Confessions 12 --- Exploding Heads

[Reasonability]

Reasy, I heard you mention big band, well here is a link to one of my absolute favorite artists. Jamie Cullum, a nice blend of jazz, and a little bit of everything. This particular concert is with the Heritage Orchestra, amazing stuff. I great concert to sit and listen to over a beverage. The first tune in the concert is one of my favorites, and this version is my favorite by far.

 

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OUTSTANDING! What's not to love with that one!?!?!

 

Oh - and FWIW...I have serious doubts - if exposed DAILY the grandmother/uncle/confinement issues you've endured...just doubt I'd ever handle it with your level of maturity and grace. Jason Day did it.... you're doing it, too If those of us here had ANY part in tossing you a lifeline in these times (all of us, including you knowing this too shall pass)... please know we get a little boost from YOU.

 

And also FWIW - I wouldn't start a thread inside of wrx - ANYTHING about dreams of professional play. We've all seen the bashing and trashing that goes with that one. WAY too easy for folks to sit at home in their socks and underwear getting their jollies taking a good dump on the next guy's beliefs - dreams - swing - you name it. All you have when you leave this world is the resonance and echos of who you were deep down. Those who can't wait to smash the post button just to shove one up your arse are WAY more interested in themselves than your dreams and passions. So there's no good reason to expose yourself to their smelly socks and dirty BVDs. Good call on avoiding that one... let the superiority complex gang find another target to troll. (and they'll surely make it their business to do so).

[DeNinny]

Ninja, EXCELLENT post, and I have to say great questions by Sixty too! I learned a ton in that post, I'm gonna have to read that one a few times. Also that kinematic sequence graph is very interesting. Thanks again for taking the time to drop knowledge Brochacho!! :)

 

...

 

Thanks too Broshambro. It is all part of 'DeNinny's Universal Swing Theory' or DUST model for short. I tortured Conrad, PD, and Reason with it for weeks when I was suspended. I have always done a lot of swing mirror work when practicing at home and eventually it led to being able to deconstruct the swing into those basic movements and actually perform them individually in front of the mirror. I realized that the sum of the individual actions that literally move the clubhead, by its own individually isolated motion, is what generates the clubhead velocity. The more the action moves the clubhead, in theory, the more it can contribute to the total clubhead velocity.

 

This is why guys can get on their knees and still hammer the ball with driver. The shoulder turn and trail arm bending are still moving the clubhead over a long distance. This is enough to get Vc up pretty high.

 

Be careful about what you read. You may get some DUST in your eye.

[mdgboxx]

OK, so here is a 6i Pusuit 510MB:

 

 

 

Got home after a good round and a couple margaritas with the Mrs to find 'the long rectangular box sitting on the porch. God, can this day get any better? The fit and finish screams quality. How do these people produce such a club at this price? At address, they sit a tad toe high, but we will see how that works out. The TT Featherlight shafts have a bunch of stepping about 2/3 down the shaft, not sure what that will mean. Faces are bigger than my FGs, almost look like GI MBs, a little bit of offset, rounded toe. Next post I will post some pics next to my FGs. Took a ton of swings in my living room. and they feel just slightly head heavy, which should be OK since I hit best when I have a languid tempo. But man they are purdy.

 

OK, so here is a 6i Pusuit 510MB:

 

 

 

Got home after a good round and a couple margaritas with the Mrs to find 'the long rectangular box sitting on the porch. God, can this day get any better? The fit and finish screams quality. How do these people produce such a club at this price? At address, they sit a tad toe high, but we will see how that works out. The TT Featherlight shafts have a bunch of stepping about 2/3 down the shaft, not sure what that will mean. Faces are bigger than my FGs, almost look like GI MBs, a little bit of offset, rounded toe. Next post I will post some pics next to my FGs. Took a ton of swings in my living room. and they feel just slightly head heavy, which should be OK since I hit best when I have a languid tempo. But man they are purdy.

 

That was quick.

 

Obviously, you know we expect a Full Review on these. :taunt:

[Matt J]

Hammer, the Diamana is better for me at the moment because I can go after it and it's straight. I use the whiteboard in my FW's and hybrids. I may use the TiNi on shorter courses because the flight is better on slower more shaped shots, but I can always use 3W for those. The Tini might get tipped for the 3W. Still have the PL Red coming too.

[mdgboxx]

Here are PWs and 4is side by side, FG to the left, Pursuit to the right:

 

 

 

 

 

I hope yall can see the larger face, esp with the wedge. I love the look of the 7 - 4i, just not sure about the big spade look of the short irons. I like the compact look of my FGs..

 

Good pics, but what struck me first was the amount of steps on the shafts. Never seen so many on any other before, then again, I haven't been around that long. I prefer stiff/stiffer shafts in my wedges, I'm probably wrong, but aren't steps (especially that many) a sign of softer shafts?

[mdgboxx]

Nice, thug!

 

But I wanna know how they FEEL! Let me live vicariously!!!

 

Stepdaughter has a junior tournament on Sun, hoping to get out ahead of the herd of juniors. They play like molasses. I can't wait to hit them. It's like looking forward to a date with a beautiful girl (like I would remember what that is like).

 

Aren't you dating Mrs. Thug?............I keed, I keed.

[mdgboxx]

Wow Sixty, first of all I'm glad your OK!!! Hopefully you and you Doc will be able to get it somewhat under control and you can drive again. Golf will always be there waiting for you, again I'm just glad your OK! :)

 

Yeah me too.. Complex partial seizures of course do nothing to you personally, but of course you can hurt yourself by what you do, or worse you could hurt someone else, and I don't ever want to do that.

I went through this a couple of years ago when I had several of these in a row, and had to quit driving. I did a lot of (funny) stupid things. My wife and I were watching a movie and I got up and took off my clothes for no reason. I told the people at work so they would be aware. I told my wife maybe we should just join a nudist colony, then the worst thing would be I would jump up and put on clothes... she didn't go for it :( hahaha

 

LOL, I'll have to use that as an excuse next time I "lose" my pants "accidentally" :) Of course not trying to take your condition lightly! I used to have problems with sleep walking and peeing in weird places growing up. My favorite "target" was the kitchen trash can, it was on of those step on to open ones and I would sleep walk to the kitchen and ......you get the idea!

 

You've gotten it under control before, I'm sure you'll be able to again!! :D

 

Thanks, me too.. Hopefully he will just up one of the meds I'm taking now- maybe that will slow down my swing even more? So I just got texts from friends in my golf league after telling some of them my comical fire truck story etc etc .... I have been assured that I don't have to worry about getting a ride to the golf course, yay

 

That's the reply I was hoping to read.

[mdgboxx]

@Matt J

 

Food for Confessions thought....

 

What do ye think of the old adage that a heavy putter is good for fast greens and vice versa. I've been playing with this 50 gram counterweight in my 350 gram Anser style putter and am starting to wonder if I don't want to throw the weight and tool in the bag. Seems like with the counterbalance is better for slower greens and without for fast which would fit the standard theory. Funny, I think when you're putting new greens it's easier to adjust to speed. We laughed at how bad we all putted yesterday because your brain is so trained on your home greens. No one could start a putt high enough or hit it slow enough to kill it at the hole. Every putt was at least two feet past and most about 5 or 6. Tough day.

=======================================================================================

I agreed with the old adage, hook/line/sinker, for one: It made sense to me. Seriously narrated by high-standing, legit WRX Experts on the matter.

 

Second: I was repeated daily, on my Home Course, by the Pro who saw me putting with my (now) lighter Ping Pal 2. (340 gr) It came with a stock Pingman Pistol grip. I later had it cut to 33" from 34", and added the Lamkin Jumbo grip.

 

That was until I bought my current Ping Craz-E, iWi Series. (370 gr) I also bought the optional "weight kit".

 

I was amazed by the side by side comparison btw "it" and a Titleist California Del Mar. But I hated the effeminate Winn grip on the Ping. So, I had it replaced by a Lamkin Jumbo, pistol grip, before I left the store.

