Jesse Ortiz of Bobby Jones Golf: Q&A

[SwingMan]

Driver Discussion

Earlier this spring, I spent some time on the phone with Jesse Ortiz and we exchanged emails regarding the design of his clubs.

As many of you know, Jesse designed the successful #1 Selling Orlimar fairways of the late 90's. Orlimar Drivers still have a cult-like following five years after their debut. Jesse left his family's company -- Orlimar -- in 2003 (as its sale to King Par was taking place) when it was sold and now designs clubs with the Bobby Jones Golf Company. Orlimar tumbled downhill and Bobby Jones received a world famous club designer who had learned to design and shape clubs from wood while sitting on his dad's knees.

I asked Jesse a few questions regarding driver design and he was gracious enough to answer them. But first, about his clubs, for those who are not familiar with Bobby Jones.

The Bobby Jones Players Series by Jesse Ortiz consists of classically shaped, shallow, fairway woods that feature Carpenter’s 465 steel alloy faces, milled to 1.6 mm thickness for performance and feel. Lofts available: 13, 15, 17, 19 degrees; and in hybrid design: 19, 21, 25 and 30 degrees.

The Series also includes 440 cc drivers of 9.5, 10.5 and 12 degree lofts, featuring graphite composite crowns for maximum rear weighting. Two weighted screws provide neutral or draw bias options for golfers. Russian BT-23 beta titanium faces are milled, heat treated and formed to maximize ball compression and minimize spin. If you'd like to learn more about Jesse's designs and Bobby Jones Clubs, see www.bobbyjonesgolf.net

Now to Jesse:


Q: There is a lot of talk about driver MOI this year. Your Driver appears to have a high toe and deep back. Was this done to increase the MOI of your driver (ie, making the club more stable and less resistant to twisting at impact) and have you measured the MOI of your driver?

Jesse Ortiz: All of my wood designs incorporate a wider head platform. My dad and I discovered decades ago that wider clubheads increase the gear effect. The further you can move the weight from the face or impact area to the rear of the clubhead, the more resistant that clubhead is to twist. The reason for the pronounced toe of my clubs is twofold. First, the movement of the toe area so far ‘north’ of the face, aids in the correction of toed shots. Secondly, the pronounced toe camouflages the ‘width’ of my design. If the toe was designed like my competitors, the club would appear ugly, due to its width. It is important to note that my drivers have been on the market since 2004. This is their fourth season on the market, and yet, until this season, they were the widest drivers on the market. My triangular design was very radical four seasons ago, but it is a very conventional looking club today. I have not measured the MOI of our drivers, but I know that it is very close to the square ones, but with more style and grace. It is important to note that when my drivers were submitted to the USGA four years ago, the restriction at that point covered 460 cc’s in volume. There was no restriction on the dimension width and length of the clubhead - only volume. On Tour, many of the pros mentioned that my driver ‘looked’ bigger than 460cc’s. From heel to toe, my driver measures exactly 5 inches. Is it a coincidence that 5 inches from heel to toe is now the (USGA) limit?

Q: While all the buzz is about MOI, it is only one feature of a driver. What are other design characteristics of which you are proud in the Bobby Jones Driver?

Jesse Ortiz: High MOI reduces the really bad shots, but it also reduces the favorable gear effect. Toed and heeled shots will not correct themselves as easily. The graphite crown on our drivers allows me to put more weight in the rear of the clubhead. No drivers have the generous bulge and roll that our drivers feature, and this increases the gear effect. It also reduces spin and increases ball velocity off the face. A curved surface deflects less than a flatter one, and thus, (you have) less ball contact on the face. This is known as compression. The more ball compression on a smaller spot on the face treanslates into less spin. Our drivers typically have 500 RPM less spin than our competitors in a very classy and attractive package.

Q: Some of your competition use variable face thickness or inverted cone technology in the faces of their driver. They claim this technology expands the sweetspot. Can you briefly discuss this and describe the technology used in your drivers?

Jesse Ortiz: Our drivers feature the thinnest face in golf. I do not believe in variable face thickness. A face that is one consistent thickness will produce the most consistent ball flight from any point off the face. Since we have more curvature on our faces, we can make the faces thinner without fear of face failure. Remember, a curved surface is more resistant to load than a flatter surface. Our face is also made from Russian Beta BT-23 Titanium, which has a Rockwell Hardness of 42HRC versus 34HRC of the typical betas. It also has a tensile strength of 210KSI versus 180KSI that my competitors feature. The reason they do not use the BT-23 is that it is more difficult to work with, and the heat-treating cycle is longer. In our drivers, more bulge and roll and a stronger harder, face means more ball velocity and less spin.

Q: Is there an ideal place to hit the sweetspot in your driver? High center? Center?

Jesse Ortiz: Most drivers, due to their size, perform better when hit in the high face area. Depending on the shape of the club, that may be high center or high toe. Most drivers perform best in the high toe area because their shapes are not symmetrical. By that I mean that the rear apex of the clubhead does not line up directly behind the center of the face. Thus a high toe shot performs best in those drivers. Our drivers are symmetrical, and therefore a high center shot is best rewarded.

Q: I noticed that your driver measures out at less than 45 inches. What is the stock swingweight at that length in a stiff flex shaft and how does that length benefit the player?

