Scotty Cameron Classic Mini

[rblmp32]

The Enzo is probably a bad example. The vast majority of that car is made by Ferrari. Engine, being the primary example. Interior, etc etc etc.

[xxio]

SC never claimed he manufactures anything, especially at the Studio. He just "makes" them there.

 

 

 

The Putter Studio is a dream setup that allows me to really focus on my number one goal, which has always been to make the finest putters in the world. Everything else is secondary. There’s hardly a sign identifying this special place, and no map to the Putter Studio. In fact, the only way to get here is to be invited. I keep it this way because the Putter Studio is a research and development facility for putters and accessories. I concentrate intensely on getting three things working together in harmony—the golf ball, the putter, and the player. My team and I are constantly trying new things, improving on the old, and pushing the Art of Putting to the next level. This is a place for testing, learning, imagination, and innovation. It’s also a hot rod shop for putters. But I’ll get to that in a minute.

 

When I started making putters in my garage, I dreamed of a larger facility where I could create. Don't get me wrong, I still work in my garage at home all the time. But to really do what I wanted to do, I needed a bigger shop. So, I sat down and hammered out a plan for the Putter Studio. And what I’ve come up with is a state-of-the-art facility. The nature of this Studio is to have a place where the art and science of putting can be practiced and put into play immediately—for the top Tour professionals and loyal Cameron putter players around the world who send their putters to the Custom Shop for work.

 

People often ask, Why a Putter Studio? It’s a great question. The Putter Studio—and namely the Performance Shop—was created as a place to help me figure out the answers to questions and thoughts we all have with putting. If the putting path is bad, does the ball actually cut or hook? Is the ball compressed hard enough to hook or cut? How does weight shift affect path? What about posture? Posture related to lie angle and shaft length? Is shaft angle the same at address as it is at impact? Does the putter have enough loft? How does ball position affect lie angle, and how does shaft angle affect loft? The list goes on. And that’s why I developed the Performance Shop inside the Putter Studio.

 

It’s inside there where I gather information based on these questions so I can formulate theories and prove them as facts—and then share them with the game’s top players. The information I use to make putters for touring professionals goes directly into my designs and modifications for putters that make it to production. Only in this environment—with the proper diagnostic tools we’ve custom fit to this location—can I find the answers to these questions to gain knowledge and the peace of mind we’re all searching for with regard to putting.

 

The Performance Shop

Everything we do at the Putter Studio revolves around the Performance Shop. This is where the Art of Putting meets its scientific counterpart. This room with its two-story vaulted ceiling is literally positioned in the center of the building and is the focal point for Tour fittings, research, and analysis. The Performance Shop is equipped with force plates to measure weight distribution, lasers for alignment, and high speed video cameras set up at various angles to capture information about a player’s address, stroke, and follow through. Everything is played back on flat screen monitors for instant analysis of the performance of the ball versus the putter versus the player.

 

This is a studio where players can learn and concentrate without distraction in a relaxing, but focused, environment. Additionally, we help them understand which putter fits their style of putting. The data we compile in the Performance Shop helps me design and create the best putter for a player’s individual needs. A player can come to the Studio and in a short time I can understand what he or she needs and likes. Then, I can create a putter to fill his or her needs right here at the Putter Studio.

 

The Custom Shop & Tour Department

I love the actual milling and grinding, buffing and bending, welding and stamping, shafting and tweaking of putter making. The Putter Studio’s Custom Shop is the perfect place for me to do this. In here, we treat every putter like a touring pro’s gamer. We can pretty much do anything we want to a putter in the Custom Shop. What I love is that not only do we service the top players in the world by dialing in putters to their exact specifications, but we also restore and customize putters for anyone who’d like to give their putter the star treatment.

 

The Custom Shop actually comprises the Tour Department, various customization stations, the Restoration Department, the Authentication Department, and Customer Service all under the same roof. Inside these walls we can pull apart a putter, mill the face, buff out the head, re-paint, add lines and sight dots, stamp initials and logos, re-shaft, re-grip, re-tune, and authenticate—pretty much outfit any putter any way you’d like it (within reason, of course). My goal with the Custom Shop is to provide you with a way to extend the life of your Scotty Cameron putter—even add some new life to it—by getting your gamer back in mint condition, giving it virtually an endless life. I want you to play my putter forever, and the Custom Shop gives you this opportunity.

