A Handicap Index Quandry

[Sean2]

Last year my overall handicap was a 13.2, however during tournaments I'd get my lunch handed to me. As a senior I like to play par three courses, in addition to regulation courses. I went over all my rounds and on par three/executive courses my HI was a 5.8. On regulation courses my HI was a 17.7. All the tournaments I play in are on regulation courses.

 

I was wondering for this year if I should just not post my par three scores since they are so out of whack from my regulation course scores? For example, last year on a par 60 I shot a 59. Yet, the best I shot on a regulation course was an 82 (par 70). I want to follow the rules, yet at the same time I don't want to be way behind the 8-ball in any tournament before I even tee the ball up. It's discouraging.

 

I'm perplexed and would appreciate any comments.

[KevCarter]

Man Sean, I see why you are perplexed!

That just doesn't sound right, and it's something I haven't thought about. My club has a 9 hole par 3 course that the members play just for fun, but it isn't rated by the USGA so nobody even thinks about turning those scores in. Does the par 3 course you play have a USGA Course Rating and Slope?

You know what the book says, if it is USGA rated, the scores should be turned in, but that just doesn't seem fair at all to you...

Kevin


[color=#474747][size=2][color=#7F7F7F][size=3]b. Scores on All Courses[/size][/color]

[color=#7F7F7F][size=3][i][url="http://www.usga.org/workarea/linkit.aspx?linkidentifier=id&itemid=14370#AdjustedGrossScore"]Adjusted gross scores[/url][/i] from all courses with a [i][url="http://www.usga.org/workarea/linkit.aspx?linkidentifier=id&itemid=14370#USGACourseRating"]USGA Course Rating[/url][/i] and [i][url="http://www.usga.org/workarea/linkit.aspx?linkidentifier=id&itemid=14370#SlopeRating"]Slope Rating[/url][/i] made during an [i][url="http://www.usga.org/workarea/linkit.aspx?linkidentifier=id&itemid=14370#activeseason"]active season[/url][/i], both at home and away, must be posted by the player along with the appropriate [i][url="http://www.usga.org/workarea/linkit.aspx?linkidentifier=id&itemid=14370#USGACourseRating"]USGA Course Rating[/url][/i] and [i][url="http://www.usga.org/workarea/linkit.aspx?linkidentifier=id&itemid=14370#SlopeRating"]Slope Rating[/url][/i]. (See Decision [url="http://www.usga.org/workarea/linkit.aspx?linkidentifier=id&itemid=14380#5-1b/1"]5-1b/1[/url].)[/size][/color]

[/size][/color]

[InTheHole]

Unless you don't follow the Rules of Golf (hint hint), you have to post the scores.

It must be a pretty long Par 3 course if it is rated. I thought a course had to be 3000 yards to be considered for a handicap, but I could be wrong.

I have an 18 hole executive course near me, Par 60, that is just over 3000 yards. All Par 3 and Par 4 holes. It is rated and I include it in my handicap.

I have the opposite problem- on the Par 60 course, my handicap soars because any mistake is compounded in the score. An 8 on a Par 60 is much worse than that same 8 on a Par 72.

The fact that you are so different on the two types of courses tells me you play pretty well but your endurance gets to you. On the longer course, you must have some blowup holes- and just by your description and not knowing you at all, I would say you need to increase your endurance and focus, not your golfing skills. But like I said, I don't know you at all so I could be way off of course- please don't take offense.

Those executive courses are like a carrot held out in front of a horse... they are so tempting. My course has no tee times- you just show up and the starter sends you out in groups or on your own. Great for a two hour round when you don't have time for a regulation course and formal tee times. You can grab a spur of the moment round of golf. Better than sitting home. But if you rush yourself, the score can soar. The course isn't as easy as it looks.

[OpusX20]

You are correct InTheHole, regarding the 3,000 yards. See below...

[url=""][/url][i]5-1f/1. Returning Scores Made at Par-3 Golf Courses[/i]

[i]Q: Why is it not permissible for a Handicap Index to be computed from scores made on par-3 courses which are less than 3,000 yards in length?[/i]

[i]A: Such courses do not normally require the use of a full set of clubs. It would not be equitable to handicap players on such short courses on the same basis as players on standard courses. A score on such a course is analogous to a score made in a competition that limits types of clubs. Such scores are not acceptable.[/i]

[i]However, scores made on par-3 courses may be used to produce equitable handicaps for use at such courses only. Please follow the policy in Appendix A.

[/i]Appendix A is pretty ugly, but if anyone is interested, here is the link...
[url="http://www.usga.org/Rule-Books/Handicap-System-Manual/Appendix-A/"]http://www.usga.org/Rule-Books/Handicap-System-Manual/Appendix-A/[/url]

[KevCarter]

[quote name='InTheHole' date='25 February 2010 - 08:43 AM' timestamp='1267108999' post='2276145']
It must be a pretty long Par 3 course if it is rated. I thought a course had to be 3000 yards to be considered for a handicap, but I could be wrong.
[/quote]


[quote name='OpusX20' date='25 February 2010 - 08:54 AM' timestamp='1267109682' post='2276166']
You are correct InTheHole, regarding the 3,000 yards. See below...