 

It never dawned on me that there would be such a difference in club head feel with a larger/heavier grip. I couldn't feel the head anymore, I was nervous (yips) every time I used it. I tinkered with the OPT weights until I felt comfortable with it again....Like I was at the store. (Before the grip change)

 

End results: I replaced the stock 2 X 12 gr by 2 X 20 gr weights. It now sits at 386 gr (head weight only)

 

I've read about all the hype of larger grips (Super Stroke) and I really like my Lamkin Jumbo.

 

Back to real life experiences: (And many unanswered questions....The juices are really flowing NOW) LMAO

 

What if,

I have a fast green uphill lie?

..........Slow green downhill lie?

...........Fast green downhill lie?

See where I'm going with this? Is 9, on the Stimp meter, considered fast, or slow, or medium?

 

Do I now, NEED to carry two or more Putters?

 

It sorta throws a wrench in my belief in the "old adage", and I am now more inclined to believe the *Older Adage*:

 

It's NOT the arrow, it's definitely the INDIAN! :rofl:

[BIG STU]

Well, here's my sad, funny story for the day...

 

l live only about 8 minutes from work, so I drive to work, and having epilepsy for 35 years now, I've never had a problem driving in all that time.

I was one minute from home, and decided to pull in to the drive through and then go straight home. So I put my car in park, paid for my purchase, and the next thing I know the 2 cars behind me are being told to back out. The lady who waited on me says "can you wait just a minute?" Just then, 4 firemen/EMT's come walking in, in front of me, and one walks up to me and says "Hi, how are you feeling?" so I said "Fine, how are you?" so he says "Can you just step out of the car, we'd like to just check you out?" so I did, and they took my car out and parked it. So all of a sudden I think 'O crap, I must have had a complex partial seizure' (you have no clue when you have them) They took me in the check out area, asked me to tell them my name, address, wanted to transport me to the hospital. So I had to explain to them (I was just fine by then, they only last like from 30 seconds up to 5 minutes) and I had to sign a thing saying I didn't want to go. Then I said well, I need to drive on home, it's time to take my afternoon meds again. So they said 'We don't think you should do that". After calling their chief, they decided they would drive me home. Well the back of the drive through shares a parking lot with the fire station, so we pulled over there. The rest of the guys decided to follow us so the guy driving me could get back. So we had a great conversation on the way to my house. I looked in my side mirror and realized we were being followed by a big fire truck..hahaha. So I thought 'oh crap, my neighbors will really really wonder what the?' (we all watch out for each other) So we pulled in the driveway, the one guy got out, shook my hand and smiled, the fire truck pulled out, neighbors mowing and stuff, looking out their curtains, the guys in the fire truck waving bye bye like we were long lost friends.. I smiled and disappeared into the house as if it were just another day :)

Now the sad part, (well at least temporarily) I texted my neurologist, and he said "ok, you're done driving until we can get this med. thing figured out.. " (usually takes several months) Well, since my wife and I are on different schedules at different times, it looks like I will probably have to quit the golf league, not having the freedom to drive to the course and back when I want to... :(

Damn!!! Glad you are ok. Hopefully your Doc can change your meds or something. The amazing thing is that somehow you see humor in all of this with your nudist colony statement. Maybe you can get one of the guys in your golf league to drive you to the league play

[BIG STU]

Mini rant here, pardon me.

 

 

So, I've been stuck at home starting on my 3rd year now. My fault I know, let me just say I've 10000000% grown up and changed. Anyway, I have a lot of time to kill each day so I'm on this site basically all day, every day. I read and read and read. I've come to the realization that to be a touring professional you (according to WRX) have to be at least a +6 cap, have played and won at every level of golf available, be a stand out in your state ( somewhat true), be able to get up and down from anywhere (somewhat true) and lastly be some kind of freak athlete (no so sure about that). Anyway, there will always be threads started by newer members that have a dream of playing on TOUR. I'm always astounded by the number of people who say there was a particular moment or tournament where they realized they had no chance ever.

 

Ok, I understand having life issues get in the way. But to just throw in the towel? I'm realizing I'm either an idiot for chasing the dream or delusional or both maybe, I honestly don't care. I always think I can improve. I just can't really understand quitting. I'm just thinking out loud here, trust me I know this path is a tough one, and the odds are GREATLY stacked against me, but until I've exhausted every opportunity, given it 100% focus, and left no stone unturned I can't walk away. My personal dream is the pursuit, the grind, to some that would be the "sucky" part, but I tell you what it can't be worse than waiting to find out if your going to prison or not, right?

 

Sorry for rambling, it's just that I have so much time to think. I work on my swing everyday, I work on my fitness everyday, I stretch everyday, I visualize playing great golf and winning tournaments everyday. Sometimes I read negative or "real" talk in the forums that make me question everything I'm doing, then I remember everyone is different. Perhaps if I had grown up in a golfing family and been encouraged things could be different, or maybe I would've hated golf I don't know. I'll never quit until I've given it my absolute all, and even then I might not quit lol.

 

If only I could just talk, I left out quite a bit because I suck at typing and conveying my thoughts through the keyboard. If you made it this far thanks for listening :)

NEVER EVER GIVE UP on what you want to do. I have been lucky in life I did what I wanted to. When I was younger I played some Pro Golf and then raced cars some drove and owned trucks rode Harleys and then played Pro Golf some more. Now to be honest I am half broke living in a older mobile home but could give a rats arse less I had fun and I am still having fun driving a truck playing golf and doing my church work. If I had a chance to do it over would I change anything hell no!! maybe a little more discipline and less party when I started playing the minis and had some real game but that would be it. Hang on to your dreams do not let anyone persuade you different. From the time I have known you -- you have come a long way-- Now I do not care about playing comp any more I am having too much fun playing with my buddies and doing exactly what I want to. I am being lazy today do not feel obligated to practice even though I did practice putt from 07:00 until 09:00 this morning. just resting some today just took a nap and got up. Besides it is Harley week here and it is difficult to get around here on the roads. May go out and piddle in the shop some may sit on my dead arse and do nothing

[BIG STU]

Thanks MC, it really is a blessing to have found you all, serious! And thank you for the encouragement and offering an ear if I need to purge some thoughts haha!

 

I think the juice is worth the squeeze. No bank of Mom so I won't be putting people in debt. At the end of the day it's my choice, so Tour or bust Brah!!! LOL :D Once this house confinement is over, 2 years of hard hard work, and I'll be ready for the Asian Tour. I have a very elaborate set of plans, very detailed plans. I just need to execute them.

 

Head dislodged from butt, thanks again for listening!

If you need a mental / short game coach look me up I will be glad to help sorry I am not a total swing guru.

[BIG STU]

@Matt J

 

Food for Confessions thought....

 

What do ye think of the old adage that a heavy putter is good for fast greens and vice versa. I've been playing with this 50 gram counterweight in my 350 gram Anser style putter and am starting to wonder if I don't want to throw the weight and tool in the bag. Seems like with the counterbalance is better for slower greens and without for fast which would fit the standard theory. Funny, I think when you're putting new greens it's easier to adjust to speed. We laughed at how bad we all putted yesterday because your brain is so trained on your home greens. No one could start a putt high enough or hit it slow enough to kill it at the hole. Every putt was at least two feet past and most about 5 or 6. Tough day.

=======================================================================================

I agreed with the old adage, hook/line/sinker, for one: It made sense to me. Seriously narrated by high-standing, legit WRX Experts on the matter.

 

Second: I was repeated daily, on my Home Course, by the Pro who saw me putting with my (now) lighter Ping Pal 2. (340 gr) It came with a stock Pingman Pistol grip. I later had it cut to 33" from 34", and added the Lamkin Jumbo grip.

 

That was until I bought my current Ping Craz-E, iWi Series. (370 gr) I also bought the optional "weight kit".

 

I was amazed by the side by side comparison btw "it" and a Titleist California Del Mar. But I hated the effeminate grip on the Ping. So, I had it replaced by a Lamkin Jumbo, pistol grip, before I left the store.