 

The Custom Shop is not only for restoration and customization of existing Cameron putters. It’s set up with everything I need for prototyping, milling, welding, buffing, grinding, shaping and finishing new putters, too. As my father always said, if you don’t have the right tools, you can’t do the right job. I’ll come in here with an idea and build a putter from scratch in no time. Having the right space and tools is everything. Now, if I just had more time!

 

One Stop Shop

Our staff offices are upstairs where we design everything from headcovers to new Cameron Creations, apparel to shaft bands, art and logos for everything we make, and even this website. It’s all housed here at the Putter Studio, my dream creative work space. I still don’t have an actual desk or office, but I consider any part of the Putter Studio my workspace. Sometimes I’ll just write an idea on the floor…or a wall…or a work bench…you name it. That’s the point of a creative space—to be creative! And, to have a place where everyone enjoys coming to work on Monday. So far, so good. Thanks for dropping in. I hope you enjoyed this brief tour of the Putter Studio.

 

 

 

The last part I highlighted. The name Rick Cooper has been brought up as a mentor in putter making. Was it this Mr. Cooper or a "father" who taught his son Donald to mill putters. Who is Scotty's dad? maybe some research on his background may show a background in golf/puttermaking.

 

Jut to add, just crossed my mind maybe the dad was just talking making things in general.

[psygolf]

Since this is an open and educational discussion; what lines did the '98 - ? skimmed heads from china start and end with...the oil cans??

Never said any of the 1998 putters were skim milled head from China. Just that Vog was confusing the Bettinardi completed heads with post Bettinardi Cameron/Titleist heads. I believe that most of the Cameron/Titleist post bettinardi heads were made in America on CNC mills from billets of metal and that there were a few Cameron/Titleist retail lines that were made from imported castings.

 

No offense intended but posting like that makes a subsequent reader believe that something was said that was not said. It is like there being 5 vs 8 Mini's. It was posted that Bettinardi had one in his office and all of a sudden some posters are demanding to see photos of all 3 additional Mini's that Bettinardi has. Well it was never said that Bettinardi had 3, just that he had 1 in his collection.

 

 

 

And is it really a surprise to anyone that Scotty doesn't "make" every putter with his name on it? That would be like being suprised that your Vokey wedge was not hand made by Bob Vokey. Or that Giorgio Armani didn't personally cut and stitch the suit you just bought.

 

Outsourcing is a common business practice. For most people all that really matters is that you get a high quality product with a value that is in line with what you paid for it.

 

So a Bugatti Veyron or Ferrari Enzo are not collectible works of art? It's ridiculous to expect a company to disclose their suppliers. Bugatti wouldn't do that, Armani shouldn't be expected to list their suppliers.

So you are stating as fact that Cameron misleads the public and that he has never manufactured any of the pieces of art in house. I am glad we are finally in agreement on something. And you are also confirming that you have knowledge that all of the components of Cameron products are made overseas by third party supplies just like the other examples you used? I do not agree with that but if you say so I will have to go with your expertise.

 

See how misinterpreting what someone's post works.

*Duly noted & removed; which specific line was made from imported cast heads?

[biscuity]

"The truth is out there" and the truth will set us all free!

 

biscuity; "Outsourcing is a common business practice" that is a fact. Where it is wrong is when you claim you did it yourself. Is there anything wrong with outsourcing and then stamping it "Handmade"?

 

Not in an industry with no definition of "Handmade". For me it doesn't make a difference if the club started as block of steel or started as a rough CNC head and was then extensively worked on by hand. It still is a custom putter with a lot of handwork and time invested.

 

For some the word "Handmade" means that it never touched a mill. Technically, the definition could be so narrow that the putter would have to be completely made by hand: no milling, no power grinding, no sandblasting, no molded rubber grip, no pre-manufactured shaft. That would eliminate nearly every putter ever made from being termed "Handmade".

