Is putter fitting overrated?

[968cab]

On 6/9/2022 at 11:07 AM, Maroon_19 said:

Is putter fitting overrated?
Short answer - No.
Longer answer - Hell no.
My answer - Having had a putter fitting with John at Artisan and having now played with the custom putter that was built based on that fitting for a year, I am a firm believer that a properly fit putter is a game-changer.  There were no computers or laser sighted anything.  There was no astro-turf.  There was three hours of putting on a bent-grass green, outside, in the elements, with a man that has spent his entire adult life fitting professional golfers into putters.  Short putts.  Long putts.  Straight putts.  Snakes.  Every five or six strokes John would hand me a different putter.  He didn't take any notes.  He just watched me putt and made little improvements in my stroke as we putted - grip pressure, follow through distance, shoulder stability.  We then went into the shop and he did a few measurements to make sure what he saw on the green matched up to the numbers in his head.  He told me to pick the putter head that I thought was the best looking head in the shop.  His firm belief is that if you don't like the way the putter looks, even if it is a perfect fit, you will never putt well with it.  He then built my putter.  Over this last year I've hit an average of 6 putts per round less than I was putting the year prior.  That is significant to me.

PROPER putter fitting is not overrated.

 

I could literally sign my name to the bottom of this post. Perfect recap of their process, and the value to your putting game.  I’m 4 rounds in with my new putter, and it’s eye opening.  

[shanx]

On 6/16/2022 at 5:08 PM, North Butte said:

I've never had a putter fitting, other than my teaching pro video'ing me rolling putts with a certain putter to check my alignment and the roll I put on the ball. But I've putter for years at a stretch with two basic kinds. 1) Something like an Anser with either a Pingman grip or some other skinny grip. 2) Something heavier, face balanced with a fatter and/or no-taper grip. 

 

If you gave me a straight 4-foot putt with one try to make for a hundred bucks I'd rather have a heavy, face-balanced mallet with some kind of fat SuperStroke grip and a nice long line on the top. That is so easy to just rock my shoulders and send the ball on my intended line that it's nearly yip-proof (for me). 

 

So I'd expect a putter fitting to give me the same recommendation like you. I make fewer alignment errors (on short-ish, straight-ish putts) and it minimizes any tendency to open the putter up and yank it behind me on the takeaway. It's the safe, solid, dependable type of putter. One short-ish, straight-ish putts, that is. 

 

But I've kept Strokes Gained stats over lots of round with both types and the stroke or so per round that those style putters save me on putts inside 6 feet are offset by the fact that I'm at least a stroke a round better on longer putts with a light Anser with skinny grip. I have no feel for distance with the heavy high-MOI mallet and on big breaking putts I tend to oversteer the alignment aid rather than letting my stroke flow. So my lag control is better AND I make more 20+ footers with the Anser.

 

But it's a tough call. There's a lot to be said for being solid over 3, 4, 5 foot putts of which most of us will have quite a few per round. Being good at those take pressure off your short game and even takes pretty off your long lag putting. And in my data, it's darned near a wash between the two types. But since putting feels freer and better with the Anser and I'm either breaking even or slightly benefiting overall in SG terms that's what I generally use. 

 

P.S. I do have a high-MOI, heavy Taylormade mallet in the closet for those times when I go through a spell of getting a bit yippy on the 2-3 footer. It's nice to be able to revert to that for a few weeks until the nerves settle down!

 

I want to loop back on this, after a few more rounds and 18 holes with a friend that plays a few rounds with me every year.

 

I've swapped out my gamer from a Sub70 100% face balanced to a Cameron Golo6, that has a slight droop (maybe 10 degrees?). It's a bit bigger and softer feeling than the Sub70. 

 

The Sub70 TAIII was a bit of a sledgehammer, heavy even with the lightest weights installed. It had a small, blocky head too..

 

I'll say this, I am much more consistent this season though. I played 18 with a buddy I played a few rounds early spring this past weekend. I had a decent round putting, a few mid range 1 putts, one bomb over 20 feet, lipped a few others. He reminded me of the same performance this spring when we played a bunch in Myrtle Beach.

 

For now, I'm sticking with the science and suggestions from my fitting. I'll keep the nostalgia to my living room carpet putting for now..

[BigUrsus]

As a big fitting advocate i would say it depends where you go. 

Ive had 3 putter fittings in the last 5 years .

• Club champion about 5 putts, they told me a scotty newport with idential specs would perform better than my nike method
• golf&ski NH about 20 putts, they told me adding 4 incles to my anser style putter would help
• PGA super store studio about 20 putts, they told me the scotty phantom 5.5 i liked was good. after about 3 putts they said the only recommendation was 2* flat. 

Overall of the 3-4 hours and $300 ive spent on putter fittings i'd say they have been useless. However, i still think a good fitter is out there somewhere. 

[Carolina Doc]

I may be naive but I don't worry about it.  I just go play for fun.  It would probably be different if I were competing.  

