If you could change one rule in golf....

[resist_hard.]

Hitting out of a divot is part of golf IMO. Its not difficult to do.

 

The only things that i would change is removing stones from near your ball in a bunker. There is nothing worse then dinging your forged wedge. Especially if you know its going to happen.

 

The second is patting down spike marks and repairing pitch marks in your putting line.

[longballjs]

But shouldn't the range be marked as a hazard?

 

No, you think that club wants knuckleheads like many of us on here who would run out into a busy range to save a stroke and risk being hit by a screaming line drive?

 

Its marked that way before the round, you knew you had to be straight there, and the rule applies to everyone - what is the problem - put down the driver, pull out a 3 iron and get on with the round

[cnelson]

Hitting out of a divot is part of golf IMO. Its not difficult to do.

 

The only things that i would change is removing stones from near your ball in a bunker. There is nothing worse then dinging your forged wedge. Especially if you know its going to happen.

 

The second is patting down spike marks and repairing pitch marks in your putting line.

 

 

Agree with stones in the bunker. The European tour allows for stones/rocks to moved out of bunker. (When the PGA tour was question why this isn't allowed, they said how do you define a stone? The answer of the European tour was, we know a stone when we see on! ha)

 

You can repair pitch marks on the putting surface just not spike marks. :)

 

longballs, you bring up a good point!

[MGWP]

The argument that you should not have it there...ie out of bounds v/s stroke and distance...is not at all vaild.

 

Why should out of bounds yield a more sever penalty than hitting into a hazrd...it should not.

There is no valid reason why out of bounds should not be treated in the same way as a lateral hazard.

 

The siging the scorecard thing...that should not change...as a player you SHOULD be resonsible for that..goodness me responsiblilty for that is minor...how hard can that be?

really..

this coming from somebody who was dq'd in the sate am after 3 rounds, one back of the lead, for failing to check my card.

[cnelson]

The argument that you should not have it there...ie out of bounds v/s stroke and distance...is not at all vaild.

 

Why should out of bounds yield a more sever penalty than hitting into a hazrd...it should not.

There is no valid reason why out of bounds should not be treated in the same way as a lateral hazard.

 

The siging the scorecard thing...that should not change...as a player you SHOULD be resonsible for that..goodness me responsiblilty for that is minor...how hard can that be?

really..

this coming from somebody who was dq'd in the sate am after 3 rounds, one back of the lead, for failing to check my card.

 

My argument isn't valid? So if someone pounds a 350 yard drive, that goes OB, they get to talk up, take a drop, hit onto the green, and still save par easily? The penalty NEEDS to be more than a hazard.

 

At least with water, chances are the player wasn't to far offline. Normally OB you need to hit a pretty bad shot to get there..

 

And the valid reason is.. the rule book says so. :)

[longballjs]

The argument that you should not have it there...ie out of bounds v/s stroke and distance...is not at all vaild.

 

Why should out of bounds yield a more sever penalty than hitting into a hazrd...it should not.

There is no valid reason why out of bounds should not be treated in the same way as a lateral hazard.

 

The rationale is more practical than anything else - to discourage play at or near that point. Many OB areas border homes, roads, and parking lots - areas that are often not on the property of the club and that contain things that cost a lot of money to repair when a ball goes through or into one ( i actually knew a guy who hooked an iron into a house through the dining room window and destroyed their china set). The clubs all have insurance to protect against this, and increasing the penalty theoretically should deter people from playing near there and decreasing the potential for a bad situation. Most hazards are internal and within the confines of the golf course and property of the club.

[rankoutsider]

Mine is going to be very unpopular, but one of the things I dislike in the rules is how often you have to find the "nearest point of complete relief." That spot can be a truly miserable two feet of the golf course. There is no way to describe "roughly similar playing conditions" etc. that will mean the same thing to all golfers, but when your ball stops on a cartpath or in casual water or on a sprinkler-head 3 inches from the putting surface, and your nearest point of complete relief no nearer the hole is a downhill lie in the rough, six feet from a short pin, etc. etc. it is difficult to take your drop. You don't have to take your drop, but hitting off a sprinkler head poses problems of its own.