 

Others have made a list of terms that I think should be adopted in the industry: Hand Milled, Hand Finished, etc. But right now there is no standard. Scotty's current Garage/Tour putters would be classified as Hand Finished. Very few putters from any current manufacturer would be considered Hand Milled.

[rrkman]

I have enjoyed this thread. Everytime I read the current posts, the same question lingers I'm my mind. I wonder when Scotty will produce the "SC bar code" headcover?

 

 

Nice drive by shot....... I'm assuming you're talking about the similarity of the cameron us open cover and the WRX cover? There is a whole thread about that in the 'style' section but it was closed because it was nothing but fighting and personal attacks....please don't get that done to this one as well.

But, since you bring it up..... Do you know if Cameron came up with that design himself? Did he even see the WRX cover? Did the person that suggested the design see the WRX cover? Was he allowed to do things that they wouldn't or won't let other people do? I think this one is a yes from what I've read. They are both interesting covers. I have the cameron one, never bought the wrx one....not sure why. The thing about this is that somewhere, somehow, the golf industry was either notified, or figured out themselves, that the bethpage area has some history with fighter planes, bombers, whatever. If you would like the complete story on bethpage, feel free to do some research on it....I'm sure it is readily available online. But, the reason I say this is because Taylor Made also had an 'air' theme for their logo for the us open stuff. Maybe a little more 'geographically accurate' but still a similar theme. So, now ask me what I think of when I think of historical fighters and bombers. Personally (and outside of the brave men that lost their lives so that we can be free - and have these silly discussions), I think of the nose art....and the first couple images that pop into my head are the teeth, the pin-up girls, the script names, the 'kill' tally, etc. I bet this is the same for many people. Did I get those images from the WRX cover, no. I got it from watching hours and hours of the history channel was I was younger. Was WRX the first to put it on a cover, I think so and it is a nice design (but I think there is also a srixon cover as well)....will they be the last, no. Has the design been used on numerous other things over the years.....yes - I'll post some pics at the bottom of this for your. Also, if I designed the wrx cover, I would be upset too. But business is business. If he broke the law, go get him. If AM&E did something unethical to wrx, don't use them. He produced a cover that would sell and it did. It certainly had some similarities to the wrx one but it was also pretty different....and personally (and like I said, I might not feel this way if I actually did design the wrx cover), if you think he used your design, feel proud that you came up with a great idea that was good enough to inspire one of the bigger names in the current golf industry...whether you love him or hate him. JMO.

 

 

Here are just a couple examples....I never even realized the shark teeth on the jordans....

[xxio]

Someone once told me about the cast heads........ so this is hearsay (with pictures of course).......If you guess correctly you've hit the bullseye :)

[xxio]

"The truth is out there" and the truth will set us all free!

 

biscuity; "Outsourcing is a common business practice" that is a fact. Where it is wrong is when you claim you did it yourself. Is there anything wrong with outsourcing and then stamping it "Handmade"?

 

Not in an industry with no definition of "Handmade". For me it doesn't make a difference if the club started as block of steel or started as a rough CNC head and was then extensively worked on by hand. It still is a custom putter with a lot of handwork and time invested.

 

For some the word "Handmade" means that it never touched a mill. Technically, the definition could be so narrow that the putter would have to be completely made by hand: no milling, no power grinding, no sandblasting, no molded rubber grip, no pre-manufactured shaft. That would eliminate nearly every putter ever made from being termed "Handmade".

 

Others have made a list of terms that I think should be adopted in the industry: Hand Milled, Hand Finished, etc. But right now there is no standard. Scotty's current Garage/Tour putters would be classified as Hand Finished. Very few putters from any current manufacturer would be considered Hand Milled.

 

 

Maybe these other manufacturers using "handmade" for putters that are not should be mentioned. The question is not just the process but there is a great value attached to the word handmade.

 

Scotty puts his definition on his site:

 

Handmade

 

"Lots of work!" The mill is moved entirely by hand to create the putter's shape. Scotty started on a tabletop mill and moved to a Bridgeport. Scotty makes very few handmade putters each year. All handmade putters are stamped "Scott Cameron".