 

It never dawned on me that there would be such a difference in club head feel with a larger/heavier grip. I couldn't feel the head anymore, I was nervous (yips) every time I used it. I tinkered with the OPT weights until I felt comfortable with it again....Like I was at the store. (Before the grip change)

 

End results: I replaced the stock 2 X 12 gr by 2 X 20 gr weights. It now sits at 386 gr (head weight only)

 

I've read about all the hype of larger grips (Super Stroke) and I really like my Lamkin Jumbo.

 

Back to real life experiences: (And many unanswered questions....The juices are really flowing NOW) LMAO

 

What if,

I have a fast green uphill lie?

..........Slow green downhill lie?

...........Fast green downhill lie?

See where I'm going with this? Is 9, on the Stimp meter, considered fast, or slow, or medium?

 

Do I now, NEED to carry two or more Putters?

 

It sorta throws a wrench in my belief in the "old adage", and I am now more inclined to believe the *Older Adage*:

 

It's NOT the arrow, it's definitely the INDIAN! :rofl:

Ok on the grip thing you have to get what feels good in YOUR hands no matter the brand,style or size. Good putting starts with good confortable hands period. Now on the feel you have to absolutely get a putter balanced again for YOU.

 

Now this morning early I worked on my putting. I have not been putting bad but just could not for the last two weeks get anything to fall. This messes with me bad since I consider myself to be a good putter. I went out and took my Cameron Santa Fe ( old Rusty) and my old 8802 style Cleveland. Using the Cleveland that I have had for 25 years or so you have to be dead nuts on it. It has a sweet spot the size of a dime. If I can roll it good with that I can roll anything. I did all of my basic checks including eye alignment etc. Putted ok with the 8802. Switched to the Scotty and noticed it felt like a sledge hammer in my hand. Huuh? Went back to my shop around the corner and I do not usually do this but put it on the swing weight machine and by God it was heavy heavy. Pulled some of the lead tape off actually 15 grams to be exact and went back out to the course. Yep it felt good. I also discovered that with the excess weight I was doing a longer follow through stroke than I normally do and it was causing me to put a funny roll on it especially from 5 foot in. I use balls with a line on them to practice with so I can see the roll and what the ball is doing. Someone asked me why I did not putt with the 8802 normally and I told the truth I do not have the confidence with it in the long run and prefer an Anser style putter. It is a great tune up tool along with an old Bulls Eye I have. You just have to work on stuff. I had also noticed that for some strange reason I had dropped my left thumb from the top of the grip (the flat part) to the right side of the grip. For me it makes a big difference in face alignment especially on short putts. BTW I use stock type grips mostly standard sized Royal Cords except on this Scotty for some reason a standard Lamkin 3 GEN does well on that putter for me. In retrospect I think I had the excess lead tape on that Scotty because when I originally when I set it up and balanced it I had a Royal Cord on it which incidently weighs 15 grams more than the Lamkin. For some reason I liked that Lamkin on that Putter. Like I always say you have to find the niche that works for you and yes absolutely different grips react differently on different brand and style of putters. Go with what works for you no matter if it seems strange to others. Most of the old fart retirees around the course think I have a screw loose on my equipment and game therories but the cheap SOBs will not play me for any green stuff

[BIG STU]

Hammer, the Diamana is better for me at the moment because I can go after it and it's straight. I use the whiteboard in my FW's and hybrids. I may use the TiNi on shorter courses because the flight is better on slower more shaped shots, but I can always use 3W for those. The Tini might get tipped for the 3W. Still have the PL Red coming too.

For me the Diamana is straight and long with out me pushing the issue but then again I am only using the 60 gram in regular flex but it is a dynamite combo for me with the 915 head and it is not too bad in the Nike Vapor Pro either.

[Palauan Hammer]

Mini rant here, pardon me.

 

 

So, I've been stuck at home starting on my 3rd year now. My fault I know, let me just say I've 10000000% grown up and changed. Anyway, I have a lot of time to kill each day so I'm on this site basically all day, every day. I read and read and read. I've come to the realization that to be a touring professional you (according to WRX) have to be at least a +6 cap, have played and won at every level of golf available, be a stand out in your state ( somewhat true), be able to get up and down from anywhere (somewhat true) and lastly be some kind of freak athlete (no so sure about that). Anyway, there will always be threads started by newer members that have a dream of playing on TOUR. I'm always astounded by the number of people who say there was a particular moment or tournament where they realized they had no chance ever.

 

Ok, I understand having life issues get in the way. But to just throw in the towel? I'm realizing I'm either an idiot for chasing the dream or delusional or both maybe, I honestly don't care. I always think I can improve. I just can't really understand quitting. I'm just thinking out loud here, trust me I know this path is a tough one, and the odds are GREATLY stacked against me, but until I've exhausted every opportunity, given it 100% focus, and left no stone unturned I can't walk away. My personal dream is the pursuit, the grind, to some that would be the "sucky" part, but I tell you what it can't be worse than waiting to find out if your going to prison or not, right?

 

Sorry for rambling, it's just that I have so much time to think. I work on my swing everyday, I work on my fitness everyday, I stretch everyday, I visualize playing great golf and winning tournaments everyday. Sometimes I read negative or "real" talk in the forums that make me question everything I'm doing, then I remember everyone is different. Perhaps if I had grown up in a golfing family and been encouraged things could be different, or maybe I would've hated golf I don't know. I'll never quit until I've given it my absolute all, and even then I might not quit lol.

 

If only I could just talk, I left out quite a bit because I suck at typing and conveying my thoughts through the keyboard. If you made it this far thanks for listening :)

NEVER EVER GIVE UP on what you want to do. I have been lucky in life I did what I wanted to. When I was younger I played some Pro Golf and then raced cars some drove and owned trucks rode Harleys and then played Pro Golf some more. Now to be honest I am half broke living in a older mobile home but could give a rats arse less I had fun and I am still having fun driving a truck playing golf and doing my church work. If I had a chance to do it over would I change anything hell no!! maybe a little more discipline and less party when I started playing the minis and had some real game but that would be it. Hang on to your dreams do not let anyone persuade you different. From the time I have known you -- you have come a long way-- Now I do not care about playing comp any more I am having too much fun playing with my buddies and doing exactly what I want to. I am being lazy today do not feel obligated to practice even though I did practice putt from 07:00 until 09:00 this morning. just resting some today just took a nap and got up. Besides it is Harley week here and it is difficult to get around here on the roads. May go out and piddle in the shop some may sit on my dead arse and do nothing

 

Thanks STU, we're not so different it seems. I don't want to play professionally to get rich. I like to compete, and when I got my first taste of traveling for competition I was hooked. Nothing like experiencing different cultures, food, and new golf courses. Not to mention it's pretty cool that your job, basically, is to play good golf. I was a fool for not working harder at it, but when given a second chance I won't let it out of my grasp! Hearing you say "Dont give up" means a lot because you've been there and of course I have respect for your input (as with the rest of the confessioners as well!). I'd rather do what I'm passionate about then give up and get a desk job. No offense to desk job people, but since I can chase the dream, I will!

 

Also, I will be reaching out to you about the short game for sure! That will be my main focus anyway, short game!

[Palauan Hammer]

Ninja, EXCELLENT post, and I have to say great questions by Sixty too! I learned a ton in that post, I'm gonna have to read that one a few times. Also that kinematic sequence graph is very interesting. Thanks again for taking the time to drop knowledge Brochacho!! :)

 

...

 

Thanks too Broshambro. It is all part of 'DeNinny's Universal Swing Theory' or DUST model for short. I tortured Conrad, PD, and Reason with it for weeks when I was suspended. I have always done a lot of swing mirror work when practicing at home and eventually it led to being able to deconstruct the swing into those basic movements and actually perform them individually in front of the mirror. I realized that the sum of the individual actions that literally move the clubhead, by its own individually isolated motion, is what generates the clubhead velocity. The more the action moves the clubhead, in theory, the more it can contribute to the total clubhead velocity.

