is this considered as sandbagging?

[gandor]

wow! thanks!

[quote name='Pepperturbo' post='2006337' date='Oct 14 2009, 01:33 PM'][quote name='gandor' post='2005832' date='Oct 14 2009, 10:13 AM']when i play regular/casual round i play very aggressive like trying to hit the pin and trying to reach the green in two on long par 5s which cost me most of the time a lot of stroke but when i play with really good players i tend to play safe so i wont slow our round and in the end i end up with a better score. I would think if I join a tournament i would play safe as well and more than likely i would shot below my handicap. for example my last round i was 1 under after 6 holes then on the 7th hole par 5 i tried to hit a hook on my (255 yrds)second shot behind a tree and ended up hitting the tree and my balls bounced off a hazard and ended up with quad bogey but if there was something on the line like if it was tournament/or $ involved then i would have more than likely played safe i would probably still make par or double at worst. and before you flame on me i dont play aggressive just to post a high score. i just think that during casual round is when i can test/practice/hit these kind of shots(working the ball, hitting my fairway woods to get in 2...etc) and not just on the range.[/quote]

You practice on the range... then take what's proven to the course and post the results; least that's what most better golfers do. What I don't do is practice shots I don't have while casually playing 18 because my score walking off 18 would essentially artificially inflate my index when posted.

This might not be what you're hoping for but it's what I would think if facing you on the 1st tee. You've made it clear you have two games, causal which equates to going for it every possible chance which results in high scores, and the more conservative game you showcase when playing with better players like myself or in tournaments...

Your handicap is developed from the 10 best of the last 20 rds. Depending on course ratings and the number of better rounds, your index probably shows higher, not reflecting your actual game. Sand-baggers come in all shapes and conniving sizes.

After sharing what will likely be construed as a manipulative excuse for a higher index which gets you more strokes then you deserve; in plain words, because I don't know what's inside your intent all I can do is say you're a manipulative sand-bagger.
[/quote]

[Ronzo]

[quote name='luxman' post='2006333' date='Oct 14 2009, 04:32 PM']Simply put, you are supposed to post all rounds playing under the rules of golf. So, those rounds you play alone or hit multiple balls should not be posted.[/quote]

Lux, my understanding is that you can (and should) post a round played according to the Rules of Golf, even if you played alone. As long as the rules of a stipulated round are followed (ball played as it lies, no multiple shots played from a position, etc.), and the score is posted honestly, then it should be a round acceptable for handicap purposes. Am I incorrect in this assumption?

If the issue is peer review, then posting similar scores with members of my club to witness them should suffice for that, correct?

[Ronzo]

[quote name='Pepperturbo' post='2006337' date='Oct 14 2009, 04:33 PM']You practice on the range... then take what's proven to the course and post the results; least that's what most better golfers do. What I don't do is practice shots I don't have while casually playing 18 because my score walking off 18 would essentially artificially inflate my index when posted.

This might not be what you're hoping for but it's what I would think if facing you on the 1st tee. You've made it clear you have two games, causal which equates to going for it every possible chance which results in high scores, and the more conservative game you showcase when playing with [size=4]better players like myself[/size] or in tournaments...[/quote]
Pepperturbo, you find ways to aggrandize yourself that most of the world probably doesn't know actually exists.

[quote name='Pepperturbo' post='2006337' date='Oct 14 2009, 04:33 PM']Your handicap is developed from the 10 best of the last 20 rds. Depending on course ratings and the number of better rounds, your index probably shows higher, not reflecting your actual game. Sand-baggers come in all shapes and conniving sizes.

After sharing what will likely be construed as a manipulative excuse for a higher index which gets you more strokes then you deserve; in plain words, because I don't know what's inside your intent [size=4]all I can do is say you're a manipulative sand-bagger[/size].[/quote]

You also find ways to be harsh that most of us on this forum don't choose to use.