 

So technically Scott Cameron putters may also be not handmade, BUT all handmade putters are "Scott Camerons".

 

So far I can see Scotty has a great lawyer/consultant/proof reader/editor. :)

 

Misleading yet not false sort of like that Nickent?? ad on the Nationwide Tour last year.

[biscuity]

The Enzo is probably a bad example. The vast majority of that car is made by Ferrari. Engine, being the primary example. Interior, etc etc etc.

 

It's not that bad of an example. The chassis is a huge part of the vehicle. Ferrari also doesn't make the brakes, wheels, tires, glass, lights I think they make the body panels are made by ATR as well.

 

But my main point was that outsourcing is extremely common, even on highly collectible and unique items. And there is a lot of fuzzy memory & speculation on how many Enzo's were actually produced. People pre-ordered them at $600,000+ with the assumption that the production would be limited to 349. Then Ferrari bumped it to 400, and rumors are that it may have ended up over 500.

[xxio]

View these videos and tell me that they are not intended to make the viewer believe that they take place at Cameron's own facility. Pay attention to the Titles, the introduction, the end, both the video and the credits: Scotty Cameron Putter Studio

 

Video title: "Inside Scotty's Shirt Shop"

http://www.scottycameron.com/studio/videos.aspx

After this video came out there were actually posts on TCC about how cool it was that Cameron had shirt printing facilities at the Cameron Studio so he accomplished his marketing goal.

 

 

Studio Select Kombi: Milling & More

"...Made entirely here in North County San Diego"

http://www.scottycameron.com/studio/videos.aspx

"You want to see more? Come on in." as he opens the door to reveal that he is now at the Scotty Cameron PutterStudio.

 

How are these video's NOT intended to mislead the viewer that his products are made at the Studio?

 

 

Just like a lot of things SC is good at. Illusions/hype/marketing. Like I mentioned very misleading but not false.

 

That is how many get brought into the empire. You have to be really good to read in between the lines. The sad thing is when the "collector" wakes up he will feel betrayed and rightfully so. The signs are there just don't get blinded by the initial lure that you don't read the fine print. I'm only realizing that now myself.

[rblmp32]

The Enzo is probably a bad example. The vast majority of that car is made by Ferrari. Engine, being the primary example. Interior, etc etc etc.

 

It's not that bad of an example. The chassis is a huge part of the vehicle. Ferrari also doesn't make the brakes, wheels, tires, glass, lights I think they make the body panels are made by ATR as well.

 

But my main point was that outsourcing is extremely common, even on highly collectible and unique items. And there is a lot of fuzzy memory & speculation on how many Enzo's were actually produced. People pre-ordered them at $600,000+ with the assumption that the production would be limited to 349. Then Ferrari bumped it to 400, and rumors are that it may have ended up over 500.

 

Agreed.

[tpariff]

I have enjoyed this thread. Everytime I read the current posts, the same question lingers I'm my mind. I wonder when Scotty will produce the "SC bar code" headcover?

 

 

Nice drive by shot....... I'm assuming you're talking about the similarity of the cameron us open cover and the WRX cover? There is a whole thread about that in the 'style' section but it was closed because it was nothing but fighting and personal attacks....please don't get that done to this one as well.