 

This is why guys can get on their knees and still hammer the ball with driver. The shoulder turn and trail arm bending are still moving the clubhead over a long distance. This is enough to get Vc up pretty high.

 

Be careful about what you read. You may get some DUST in your eye.

 

DUST! I like it! The past few years I've learned a bunch from you and the Judge about swings, and golf physics. The one thing I always did, and still adhere by is to let the club flow back and through. Perhaps, for me, thinking of the clubs motion overall helped to unconsciously get my body moving the right way? I have no idea, I'm just lucky to have stumbled onto a golf swing that ticked a few boxes in the DUST method. The cool thing is the more I learn, I become aware. I'm more aware of my swing than ever, I'm confident now that the next time I get a little lost on the range or course I'll be able to draw upon what I've learned from you and the Judge in regards to the swing.

 

Also, not to worry Brodistava I won't quit. Sometimes I get in my head a little too much, but I've invested WAY too much time to walk away, or stop now. Philippine Tour here we come!

 

 

 

Also, I'd like to thank (again) EVERY ONE OF YOU for the support and holding me up when I'm weak. I try to stay as strong as possible, I also try to not be whiney LOL.

[BIG STU]

Nothing in life has ever been about money for me. Like now with my clean driving record and experience I could run regional for a large trucking company and make more money but I like who I work for and what I am doing. I am home every night and off on weekends. In some folks eyes I was an under achiever but I always did it my way. For me it has always been about doing what I wanted to do and having fun doing it and my wife bless her of 30 years is the same way. Most guys my age are slowing down but I am still WFO and hope to go out that way. My body had been battered and slowed down some but I still push on and my mind still works like I am 20 years old. I have had to tone it down on the course some and think older as in I can no longer carry a shot 230 or so over water so I reluctently lay up and wedge it to the hole. Since I am eating properly, have my BP under control with meds and diet and have lost 40 lbs total since last year I feel better and have plenty of energy. I am at 310 now and I am working on getting back to my racing weight which was around 260 or so. That may still seem fat to some but I am a big framed guy. My doc told me to progress slowly that I was doing good and he knows my tendency to take thing to the extreme. The main thing I can coach you on here is some advice--- Do your own swing thing you seem to me from your posts to have a great knowledge of your swing and game as you have developed it stick with it that way. Do not let anyone sway you from how you have developed it. Remember there is no sure fire correct etched in stone tablet way to swing and play this game. Good example look at the Champion's Tour you can see many different swings and methods that have endured and played great golf for years and are still doing that. And never mess with old fat crew cut tobacco chewing old farts carrying rusty Macgregor irons and a rusty beat to hell Scotty putter and rusty Cleveland wedges especially if he insists on playing the Gold (senior) tees---- Oh crap that describes me I gave my secrets away

[Palauan Hammer]

Yeah, chasing money or fame with golf are absolutely the wrong reasons, for me, to chase the dream. I will admit, for a while, before getting into trouble and while I was still drinking, I would put way too much pressure on myself everyday. Like I had to do it so I could give everyone in my family a better life. Too much pressure, I'll do it because I love to.

 

Great job on your weight loss, and keep it going. Your Doc is correct, slow and steady. I'm the same way, when I do something I have a tendency to go ALL OUT, then I get burnt out. Another 50 lbs can be done easily, you have the formula and discipline already, you'll get there! Personally, as I sit here, I've never been in better shape, ever. Swinging the golf club is a breeze now, I have balance for days. So I can imagine that swinging the club is much more fun now that your in better shape. I tried to swing everyday while changing my body so my swing would evolve with my body. The last time I lost weight I made the mistake of neglecting golf, I barely played or practiced, as a result my swing was all out of whack when I came back.

 

As for my swing, my move is so ingrained that no matter what I do it still is always somewhat still "my swing". I have made a few tweaks with the help of Reasy, but he was great at making sure I didn't compromise the things I do well. Also, my on and only "belly to belly" coach here on island came to see me and said my swing looks great, agreed with the little tweaks and then said his usual to me," NOW STOP THINKING ABOUT IT" LOL. All he ever harps on with me is staying tension free, and mentally strong. He talks about killer instinct, and being able to finish rounds strong. He'll help me once I'm back to practicing, he's a hell of a player and should have played pro but he had 5 kids instead. You remind me a lot of him, when I'd ask a technical question he'd always just look at me funny, and say,"Ahhh don't worry about that non-sense, just swing the damn club" Haha. Being that I never saw my swing on camera until 2014 was a good thing, he knew that I would over analyze it. I've used this time I have here at home to learn the "ins and outs" of the swing, how it relates to my swing, and study how others approach their swings and game overall. When I get back out, it's all about grooving everything, getting my rhythm back, short game, short game, short game, short game, and LOTS of golf. I figure I should par everything, and birdie the par 5's. That will be my goal for every round. OK I'm rambling now LOL

[thug the bunny]

Thug, that makes perfect sense....all 4 times. :D I keed.

 

I've been watching Matsuyama.. (spelling)...and how he stops. Ive also been doing freezers where you stop at the top then go. It seems to make me much more aware of where the club is. I haven't put it on video yet but the strikes are solid. The litmus test is always ball flight for me. I can't just do a move correctly and hit it bad because it seems I'm emotionally attached to the result. I call it positive reinforcement but have come to understand I could be a mental midget with zero patience. Lmao!

 

Man, WRX was working (nice alliteration, huh) really slow last night. Hit post, nothing happens...I guess I hit it 4x.

 

I got that idea of starting the swing at the top from watching a buddy of mine. He takes a couple of half practice swings, steps in and pulls it back immediately. Then at the top he pauses, and I could tell that is where he engages. It's like he just goes to a top position, not really caring how he got there, and then begins his swing. He could go to the top and then step into the ball and hit it the same. And he is a good ball striker, about a 5. So, I decided to try that, and it has been working. Because it is such a mental thing, it is sometimes hard to execute, but when I do it, it removes all that obsession over the backswing.

[thug the bunny]

So, yesterday's arrival of the new babies totally drove it from my mind, but something happened at the end of yesterday's round that sealed a triple crown day. Me and mrs thug are coming down 18 finishing up a really nice round, she hits a good 4w 2nd shot on the par 5, middle of the fairway. We start driving up, and she goes, 'look there's a hawk, it's got something'. There in the fairway is a juvie red tail in the classic stance when they got prey, wings spread, looking down at their prey. Then, it starts hopping as if it is going to fly. But then it would come back down. And then, that's when we saw - it was playing with mrs thugs ball. It would pick it up a couple feet into the air and drop it and pounce on it. Over and over. We were besides ourselves, especially being birders. What a special moment. PD, this should tickle your fancy given our past association with critters..

 

I started this vid too late, and the quality sucks, but just to give you an idea..

 

Shoot, the vid is too large to upload. It was all shaky and blurry anyway..

[mdgboxx]

@Matt J

 

Food for Confessions thought....

 

What do ye think of the old adage that a heavy putter is good for fast greens and vice versa. I've been playing with this 50 gram counterweight in my 350 gram Anser style putter and am starting to wonder if I don't want to throw the weight and tool in the bag. Seems like with the counterbalance is better for slower greens and without for fast which would fit the standard theory. Funny, I think when you're putting new greens it's easier to adjust to speed. We laughed at how bad we all putted yesterday because your brain is so trained on your home greens. No one could start a putt high enough or hit it slow enough to kill it at the hole. Every putt was at least two feet past and most about 5 or 6. Tough day.

=======================================================================================

I agreed with the old adage, hook/line/sinker, for one: It made sense to me. Seriously narrated by high-standing, legit WRX Experts on the matter.

 

Second: I was repeated daily, on my Home Course, by the Pro who saw me putting with my (now) lighter Ping Pal 2. (340 gr) It came with a stock Pingman Pistol grip. I later had it cut to 33" from 34", and added the Lamkin Jumbo grip.

 

That was until I bought my current Ping Craz-E, iWi Series. (370 gr) I also bought the optional "weight kit".

