penalty and a distance penalty. If you hit in the water, you take a one penalty stroke drop at the point it went in. No distance penalty. If you hit it out of bounds, you take a stroke penalty and by re-teeing, you take a distance penalty.

> > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > If I hit a 200-yard shot into a penalty area but the ball crossed into the PA 5 yards in front of the spot from which I made the stroke, I'm losing 195 yards despite there being no distance penalty. If I skull my 20-yard lob shot 60 yards over the green and OB, I've gained 40 yards with the distance penalty.

> > > > > > >

> > > > > > > Please show me this 200 yard PA that starts 5 yards from your shot

> > > > > >

> > > > > > Here are two pictures from my home club from one single hole.

> > > > > >

> > > > > >

> > > > >

> > > > > I can’t make out what that is showing. Where is the tee box?

> > > >

> > > > The white dot in the first picture. Most players lay up their tee shots to around where the white dot is in the second picture because there's long hay and bushes to the right of the fairway and if you miss slightly left (like the line in the first picture), it's atleast a 230-meter carry over the water.

> > >

> > > ...learn to hit it further with accuracy? or play a different box? not sure what to tell you man, that fairway looks wide enough you could hit it further up the right side where the left elbow begins.

> >

> > You're completely missing the point of this discussion.

>

> am i tho?

I think you are

He wasn't looking to be told anything about the hole management. LICC wanted pics of a certain scenario of a large PA close to tee box. Thus the pics.

[gioguy21]

> @Vindog said:

> > @gioguy21 said:

> > > @Halebopp said:

> > > > @gioguy21 said:

> > > > > @Halebopp said:

> > > > > > @LICC said:

> > > > > > > @Halebopp said:

> > > > > > > > @LICC said:

> > > > > > > > > @Halebopp said:

> > > > > > > > > > @LICC said:

> > > > > > > > > > > @Halebopp said:

> > > > > > > > > > > > @LICC said:

> > > > > > > > > > > > > @Halebopp said:

> > > > > > > > > > > > > > @LICC said:

> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > @Halebopp said:

> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > @LICC said:

> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > @Vindog said:

> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Fine, I'll bite.

> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > One is IN BOUNDS

> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > One is OUT OF BOUNDS

> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > It really is that simple.

> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > So you have no answer. No idea. Nothing to add. Got it.

> > > > > > > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > There are consequences in all sports for sending the ball off the playing field. Do you think it's unfair a player loses the point in tennis if s/he hits the ball out of bounds or that you lose possession of the ball if you send the ball off the pitch in football?

> > > > > > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > > > > > > Your analogy helps my argument. The player loses one point in tennis (and not even that on the first serve). This rule is like the player would lose two points in tennis for one OB stroke

> > > > > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > > > > > No it doesn't, there's a one-stroke penalty, not two. The ball didn't fly OB on its own no matter how much you want to avoid the responsibility for the stroke.

> > > > > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > > > > > You chose the club, the swing and the aim and then tried to execute the shot. It was you and only you who sent the ball OB and you're penalized one stroke for such an awful shot.

> > > > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > > > > Stroke AND distance. That is a two stroke penalty. The new local rule that lets you place the ball on the fairway requires a TWO stroke penalty. You are now hitting 4. Let’s not be distorting the discussion

> > > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > > > Like you said it is Stroke and Distance, not Two Strokes and Distance.

> > > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > > > You hit your tee shot OB but hit the fairway with your second try. You're now lying three on the fairway, not four. You've made two strokes at the ball and have had to add one penalty stroke to your score, not two.

> > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > > This is silly. Please stop with this. There is a stroke penalty and a distance penalty. If you hit in the water, you take a one penalty stroke drop at the point it went in. No distance penalty. If you hit it out of bounds, you take a stroke penalty and by re-teeing, you take a distance penalty.

> > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > If I hit a 200-yard shot into a penalty area but the ball crossed into the PA 5 yards in front of the spot from which I made the stroke, I'm losing 195 yards despite there being no distance penalty. If I skull my 20-yard lob shot 60 yards over the green and OB, I've gained 40 yards with the distance penalty.

> > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > Please show me this 200 yard PA that starts 5 yards from your shot

> > > > > > >

> > > > > > > Here are two pictures from my home club from one single hole.

> > > > > > >

> > > > > > >

> > > > > >

> > > > > > I can’t make out what that is showing. Where is the tee box?

> > > > >

> > > > > The white dot in the first picture. Most players lay up their tee shots to around where the white dot is in the second picture because there's long hay and bushes to the right of the fairway and if you miss slightly left (like the line in the first picture), it's atleast a 230-meter carry over the water.

> > > >

> > > > ...learn to hit it further with accuracy? or play a different box? not sure what to tell you man, that fairway looks wide enough you could hit it further up the right side where the left elbow begins.

> > >

> > > You're completely missing the point of this discussion.

> >

> > am i tho?

> I think you are

> He wasn't looking to be told anything about the hole management. LICC wanted pics of a certain scenario of a large PA close to tee box. Thus the pics.

 

There are large PAs on many courses off tees. My point was what was he attempting to do or play based on the shot? Is he trying to say it's not supposed to be a pa?

[Halebopp]

> @gioguy21 said:

> > @Halebopp said:

> > > @gioguy21 said:

> > > > @Halebopp said:

> > > > > @LICC said:

> > > > > > @Halebopp said:

> > > > > > > @LICC said:

> > > > > > > > @Halebopp said:

> > > > > > > > > @LICC said:

> > > > > > > > > > @Halebopp said:

> > > > > > > > > > > @LICC said:

> > > > > > > > > > > > @Halebopp said:

> > > > > > > > > > > > > @LICC said:

> > > > > > > > > > > > > > @Halebopp said:

> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > @LICC said:

> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > @Vindog said:

> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Fine, I'll bite.

> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > One is IN BOUNDS

> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > One is OUT OF BOUNDS

> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > It really is that simple.

> > > > > > > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > So you have no answer. No idea. Nothing to add. Got it.

> > > > > > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > > > > > > There are consequences in all sports for sending the ball off the playing field. Do you think it's unfair a player loses the point in tennis if s/he hits the ball out of bounds or that you lose possession of the ball if you send the ball off the pitch in football?

> > > > > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > > > > > Your analogy helps my argument. The player loses one point in tennis (and not even that on the first serve). This rule is like the player would lose two points in tennis for one OB stroke

> > > > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > > > > No it doesn't, there's a one-stroke penalty, not two. The ball didn't fly OB on its own no matter how much you want to avoid the responsibility for the stroke.

> > > > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > > > > You chose the club, the swing and the aim and then tried to execute the shot. It was you and only you who sent the ball OB and you're penalized one stroke for such an awful shot.

> > > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > > > Stroke AND distance. That is a two stroke penalty. The new local rule that lets you place the ball on the fairway requires a TWO stroke penalty. You are now hitting 4. Let’s not be distorting the discussion

> > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > > Like you said it is Stroke and Distance, not Two Strokes and Distance.

> > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > > You hit your tee shot OB but hit the fairway with your second try. You're now lying three on the fairway, not four. You've made two strokes at the ball and have had to add one penalty stroke to your score, not two.

> > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > This is silly. Please stop with this. There is a stroke penalty and a distance penalty. If you hit in the water, you take a one penalty stroke drop at the point it went in. No distance penalty. If you hit it out of bounds, you take a stroke penalty and by re-teeing, you take a distance penalty.

> > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > If I hit a 200-yard shot into a penalty area but the ball crossed into the PA 5 yards in front of the spot from which I made the stroke, I'm losing 195 yards despite there being no distance penalty. If I skull my 20-yard lob shot 60 yards over the green and OB, I've gained 40 yards with the distance penalty.