But, since you bring it up..... Do you know if Cameron came up with that design himself? Did he even see the WRX cover? Did the person that suggested the design see the WRX cover? Was he allowed to do things that they wouldn't or won't let other people do? I think this one is a yes from what I've read. They are both interesting covers. I have the cameron one, never bought the wrx one....not sure why. The thing about this is that somewhere, somehow, the golf industry was either notified, or figured out themselves, that the bethpage area has some history with fighter planes, bombers, whatever. If you would like the complete story on bethpage, feel free to do some research on it....I'm sure it is readily available online. But, the reason I say this is because Taylor Made also had an 'air' theme for their logo for the us open stuff. Maybe a little more 'geographically accurate' but still a similar theme. So, now ask me what I think of when I think of historical fighters and bombers. Personally (and outside of the brave men that lost their lives so that we can be free - and have these silly discussions), I think of the nose art....and the first couple images that pop into my head are the teeth, the pin-up girls, the script names, the 'kill' tally, etc. I bet this is the same for many people. Did I get those images from the WRX cover, no. I got it from watching hours and hours of the history channel was I was younger. Was WRX the first to put it on a cover, I think so and it is a nice design (but I think there is also a srixon cover as well)....will they be the last, no. Has the design been used on numerous other things over the years.....yes - I'll post some pics at the bottom of this for your. Also, if I designed the wrx cover, I would be upset too. But business is business. If he broke the law, go get him. If AM&E did something unethical to wrx, don't use them. He produced a cover that would sell and it did. It certainly had some similarities to the wrx one but it was also pretty different....and personally (and like I said, I might not feel this way if I actually did design the wrx cover), if you think he used your design, feel proud that you came up with a great idea that was good enough to inspire one of the bigger names in the current golf industry...whether you love him or hate him. JMO.

 

 

Here are just a couple examples....I never even realized the shark teeth on the jordans....

 

Randy,

 

Maybe Scotty or his headcover designer (assuming Scotty doesn't design every cover himself) never saw the Golfwrx cover. But rest assured that AM&E, the company who stitches the covers for SC and did the cover for Golfwrx, knows DAMN well that those covers looked somewhat similar in design. Yet they produced the cover for their biggest customer. I don't necessarily have a problem with that, but it's a double edged sword.

 

Try this: send a request to AM&E to have a cover created with dancing letters and see what kind of response you get. Or see if they will make you a "Randy & Co." headcover in "tiffany" blue.

 

Kevin

[biscuity]

Using the shirt analogy, would it devastate you to find out that shirts were made in Bangladesh and then printed by a specialized printing company? Would that be a huge scandal that "proves" that Scotty Cameron is an evil person? Would that be sufficient information to set you on a campaign to enlighted everyone on golf forums that Scotty is using marketing trickery?

 

It just doesn't matter to most people, all they want is a nice putter or shirt.

 

 

View these videos and tell me that they are not intended to make the viewer believe that they take place at Cameron's own facility. Pay attention to the Titles, the introduction, the end, both the video and the credits: Scotty Cameron Putter Studio

 

Video title: "Inside Scotty's Shirt Shop"

http://www.scottycameron.com/studio/videos.aspx

After this video came out there were actually posts on TCC about how cool it was that Cameron had shirt printing facilities at the Cameron Studio so he accomplished his marketing goal.

 

 

Studio Select Kombi: Milling & More

"...Made entirely here in North County San Diego"

http://www.scottycameron.com/studio/videos.aspx

"You want to see more? Come on in." as he opens the door to reveal that he is now at the Scotty Cameron PutterStudio.

 

How are these video's NOT intended to mislead the viewer that his products are made at the Studio?

[tpariff]

Using the shirt analogy, would it devastate you to find out that shirts were made in Bangladesh and then printed by a specialized printing company? Would that be a huge scandal that "proves" that Scotty Cameron is an evil person? Would that be sufficient information to set you on a campaign to enlighted everyone on golf forums that Scotty is using marketing trickery?

 

It just doesn't matter to most people, all they want is a nice putter or shirt.

 

 

View these videos and tell me that they are not intended to make the viewer believe that they take place at Cameron's own facility. Pay attention to the Titles, the introduction, the end, both the video and the credits: Scotty Cameron Putter Studio

 

Video title: "Inside Scotty's Shirt Shop"

http://www.scottycameron.com/studio/videos.aspx

After this video came out there were actually posts on TCC about how cool it was that Cameron had shirt printing facilities at the Cameron Studio so he accomplished his marketing goal.

 

 

Studio Select Kombi: Milling & More

"...Made entirely here in North County San Diego"

http://www.scottycameron.com/studio/videos.aspx

"You want to see more? Come on in." as he opens the door to reveal that he is now at the Scotty Cameron PutterStudio.

 

How are these video's NOT intended to mislead the viewer that his products are made at the Studio?