 

In almost every other situation in golf, it is deemed to be advantageous to go nearer to the hole, so why not allow people to take relief further from the hole even if it is not the nearest point of complete relief from the obstruction, etc. I'm not saying people should be allowed to drop it on the fairway, but man, sometimes you get really torched on that one.

 

I can provide anecdotes from my own tournament play if need be.

[SwingLikeElk]

BTW; The comment about scorecards.. The players do NOT have to add up the strokes. All they must do is simply write in the numbers and sign the card. (to my understanding) it is the sole job of the committee to add the scores, the only way to be DQ is if you have a 4 on your card, and the player really made a 5. (to my understand at least, and the way all tournaments i've ever played in have been)

 

 

Irrelevant. In no other game does a player or team (that I can think of) have to keep score and assert that the score is correct at the end, or be disqualified.

 

With the computers, cameras, spotters, and officials all over the place, and with millions of dollars at stake each week, keeping score on paper is rediculous.

 

And even with the "keep score" rules, the fact that a player could walk away from the scoring table, for whatever stupid reason, and not be allowed to walk back and sign the scorecard is equally stupid (ala Michelle Wie).

 

Rule: sink putt on 18, game over- walk to locker room or collect trophy. Done. Anything else is having a rule for the rule's sake.

 

In amateur tournaments without all the volunteers and computers, different story. Especially with the size of a golf course and the number of participants. But in a pro tourny? C'mon. Silliness. Look at the PGA Tour web site with the stats, shot tracker, etc. We know the score almost before the player does!

 

 

IMO,

 

The game has nothing to do with officials, cameras or computers. It has to do with integrity. One day, we may all have a chip implanted in our brains that would prevent mistakes of any kind. But you will STILL have to sign your card. This rule isn't meant to offend. It's your stamp that you believe what you are turning in is accurate. People have lost the Masters over this. Yet it is quite easy to prevent a disaster by reviewing your card.

[Smokey1226]

The divot one in the fairway is definitely the rule to change however the only way i can see it being done is just to have placing on all the time. If distinguishing between divot and not divot is going to cause issues just say if you hit it in the fairway you can place it within a foot regardless.

 

 

agreed, If they needed to....make the fairway (short cut) tighter, with a longer/wider first cut.

 

That way you are being rewarded for being extremely accurate and you dont to be punished for hitting a nearly perfect shot.

[pjccjp]

stroke and distance

 

 

Stroke and distance what? Ha. There has to be at least 12 rules that you may continue under stroke and distance, are you saying that stoke and distance just shouldn't be an option?

 

The idea behind not grounding in a hazard (any kind of hazard) is that you may be able to get an idea of how the club with react to the ball. No offense, but golf clubs aren't some sort of fancy pen.. If they get banged up, they get banged up. I've seen people play balls off cart paths because the nearest point of relief was horrible. Of course you just make sure you catch that ball thin! ha.

 

Stroke AND Distance is a double penalty. I don't think there is another rule that I am aware of that penalizes a player twice for an errant shot other than that one. So, in answering the OP's question, that is the one rule I would change (regardless of circumstance - OB, lost ball, etc).

[Leeds1888]

The idea that a guy can lose a tournement with 50,000 people on site, millions on tv who know the score, because he made an addition error seems stupid in todays age.

 

This is the first thing I said when I saw the thread title. It doesn't happen often but Major Championships have been lost over this garbage.

[cnelson]

stroke and distance

 

 

Stroke and distance what? Ha. There has to be at least 12 rules that you may continue under stroke and distance, are you saying that stoke and distance just shouldn't be an option?

 

The idea behind not grounding in a hazard (any kind of hazard) is that you may be able to get an idea of how the club with react to the ball. No offense, but golf clubs aren't some sort of fancy pen.. If they get banged up, they get banged up. I've seen people play balls off cart paths because the nearest point of relief was horrible. Of course you just make sure you catch that ball thin! ha.