One of these days, you'll say that to someone who won't tolerate it. Unless you wouldn't dare to say it that way to a man's face.

[Pepperturbo]

Yes, you are correct as far as I know. There are folks that think everyone should follow a few unpractical rules like there's suppose to be a witness to your round. Everyone I know overlooks that line of thought because we're honest players.... you know that part of golf that says we're different then other sports; we call our own penalties and pride ourselves in being honest

[gandor]

it's all good man. I think we heard you now. A 1.3 index and ultimate warrior.

[quote name='Pepperturbo' post='2006459' date='Oct 14 2009, 02:28 PM'][quote name='Ronzo' post='2006431' date='Oct 14 2009, 03:17 PM'][quote name='Pepperturbo' post='2006337' date='Oct 14 2009, 04:33 PM']You practice on the range... then take what's proven to the course and post the results; least that's what most better golfers do. What I don't do is practice shots I don't have while casually playing 18 because my score walking off 18 would essentially artificially inflate my index when posted.

This might not be what you're hoping for but it's what I would think if facing you on the 1st tee. You've made it clear you have two games, causal which equates to going for it every possible chance which results in high scores, and the more conservative game you showcase when playing with [size=4]better players like myself[/size] or in tournaments...[/quote]
Pepperturbo, you find ways to aggrandize yourself that most of the world probably doesn't know actually exists.

[quote name='Pepperturbo' post='2006337' date='Oct 14 2009, 04:33 PM']Your handicap is developed from the 10 best of the last 20 rds. Depending on course ratings and the number of better rounds, your index probably shows higher, not reflecting your actual game. Sand-baggers come in all shapes and conniving sizes.

After sharing what will likely be construed as a manipulative excuse for a higher index which gets you more strokes then you deserve; in plain words, because I don't know what's inside your intent [size=4]all I can do is say you're a manipulative sand-bagger[/size].[/quote]

You also find ways to be harsh that most of us on this forum don't choose to use.

One of these days, you'll say that to someone who won't tolerate it. Unless you wouldn't dare to say it that way to a man's face.
[/quote]

You're an immature jerk that's obviously poorly read based the posting intent you reference; but that's nothing new. I wasn't aggrandizing either, the word means "to make great or greater". I included myself because of my 1.3 this month keeping within the OP's stated perimeters. Excuse me... I forgot; you didn't read all his words so its no wonder comprehension fails you. ps wizbang - note my aviatar - it speaks to my background or to my ability to stand my ground in person.
[/quote]

[Ronzo]

[quote name='Pepperturbo' post='2006459' date='Oct 14 2009, 05:28 PM']You're an immature jerk that's obviously poorly read based the posting intent you reference; but that's nothing new. I wasn't aggrandizing either, the word means "to make great or greater". I included myself because of my 1.3 this month keeping within the OP's stated perimeters. Excuse me... I forgot; you didn't read all his words so its no wonder comprehension fails you. ps wizbang - note my aviatar - it speaks to my background or to my ability to stand my ground in person.[/quote]

Pepperturbo, feel as you like. Those who know me personally would get a good laugh at the "poorly read" comment. As for your avatar, that doesn't matter to me, even if we were face to face. I will say this: if you said that to my face, I would be inviting you outside to discuss this further. Even if I were to get my a$$ kicked, at least I'll have stood up for myself.

When you post comments as you did, I find you to be quite obnoxious. I will call you on it if I see it. You have a lot of good information to offer, such as the response to my earlier post. It's a shame that you have difficulty sharing that knowledge in a more constructive and less irritating way.

Have a good day, and enjoy your next round of golf.

[Ronzo]

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"Special Forces Assessment and Selection (SFAS) is the first phase of the Special Forces Qualification Course, held at Camp Mackall. It is a mentally and physically demanding course designed to see if the soldier has the twelve "Whole Man" attributes to continue in Special Forces training and to serve on an ODA. These attributes include intelligence, physical fitness, motivation, trustworthiness, accountability, maturity, stability, judgment, decisiveness, teamwork, influence, and communications. Approximately forty percent of all candidates attempting SFAS are successful."