 

The Golf Pride grips on SC putters are ALL made in Taiwan or Thailand. I emailed Eaton directly and got a response from Ms. Cherrie Johnson. She confirmed that ALL Golf Pride grips are made in one of those two countries.

 

So I guess the issue then becomes what does "Made in America" truly mean.

 

Kevin

[tpariff]

Grips are a tough one....does anyone even make them in the US anymore?

 

No, but the point is that trying to stand behind the "Made in America" slogan is BS no matter who you are.

[biscuity]

And Bettinardi's molded grips are probably made overseas too. But as rrkman said, if "Made in USA" is high on your priority list when it comes to what you buy or who you criticize, apply that attitude consistently.

[rrkman]

View these videos and tell me that they are not intended to make the viewer believe that they take place at Cameron's own facility. Pay attention to the Titles, the introduction, the end, both the video and the credits: Scotty Cameron Putter Studio

 

Video title: "Inside Scotty's Shirt Shop"

http://www.scottycameron.com/studio/videos.aspx

After this video came out there were actually posts on TCC about how cool it was that Cameron had shirt printing facilities at the Cameron Studio so he accomplished his marketing goal.

 

 

Studio Select Kombi: Milling & More

"...Made entirely here in North County San Diego"

http://www.scottycameron.com/studio/videos.aspx

"You want to see more? Come on in." as he opens the door to reveal that he is now at the Scotty Cameron PutterStudio.

 

How are these video's NOT intended to mislead the viewer that his products are made at the Studio?

 

 

Just like a lot of things SC is good at. Illusions/hype/marketing. Like I mentioned very misleading but not false.

 

That is how many get brought into the empire. You have to be really good to read in between the lines. The sad thing is when the "collector" wakes up he will feel betrayed and rightfully so. The signs are there just don't get blinded by the initial lure that you don't read the fine print. I'm only realizing that now myself.

 

I have a question on this. In a collectors world, what actually matters? Is it how it was made? probably in the case of a famous painter and/or carpenter. Is it the perceived value by some of the public - I mean beanie babies were probably made in china for about $.30 each but that didn't hurt there value when they were considered collectible? So, I guess my question is - what category do the real cameron collectors fit in? Are they collectors because they feel the putter they have on their wall was a block of steel that Cameron turned into a putter head with only his hands? Or is it value....like many things in the collectibles market, collectors like to have things that are perceived as valuable. Or are they just fans and want (and can afford) any of the products they choose to buy? My guess is that there are probably a little of each and a bunch in the middle. Just curious...and I guess I wouldn't mind knowing why people collect other golf things either.

 

Personally, I have a handful of cameron covers. Could I get something cheaper that works just as well...probably. Do I think that the cover was handmade by Cameron - no....do I think that he personally came up with all the designs- again, probably no. Do I like them because some of them are 'valued' at more than I paid for them - I would be lying if I didn't appreciate that but that isn't why I 'collect' them. Some of my favorite ones are probably at a lesser value then when they were originally sold....I still like them. And if value was the reason I collect them, I'm a moron because almost all of my covers have seen the course....I'm still deciding on whether I'll keep a couple of the more recent ones but for the most part, they are all gamers. Personally, one of my favorites is the 08 Hawaii cover. Sure, it might be 'valued' slightly more than the original cost, great. But, I like it because it reminds me of a great golf trip that I took to Oahu that same spring.....and met some great WRXers while I was there as well. Could I have bought a t-shirt, probably. Could I have brought home a cup of sand, probably. Could I have bought a hat - I did....but one of the best item that I have (and I didn't even get it on that trip) is the headcover.....outside of the memories of course.

 

Like I said...I'm just trying to paricipate in a constructive discussion so that I can determine my own opinions on things. I appreciate the increase in 'courtesy' and hopefully we can all walk away with feeling that we learned something...whether it be good or bad. Thanks.

[rrkman]

Randy,

 

Maybe Scotty or his headcover designer (assuming Scotty doesn't design every cover himself) never saw the Golfwrx cover. But rest assured that AM&E, the company who stitches the covers for SC and did the cover for Golfwrx, knows DAMN well that those covers looked somewhat similar in design. Yet they produced the cover for their biggest customer. I don't necessarily have a problem with that, but it's a double edged sword.