 

I was amazed by the side by side comparison btw "it" and a Titleist California Del Mar. But I hated the effeminate grip on the Ping. So, I had it replaced by a Lamkin Jumbo, pistol grip, before I left the store.

 

It never dawned on me that there would be such a difference in club head feel with a larger/heavier grip. I couldn't feel the head anymore, I was nervous (yips) every time I used it. I tinkered with the OPT weights until I felt comfortable with it again....Like I was at the store. (Before the grip change)

 

End results: I replaced the stock 2 X 12 gr by 2 X 20 gr weights. It now sits at 386 gr (head weight only)

 

I've read about all the hype of larger grips (Super Stroke) and I really like my Lamkin Jumbo.

 

Back to real life experiences: (And many unanswered questions....The juices are really flowing NOW) LMAO

 

What if,

I have a fast green uphill lie?

..........Slow green downhill lie?

...........Fast green downhill lie?

See where I'm going with this? Is 9, on the Stimp meter, considered fast, or slow, or medium?

 

Do I now, NEED to carry two or more Putters?

 

It sorta throws a wrench in my belief in the "old adage", and I am now more inclined to believe the *Older Adage*:

 

It's NOT the arrow, it's definitely the INDIAN! :rofl:

Ok on the grip thing you have to get what feels good in YOUR hands no matter the brand,style or size. Good putting starts with good confortable hands period. Now on the feel you have to absolutely get a putter balanced again for YOU.

 

Now this morning early I worked on my putting. I have not been putting bad but just could not for the last two weeks get anything to fall. This messes with me bad since I consider myself to be a good putter. I went out and took my Cameron Santa Fe ( old Rusty) and my old 8802 style Cleveland. Using the Cleveland that I have had for 25 years or so you have to be dead nuts on it. It has a sweet spot the size of a dime. If I can roll it good with that I can roll anything. I did all of my basic checks including eye alignment etc. Putted ok with the 8802. Switched to the Scotty and noticed it felt like a sledge hammer in my hand. Huuh? Went back to my shop around the corner and I do not usually do this but put it on the swing weight machine and by God it was heavy heavy. Pulled some of the lead tape off actually 15 grams to be exact and went back out to the course. Yep it felt good. I also discovered that with the excess weight I was doing a longer follow through stroke than I normally do and it was causing me to put a funny roll on it especially from 5 foot in. I use balls with a line on them to practice with so I can see the roll and what the ball is doing. Someone asked me why I did not putt with the 8802 normally and I told the truth I do not have the confidence with it in the long run and prefer an Anser style putter. It is a great tune up tool along with an old Bulls Eye I have. You just have to work on stuff. I had also noticed that for some strange reason I had dropped my left thumb from the top of the grip (the flat part) to the right side of the grip. For me it makes a big difference in face alignment especially on short putts. BTW I use stock type grips mostly standard sized Royal Cords except on this Scotty for some reason a standard Lamkin 3 GEN does well on that putter for me. In retrospect I think I had the excess lead tape on that Scotty because when I originally when I set it up and balanced it I had a Royal Cord on it which incidently weighs 15 grams more than the Lamkin. For some reason I liked that Lamkin on that Putter. Like I always say you have to find the niche that works for you and yes absolutely different grips react differently on different brand and style of putters. Go with what works for you no matter if it seems strange to others. Most of the old fart retirees around the course think I have a screw loose on my equipment and game therories but the cheap SOBs will not play me for any green stuff

 

When you mentioned lead tape, it reminded me. Before I had the Winn removed I asked for it's SW. It read F7, I didn't think anything of it at the time, but with the Lamkin the SW read somewhere in the D6 level. After the 2 X 20 gr change, it's back up to F6. Although the putter is heavier, it's just as comfortable as it was before the initial change. Whether it's in my basement, at the Putt-Putt or on the green, it's like saying "Hi" to an old friend every time I pick it up. Needless to say, I'm not looking for a new friend, at this point in time.

[DeNinny]

So, yesterday's arrival of the new babies totally drove it from my mind, but something happened at the end of yesterday's round that sealed a triple crown day. Me and mrs thug are coming down 18 finishing up a really nice round, she hits a good 4w 2nd shot on the par 5, middle of the fairway. We start driving up, and she goes, 'look there's a hawk, it's got something'. There in the fairway is a juvie red tail in the classic stance when they got prey, wings spread, looking down at their prey. Then, it starts hopping as if it is going to fly. But then it would come back down. And then, that's when we saw - it was playing with mrs thugs ball. It would pick it up a couple feet into the air and drop it and pounce on it. Over and over. We were besides ourselves, especially being birders. What a special moment. PD, this should tickle your fancy given our past association with critters..

 

I started this vid too late, and the quality sucks, but just to give you an idea..

 

Shoot, the vid is too large to upload. It was all shaky and blurry anyway..

 

LOL cool beans, thug. I think the USGA(<=B) rules of golf book calls that ball moved by an 'outside agent' or something like that. I think you have to play it as it lies. It must have thought the ball was a nice and perfect egg or something to snack on.

 

The local bald eagle that lives near my course was out today. It flew right over us a few times. Such a beautiful creature.

 

I always like to think seeing a bird of prey on the course is a good omen for a good round. LOL On that note, I'm only right about 50% of the time. Shot 89 today. 20 mph winds will be my excuse. Or I was so distracted by that darn eagle!

[thug the bunny]

So, yesterday's arrival of the new babies totally drove it from my mind, but something happened at the end of yesterday's round that sealed a triple crown day. Me and mrs thug are coming down 18 finishing up a really nice round, she hits a good 4w 2nd shot on the par 5, middle of the fairway. We start driving up, and she goes, 'look there's a hawk, it's got something'. There in the fairway is a juvie red tail in the classic stance when they got prey, wings spread, looking down at their prey. Then, it starts hopping as if it is going to fly. But then it would come back down. And then, that's when we saw - it was playing with mrs thugs ball. It would pick it up a couple feet into the air and drop it and pounce on it. Over and over. We were besides ourselves, especially being birders. What a special moment. PD, this should tickle your fancy given our past association with critters..

 

I started this vid too late, and the quality sucks, but just to give you an idea..

 

Shoot, the vid is too large to upload. It was all shaky and blurry anyway..

 

LOL cool beans, thug. I think the USGA(<=B) rules of golf book calls that ball moved by an 'outside agent' or something like that. I think you have to play it as it lies. It must have thought the ball was a nice and perfect egg or something to snack on.

 

The local bald eagle that lives near my course was out today. It flew right over us a few times. Such a beautiful creature.

 

I always like to think seeing a bird of prey on the course is a good omen for a good round. LOL On that note, I'm only right about 50% of the time. Shot 89 today. 20 mph winds will be my excuse. Or I was so distracted by that darn eagle!

 

Actually this young hawk had flown over our heads into a tree bordering #18 while we were teeing off 3 holes previous. We went ooh look a juvie red tail and moved on. We had no idea that he would wait there patiently to pounce on mrs thug's ball coming up 18. I think what triggered the hawk was her ball running across the ground after it landed. It was a juvenal, so at that age they are just relying on hardwired instinct. If you think about it, a ball running out is a good approximation of a mouse or squirrel running across the ground. But, what was weird is the way he kept playing with it. We were enraptured.

[mdgboxx]

So, yesterday's arrival of the new babies totally drove it from my mind, but something happened at the end of yesterday's round that sealed a triple crown day. Me and mrs thug are coming down 18 finishing up a really nice round, she hits a good 4w 2nd shot on the par 5, middle of the fairway. We start driving up, and she goes, 'look there's a hawk, it's got something'. There in the fairway is a juvie red tail in the classic stance when they got prey, wings spread, looking down at their prey. Then, it starts hopping as if it is going to fly. But then it would come back down. And then, that's when we saw - it was playing with mrs thugs ball. It would pick it up a couple feet into the air and drop it and pounce on it. Over and over. We were besides ourselves, especially being birders. What a special moment. PD, this should tickle your fancy given our past association with critters..