[InTheHole]

C'mon guys, if you can't contribute constructively to the thread, go elsewhere.

[luxman]

[quote name='Ronzo' post='2006410' date='Oct 14 2009, 05:05 PM'][quote name='luxman' post='2006333' date='Oct 14 2009, 04:32 PM']Simply put, you are supposed to post all rounds playing under the rules of golf. So, those rounds you play alone or hit multiple balls should not be posted.[/quote]

Lux, my understanding is that you can (and should) post a round played according to the Rules of Golf, even if you played alone. As long as the rules of a stipulated round are followed (ball played as it lies, no multiple shots played from a position, etc.), and the score is posted honestly, then it should be a round acceptable for handicap purposes. Am I incorrect in this assumption?

If the issue is peer review, then posting similar scores with members of my club to witness them should suffice for that, correct?
[/quote]

You would be correct

5-1a/2. Score Made When Playing Alone
Q: If a player plays alone, should the score be returned for handicap purposes?
A: Yes, provided the round is played in accordance with the Rules of Golf

However,

5-1d/2. Status of Scores Made when Two Balls Played Throughout Round
Q: A player [b]frequently[/b] plays alone and plays two balls throughout the round. May the player return the score made with each ball for handicap purposes?
A: No. The player may not return the score made with either ball, as such scores are not made in accordance with the Rules of Golf�see Rule 7-2 of �The Rules of Golf.�

I post this because in another thread the OP started another thread and stated "[b]i usually play by myself every weekday at my club after work and play more than one ball every hole[/b] but i only score the first ball. should i post my score?

So, in this particular case, I would say that 5-1d/2 would apply.

Call me untrusting, but of 1000 golfers I would bet that you could count on one hand how many would actually play by the rules of golf to the letter of the law if they were playing by themselves.

Further, if someone has to ask if it's sandbagging there's obviously a thought in their mind that it is. If it walks like a duck, quacks like a duck, looks like a duck, it must be a duck.

[Ronzo]

Thanks, Lux!

[gandor]

like i said i havent posted anything yet...so you guys think its better(fair) if i dont post my casual rounds when i play aggressive and shoot high score and just post my score when i play as if im playing in a tournament? and yes i didnt intend to ask this question to be a sandbagger...i just wanted to be clear before i start posting my score...

[InTheHole]

I think the general consensus is more that you should post all your rounds and stop sandbagging!

[gandor]

[quote name='InTheHole' post='2008559' date='Oct 15 2009, 01:53 PM']I think the general consensus is more that you should post all your rounds and stop sandbagging![/quote]

sandbagging??? im still not sure what u dont understand on my post. i have not posted anything and im already being judge wow!

[InTheHole]

[quote name='gandor' post='2008568' date='Oct 15 2009, 04:57 PM'][quote name='InTheHole' post='2008559' date='Oct 15 2009, 01:53 PM']I think the general consensus is more that you should post all your rounds and stop sandbagging![/quote]

sandbagging??? im still not sure what u dont understand on my post. i have not posted anything and im already being judge wow!
[/quote]


Then post all your rounds!

[gandor]

[quote name='InTheHole' post='2008559' date='Oct 15 2009, 01:53 PM']I think the general consensus is more that you should post all your rounds and stop sandbagging![/quote]

btw, you really are InThe"HOLE"...peace!

[Pepperturbo]

Better golfers, or should I say those like me that play by the rules become uneasy about sandbagers... its even worse when giving strokes or people are playing off my ball. I play with guys where I give 18-22 strokes. My teeth hurt just thinking about that.

Anyways, like I said don't play one style of golf with your better golfer friends and another more aggressive style attempting any shot during casual rds because it distorts your scores; and depending on how you post those cards you've collected it they can artificially inflate your index. Leave practicing shots for the range - and take the shots you know you have to the course, then using ESC post the result. Good luck.