 

Try this: send a request to AM&E to have a cover created with dancing letters and see what kind of response you get. Or see if they will make you a "Randy & Co." headcover in "tiffany" blue.

 

Kevin

 

Kevin,

 

I understand completely....and man, wouldn't it be great if I had the 'social status' to deserve a tiffany Randy & Co cover.

 

Sorry, back to the topic. I completely agree but like you said, Cameron/Titleist is a major player in the golf industry. And even though I love WRX, this is a business decision for AM&E. Could they have said - "Scotty, we already did a cover like this...maybe you should try something else". Seems like a good idea and maybe the right thing to do....but if I had to guess, the rep that works with them jumped up and down, saying it was the nicest thing they ever saw. Did they truly believe that or were they just doing their job? I don't know the answer to that. Plus, I find it comical that he has the 'patent' on the dancing headcover...but, you know what? I really like that look and it seems to have been a good decision....for both him and AM&E.

 

Randy

[captain3jack]

Would you expect anything else? Lets not forget that Titliest gave Bridgestone 350 MILLION dollars for stealing there ball patents. Whats a golfwrx cover? Or a site dot on Circa 62 putters?

 

Here is a fact. I did 154 Red X putters for a golf tourney, over 50 putters had shrink wrap around the head.

One goes up on Ebay and is pulled by Scotty Cameron/Titleist because they do not put shrink wrap on there putters. The customer gets the putter back from his player who was selling it and returns to the store ready to declare Holy war on us for selling "fake" Camerons. We call Titliest legal, they say send it in as is. After 2 weeks they call and say the putter came from South Korea, back to the Studio, reboxed with Special Event covers and nobody took the shrink wrap off. She cant explain to me how that happened 50 times in 154 putter order. They send two dz Pro v1 balls and the putter back to us. SHRINK WRAP STILL ON HEAD!!

 

Whats that got to do with 1/5 or 1/8? The hypocrysy. Its either really 1/5 or its a fabrication.

[rrkman]

Grips are a tough one....does anyone even make them in the US anymore?

 

No, but the point is that trying to stand behind the "Made in America" slogan is BS no matter who you are.

 

Thanks...you just said in 15 words what I've been trying to say in about 500???? The entire slogan is BS...whether you're using it to sell something or whether you use it as the consumer. Without a global economy, we wouldn't even be having these conversations. And the grip is a good point.....if made in the usa is that important, then you should find someone in the us that can make it for you (or make it yourself). I'll stop before I get to 500 words again....and just defer to your statement - it is BS.

[tpariff]

Would you expect anything else? Lets not forget that Titliest gave Bridgestone 350 MILLION dollars for stealing there ball patents. Whats a golfwrx cover? Or a site dot on Circa 62 putters?

 

Here is a fact. I did 154 Red X putters for a golf tourney, over 50 putters had shrink wrap around the head.

One goes up on Ebay and is pulled by Scotty Cameron/Titleist because they do not put shrink wrap on there putters. The customer gets the putter back from his player who was selling it and returns to the store ready to declare Holy war on us for selling "fake" Camerons. We call Titliest legal, they say send it in as is. After 2 weeks they call and say the putter came from South Korea, back to the Studio, reboxed with Special Event covers and nobody took the shrink wrap off. She cant explain to me how that happened 50 times in 154 putter order. They send two dz Pro v1 balls and the putter back to us. SHRINK WRAP STILL ON HEAD!!

 

Whats that got to do with 1/5 or 1/8? The hypocrysy. Its either really 1/5 or its a fabrication.

 

It's actually "fewer than 5" according to the Cameron website. That still hasn't been explained. "Fewer than 5" means 0-4, yet there is one stamped 1/5. That still doesn't make sense to me.

 

Kevin

[xxio]

rrk,

 

Yes in collector's world these things matter otherwise all the putters would be $300. Some wouldn't be $5000 and others $40k.

[rrkman]

rrk,

 

Yes in collector's world these things matter otherwise all the putters would be $300. Some wouldn't be $5000 and others $40k.