 

I started this vid too late, and the quality sucks, but just to give you an idea..

 

Shoot, the vid is too large to upload. It was all shaky and blurry anyway..

 

LOL cool beans, thug. I think the USGA(<=B) rules of golf book calls that ball moved by an 'outside agent' or something like that. I think you have to play it as it lies. It must have thought the ball was a nice and perfect egg or something to snack on.

 

The local bald eagle that lives near my course was out today. It flew right over us a few times. Such a beautiful creature.

 

I always like to think seeing a bird of prey on the course is a good omen for a good round. LOL On that note, I'm only right about 50% of the time. Shot 89 today. 20 mph winds will be my excuse. Or I was so distracted by that darn eagle!

 

You're right, it's an Outside Agency. Under Rule 18-1, a ball moved by an outside agency must be replaced, without penalty.

[DeNinny]

Ninja, EXCELLENT post, and I have to say great questions by Sixty too! I learned a ton in that post, I'm gonna have to read that one a few times. Also that kinematic sequence graph is very interesting. Thanks again for taking the time to drop knowledge Brochacho!! :)

 

...

 

Thanks too Broshambro. It is all part of 'DeNinny's Universal Swing Theory' or DUST model for short. I tortured Conrad, PD, and Reason with it for weeks when I was suspended. I have always done a lot of swing mirror work when practicing at home and eventually it led to being able to deconstruct the swing into those basic movements and actually perform them individually in front of the mirror. I realized that the sum of the individual actions that literally move the clubhead, by its own individually isolated motion, is what generates the clubhead velocity. The more the action moves the clubhead, in theory, the more it can contribute to the total clubhead velocity.

 

This is why guys can get on their knees and still hammer the ball with driver. The shoulder turn and trail arm bending are still moving the clubhead over a long distance. This is enough to get Vc up pretty high.

 

Be careful about what you read. You may get some DUST in your eye.

 

DUST! I like it! The past few years I've learned a bunch from you and the Judge about swings, and golf physics. The one thing I always did, and still adhere by is to let the club flow back and through. Perhaps, for me, thinking of the clubs motion overall helped to unconsciously get my body moving the right way? I have no idea, I'm just lucky to have stumbled onto a golf swing that ticked a few boxes in the DUST method. The cool thing is the more I learn, I become aware. I'm more aware of my swing than ever, I'm confident now that the next time I get a little lost on the range or course I'll be able to draw upon what I've learned from you and the Judge in regards to the swing.

 

Also, not to worry Brodistava I won't quit. Sometimes I get in my head a little too much, but I've invested WAY too much time to walk away, or stop now. Philippine Tour here we come!

...

 

I hear you loud and clear about having the correct understanding of the physics and swing mechanics in your head. You don't have to think about it at all when you play, but it is just good to have that "program" of it stored in your brain. My theory is that your smart subconscious mind can use and access it at ANY time and it will help you execute things properly. At the very least it cannot ever hurt you (unless maybe you are drunk on the Kool-Aid of HALF-TRUTH golf marketing "physics"). And by contrast, I think it is NOT good to have the wrong version of the physics in your head because it will only confuse your subconscious. Or at least there is the potential for all of this. Also it is better to have zero understanding of the physics than to have the wrong understanding of it. Additionally it can really help when you need to troubleshoot an issue in your swing. So once you start going down the technical road, you actually should not ever stop continuing to refine your understanding so that it is all a clear picture in your head to the best of your knowledge.

 

For my game personally, I cannot decouple feel from mechanics anymore. They are one and the same now. Everything I physically feel in the swing is tied to a specific action and they are forever inseparable in my head. Also I don't think there really is a "feel" player because I believe all golfers play by feel. Who doesn't call themselves a "feel" player anyway? Also saying you are just a feel player is a cop out because at some level you are computing the mechanics of the swing. Feel is just a way of interpreting the mechanics without actually needing to know them in detail. But at some level there is always a tie to feel and what you mechanically are doing in the swing.

 

BTW, the DUST model all started after I became comfortable in my technical understanding of impact, ball spin, ball flights, and clubhead design. I realized that instead of learning the swing from the beginning through setup, the fundamentals, the takeaway, etc, I could instead "derive" the universal swing backwards from impact. I already had the goal of impact (maximize Vc and minimize Ec with a square face and square path), so why not continue to work the physics backwards to the top of the downswing? It just seemed like the natural progression on my quest for golf knowledge anyway. Plus, this is how a lot of actual physics and chemistry problems are solved. So I developed those two "grand swing equations", Vc and Ec, and simply tried to find the proper mechanics, from a physics perspective, on how to "solve" them by working backwards. In the process I used known good mechanics and also I just studied good swings and started seeing universal things in all swings that match up to the ideal physics of maximizing Vc while minimizing Ec. And the final product of all of this is the DUST swing model. And also BTW I have to mention that I could not have done any of it without the help from all confessors talking about their swings and also from some offline PMs with friends.

 

And for you, Lorena Brochoa, I'm telling you that your swing is just about the PERFECT example of the DUST swing model. So I am VERY glad that you mentioned that you were aligned to parts of it. I haven't elaborated on the other parts of it yet, but I'm telling you that your swing plane on the downswing is pretty much exactly what it should be.

 

The ideal swing plane is based on having the entire mass of the swing, comprised of the arms, hands, and club in a balanced orbit around the point directly between the shoulder sockets, the center of the swing. The laws of physics dictate that that entire swing mass naturally rotate around the center on a flat plane. The basic theory behind this is no different than planetary orbits around the sun or a hammer thrower spinning the hammer about his body. The planets and hammer swing about a center point in a perfectly flat plane. This same principle applies to that average or center of mass of the entire swing "weight" (again, that is comprised of the arms, hands, and club). The difference with the planets and hammer analogy is that the distribution of that weight is constantly changing in the downswing, so there is a sort of dynamic "center" or "average" position of that weight, where by looking DTL, half the total weight is above a plane in space and half of it is below it. I call this plane DUST swing plane. And to be clear, I'm NOT talking about the shaft plane, the arms plane, the clubhead plane, or the Hogan plane when I talk about the DUST plane. It is related to all those planes, but it is defined differently and ultimately is based on where the sort of average mass or center of mass of the arms, hands and club are at every point in the downswing. At the bottom of the swing and looking DTL, I would approximate that it touches the ground (and also passes through the point between the shoulder sockets) somewhere below the ball by no more than a few inches. It is almost at the ball but really just below it. Looking DTL, this puts half of the swing "weight" above the plane, which includes the entire clubhead and some of the shaft, and thus below that point are the arms, hands and remainder of the shaft. Then at the top of the swing, if you were to put that same "average" or center of mass diametrically opposed to the point where it touches the ground, you would set your hands pretty much right on it (and not coincidentally this is just about on the same Hogan plane of glass). Basically, the DUST plane is close but not quite the same as the clubhead plane and Hogan plane. BUT... it can't be exactly the clubhead plane because there is other mass going around the swing center besides it. The mass of the arms, hands, and shaft need to be taken into account. Also the centripetal force of the swing on all that mass needs to be taken into account. The mass further away from the center, namely the clubhead, will feel the pull of centripetal force more and more during the downswing, so it will feel heavier as the swing progresses, brining the DUST plane closer to it than the rest of the swing mass.

 

I hope all this is making sense and if not I will draw you a picture, but my main point is that you are already swinging on the ideal DUST plane. Also I know I went into a complicated explanation of it, but in reality the DUST plane should come naturally if you freely swing the club around your body with relaxed arms. The beauty of all of it is that that average swing mass will find that perfect orbit on its own, especially in the lower half of the downswing when centripetal force is high. It is almost self correcting too. If you fight this plane and try to establish that the mass swing around the center in more of a conical orbit, the mass will naturally move towards a flat orbit around the center. It actually takes more WORK to swing off the DUST plane than on it because you fight the natural path that the average or center of mass of the swing WANTS to take. And ultimately when you learn to swing on this plane, you use the least amount of energy to generate Vc and hopefully it is as high as possible. Also swinging on this plane minimizes Ec since it is natural to swing this way. Fighting it would increase Ec (clubhead error). And again, from what I remember about your swing and also just looking at it in your avatar pic, you are already swinging on the DUST plane. Looking at your avatar, if I were to draw a line from your hands and through the point directly between your shoulder sockets, it would pass either at the ball or just below it (by no more than those few inches I mentioned earlier). This is being preset to swing on the DUST plane perfectly!