 

Stroke AND Distance is a double penalty. I don't think there is another rule that I am aware of that penalizes a player twice for an errant shot other than that one. So, in answering the OP's question, that is the one rule I would change (regardless of circumstance - OB, lost ball, etc).

 

Its not a double penalty.. It would just be to advantageous for the player to need only do one. ie; You hit a ball OB, "oh ok, i'll drop where I went out, one stroke penalty" or, "i'll re-hit from here, no penalty." that doesn't make much sense to me.

 

 

On another note about scorecards, like someone said earlier, the point is just to protect the integrity of the game. I think its a good idea.

[MAK2525]

The Tiger version of "Loose Impediment"! To me, the definition for a loose impediment is something the player can remove by himself! It is NOT a boulder that takes 12 beer belly behemoths to roll out of the way! :ok:

[SadTrombone]

The argument that you should not have it there...ie out of bounds v/s stroke and distance...is not at all vaild.

 

Why should out of bounds yield a more sever penalty than hitting into a hazrd...it should not.

There is no valid reason why out of bounds should not be treated in the same way as a lateral hazard.

Because when you hit it OB, it's off the course. It's gone. When you hit it in a hazard, you're still on the course...go ahead and climb in and hit it out if you don't want to drop. Stroke and distance is perfect for OB. Don't hit it there. That's a very valid argument. You just don't like it.

 

Stroke AND Distance is a double penalty. I don't think there is another rule that I am aware of that penalizes a player twice for an errant shot other than that one. So, in answering the OP's question, that is the one rule I would change (regardless of circumstance - OB, lost ball, etc).

Lost ball. Stroke and distance is a great penalty for lost or ball out of bounds.

 

I'd like to see players able to tap down spike marks IF they aren't wearing metal spikes. If you aren't causing the greens to get spiked up, you shouldn't be penalized for someone who is. Likewise, if you're going to wear metal spikes, you should be willing to take the chance that someone else wearing metal spikes is going to leave one in your line.

 

-mini

[MGWP]

longball..

come on mate..the out of bounds rule is alot older than the logic of houses on golf courses.

This game was played for hundreds of years before there was a house on a golf course boundary...that is a poor argument!

[longballjs]

longball..

come on mate..the out of bounds rule is alot older than the logic of houses on golf courses.

This game was played for hundreds of years before there was a house on a golf course boundary...that is a poor argument!

 

Not really - while there may not have been houses or parking lots, there was adjoining property owned by others (basic property rights does not allow one to just go onto the property of another), but in any event, for many of those years there was no out of bounds period.

 

Then it became a need to define a certain boundary for fair play and uniformity. Those ideas combined with the deterrent from damaging and/or tresspassing upon anothers property, are the reason that the rule is in place and will not change.

[MGWP]

Minitour...

That is not true...my argument is that you can hit a ball twenty yards offline into the middle of a lake abd get a drop, whilst you could be two inches"off the course" as you put it and have a sterner penalty...that is my argument.

 

You think that is right?

[dlygrisse]

1. Stroke and distance

2. 14 club rule, let's go to 12 then see how good of shotmakers the pros are

3. COR-the COR was allowed to give long hitters too much of an advantage by increasing the spring like effect which was in the rule book for years. When the USGA finally figured out a way to measure spring like effect the market was already flooded with large Titanium drivers and for the fear of a lawsuit they set the standard way too lacks. The issue I have with the rule is that long hitters seem to gain distance exponentially while shorter hitters gain very little. Shorter courses less bomb and gouge and more shot making. I love the larger Ti heads, but I dont think you should gain an COR advantage, I am fine with the MOI advantage but this is JMO.

4. I like the new groove rule, it should be enforced tomorrow and get rid of the stupid grace period. I have a spin milled wedge and love it, but again the pros gain too much of an advantage while the average guy really gains nothing.

[MGWP]

(basic property rights does not allow one to just go onto the property of another),

 

Who said anything about going onto their property?

Not me...when you hit your ball into the middle of a lake do you go onto the lake and hit it?

I maintain that the penalty does not fit the crime...as in the previous post...that is my only beef.