> > > > > > >

> > > > > > > Please show me this 200 yard PA that starts 5 yards from your shot

> > > > > >

> > > > > > Here are two pictures from my home club from one single hole.

> > > > > >

> > > > > >

> > > > >

> > > > > I can’t make out what that is showing. Where is the tee box?

> > > >

> > > > The white dot in the first picture. Most players lay up their tee shots to around where the white dot is in the second picture because there's long hay and bushes to the right of the fairway and if you miss slightly left (like the line in the first picture), it's atleast a 230-meter carry over the water.

> > >

> > > ...learn to hit it further with accuracy? or play a different box? not sure what to tell you man, that fairway looks wide enough you could hit it further up the right side where the left elbow begins.

> >

> > You're completely missing the point of this discussion.

>

> am i tho?

 

Yes you are, it's a discussion about the different consequences of hitting a ball OB or into a penalty area, not about course management.

[gioguy21]

> @Halebopp said:

> > @gioguy21 said:

> > > @Halebopp said:

> > > > @gioguy21 said:

> > > > > @Halebopp said:

> > > > > > @LICC said:

> > > > > > > @Halebopp said:

> > > > > > > > @LICC said:

> > > > > > > > > @Halebopp said:

> > > > > > > > > > @LICC said:

> > > > > > > > > > > @Halebopp said:

> > > > > > > > > > > > @LICC said:

> > > > > > > > > > > > > @Halebopp said:

> > > > > > > > > > > > > > @LICC said:

> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > @Halebopp said:

> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > @LICC said:

> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > @Vindog said:

> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Fine, I'll bite.

> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > One is IN BOUNDS

> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > One is OUT OF BOUNDS

> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > It really is that simple.

> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > So you have no answer. No idea. Nothing to add. Got it.

> > > > > > > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > There are consequences in all sports for sending the ball off the playing field. Do you think it's unfair a player loses the point in tennis if s/he hits the ball out of bounds or that you lose possession of the ball if you send the ball off the pitch in football?

> > > > > > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > > > > > > Your analogy helps my argument. The player loses one point in tennis (and not even that on the first serve). This rule is like the player would lose two points in tennis for one OB stroke

> > > > > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > > > > > No it doesn't, there's a one-stroke penalty, not two. The ball didn't fly OB on its own no matter how much you want to avoid the responsibility for the stroke.

> > > > > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > > > > > You chose the club, the swing and the aim and then tried to execute the shot. It was you and only you who sent the ball OB and you're penalized one stroke for such an awful shot.

> > > > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > > > > Stroke AND distance. That is a two stroke penalty. The new local rule that lets you place the ball on the fairway requires a TWO stroke penalty. You are now hitting 4. Let’s not be distorting the discussion

> > > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > > > Like you said it is Stroke and Distance, not Two Strokes and Distance.

> > > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > > > You hit your tee shot OB but hit the fairway with your second try. You're now lying three on the fairway, not four. You've made two strokes at the ball and have had to add one penalty stroke to your score, not two.

> > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > > This is silly. Please stop with this. There is a stroke penalty and a distance penalty. If you hit in the water, you take a one penalty stroke drop at the point it went in. No distance penalty. If you hit it out of bounds, you take a stroke penalty and by re-teeing, you take a distance penalty.

> > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > If I hit a 200-yard shot into a penalty area but the ball crossed into the PA 5 yards in front of the spot from which I made the stroke, I'm losing 195 yards despite there being no distance penalty. If I skull my 20-yard lob shot 60 yards over the green and OB, I've gained 40 yards with the distance penalty.

> > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > Please show me this 200 yard PA that starts 5 yards from your shot

> > > > > > >

> > > > > > > Here are two pictures from my home club from one single hole.

> > > > > > >

> > > > > > >

> > > > > >

> > > > > > I can’t make out what that is showing. Where is the tee box?