[gandor]

now thats much more helpful reply. thanks man!

[quote name='Pepperturbo' post='2008637' date='Oct 15 2009, 02:31 PM']Better golfers, or should I say those like me that play by the rules become uneasy about sandbagers... its even worse when giving strokes or people are playing off my ball. I play with guys where I give 18-22 strokes. My teeth hurt just thinking about that.

Anyways, like I said don't play one style of golf with your better golfer friends and another more aggressive style attempting any shot during casual rds because it distorts your scores; and depending on how you post those cards you've collected it they can artificially inflate your index. Leave practicing shots for the range - and take the shots you know you have to the course, then using ESC post the result. Good luck.[/quote]

[Pepperturbo]

There are many good golfers on this site. Beware most won't help and are NOT instructors, including me. Trying to formulate exactly what someone is looking to hear face to face is difficult; in 2D world its that much more difficult. In my earlier posts to you I was telling it like it is when my buddy's or I encounter a "possible" sand-bagger; sorry if it came across otherwise.

I say what I think and know and do NOT blow smoke up anyone's... Either someone wants to learn and recognizes the information is free, or they want to be told what ever in a certain way... If it's the later, they probably won't like my contribution.

[bigred90gt]

[quote name='luxman' post='2006333' date='Oct 14 2009, 03:32 PM']Simply put, you are supposed to post all rounds playing under the rules of golf. So, those rounds you play alone or hit multiple balls should not be posted.[/quote]

Why would you not post a round just because you played alone? I dont recall seeing anything in the rules of golf stating that you cannot play alone.

EDIT: I posted that before I read any of the posts following it. This has already been addressed, so nevermind.

[jjj912]

Let's go to the USGA handicap manual and see what it says.

[i]1-1. Purpose
The purpose of the USGA Handicap System is to make the game of golf more enjoyable by enabling players of differing abilities to compete on an equitable basis. The System provides a fair Course Handicap for each player, regardless of ability, and adjusts a player's Handicap Index up or down as the player's game changes. At the same time, the System disregards high scores that bear little relation to the player's potential ability and promotes continuity by making a Handicap Index continuous from one playing season or year to the next. A Handicap Index is useful for all forms of play, and is issued only to individuals who are members of a licensed golf club.
[b]Two basic premises underlie the USGA Handicap System[/b], namely that [b]each player will try to make the best score at every hole in every round[/b], regardless of where the round is played, [b]and [/b]that [b]the player will post every acceptable round for peer review[/b]. The player and the player's Handicap Committee have joint responsibility for adhering to these premises.[/i] (Empahsis added.)

The premise that each player will try to make the best score at every hole in every round is very much debateable as this thread is but one of many where someone has commented that they play two different styles of golf: tournament style (where the goal is to shoot a low score by concentrating on the game and carefully balancing risks and rewards) and non-tournament style (where the goal or method is something else).

In theory, a golfer's handicap is reduced to reflect exceptionally low tournament scores. This is accomplished by using an alternate method for calculating golfer's handicap spelled out in section 10 of the handicap manual. The alternate method allows for a player's handicap index to be reduced by as much as 13.7 strokes.

In practice, I don't know what happens. It could be that the difference between the player's tournament differentials and non-tournament differentials isn't sufficient to merit a reduction (despite the golfer's claims to the contrary. The difference needed is 3 strokes), or the scores aren't being reported by the player (or are reported, but not as tournament scores), or maybe the alternate calculation is never performed.

[InTheHole]

You also have to remember, from the perspective of the handicap system, the USGA is [i]assuming[/i] you are attempting to make the best score on every hole. It has no way of knowing what the player's intentions are... [i]they assume you are going for the lowest score possible on every hole.[/i]

If the player is [i]not[/i] doing that, tough... the score still stands and should be posted.

Of course, the way out is to not follow The Rules of Golf and call the whole round a wash.