Jesse Ortiz: Our drivers measure out at 44.75†with swingweights about D-3 to D-4. I have always felt that drivers with a bit less length are easier to control, and easier to hit more squarely. The shorter length and heavier swingweights also increase the MOI. The increased distance an inch may give a player is offset by the difficulty in making solid, ‘center-face’ contact.

Q: Many players prefer a square face angle and a less draw-biased club -- Is there a manner in which they can order a specific head and a specific shaft for their preferences?

Jesse Ortiz: Most of our driver sales are custom specs. Our drivers can be ordered square, open or slightly closed. I do not believe in big hook faces. They are too difficult to line up to the target. I would rather use weighting to bring the ball around. Our drivers also feature an adjustable weight for neutral and draw bias; but that weighting is done here at my shop. We handle all the popular shafts.

Q: Can you tell us who is using your driver on the Tours?

Jesse Ortiz: I have not gotten out on the Champions Tour this season, but I know that John Jacobs, Tom Kite and Andy Bean, among others, had them in play early in the season.

Q: Why is your driver 440 instead of 460cc?

Jesse Ortiz: I just made the club look how I wanted it to look like, and it came out 440cc’s. In fact, when I went on tour with it, Gary McCord told John Jacobs that the club was non-conforming because it was over 460cc’s. That’s because it was bigger from heel to toe and from face to back than his TaylorMade 460cc driver. The key dimensions of my driver were bigger than any of the 460s out there, but because of the way I scooped away the underside of the heel and toe areas, the volume displacement was less than 460cc’s. My 440 cc driver was really bigger than any of the 460 cc drivers until this year when the square drivers came out.

Q: Let's close briefly with your hybrids. Many of us have noticed your Bobby Jones Hybrids from The Golf Channel Commercials. Why go to a mini fairway wood look instead of a more traditional iron-like hybrid?

Jesse Ortiz: The mini fairway wood look is better suited to moving the weight further away from the face area. It also increases the gear effect on off center hits, and allows me to create a sole area that has much less turf drag. Although the iron-like hybrids look more familiar due to the club-style they are replacing (long irons), it does not present a functional advantage over the fairway-type design. In fact, it has many more deficiencies, especially for mid to high handicappers.

[generalpatton]

Swingman, thanks for posting this Q+A......great stuff from one of the true masters in the equipment industry. I was thinking about this the other day that I knew the Bobby Jones line had been out for a few years, yet the designs still work today. If nothing else, I applaud Jesse for recognizing the value of both a good design....and the longevity of it.....and not barraging us yearly with the latest and greatest. I'm thinking seriously now that I know other shafts are available of purchasing one of the Bobby Jones drivers as I've always liked the way they sit behind the ball.

[SwingMan]

Swingman, thanks for posting this Q+A......great stuff from one of the true masters in the equipment industry. I was thinking about this the other day that I knew the Bobby Jones line had been out for a few years, yet the designs still work today. If nothing else, I applaud Jesse for recognizing the value of both a good design....and the longevity of it.....and not barraging us yearly with the latest and greatest. I'm thinking seriously now that I know other shafts are available of purchasing one of the Bobby Jones drivers as I've always liked the way they sit behind the ball.

 

 

It is a pleasure to talk with Jesse.

 

I have a 9.5 Driver that is neutrally biased with a square face angle. Once I settled on a shaft and grew accustomed to a new swing, I've gone 11/14 and 12/14 Fairways, which is fairly unheard of for me. You can't even tell that it has a composite top. Very sweet sound.

[rollingrock]

Thanks for posting - as you can tell from my WITB, I'm sort of a fan of these clubs! :tongue:

 

I love the driver. An absolute fairway finder...whether it is due to the bulge & roll or the weighting I don't know, but I like the results.

 

The fairways are a love/hate thing at the moment. My 5 wood is a security blanket, but I have been fighting the 3 wood. Such a shallow face... great off the fairway, but out of the rough or off the tee , you have to guard against the dreaded pop-up. Please Mr. Ortiz, a little more face height next go-round for the mortals among us who get steep. :cheesy:

[born4golf77]

i have hit one of th 9.5 drivers and they are sweet. forgiving and long with a great feel and sound

[Cjpl1]

Hey Jesse, bought your 52 degree sand wedge few years ago, love it until last Saturday was in fairway bunker about 70 Yards away..soon as I hit the ball felt different,  like I toped it as the ball ran through the green,looking at the club noticed the whole face detached from the club, never ever heard of this happening before, waz up?never found the face! Curtis 408-679-2538 

[animalgolfs]

19 hours ago, Cjpl1 said:

Hey Jesse, bought your 52 degree sand wedge few years ago, love it until last Saturday was in fairway bunker about 70 Yards away..soon as I hit the ball felt different,  like I toped it as the ball ran through the green,looking at the club noticed the whole face detached from the club, never ever heard of this happening before, waz up?never found the face! Curtis 408-679-2538 

Wholly thread revive!

 

Um.....Bobby Jones golf is no longer

 

But I have an idea that a few members may give you a call

[Bad9]

Holee 13yr zombie thread revival

[caniac6]

Loved the Orlimar, and Bobby Jones clubs. I didn't look at the date of this thread, and got a little excited that they were back.

[kcsf]

13 years, that has to be a record, right?