I need help with a ruling

TCWhite · October 22, 2007

Eagle or Birdie?

Par 5, I hit my driver and then a four iron which leaves me 100 yards from the hole. My second shot lands just out of the fairway in the right rough, but a few feet this side of the cart path. When I get there, I can't find my ball. Then my kid notices a 10" drain pipe that runs under the cart path where the fairway drains down to a little pond. I can see a ball inside the pipe, but it is 6-7 feet out of reach. It has to be my ball, but since I can't play it I drop another and make my third shot which hits 6 feet from the pin and then rolls in. I put down a 4 rather than a 3 since I couldn't play my first ball, but is that correct?

Thanks for any help!

cwglum · October 22, 2007

Eagle - Eagle - Eagle ... assuming you could identify the ball in the pipe as yours (e.g. you saw your markings on the ball).

If you could not identify the ball in the pipe as yours and no one actually saw it go into the pipe, your ball would've been a "lost ball" and in a tournament you would've had to go back to spot of your 2nd shot, drop (3) and hit your 4th shot.

mags300 · October 22, 2007

I'm not an expert on this, but i believe this would be the situation. If you could identify the ball you would be intitled to a free drop so you would make an eagle, but because you could not CLEARLY id your ball you must go back to re-hit your 2nd shot because it was not marked as a hazard. So tuff break, technically you did'nt make a birdie either.

TM golf guy · October 22, 2007

I'm not an expert on this, but i believe this would be the situation. If you could identify the ball you would be intitled to a free drop so you would make an eagle, but because you could not CLEARLY id your ball you must go back to re-tee because it was not marked as a hazard. So tuff break, technically you did'nt make a birdie either.

Not re-tee, simply re-hit from where the 4 iron was. (You may have meant that anyway.)

TCWhite · October 22, 2007

Thanks guys!! That's just my luck, I couldn't see the ball clearly enough to know 100% it was mine. I guess circumstantial evidence only works in a court of law...

wkuo3 · October 22, 2007

Yeah, technically and by the rules, you have to return to the spot where the last stroke was taken ( where you hit your original 4 iron ) plus 2 strokes.

Since you're not in a tournament ( while your caddy would have gone down to ID the ball in the drain ), we could assume that it's the case and you have an eagle.

Now you know it's possible, so go out and get more.

Rockfish · October 22, 2007

They're correct. Under the circumsatnces you describe you were required to go back to where you hit the previously shot and you would have been lying 3, hitting 4.

You actually made NO score for that hole OR the round since you were DQ'd for playing from a wrong place and writing down a score LESS THAN what you really made.

Now had somebody seen you hit the shot AND seen your ball go down the drain (I believe) you would NOT have to identify it and you'd have made eagle with the free drop.

But since there were NO spectators you MUST identify your ball.

TCWhite · October 22, 2007

OK, so let me ask this - Is this a situation where your playing partner could concede and declare it your ball, allowing you the free drop?

That ruling is fine for a tournament, but it is just too impractial to back up 180 yards and hit again when people are waiting to tee off behind you.

Kentsp1 · October 22, 2007

OK, so let me ask this - Is this a situation where your playing partner could concede and declare it your ball, allowing you the free drop?

That ruling is fine for a tournament, but it is just too impractial to back up 180 yards and hit again when people are waiting to tee off behind you.

No, agreeing to wave any rules is grounds for immediate disqualification on both players.

larrybud · October 22, 2007

OK, so let me ask this - Is this a situation where your playing partner could concede and declare it your ball, allowing you the free drop?

That ruling is fine for a tournament, but it is just too impractial to back up 180 yards and hit again when people are waiting to tee off behind you.

No, agreeing to wave any rules is grounds for immediate disqualification on both players.

Disqualification from what? It's not a tournament.

rl4673 · October 22, 2007

OK, so let me ask this - Is this a situation where your playing partner could concede and declare it your ball, allowing you the free drop?

That ruling is fine for a tournament, but it is just too impractial to back up 180 yards and hit again when people are waiting to tee off behind you.

No, agreeing to wave any rules is grounds for immediate disqualification on both players.

Disqualification from what? It's not a tournament.

Exactly. Card your eagle and move on. Nice shot, too!

themouth1 · October 22, 2007

The rules do not change in a tournament. Golf is Golf. If you aren't following the rules, you cannot post the score for handicap and the score you shoot is invalid. Why do anything for four hours if you aren't doing it right? Not to be harsh but there have been a lot of threads lately on what rules you follow and which are just suggestions...

willamette · October 23, 2007

The rules do not change in a tournament. Golf is Golf. If you aren't following the rules, you cannot post the score for handicap and the score you shoot is invalid. Why do anything for four hours if you aren't doing it right? Not to be harsh but there have been a lot of threads lately on what rules you follow and which are just suggestions...

Gimmie a break. Tournament? OK, I can see. But to keep your handicap...you mean to say that a more accurate handicap results from not carding that score because the super didn't take the time to install a grate on the drain? In fact, for tournament purposes if he adds that stroke to his handicap for all intensive purposes he will have an unfair advantage over the other players, since handicap is supposed to measure SKILL. I mean the poster even identitied his ball (who else's ball is it...his ball in not in the fairway where he hit it, and it's the only ball in the drain?).

Man, if you can't understand why people would "do something for four hours if [they] aren't doing it right" then you've never been golfing. I don't mean to get personal, but comments like that on golfwrx are some of the most ludicrous on the internet. Some people just play to have fun.

ApexGrind · October 23, 2007

Man, if you can't understand why people would "do something for four hours if [they] aren't doing it right" then you've never been golfing. I don't mean to get personal, but comments like that on golfwrx are some of the most ludicrous on the internet. Some people just play to have fun.

Sure, but they aren't playing golf. You are free to make up any game that pleases you.

themouth1 · October 23, 2007

The rules do not change in a tournament. Golf is Golf. If you aren't following the rules, you cannot post the score for handicap and the score you shoot is invalid. Why do anything for four hours if you aren't doing it right? Not to be harsh but there have been a lot of threads lately on what rules you follow and which are just suggestions...

Gimmie a break. Tournament? OK, I can see. But to keep your handicap...you mean to say that a more accurate handicap results from not carding that score because the super didn't take the time to install a grate on the drain? In fact, for tournament purposes if he adds that stroke to his handicap for all intensive purposes he will have an unfair advantage over the other players, since handicap is supposed to measure SKILL. I mean the poster even identitied his ball (who else's ball is it...his ball in not in the fairway where he hit it, and it's the only ball in the drain?).

Man, if you can't understand why people would "do something for four hours if [they] aren't doing it right" then you've never been golfing. I don't mean to get personal, but comments like that on golfwrx are some of the most ludicrous on the internet. Some people just play to have fun.

Before you go off on a tirade, go back and read his post. He freely admits he COULD NOT IDENTIFY HIS BALL. That means that he has to go back and hit another ball. Handicaps are only valid if you follow the rules. Period...I don't really care if you think my comments are ludicrous...I call it how I see it. If the poster was "just playin for fun" and didn't want to know the actual score, he wouldn't have asked the question on an open forum. Keep playing your game (it's not golf) and I will play mine. Rules are rules...

willamette · October 23, 2007

Man, if you can't understand why people would "do something for four hours if [they] aren't doing it right" then you've never been golfing. I don't mean to get personal, but comments like that on golfwrx are some of the most ludicrous on the internet. Some people just play to have fun.

Sure, but they aren't playing golf. You are free to make up any game that pleases you.

Right. So next time you go 36mph in a 35mph speed zone apparently don't call it driving a car. You are no longer "Driving," but "making up an [activity] that pleases you." OK.

Go ahead and not card that score to your handicap. Any reasonable person on an even somewhat busy course would card it (because we couldn't take the time to walk back and hit the ball again), and they (and I) will have the more accurate handicap. Thus our tournament scores will be more accurate.

Sorry, just don't agree with you guys on this one, living in the real world having to share a course with everyone else. Yes, I fully admit you are technically correct.

Rockfish · October 23, 2007

Man, if you can't understand why people would "do something for four hours if [they] aren't doing it right" then you've never been golfing. I don't mean to get personal, but comments like that on golfwrx are some of the most ludicrous on the internet. Some people just play to have fun.

Sure, but they aren't playing golf. You are free to make up any game that pleases you.

Right. So next time you go 36mph in a 35mph speed zone apparently don't call it driving a car. You are no longer "Driving," but "making up an [activity] that pleases you." OK.

Go ahead and not card that score to your handicap. Any reasonable person on an even somewhat busy course would card it (because we couldn't take the time to walk back and hit the ball again), and they (and I) will have the more accurate handicap. Thus our tournament scores will be more accurate.

Sorry, just don't agree with you guys on this one, living in the real world having to share a course with everyone else. Yes, I fully admit you are technically correct.

No, you're still driving - you're just speeding too !!! :crazy:

And besides, he hit it OFF the fairway, not ON it. He lost the ball. :clapping:

ApexGrind · October 26, 2007

Go ahead and not card that score to your handicap. Any reasonable person on an even somewhat busy course would card it (because we couldn't take the time to walk back and hit the ball again),

No. Most of the people I play with regularly, with one exception, would go back and hit another ball. Point is it just doesn't happen very often. MAYBE once every 5 to 10 rounds (if that often) a situation like this occurs. It's barely off the fairway with no unusual condition and the ball just isn't there. You go back and hit again. The rest of the foursome plays on. The guy who went back should get to the green about the time the rest of you putt out. If it's questionable and you're playing backed up courses you should get in the habit of hitting a provisional. That one other guy has it happen to him more often because he almost always refuses to hit a provisional. "no, it didn't get near the woods, it'll be right there in the rough". He doesn't go back to re-hit for the same reason every time too, "there's people waiting" (He does take a 2 stroke penalty and drops where he thinks it should have been). Same guy that lobbys for playing all the woods as laterals...