[mitchdoc]

Reviving an old thread has here in northeast Canada where there is no on the ground I have been putting quite a lot in my basement and I have a few different styles of putter that I have been fooling around with.

 

Ironically some 30-year-old Bobby Grace Cobra putter that was cut down to 34 in or less and has some crappy old worn out thin grip on it I can be lights out with. That said I remember going away from that putter because on the golf course I never had it performed as good as this.

 

I have a spider X slant neck model and a more blade style Mizuno M craft number 4 and a Cobra Agera large mallet.

 

Seemingly I can get in a groove and put well with any one of them.

 

I live in Montreal Canada and getting onto a Sam puttlab or quintic system is not so easy or local for me.

 

So I cannot comment directly on experiences getting fit for a putter in a professional way that I would like to try.

 

Overall I think I am a reasonably good putter and most of my rounds I would say I have between 28 and 33 putts per round with an average probably closer to 31.

 

I think the limitations of most putter fittings that are done are that you are rolling a ball on an effectively straight putt from 10 to 12 feet away and then looking at tendencies such as aim back spin etc.

 

I think those all have their place and can be useful....

 

However. I don't play golf on 10 foot long straight putt greens.

 

What if on my 30 footer with 3 foot break that putter gives me poor distance control or if on a longer putt I have tendency to hit it more off the toe and that putter I aim so well at 10 feet twists more and the putt now is off line and is short.

 

My principle for putting off as follows. Look at tour data.

Pros after 8 feet from target miss more than 50%.

 

On average PGA Tour pros make 99% of 2-foot putts, 96% of 3-foot putts, 88% of 4-foot putts and 77% of 5-foot putts according to strokes gained pioneer, Mark Broadie. From 10 feet their one putt percentage is 40%, 23% from 15 feet, 15% from 20 feet, 7% from 30 feet, 4% from 40 feet, 3% from 50 feet and 2% from 60 feet.

 

Knowing this I want 3 things from my putter.

 

1. I want to make almost all my 4 footers and 75% of 5 footers. Whatever putter can do that will give me best chance at low score assuming my short game can get me the ball to 5 feet.

 

2. Since pros only make 25% or less from putts outside 15 feet my expectations should be lower and my goal is to make sure my 1st out gets inside that 3 foot range to near guarantee no 3putts.

 

So I want a putter that is consistent for distance control on mishits. Meaning if I hit it a bit toe or heel side or with a bit too much loft or to little, that the end result won't be much different.

 

3. Finally I want a putter that I can guarantee my distances with. It's one thing to be consistent on mishits and another to say I want to hit this 30 feet but I keep coming up long or short because the face is too hot or soft.

 

Most of what I am looking for can be determined with trial and error in a golf store with a big practice green or on a real practice green with a demo putter.

 

Find a straight putt. Aim the putter and see if it goes on your intended line. Try a few styles and necks and alignment lines. If nothing stands out for better or worse, then you know you are a good  aimer and you have many styles to choose from.

 

Then go to long putts. Try leaving them as close as possible. Miss toe or heel about too on purpose.

If one seems consistently closer under good and off center strikes. You now have your winner.

 

In a real round of golf of you don't 3putt you will max at 36 putts. Assuming you miss say 8 greens and are a good enough s short game player to get 5 of those 8 to 5 feet or less you will have minimum 3 1putts. If of the remaining 3 you get them inside 10 feet you should make 1 more.

Of the remaining 10 GIR , if you hit 1 close and of the other 9 you are able to sink 1 longer putt, you should average 30 putts without draining anything long.

 

The key is sinking the 5 or less and leading the rest inside 3 feet.

 

Putter fitting doesn't test for those things. So if my putt skids for 14 or 16 inches before forward roll, will I sink more 4 footers or lag it closer? I don't know? If I do I should be able to tell that empirically without seeing all the data from the Quintic.

 

Also the SAM puttlab attached something to your putter. How does that added weight and balance change affect your stroke. Will the numbers extrapolate when it is removed?

 

Someone else mentioned earlier that when on these machines that they try  to modify their stroke(even subconsciously) to get the best data. Well we don't have that feedback on the course so we aren't even testing it natural stroke...

 

This is why I prefer my method of doing so return and error specific testing. Was it doesn't matter if my eyes are over the ball inside the line. If my path is 2* outside in our face is 2*open. It matters only if my out hours where I want it to and at the right distance.

 

Tiger Woods, arguably one of the best putters ever:

 

Aiming: Open 2.5* (92% consistency)

Face at Impact: 0.9* closed (91% consistency)

Path at Impact: 0.0* (95% consistency)

Face Rotation: Backswing 7.8* open, End of FWD swing 12.2* closed. Total of 20.0* degree of rotation throughout the stroke (a fair amount)

Impact Spot: 5.3 MM towards toe (96% consistency)

Rise Angle: 3.4* up (putter loft of 3*)

 

So he misses on the toe. He sings his putter right of the target and has a lot of face rotation. Hmm put me on  Sam puttlab with those numbers and they would have me change putters.....

 

 

Food for thought .