Very often, especially on mdern house laden golf courses, the worst of the two shots would be hitting into the hazard versus out of bounds and the penalty is less severe.

I dont see why the two penalties cannot be the same.

ie..drop and penalty shot closest point to where the ball went out of bounds.

Speed up play as well...as in wlaking up and finding that your ball is out of bounds and having to walk back to the tee.

[InTheHole]

The argument that you should not have it there...ie out of bounds v/s stroke and distance...is not at all vaild.

 

Why should out of bounds yield a more sever penalty than hitting into a hazrd...it should not.

There is no valid reason why out of bounds should not be treated in the same way as a lateral hazard.

 

The siging the scorecard thing...that should not change...as a player you SHOULD be resonsible for that..goodness me responsiblilty for that is minor...how hard can that be?

really..

this coming from somebody who was dq'd in the sate am after 3 rounds, one back of the lead, for failing to check my card.

 

Out of bounds should be more of a penalty because it is not part of the hole. Hazards are placed there to make the game more of a challenge- risk vs. reward, etc. Out of bounds is just that, out of bounds. It is not part of the playing surface. So you should be penalized more for hitting a ball outside of the valid playing surface.

 

As far as the scorecard thing, I guess we should now start asking bowlers to sign their scorecard, baseball teams to validate their score at the end of the game, maybe football teams too? This is the only sport that does this to professionals.

 

When it comes to the score, ALL that matters is what actually happened- the actual score. Reality is king here. It does not matter that the player signed the card- 4 strokes on 18 is still 4 strokes on 18- regardless of whether he put a 5 on the card or signed it. It makes no sense. We know he really shot a 4 and the only purpose to the rule in this case is to make sure the player is honest or not mistake prone. Is the 4 somehow in question? No! It will still be reported as a 4!

 

The only reason those rules exist is because when there are no officials on the course, no one to keep score for the players, all you have left is some guys word that he really shot what his scorecard says he shot. He's been out on the course for 5 hours with no supervision other than his opponent. In a professional tournament, covered on TV and the Internet, that makes no sense- it is not needed.

 

As I said, for amateur and mini-tour tournaments where you don't have all the video, computers, Shot Link, and hundreds of volunteers, absolutely- the scorecard rules should apply.

[blade_man]

I think that having to hit out of a divot in the fairway is the worst rule in golf. However in regards to the bunkers,OB and grounding club in hazard,they have to stay,golf has to have penalties for bad shots. Hitting it long and deep down the fairway is not a bad shot!! Also you should be able to tap down spike marks,the green is not a penalty area. IMO Todd

 

I agree here, you hit in a bunker and it is called a "hazard" so be careful! But as far as spike marks you shouldn't be penalized because of someones bigfooting! And scorecards, please, take responsibility to put the correct score down.

[jmiller2]

i think you should get a free drop, for having your ball in a divot in the fairway i hate that rule...

 

i don't like the scorecard rules in effect currently, the amount of errors in addition and simple wrong score on a given hole etc. i have heard rules officials tell players "take your time make sure the score card is correct before you sign it" when talking to a player that will be in a playoff or winning... just stupid...

[longballjs]

Not me...when you hit your ball into the middle of a lake do you go onto the lake and hit it?

No, I dont, nor do I hit one out of a back yard - Does the country club bare any risk when you hit the ball in a lake, fish going to file a claim with insurance - It may not be the only reason, but it is certainly a factor

 

Out of bounds should be more of a penalty because it is not part of the hole. Hazards are placed there to make the game more of a challenge- risk vs. reward, etc. Out of bounds is just that, out of bounds. It is not part of the playing surface. So you should be penalized more for hitting a ball outside of the valid playing surface.

 

exactly

[astamm8]

i'd change the penalty for holing a putt with the flag in. i play as a single a lot, and i can't tend my own flag. if it's a long putt or a ridge or something, and i can't see the flag, i'm in a tough spot. formerly, there was no penalty for this. i'm not sure when or why it was changed, but i think it should be changed back. the only advantage i can see is leaving in the flag on a slick down hiller or the like and using it for a backstop. obviously that's risky, but for me it's not enough of an advantage to overcome the problem of making the player take it out.