> > > > >

> > > > > The white dot in the first picture. Most players lay up their tee shots to around where the white dot is in the second picture because there's long hay and bushes to the right of the fairway and if you miss slightly left (like the line in the first picture), it's atleast a 230-meter carry over the water.

> > > >

> > > > ...learn to hit it further with accuracy? or play a different box? not sure what to tell you man, that fairway looks wide enough you could hit it further up the right side where the left elbow begins.

> > >

> > > You're completely missing the point of this discussion.

> >

> > am i tho?

>

> Yes you are, it's a discussion about the different consequences of hitting a ball OB or into a penalty area, not about course management.

 

My point is that there's no reason to gripe about it. It's a pa, move on.

[LICC]

> @Halebopp said:

> > @LICC said:

> > > @Halebopp said:

> > > > @LICC said:

> > > > > @Halebopp said:

> > > > > > @LICC said:

> > > > > > > @Halebopp said:

> > > > > > > > @LICC said:

> > > > > > > > > @Halebopp said:

> > > > > > > > > > @LICC said:

> > > > > > > > > > > @Halebopp said:

> > > > > > > > > > > > @LICC said:

> > > > > > > > > > > > > @Vindog said:

> > > > > > > > > > > > > Fine, I'll bite.

> > > > > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > > > > > One is IN BOUNDS

> > > > > > > > > > > > > One is OUT OF BOUNDS

> > > > > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > > > > > It really is that simple.

> > > > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > > > > So you have no answer. No idea. Nothing to add. Got it.

> > > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > > > There are consequences in all sports for sending the ball off the playing field. Do you think it's unfair a player loses the point in tennis if s/he hits the ball out of bounds or that you lose possession of the ball if you send the ball off the pitch in football?

> > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > > Your analogy helps my argument. The player loses one point in tennis (and not even that on the first serve). This rule is like the player would lose two points in tennis for one OB stroke

> > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > No it doesn't, there's a one-stroke penalty, not two. The ball didn't fly OB on its own no matter how much you want to avoid the responsibility for the stroke.

> > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > You chose the club, the swing and the aim and then tried to execute the shot. It was you and only you who sent the ball OB and you're penalized one stroke for such an awful shot.

> > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > Stroke AND distance. That is a two stroke penalty. The new local rule that lets you place the ball on the fairway requires a TWO stroke penalty. You are now hitting 4. Let’s not be distorting the discussion

> > > > > > >

> > > > > > > Like you said it is Stroke and Distance, not Two Strokes and Distance.

> > > > > > >

> > > > > > > You hit your tee shot OB but hit the fairway with your second try. You're now lying three on the fairway, not four. You've made two strokes at the ball and have had to add one penalty stroke to your score, not two.

> > > > > >

> > > > > > This is silly. Please stop with this. There is a stroke penalty and a distance penalty. If you hit in the water, you take a one penalty stroke drop at the point it went in. No distance penalty. If you hit it out of bounds, you take a stroke penalty and by re-teeing, you take a distance penalty.

> > > > >

> > > > > If I hit a 200-yard shot into a penalty area but the ball crossed into the PA 5 yards in front of the spot from which I made the stroke, I'm losing 195 yards despite there being no distance penalty. If I skull my 20-yard lob shot 60 yards over the green and OB, I've gained 40 yards with the distance penalty.

> > > >

> > > > Please show me this 200 yard PA that starts 5 yards from your shot

> > >

> > > Here are two pictures from my home club from one single hole.

> > >

> > >

> >

> > I can’t make out what that is showing. Where is the tee box?

>

> The white dot in the first picture. Most players lay up their tee shots to around where the white dot is in the second picture because there's long hay and bushes to the right of the fairway and if you miss slightly left (like the line in the first picture), it's atleast a 230-meter carry over the water.

 

Is this a par 5? Why would you take the line you drew in the 1st picture?