 

BTW, I know that every swing on tour is NOT like this, but I have studied a lot of DTL pics and videos and MANY tour swings are like this. Hogan pretty much nailed it already with that plane of glass and why it is ideal to set your hands on it. And even those swings that deviate from this eventually establish a DUST plane before getting halfway down. You really can't fight it by that point, so to me it is best to start on it at the top and stay on it all the way to impact.

 

Anyhow, I hope all this makes sense. It really is just a complicated way of saying, yes, thinking "back and through" in your swing is good! LOL to me you just proved you are a natural at this game. You have a model swing and don't even know it!

[Palauan Hammer]

Ninja, I get it! I followed you through that whole post, and I do think a drawing would help solidify exactly what your saying. I think it's pretty amazing you've been able to decipher all of that in the past couple years. I don't remember you talking about the parts of the swing much when I first joined the group but I could be wrong. I also liked that you said the club will naturally want to find the DUST plane. I would imagine having a sound set up (posture, grip, alignment) helps to find this plane with minimal compensations. I think when I first picked up a club I was 9, I played baseball and was a visual learner with all sports. I watched golf on TV, found a club, and went outside. Maybe because the club was an adult length club, it was a Mac MB too, the weight forced me find the swing of least resistance.

 

Thanks for giving me the comfort of knowing that my swing is decent! You and Judge have helped me there big time. With all these talking heads on TV, and all the swing breakdowns it's easy to develop swing envy, then I start trying to make my swing "textbook". And being on WRX I'll end up in I and A and I swear swing threads can be like prescription medication commercials LOL, I'll be in there reading the OP's problem then I"m like," I think I do that", "hmm I'll have to give that a try" , rinse repeat.

 

I finding that balance of technique and flow, and like you said, having the correct knowledge can only help me.

 

Great stuff Brory McIlroy :)

[BIG STU]

Ninja, I get it! I followed you through that whole post, and I do think a drawing would help solidify exactly what your saying. I think it's pretty amazing you've been able to decipher all of that in the past couple years. I don't remember you talking about the parts of the swing much when I first joined the group but I could be wrong. I also liked that you said the club will naturally want to find the DUST plane. I would imagine having a sound set up (posture, grip, alignment) helps to find this plane with minimal compensations. I think when I first picked up a club I was 9, I played baseball and was a visual learner with all sports. I watched golf on TV, found a club, and went outside. Maybe because the club was an adult length club, it was a Mac MB too, the weight forced me find the swing of least resistance.

 

Thanks for giving me the comfort of knowing that my swing is decent! You and Judge have helped me there big time. With all these talking heads on TV, and all the swing breakdowns it's easy to develop swing envy, then I start trying to make my swing "textbook". And being on WRX I'll end up in I and A and I swear swing threads can be like prescription medication commercials LOL, I'll be in there reading the OP's problem then I"m like," I think I do that", "hmm I'll have to give that a try" , rinse repeat.

 

I finding that balance of technique and flow, and like you said, having the correct knowledge can only help me.

 

Great stuff Brory McIlroy :)

All the real old school guys including my old man were of the theory of starting a kid off with a heavy club. In their words it helped develop proper golf muscles and muscle memory. I can remember in his latter years my old man did not get around as good and I got him some subscriptions to golf magazines and Sports Illustrated. He was an avid sports enthusist of all sports. I can remember he read some instruction article in one of the mags about not using such a heavy club with kids starting out and remarked "The communist are now trying to pussify golf" In his latter years everything he did not agree with was a "communist conspiercy".

[DeNinny]

Ninja, I get it! I followed you through that whole post, and I do think a drawing would help solidify exactly what your saying. I think it's pretty amazing you've been able to decipher all of that in the past couple years. I don't remember you talking about the parts of the swing much when I first joined the group but I could be wrong. I also liked that you said the club will naturally want to find the DUST plane. I would imagine having a sound set up (posture, grip, alignment) helps to find this plane with minimal compensations. I think when I first picked up a club I was 9, I played baseball and was a visual learner with all sports. I watched golf on TV, found a club, and went outside. Maybe because the club was an adult length club, it was a Mac MB too, the weight forced me find the swing of least resistance.

 

Thanks for giving me the comfort of knowing that my swing is decent! You and Judge have helped me there big time. With all these talking heads on TV, and all the swing breakdowns it's easy to develop swing envy, then I start trying to make my swing "textbook". And being on WRX I'll end up in I and A and I swear swing threads can be like prescription medication commercials LOL, I'll be in there reading the OP's problem then I"m like," I think I do that", "hmm I'll have to give that a try" , rinse repeat.

 

I finding that balance of technique and flow, and like you said, having the correct knowledge can only help me.

 

Great stuff Brory McIlroy :)

 

Thank you, Brony Finau. I'm really enjoying this alignment with you about the swing. And yeah I guess I have expanded my understanding of golf and the swing since earlier confessions threads. And as mentioned, I couldn't have done it without them and all the confessors. Also since you understood what I wrote, you honestly don't need to see a sketch. I'm approximating the location of the DUST plane anyway.

 

So now let me tie it to Vc and Ec a little more and how to maximize Vc and minimize Ec as that center of swing mass moves along the DUST plane and around the point between the shoulder sockets.

 

It all obviously starts at the top, where the goal is to start accelerating the clubhead as fast as possible from basically the point where it changes directions from going back to down. At this very point, the goal of the swing should be to set up a minimum rotational MOI, so that the swing requires the least amount of energy to start, and the only way to do this mathematically is to set up to turn with the lowest MOI possible. And so to do this the trail arm should be bent 90 degrees, which pulls the club closer to the body, and if possible the wrists should hinge to bring the weight of the club even closer. In this position, the swing has a low MOI. Also, the position of the club at the top is important for providing the least resistance to the muscles powering the swing. And the best position for this is to set up with the weight of the club, the clubhead itself, dragging DIRECTLY behind the pulling hands. So the wrist must hinge in synchronicity with the trail arm bending, and they both need to hinge such that the club is set with the clubhead and shaft trailing directly behind the hands and on the DUST plane itself (which at this point is nearly the same thing as the Hogan plane). So with all this, the golfer is poised to make a turn as fast as possible.

 

Now as the swing starts going down, again that average swing mass should ideally stay on the DUST plane which is pointing to a point just below the ball. The goal again is to swing the average mass of the swing toward that point. And so now in order to start going down efficiently to maximize Vc, the base of the swing, the hips (<- but really per Da Judge it really is the lead knee that starts the whole thing) need to start everything going. The reason for this is because all other actions will get the benefit of their movement ON TOP of the movement of the hips, so the hips must be the first to start the downswing out of the aforementioned five actions. Also what this does is get the same muscles that power the shoulders to start stretching, which in turn will set them up to really contract with even more power than from a neutral state.

 

But now before the shoulders start turning, already the clubhead is starting to move, so in order to stay on that DUST plane, the clubhead must start to drop a little which is done with the arms drop action. So at this very beginning of the downswing, we only have the hips turning and the arms dropping the clubhead a little. The MOI of the swing is still low, so acceleration of Vc can still be as fast as possible. Also again, by swinging on the ideal plane, no energy is lost toward keeping it on plane, so also Ec is minimized. Mathematically, the grand swing equations thus far are

 

Vc = Vh + Va

 

and

 

Ec = Eh + Ea

 

Only the hips and arms are the swing actions at this point. Note that the shoulders are turning, but this is only because they are on top of the hips. Their muscles are not actually turning them in relation to the hips yet, so I have left them out of the equations.

