Too "armsy" and "lifting" my arms/shoulders

[jjinsa]

About twice a year I go for a 4-Lesson package, once around Feb/March and again Sep/Oct.   I really enjoy the coach I go to, he likes to coach a swing for longevity, that is a very "effortless" swing.  I certainly feel that in my swing it is much easier now.

 

He says my swing is good, but I have a tendency to want to involve my arms/hands too much, and my bad shots are when I (his terminology) "lift" my right shoulder and arm as opposed to rotating around my spine on the backswing.  Which causes all sorts of manipulation on the downswing to get back to the ball.  I have not taken a video in a while, and because of this have struggled to visualize what he means by this.  I understand theoretically, but nice to see yourself doing it.

 

He promotes a very relaxed setup, not bending the knees too much, relaxes arms hanging straight down etc, and a nice light grip sitting at the base of the fingers.  

 

Please let me know what you think of the swing, I think it was a PW swing. 

[TheDeanAbides]

That’s a nice swing. I’m not a big fan of a light grip pressure though because it can lead to regripping later in the swing. You have to grip the club firmly to hit the ball, so your grip pressure will increase through the swing. 

Edited April 22 by TheDeanAbides

[jjinsa]

17 minutes ago, TheDeanAbides said:

That’s a nice swing. I’m not a big fan of a light grip pressure though because it can lead to regripping later in the swing. You have to grip the club firmly to hit the ball, so your grip pressure will increase through the swing. 

Well light is subjective I suppose.  I certainly don't grip light, maybe just lighter than I used to, but certainly not as light as one would for chipping.  I used to grip very firm, which I think in part also causes the arms/hands to be too active?

[TheDeanAbides]

Just now, jjinsa said:

Well light is subjective I suppose.  I certainly don't grip light, maybe just lighter than I used to, but certainly not as light as one would for chipping.  I used to grip very firm, which I think in part also causes the arms/hands to be too active?

What do you mean by “too active”? I’m in the camp that believes that most players are too inactive with their arms leading to getting stuck. 
 

The goal should be a firm grip, but with relaxed forearms. 

[Valtiel]

There is a lot to like here, I would just make the following adjustments:



Your overall address position including hand position and eye line as noted above are generally too close. Hands too close to the body, eye line too far out over the ball. Your first move off the ball looks to be subconsciously correcting this via pushing your hands away and backing up slightly. Nothing fatal, but suggestive of the need to adjust your position relative to the ball at address. The somewhere between the amount your hands push out and your eye line backs up is how much further you should be from the ball. Eye line should closer to halfway between your feet and the ball (currently it's about 2/3rds towards the ball) and you want some daylight between the butt of the club and the front of your thighs here.
 

[TheDeanAbides]

1 minute ago, Valtiel said:

There is a lot to like here, I would just make the following adjustments:



Your overall address position including hand position and eye line as noted above are generally too close. Hands too close to the body, eye line too far out over the ball. Your first move off the ball looks to be subconsciously correcting this via pushing your hands away and backing up slightly. Nothing fatal, but suggestive of the need to adjust your position relative to the ball at address. The somewhere between the amount your hands push out and your eye line backs up is how much further you should be from the ball. Eye line should closer to halfway between your feet and the ball (currently it's about 2/3rds towards the ball) and you want some daylight between the butt of the club and the front of your thighs here.
 

Yeah, I noticed that too. Good spot. 👍🏻

[jjinsa]

38 minutes ago, Valtiel said:

There is a lot to like here, I would just make the following adjustments:



Your overall address position including hand position and eye line as noted above are generally too close. Hands too close to the body, eye line too far out over the ball. Your first move off the ball looks to be subconsciously correcting this via pushing your hands away and backing up slightly. Nothing fatal, but suggestive of the need to adjust your position relative to the ball at address. The somewhere between the amount your hands push out and your eye line backs up is how much further you should be from the ball. Eye line should closer to halfway between your feet and the ball (currently it's about 2/3rds towards the ball) and you want some daylight between the butt of the club and the front of your thighs here.
 

Thanks!  I also notice my arms don't hang straight down, they go slightly "towards" my body. 

