Lift Clean and Cheat???

Gxgolfer · August 10, 2005

Do you play it as it lies or lift, clean and place???

JHR · August 10, 2005

Play as it lies most of the time. I would be lieing if I said I never rolled one, but it depends on the reason. I play with guys that roll everything, I play with customers that you have to let roll em. I personally don't like to, but sometimes it happens.

TheLastDon · August 11, 2005

I play it as it lies usually as well. I will roll it if balls plugged (Permanent local rule in my book) or something of that nature.

One place I will always roll it is if I'm in the trees (semi-common) and ball is close to a tree root. I'm not going to risk my clubs and/or injury for a casual round. I dont "foot wedge" it back into the fairway, but I'll take a few inches :vava: .

phillypete · August 11, 2005

total depends on the attitude for that day. If I am going out and keeping score, I'll play it as it lies.

If I am out just to relax and have a good time, I'll do as the mood strikes me. If I end up in the rough on a par five I might give it a nudge to get a lie worthy of a 3 wood. If I am near a tree I might give it a kick fo a clearer view.

There is a course in augusta called the River Club, and it is a fantastic layout. The grass usually looks great, the only problem is a few holes can really get soggy since it sits on a flood plain. I would get balls that would plug so bad that I would need my divot tool to dig them out. Thats an obivous lift clean and place.

One guy I played with in Georgia was a habitual roller and we would play for money. I didn't really have a problem because even with his lie adjustment he was still a making regular contributions to my college loans, but one of the other guys said something to him one day. The guy got really defensive and said it wasn't his fault we had to play these dogtracks (they weren't dog tracks by a long shot). So we made a deal that if you wanted to move his ball you could move it parallel or backwards from its orginal spot but you had to toss it up and hit it and any wiffs counted as strokes. by the end of the day we had all envoked the rule at least once and were all sorry that we did each time.

Debit · August 11, 2005

Nope, play that puppy as it lies. If it's unplayable, the situation is covered under the Rules of Golf and it's a one-troke penalty. However, you can play your ball any way you want to .. unless we're in a tournament, got money on it, or it's a league play day. Another member of my league always posted a lower score. yada yada yada .. and then I realized that she was improving her lie on every shot through green. However, she could never finish ahead of me in any tournament that required that the ball be played as it lies. There are times when the course is just soooooo ugly (wet, frozen hillocks, etc) that it's only fair to agree to improve your lie through the green. IMHO Tiger is correct, it's lift-clean & cheat. The better relief is lift-clean-and-replace

rhinogolfer · August 15, 2005

I'm on the same page as Debit.

Did read an interesting article in GDigest on just this topic, it proposed 'lift, clean and DROP as a fairer way of play in marginal turf conditions.

Debit · August 16, 2005

Did read an interesting article in GDigest on just this topic, it proposed 'lift, clean and DROP as a fairer way of play in marginal turf conditions.
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Dropping into marginal conditions doesn't provide any relief. On those occasions when it's "lift, clean, and place (or replace -- LPGA)", the ground is saturated and the balls muddy. I don't do "splat" golf myself (rain soaked muddy fairways), so I wouldn't want to require someone else to suffer those conditions. To require the player to replace the ball with so many inches is a whole lot better than allowing that clublength improved lie business.

kenfuji · August 16, 2005

I only take advantage of the rule if the ball is caked in mud from the landing. other then that i play it as is.

xxio · August 17, 2005

I don't unless it has been posted by my club that that is the local rule for the day. That is also one of the reasons I stopped playing the ProV. That thing picks up so much mud for me. I spin the ball a ton, even though I don't hit it that far or hit it that high.

Sakman · August 18, 2005

I play the ball as it lies, but have on occasion rolled one due to the situation (weather, etc.)

Something that really irritates me is when people "fluff" their ball in the rough...FOR EVERY SINGE SHOT.

cpa49707 · August 18, 2005

Play it as it lies. The only time i don't is we have a local rule posted that day, or if its a casual round and i may damage a club by swinging on a tree root or rock. other than that play it as it lies!

RickK · November 10, 2005

My golf league has this in the rules. The ball shall be played as it lies unless play has been deemed as "cart path only". If CPO is in effect, then "lift, clean, and place" is also in effect. It goes on to say that if you start the day playing the ball down, then you will play it down for the entire round, even if it comes a downpour during the round. At that point, you can get relief from casual water if you need it. And, if you start out as CPO and you are playing lift, clean and place and they later tell you you can drive on the fairways...you still play lift, clean and place.

I have a nice scar on the sole of my 9 iron from hitting a shot in our last event from the rough where my ball was laying on top of a small boulder.

Madball · November 12, 2005

There was a situation at our club this year of not being to wet-but the drought was so bad that in some areas holes would develop in the turf on fairways, roughs ,and around the greens.

Didn't matter how much we watered (all the time)-if we don't get any rain for 4-5 months like happened this year, the turf will suffer.

We made it lift-clean and place up to 6 inches of where the ball laid. This was enough to take it out of most unplayable lies that there were and eliminated the course from causing a difference in a match or tournament from any "unlucky" lies.

This was only done from mid August thru Sept and since then the weather came back and everything is fine again and the ball is played as it lies..

Steve_FLA · November 18, 2005

I play in a Saturday morning league and the local rule at the coures is lift clean and place. IMO that is fine in the fairway...but in the rough it should be lift, clean and drop.

-Steve

USNHack · March 22, 2006

For tourney's my club allows winter rules lift, clean and place in the fairways only so if your in the rough it's tough you know what, play it as it lies. I stay true to this rule even in casual rounds during the winter months.

Lord Thomas · March 22, 2006

Ordinarily I'll play the ball as it lies, unless there is a very good reason to do otherwise (risk of injury to my clubs or myself, in an area designated as a free drop, etc.). However, if I'm playing in a tournament and it is designated as lift, clean and place, and I think that cleaning the ball and placing it puts me in a better situation, I will take advantage of the lift, clean and place.

-Thomas

d__d · March 22, 2006

If the fairways are completely soaked and I'm not playing for money or in a tournament, I'll clean it off from time to time depending on how much mud sticks to the ball. I try to play the ball as it lies. If I end up hitting a good shot after cleaning my ball the first thing that pops in my head is "Would I have hit that shot if I wouldnt have cleaned my ball?" Then I usually say, oh well and move on to my next shot. :drinks: