Iron Spin

[Bsudgolf]

Does more Spin off of the irons cause distance loss? I'm trying to decide which ball I want to play. I'm currently playing the Diamond which my understanding is high spin off irons. I play the ZX5 irons. I feel as though that higher iron Spin from the diamond may be hurting me. My PW carry distance is 115 and a 7i is 145. I'm wondering if a ball like the Reg Z Star may be a better fit. I'm not just a real high spinner of the ball. I'm a 4hcp right now and I do strike it pretty good. Just trying to figure out if that Diamond is the right ball. Im not a high SS player either 92 driver. 

Edited August 3, 2023 by Bsudgolf

[bluedot]

2 minutes ago, Bsudgolf said:

Does more Spin off of the irons cause distance loss? I'm trying to decide which ball I want to play. I'm currently playing the Diamond which my understanding is high spin off irons. I play the ZX5 irons. I feel as though that higher iron Spin may be hurting me. My PW carry distance is 115 and a 7i is 145. I'm wondering if a ball like the Reg Z Star may be a better fit

Hurting you how?
 

IF using a higher spin ball is causing you to hit a 7 iron where a lower spin ball might only require an 8 iron, understand that which iron is you hit from a given distance is only one part of the picture in selecting a ball.  While the lower spinning ball MIGHT go farther off a given iron, that also might well translate to less control and maybe less predictable results.  
 

But in any case, this shouldn’t be a very hard test.  I’d start at the practice green/short game area and see which ball you like better for pitching, chipping, and putting.  Then take them out on the course, and see what your actual distances are with each.  Really, I don’t think you’ll find distance to be the big difference; control will be.

 

At considerable risk of over-generalizing, good players tend to use higher spinning balls because they provide more control as you get closer to the green.  This will make some here crazy, but IMO players who use lower spinning balls TEND to do that either because of cost (spin costs more!) or because they mistakenly believe that they’ll gain distance AND hit the ball straighter off the tee.  I don’t know of very many players, good or otherwise, who opt for a lower spin ball because of iron play.

[Bsudgolf]

8 minutes ago, bluedot said:

Hurting you how?
 

IF using a higher spin ball is causing you to hit a 7 iron where a lower spin ball might only require an 8 iron, understand that which iron is you hit from a given distance is only one part of the picture in selecting a ball.  While the lower spinning ball MIGHT go farther off a given iron, that also might well translate to less control and maybe less predictable results.  
 

But in any case, this shouldn’t be a very hard test.  I’d start at the practice green/short game area and see which ball you like better for pitching, chipping, and putting.  Then take them out on the course, and see what your actual distances are with each.  Really, I don’t think you’ll find distance to be the big difference; control will be.

 

At considerable risk of over-generalizing, good players tend to use higher spinning balls because they provide more control as you get closer to the green.  This will make some here crazy, but IMO players who use lower spinning balls TEND to do that either because of cost (spin costs more!) or because they mistakenly believe that they’ll gain distance AND hit the ball straighter off the tee.  I don’t know of very many players, good or otherwise, who opt for a lower spin ball because of iron play.

I will honestly say I have VERY good control from Tee to green. I hit 95% of Fairways with driver but my drives are 240-250 (Im not one to over swing due to back issues). I did shoot my lowest ever of 70 couple weeks ago with the diamond but my normal course is Short so I'm hitting wedges into the par 4s. As far as feel goes I do not like Firm feel mainly due to I can't compress them enough so they feel like rocks. 

I would love to hit a 8i in place of my 7i but I'm just not sure a ball change would do that. As for as hitting me how, I feel as though my irons are Short possibly due to "too much spin" but it all could just be me. 

[Sean124]

Next round, I’d just hit 2 different balls from the same spot on some approach shots and see what happens. 
 

The Q Star is probably worth trying at your speed since it’s lower compression. 

[Bsudgolf]

9 minutes ago, Sean124 said:

Next round, I’d just hit 2 different balls from the same spot on some approach shots and see what happens. 
 

The Q Star is probably worth trying at your speed since it’s lower compression. 

But does it spin as much around the greens as the diamond. That's what I don't won't to lose I'll try any of them that has similar spin as diamond 

[SNIPERBBB]

At your club speed you're  not getting a lot of help/hurt adding or reducing spin. Lower spin will get you more rollout

[Sean124]

2 minutes ago, Bsudgolf said:

But does it spin as much around the greens as the diamond. That's what I don't won't to lose I'll try any of them that has similar spin as diamond 

I don’t think any other Srixon spins as much as the diamond. 

[bluedot]

35 minutes ago, Bsudgolf said:

I will honestly say I have VERY good control from Tee to green. I hit 95% of Fairways with driver but my drives are 240-250 (Im not one to over swing due to back issues). I did shoot my lowest ever of 70 couple weeks ago with the diamond but my normal course is Short so I'm hitting wedges into the par 4s. As far as feel goes I do not like Firm feel mainly due to I can't compress them enough so they feel like rocks. 

I would love to hit a 8i in place of my 7i but I'm just not sure a ball change would do that. As for as hitting me how, I feel as though my irons are Short possibly due to "too much spin" but it all could just be me. 

Not to get too much into the weeds here, but the idea that you lose the performance on a firmer ball because you can’t compress it is largely a myth.  For the most part, a firmer ball is longer, and a softer ball is shorter, regardless of swing speed.  
 

What golfers perceive as “feel” is mostly sound; we think a softer sound equates to the ball staying on the club face longer, and a harsher click means we aren’t adequately “compressing” the ball. Neither is true.

 

A quick story:  My partner and I recently won the Member-Member shootout at our club, playing six holes of true alternate shot.  Because he hit the first tee shot, and because he’s the higher handicap and I wanted him to be comfortable, we used his ball, which is a Callaway Super Soft; I use a ProV1x, so that’s about as different as you can get.  My irons were ok, though they didn’t draw they way I expected.  I only had to chip once, but it was a near-disaster because the ball just didn’t spin at all, at least compared to what I was used to and expected.  Fortunately, he made the long putt that I left him, and we stayed alive and later won.  Granted, it’s a small sample size, but I didn’t find the Super Soft to be any longer, I DID have less control of it off my irons.

Edited August 3, 2023 by bluedot

[Bsudgolf]

3 minutes ago, SNIPERBBB said:

At your club speed you're  not getting a lot of help/hurt adding or reducing spin. Lower spin will get you more rollout

I don't want more Iron rollout. And I hit a 9.5° driver which gives me quite a bit of rollout 

 

[Bsudgolf]

8 minutes ago, bluedot said:

Not to get too much into the weeds here, but the idea that you lose the performance on a firmer ball because you can’t compress it is largely a myth.  For the most part, a firmer ball is longer, and a softer ball is shorter, regardless of swing speed.  
 

What golfers perceive as “feel” is mostly sound; we think a softer sound equates to the ball staying on the club face longer, and a harsher click means we aren’t adequately “compressing” the ball. Neither is true.

 

A quick story:  My partner and I recently won the Member-Member shootout at our club, playing six holes of true alternate shot.  Because he hit the first tee shot, and because he’s the higher handicap and I wanted him to be comfortable, we used his ball, which is a Callaway Super Soft; I use a ProV1x, so that’s about as different as you can get.  My irons were ok, though they didn’t draw they way I expected.  I only had to chip once, but it was a near-disaster because the ball just didn’t spin at all, at least compared to what I was used to and expected.  Fortunately, he made the long putt that I left him, and we stayed alive and later won.  Granted, it’s a small sample size, but I didn’t find the Super Soft to be any longer, I DID have less control of it off my irons.

Well I may just not find any better than the Diamond since it's right in between. I love the "feel" of that ball not too soft and not too hard, but my concern is am I giving up distance especially my irons over something that better. I was playing the XV but I couldn't stand it especially after I switched to the diamond! I tried going back to the XV and just couldn't do it 

[Morkler]

Z Star is higher spinning than the Diamond.  At least when it comes to greenside.  I normally play the Z Star but tried the Diamond because I needed the mid iron spin due to using loft jacked irons.  I prefer the Z Star overall.  Plus it's a lower compression so you may like that aspect better too. 

Edited August 3, 2023 by Morkler

[Bsudgolf]

24 minutes ago, Morkler said:

Z Star is higher spinning than the Diamond.  At least when it comes to greenside.  I normally play the Z Star but tried the Diamond because I needed the mid iron spin due to using loft jacked irons.  I prefer the Z Star overall.  Plus it's a lower compression so you may like that aspect better too. 

Did you find the Z Star to be shorter off the Driver than the diamond or about the same?

[Pepperturbo]

@Bsudgolf

Can't speak to your ball choice, but spin can hurt trajectory and distance thanks to club head AoA, shaft or ball profile. 

 

Spin is the reason I removed the new T100S irons purchased last Oct and put my trusted 620 MB & CBs with MMT 105s shafts back in the bag, and play DASH -ProV1x.  The other possible culprit is 2.8 higher torque tip section of MMT shafts.  It turns out, 1'-2' of loft is better for me vs. strong 3'-4' of loft which says I will be ordering the new 2023 T100 irons.

 

If composite MMT shafts are much stronger than steel, why is the torque value higher than 1.7 torque of PX 5.5 steel?  Probably going to put PX 5.5 in the 620s too. 

 

 

[Morkler]

About the same.  I prefer the softer feel of the Z star off the putter and the greenside spin is great.  I am not sure I have noticed any major differences in the balls other than feel.

[phizzy30]

Spin can either help or hurt you distance wise with irons.  If you're a high ball hitter with low spin, you will get more carry distance in most instances.  If you're low/low, then it will hurt you carry distance wise.     

[Bsudgolf]

36 minutes ago, phizzy30 said:

Spin can either help or hurt you distance wise with irons.  If you're a high ball hitter with low spin, you will get more carry distance in most instances.  If you're low/low, then it will hurt you carry distance wise.     

Well I do hit the ball high especially with mid to short irons

[iacas]

5 hours ago, Bsudgolf said:

I hit 95% of Fairways with driver

 

[Bsudgolf]

9 minutes ago, iacas said:

 

I am very accurate off the Tee with Driver. I may miss 1 or 2 around. But that's not hard to do when you Swing within your limits. 

[iacas]

29 minutes ago, Bsudgolf said:

I am very accurate off the Tee with Driver. I may miss 1 or 2 around. But that's not hard to do when you Swing within your limits. 

 

I still don't believe you. 😄 

 

https://www.lpga.com/statistics/driving/driving-accuracy

[Bsudgolf]

43 minutes ago, iacas said:

 

I still don't believe you. 😄 

 

https://www.lpga.com/statistics/driving/driving-accuracy

I really couldn't give a S:'& whether you believe me or not. When you don't hit drives but 240yds it's really not that hard to hit a damn fairway. Let me guess you miss fairways cause you bomb them 340??

Edited August 3, 2023 by Bsudgolf

[North Butte]

When I first started out playing golf three decades ago, that first summer I hardly ever missed a fairway. I bought a "starter set" of clubs that, believe it or not, had a persimmon driver and 3w. Steel shafts. It seemed obvious I shouldn't hit the driver so I just teed off with the 3w.

 

It started out about knee high, "carried" maybe 30-40 yards and rolled out another hundred, sometimes as far as 160 total. But I'd hit that sucker straight down the middle every time. 

 

There's more to driving the ball than hitting every fairway, is what I'm saying. 

[Bsudgolf]

14 minutes ago, North Butte said:

When I first started out playing golf three decades ago, that first summer I hardly ever missed a fairway. I bought a "starter set" of clubs that, believe it or not, had a persimmon driver and 3w. Steel shafts. It seemed obvious I shouldn't hit the driver so I just teed off with the 3w.

 

It started out about knee high, "carried" maybe 30-40 yards and rolled out another hundred, sometimes as far as 160 total. But I'd hit that sucker straight down the middle every time. 

 

There's more to driving the ball than hitting every fairway, is what I'm saying. 

Yes but I will take  240-250 right down the middle consistently every time over a 300yd Drive into the rough or worse. 

Edited August 4, 2023 by Bsudgolf

[ChaosTheory]

I’m out of my league a bit, but, what I do know is that the hotter hollow irons generate more height and distance and less spin.  And that the lower spin is said to be a big reason for the extra height and distance.

 

If so, you might gain distance with a ball that spins less on the irons.  I know I have experienced that with some of the cheaper soft 2 piece balls versus the premium balls.  
 

Im a slower swinger than you.  I like the Q Star Tour. With irons I don’t know that I see a lot of difference with the ZStar and XV.  Not green side either.  Maybe try the QST.

[Bsudgolf]

2 minutes ago, Snowman9000 said:

I’m out of my league a bit, but, what I do know is that the hotter hollow irons generate more height and distance and less spin.  And that the lower spin is said to be a big reason for the extra height and distance.

 

If so, you might gain distance with a ball that spins less on the irons.  I know I have experienced that with some of the cheaper soft 2 piece balls versus the premium balls.  
 

Im a slower swinger than you.  I like the Q Star Tour. With irons I don’t know that I see a lot of difference with the ZStar and XV.  Not green side either.  Maybe try the QST.

Are the ZX5s considered low spin or high spin irons?

[phizzy30]

Just now, Bsudgolf said:

Yes but I will take  240-250 right down the middle consistently every time over a 300yd Drive into the rough or worse. 

Not me.  Just having the ability to hit the ball 300+ off the tee is a weapon that very few golfers have in their arsenal.  Fortunately, I have the ability to do so which gives me more opportunities to make more birdies and eagles on any given day.   

[Bsudgolf]

3 minutes ago, phizzy30 said:

Not me.  Just having the ability to hit the ball 300+ off the tee is a weapon that very few golfers have in their arsenal.  Fortunately, I have the ability to do so which gives me more opportunities to make more birdies and eagles on any given day.   

Good for you. I'm a 4 cap and too me that's pretty impressive for me with no more distance than I generate. So I too make my fair Share. I don't shoot in the Low 70s without them 

Edited August 4, 2023 by Bsudgolf

[phizzy30]

Just now, Bsudgolf said:

Good for you. I'm a 4 cap and too me that's pretty impressive for me with no more distance than I generate. So I too make my fair Share. I don't shoot in the Low 70s without them 

Cool story bro. 

[ChaosTheory]

28 minutes ago, Bsudgolf said:

Are the ZX5s considered low spin or high spin irons?

 
I “think” they fall in the power category, with lower spin.

 

 I switch between two sets of Maltby irons.  One being a hollow, power design and the other being a traditional solid one.  The power ones go higher and farther but I do think I’m on the ragged edge of not enough spin with them.  There definitely is a trade off.

 

 

[Bsudgolf]

1 minute ago, Snowman9000 said:

 
I “think” they fall in the power category, with lower spin.

 

 I switch between two sets of Maltby irons.  One being a hollow, power design and the other being a traditional solid one.  The power ones go higher and farther but I do think I’m on the ragged edge of not enough spin with them.  There definitely is a trade off.

 

 

See that's what I'm wondering too is if the Diamond that I'm playing may not be spinning enough off the irons causing lack of distance. But I've read that the Z Star diamond is supposed to be high spin off irons? 

[ChaosTheory]

6 minutes ago, Bsudgolf said:

See that's what I'm wondering too is if the Diamond that I'm playing may not be spinning enough off the irons causing lack of distance. But I've read that the Z Star diamond is supposed to be high spin off irons? 

Well, my basic understanding is the opposite; that more spin comes with less distance, and vice versa.  Maybe someone else who doesn’t want to call out your driving accuracy will chime in with the answers.

To me the bottom line would be to try different balls and see.  I’d really be interested in what you’d find with a regular Chrome Soft or a TM Tour Response. I think they  would fly farther off your irons.

 

 

Edited August 4, 2023 by Snowman9000