 

So eventually after enough hips turn, the shoulder turn muscles are going to be stretched to the point that they must contract and at this point they should start contributing to Vc and Ec and become involved with the swing. So while the hips are still turning and the arms are still dropping such that the swing average mass is on the DUST plane, the shoulders simply start turning eventually as well. Also the trail arm is still bent 90 degrees and the wrists are hinged with the clubhead and shaft still on the DUST plane. The swing equations are now

 

Vc = Vh + Vs + Va

 

and

 

Ec = Eh + Es + Ea

 

Vh is climbing high now because of all those core muscles are still turning a very low MOI swing. And also Vs should be climbing high too. This is seen in the kinematic sequence graph in the first half of the downswing. Also the trail arm is still bent and the wrists are hinged and dragging the clubhead directly behind them. But also now centripetal force is increasing too, as a result of the high acceleration! This is a key part of the DUST swing. Centripetal force is your greatest ally in the entire swing, and so the key to the first half of the downswing is setting it up is part of also just getting clubhead velocity up quickly. As the downswing progresses, centripetal force wants to pull the clubhead away from the center of the swing so eventually you want to let it go at the right time such that the clubhead returns to impact with maximum Vc. Again, all the while maintaining the average mass of the swing on the DUST plane.

 

So now it is time to unleash all that energy of the swing into impact and utilizing centripetal force as much as possible, but before that I want to mention that as soon as the MOI of the swing starts increasing, the velocity of all the actions will start slowing down. This is per Newton's conservation of momentum law. And unfortunately, this is a detrimental physics to the whole swing and is also why, in that kinematic sequence graph, the acceleration starts slowing down as shown by the downward curvature of the Club Head velocity trend. Also this is seen in that abrupt drop in Mid-Hands velocity trend just before impact. This is the lag of the clubhead finally being let go. It is the point where the trail arm straightens simultaneously with the wrist unhinging. These actions put the swing mass farther away so the swing will slow down proportionately to this. I must confess that this is something that I struggled with technically for quite a while. Newton's own law of conservation of momentum is going against my whole theory here. And so it wasn't until I tied centripetal force to everything that I saw how clubhead velocity can still be increasing when the MOI is also increasing. The clubhead literally "falls away" from the golfer in the last half of the swing from centripetal force, and this action is almost independent of the increasing MOI because it is also happening on a separate hinge than the center of the swing. As long as the trail arm doesn't fully straighten before impact, all that centripetal force is what is actually contributing to Vc through Vt and Vw. The trail arm and wrists are much weaker muscles than the torso and core muscles, but they can provide a VERY significant contribution to clubhead velocity by utilizing gravity and centripetal force to help.

 

So finally, with all this we can finish the downswing with the action of the trail arm straightening simultaneously with the wrist unhinging. The action starts approximately when the arms drop reaches the point where the trail elbow is close to the trail hip. At about this point, the centripetal force assists tremendously with the entire action and also it helps to maintain the swing average mass on the DUST plane. But it is also worth noting that as soon as the trail arm starts straightening, the clubhead and shaft IMMEDIATELY start diverging from traveling ON the DUST plane to where the clubhead is travelling ABOVE the DUST plane and the arms, hands and most of the shaft are travelling UNDER the DUST plane. This is because the trail arm is what pulls the clubface off square to the path to parallel to the path when it is bent 90 degrees. So when it straightens, that entire swing weight has to spread out to be half above and half below the DUST plane. I note this because this is going to be a mathematically complicated area and also as mentioned earlier to Sixty, this is an area of the swing that is fraught with potential for error. This is where the flips, the rolling of the wrists, the swiping of the hands can come into play and just ruin impact. So anyway, at this point in the swing we have all the actions contributing to the swing equations:

 

Vc = Vh + Vs + Va + Vt + Vw

 

and

 

Ec = Eh + Es + Ea + Et + Ew

 

And so this about wraps up my DUST swing model. I intentionally don't go into very detailed mechanics with it because I think many swings are already doing everything stated and as long as you are copying a tour proven swing or even a good golfer's swing, you are learning the right mechanics. For example I never stated how to hinge your wrist at the top. The DUST model just requires that the wrist be hinged and to set the club on the DUST plane. It doesn't matter too much if the wrist are bowed like Dustin Johnson or slightly cupped like Gary Player. Both of these tour proven swings are following the DUST model but yet they have individuality. Also EVERYTHING that Judge Reasy has ever stated about the swing is also in 100% alignment with the DUST model. I have applied every bit of physics knowledge to everything he states about a good swing and there is not one thing he states that is in violation of it. I would say that his wrist hinge and grip is just about perfect for minimum Ew (wrists error).

 

So after all my analysis and development of this, I allowed myself, for my swing, to be a little LESS technical about thing like a perfect reverse K posture or having a textbook grip or perfect flat wrist at the top. To be clear, I'm NOT saying that this stuff isn't important, I'm just saying that it gave me a bigger picture goal of things and actually a more simple model to follow. I don't just set my grip now because it is in the position I read in a book anymore. I now can set it such that my wrists hinge on that DUST plane at the top properly and that I can return them to address position in a simple hinged action, that feels comfortable for ME.

 

Anyway, I hope this helps and maybe clarifies what you were already doing with your swing...

[Palauan Hammer]

Very interesting read again, I had to slow down and really absorb everything, but it all makes sense to me. The golf swing is an amazing thing, they way you and the Judge are able to see everything blows my mind! I would definitely agree that the unhinging part is where things can go wrong. When I think of my swing these days I really focus on my legs and hips. Really paying attention to how I shift my weight, and using the ground to create power. Also, wrist hinge. I have very flexible wrists, and I notice the more I hinge them the more consistent my swing bottoms out in the correct place. I like the "downloading" method, or thinking of increasing my wrist angle starting the downswing.

 

One thing I've noticed for a while, and for the life of me was trying to change for some reason is that at impact I present the club basically in a straight line with my lead arm. I have shaft lean but it's not much, that's probably why I hit the ball super high LOL.

 

Well played with the "Brony Finau"!!

[DeNinny]

Brodo Baggins, I can further break down the hips turn action to be a function of the feet and calves powering the knees, which in turn power the hips. So that ground work you are doing is good for power. Plus a stable hip rotation is key for minimal Eh (hips error) and moreover better for all other errors since an error at the hips will exacerbate all the other errors. Groundwork is also good because the hips (and legs and feet) are what bear the "load" of the rest of the swing. The stronger the ground leverage, the faster the hips AND the entire swing turns.

 

And that downloading move at the top to create more wrist hinge is another good energy saving move. By downloading, you are letting the natural drag and weight of the clubhead to set the wrists. This is an efficient wrist hinge method! Plus the relaxed wrists more easily allow the club to stay on the DUST plane. Easy peasy.

 

And that straight line relationship between the lead arm and shaft is something I like too. The minimal shaft lean is a sign of a nice shallow AoA swing. There is nothing wrong with that impact position from a physics perspective.

[Matt J]

My buddy and I were talking about this thread on WRX about the guy using SkyPro to measure his path and face angle on his putting stroke. He tells me he hates gadgets but his wife, who used to be quite the player, always gives him the latest toys for Xmas and his birthday. So, the next day, he shows up with something similar to the SkyPro, the SwingTip sensor.

 

It's Bluetooth to your phone, basically gives you a trace of your path you can view from face on, from the back, or from overhead. It will tell you if your downswing is relatively square to the backswing, out to in, or in to out, your swing speed, where you hit it on the face, and whether the face angle was square, closed, or open.

 

None of it seems terribly accurate compared to a real monitor, but I used it out on the range yesterday for about 40 swings with driver and was a bit intrigued. I'll probably put it on an iron next week just for the hell of it. Driver swing speed starts out slow for me and picks up after about the 10th swing. I was up just over a hundred which is about right. I probably need to do one of those swing speed improvement programs. If I could get 5 or 10 mph out of it I would be super stoked.

 

Happy Sunday confessionieers!