[Double True]

As for the whole scorecard debacle, instead of DQ'ing a player for that, give them a sever penalty like 4 strokes or something. It punishes them in a way to where they still finish the tourney and get paid for their play but at the same time might drop them a few spots as well. Hell, you might even see a change in the leaderboard from time to time too.

[muxi87]

I like the game as is, but if I were to change one rule, it'd be in regards to divots. A well struck shot that travels into the fairway shouldn't run the risk of landing in a worse lie than one that is 50 yards offline. This is especially bad on tour where the guys are generally hitting shots to the same place on the golf course (especially on par 5 layup shots). I don't know how you would police moving it from the divot...but if I were to change one, that would be it.

[squarre]

Scorecard rules for me - both the DQ for a lower score on a hole and having to keep the higher score on a hole. Signing an incorrect scorecard has nothing to do with playing golf. I don't understand the integrity argument for the cards. If someone is cheating by listing lower scores then it is a completely different problem/situation.

 

I have "won" a tournament due to an incorrect scorecard by a fellow competitor and it really made the victory feel strange. And no I wasn't keeping his card.

[jmiller2]

i'd change the penalty for holing a putt with the flag in. i play as a single a lot, and i can't tend my own flag. if it's a long putt or a ridge or something, and i can't see the flag, i'm in a tough spot. formerly, there was no penalty for this. i'm not sure when or why it was changed, but i think it should be changed back. the only advantage i can see is leaving in the flag on a slick down hiller or the like and using it for a backstop. obviously that's risky, but for me it's not enough of an advantage to overcome the problem of making the player take it out.

 

i think there are some rules in effect to preserve the caddie's job...

rule 17-2 i find kinda funny... (this happened on the PGA Tour before a players follow-competitor tended the flag to avoid having his playing partner receive a 2 stroke penalty and in doing so got 2 strokes himself...)

 

17-2. Unauthorized Attendance

If an opponent or his caddie in match play or a fellow-competitor or his caddie in stroke play, without the player's authority or prior knowledge, attends, removes or holds up the flagstick during the stroke or while the ball is in motion, and the act might influence the movement of the ball, the opponent or fellow-competitor incurs the applicable penalty.

 

*Penalty for Breach of Rule 17-1 or 17-2:

Match play - Loss of hole; Stroke play - Two strokes.

 

*In stroke play, if a breach of Rule 17-2 occurs and the competitor's ball subsequently strikes the flagstick, the person attending or holding it or anything carried by him, the competitor incurs no penalty. The ball is played as it lies, except that if the stroke was made on the putting green, the stroke is canceled and the ball must be replaced and replayed.

 

i find majority of the flagstick rules kinda funny

[krustyburger]

i think you should get a free drop, for having your ball in a divot in the freeway i hate that rule...

 

Wouldn't a divot in the freeway be called a pothole?

[cnelson]

(basic property rights does not allow one to just go onto the property of another),

 

Who said anything about going onto their property?

Not me...when you hit your ball into the middle of a lake do you go onto the lake and hit it?

I maintain that the penalty does not fit the crime...as in the previous post...that is my only beef.

Very often, especially on mdern house laden golf courses, the worst of the two shots would be hitting into the hazard versus out of bounds and the penalty is less severe.

I dont see why the two penalties cannot be the same.

ie..drop and penalty shot closest point to where the ball went out of bounds.

Speed up play as well...as in wlaking up and finding that your ball is out of bounds and having to walk back to the tee.

 

Honestly? Come on, know the rules!

 

Rule 27-2 (a) Provisional Ball. A ball may be re-hit if the original ball is thought to be lost outsides the margins of a hazard (OB isn't a hazard, so if you think its OB you may play a provisional ball) You may continue to play that ball as long as it is no nearer to the hole, than where the original ball lay. If you play it from a point past where the original ball lay, the provisional ball in now in play. If you find your original ball, you may play it as long as you didn't play the provisional from a spot nearer the hole.

 

That rule is for speed of play!!