In getting further away, without moving my feet back, what are the options for actually doing it?  Less bend at the hip / stand taller?  Or should I step back slightly and stand further away?

 

Regarding hands moving towards ball initially, should they move in slightly or straight back rather?

[jjinsa]

44 minutes ago, TheDeanAbides said:

What do you mean by “too active”? I’m in the camp that believes that most players are too inactive with their arms leading to getting stuck. 
 

The goal should be a firm grip, but with relaxed forearms. 

To be honest, I don't know exactly.  I hit a draw generally, and I just know when I hit a bad swing (might be a block to the right, or an over hook), I feel my hands/arms "hit" the ball too much, and it is inconsistent.  The less I feel myself trying to "hit" it, the better I hit it.  Almost trying to turn the club over too actively.

[TheDeanAbides]

8 minutes ago, jjinsa said:

To be honest, I don't know exactly.  I hit a draw generally, and I just know when I hit a bad swing (might be a block to the right, or an over hook), I feel my hands/arms "hit" the ball too much, and it is inconsistent.  The less I feel myself trying to "hit" it, the better I hit it.  Almost trying to turn the club over too actively.

I agree with @Valtiel. Your swing is basically excellent, but you could use a hair more room which should help with that. 
 

Often when we find ourselves saving the swing like that it’s because we’ve stalled and the hands have had to save the shot. We often stall because the arms aren’t active enough in transition. Getting the arms off the body easily creates the room for the downswing to happen. 

[jjinsa]

9 minutes ago, TheDeanAbides said:

I agree with @Valtiel. Your swing is basically excellent, but you could use a hair more room which should help with that. 
 

Often when we find ourselves saving the swing like that it’s because we’ve stalled and the hands have had to save the shot. We often stall because the arms aren’t active enough in transition. Getting the arms off the body easily creates the room for the downswing to happen. 

Okay, now you have reminded me something.  What I do try to do, is to do a very little "cast" for lack of a better word, not a cast as in someone who slices the ball, but a cast as per how Monty would describe it.  I start with an almost visually unnoticeable cast of the wrists, and when I do this, my ball striking goes through the roof.  I forget about it sometimes, and I think this causes me to be more active to flip the club at the bottom of the swing.  I think this better describes what I mean by too active. 

[TheDeanAbides]

11 minutes ago, jjinsa said:

Okay, now you have reminded me something.  What I do try to do, is to do a very little "cast" for lack of a better word, not a cast as in someone who slices the ball, but a cast as per how Monty would describe it.  I start with an almost visually unnoticeable cast of the wrists, and when I do this, my ball striking goes through the roof.  I forget about it sometimes, and I think this causes me to be more active to flip the club at the bottom of the swing.  I think this better describes what I mean by too active. 

Yep, that NTC 'cast' move is essential along with getting the arms off the chest. 

[jjinsa]

3 hours ago, TheDeanAbides said:

Yep, that NTC 'cast' move is essential along with getting the arms off the chest. 

Thanks!  What does "NTC" mean? What do you mean by "getting the arms off the chest"?

[TheDeanAbides]

1 minute ago, jjinsa said:

Thanks!  What does "NTC" mean? What do you mean by "getting the arms off the chest"?

NTC = no turn cast ala Monte.

 

Getting the arms off the chest as shown by Justin Rose here. 

 

[jjinsa]

14 minutes ago, TheDeanAbides said:

NTC = no turn cast ala Monte.

 

Getting the arms off the chest as shown by Justin Rose here. 

 

Ah, just didn't know what the NTC stood for haha.  Got you with Justin Rose there, I would have referred to it in my layman's terms, as dropping the arms.  Appreciate all the comments and help!

[jjinsa]

@TheDeanAbides @Valtiel, one of your comments was about my hands being a little close to thighs and eyeline to close to ball.  What would a fix be for this?

Less bend at the hip?  Or stand further away?  What would be the best way to correct this?

[TheDeanAbides]

I’ve found this method to be foolproof on any lie. Your body knows how to balance you without you getting in the way. 
 

 

Edited April 23 by TheDeanAbides