 

 

I guess what I'm saying is.....for the billionaire that pays $1 million for a chair because it was 'hand crafted' by some 17th century carpenter in England.....did they buy it because they were a fan of that carpenters work, because it was 'worth' $1 million, or did they just like that chair? Just curious as to why you think people buy camerons. I can only speak for myself....I like the items and the fact that some of them are perceived to have additional value is nice as well....but the perceived value isn't really the major point for me. I also consider myself a minor collector...very minor - mostly because I have multiple items.

[xxio]

Then that doesn't make you a "collector". That makes you a fan who games Cameron putters.

 

A lot of people buy Camerons for different reasons. The name, the perceived value, the quality, etc.

 

The collectors buy them because they have value, determined by factors like if it was a 1/5 or a /8. If it was a Scott or a Scotty. If it was a headcover with a gold tooth or not.

 

Hey it is their money right? As long as the numbers and the practices are truthful there should never be a problem.

 

The problem is collectors and buyers have seen/felt the wrong end of the spectrum. I have had a deal before with Craiga a long time ago and it was unbelievably pleasant. He went out of his way to get things together for me. For someone like him to have a bad experience and post it out here is a testament to how bad the Cameron organization has become. It may have been a Titleist fault but his name is what gives value to those Titelist putter. Cameron makes money on the that business relationship he should be prepared to take the flak for it as well. For all we know it could be Wally and not Donald ordering some of the cloudy business decisions but again it does not say Wally on the putters.

 

 

 

 

That is the problem it is all about money and people having to defend the value of their putter. I don't think you have shown that motivation, good for you.

 

I think it was "stage" that said it. If the thread was just started with no mention of the $40k this would have been off the front page by now. The $40k opened a can of worms and now they are feasting on the body of that Mini.

[tangojay]

I just turn down an offer of $50,000 for my Byron DH89....

 

 

:man_in_love: :friends:

[golfing7861]

my apologies if someone has asked this before but what do you guys think the value of this putter is? or how much you would give it away for if you owned one

[golfing7861]

Well The classic mini 1of5 was originally valued at $2000/2500 by a very knowledgeable collector back in Sept of 2003

 

but if the owner turned down 40k im guessing its worth way more now? or did the owner just want to keep it?

[tangojay]

Years ago, a very experience baseball card collector told my son

 

"The value of an item is not in the book value, but, the highest price a person is willing to pay for it"

 

To some this might be worth in the 10K range to others maybe $200,,, I am sure we have/had a putter which to us is invaluable.

 

I am done with thread, thanks for the info to all! time to go see if there is such thing as a 8802 model with a sound slot or find a copper one,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,

[biscuity]

As usual you just do not get the point.

 

That kind of comment is unnecessary.

[biscuity]

If the thread was just started with no mention of the $40k this would have been off the front page by now. The $40k opened a can of worms and now they are feasting on the body of that Mini.

 

This thread would have been off the first page right now it the second post didn't start with the inflammatory claim of "Complete B.S."

 

What we've learned is that 1/5 is not "complete BS". Complete BS would be if someone could show photos of more than 5 Classic Minis, but they can't, nobody has photos of even 5 of them. There might be 3 unfinished heads out there, they may have been destroyed, they may be sitting in someone's office, but they aren't going to get COA's. So the number of finished official Classic Mini's might be 3, 4, or 5. I'd guess that it's 4 plus Scotty's personal putter commerating the birth of his daughter. That would make 5.

 

The $40,000 number is a distraction for some, impressive to Cameron collectors, and a thorn in the side for others. I'd never pay that kind of money for a putter, but if someone has that kind of cash then they can pay whatever they want. I'd never pay A-Rod $175,000 for every baseball game he plays, but the Yankees did. Yankee fans love it, a lot of people hate it, but it sells newspapers and seat tickets.

[psygolf]

Someone once told me about the cast heads........ so this is hearsay (with pictures of course).......If you guess correctly you've hit the bullseye :)

would one have to "reut" any further than these models to find others that were cast... or was it a one stop shop for him?