[i]5-1f/1. Returning Scores Made at Par-3 Golf Courses[/i]

[i]Q: Why is it not permissible for a Handicap Index to be computed from scores made on par-3 courses which are less than 3,000 yards in length?[/i]

[i]A: Such courses do not normally require the use of a full set of clubs. It would not be equitable to handicap players on such short courses on the same basis as players on standard courses. A score on such a course is analogous to a score made in a competition that limits types of clubs. Such scores are not acceptable.[/i]

[i]However, scores made on par-3 courses may be used to produce equitable handicaps for use at such courses only. Please follow the policy in Appendix A.

[/i]Appendix A is pretty ugly, but if anyone is interested, here is the link...
[url="http://www.usga.org/Rule-Books/Handicap-System-Manual/Appendix-A/"]http://www.usga.org/...ual/Appendix-A/[/url]

[/quote]

If the question asked in my response is answered, it covers both of your follow up posts.

[color=#1C2837][quote]Does the par 3 course you play have a USGA Course Rating and Slope?[/quote][/color]


Kevin

[color=#474747][size=2][b](iv) Short Course Handicaps may be issued by clubs with courses under 3,000 yards in length for 18 holes. However, such courses may not be issued a USGA Course Rating and Slope Rating. Such handicaps may not be termed a "Handicap Index" and must be identified by an "SL" to indicate that they are Short Course Handicaps. [/b][/size][/color]

[Sean2]

[quote name='kevcarter ' date='25 February 2010 - 09:33 AM' timestamp='1267108383' post='2276125']
Man Sean, I see why you are perplexed!

That just doesn't sound right, and it's something I haven't thought about. My club has a 9 hole par 3 course that the members play just for fun, but it isn't rated by the USGA so nobody even thinks about turning those scores in. Does the par 3 course you play have a USGA Course Rating and Slope?

You know what the book says, if it is USGA rated, the scores should be turned in, but that just doesn't seem fair at all to you...

Kevin


[color=#474747][size=2][color=#7F7F7F][size=3]b. Scores on All Courses[/size][/color]

[color=#7F7F7F][size=3][i][url="http://www.usga.org/workarea/linkit.aspx?linkidentifier=id&itemid=14370#AdjustedGrossScore"]Adjusted gross scores[/url][/i] from all courses with a [i][url="http://www.usga.org/workarea/linkit.aspx?linkidentifier=id&itemid=14370#USGACourseRating"]USGA Course Rating[/url][/i] and [i][url="http://www.usga.org/workarea/linkit.aspx?linkidentifier=id&itemid=14370#SlopeRating"]Slope Rating[/url][/i] made during an [i][url="http://www.usga.org/workarea/linkit.aspx?linkidentifier=id&itemid=14370#activeseason"]active season[/url][/i], both at home and away, must be posted by the player along with the appropriate [i][url="http://www.usga.org/workarea/linkit.aspx?linkidentifier=id&itemid=14370#USGACourseRating"]USGA Course Rating[/url][/i] and [i][url="http://www.usga.org/workarea/linkit.aspx?linkidentifier=id&itemid=14370#SlopeRating"]Slope Rating[/url][/i]. (See Decision [url="http://www.usga.org/workarea/linkit.aspx?linkidentifier=id&itemid=14380#5-1b/1"]5-1b/1[/url].)[/size][/color]

[/size][/color]
[/quote]
Yes, the par three courses have a USGA slope and rating. I've always posted the scores, but my HI is no indication of how I play regulation courses. And, I thought the purpose of keeping an HI was to reflect how one would do on a golf course. If I post all my scores, like last year, than I might as well not play in any tournaments because there is no way my HI is an indication of my ability, and that's what I thought it's purpose was.

[Sean2]

[quote name='InTheHole' date='25 February 2010 - 09:43 AM' timestamp='1267108999' post='2276145']
Unless you don't follow the Rules of Golf (hint hint), you have to post the scores.

It must be a pretty long Par 3 course if it is rated. I thought a course had to be 3000 yards to be considered for a handicap, but I could be wrong.

I have an 18 hole executive course near me, Par 60, that is just over 3000 yards. All Par 3 and Par 4 holes. It is rated and I include it in my handicap.

I have the opposite problem- on the Par 60 course, my handicap soars because any mistake is compounded in the score. An 8 on a Par 60 is much worse than that same 8 on a Par 72.

The fact that you are so different on the two types of courses tells me you play pretty well but your endurance gets to you. On the longer course, you must have some blowup holes- and just by your description and not knowing you at all, I would say you need to increase your endurance and focus, not your golfing skills. But like I said, I don't know you at all so I could be way off of course- please don't take offense.

Those executive courses are like a carrot held out in front of a horse... they are so tempting. My course has no tee times- you just show up and the starter sends you out in groups or on your own. Great for a two hour round when you don't have time for a regulation course and formal tee times. You can grab a spur of the moment round of golf. Better than sitting home. But if you rush yourself, the score can soar. The course isn't as easy as it looks.
[/quote]
Endurance isn't the issue. I still walk and carry. My big problem is off the tee (wildly inconsistent) and lack of distance. I'm probably a 30+ HI off the tee. I recently purchased a new driver, and I hit it better than any other (at least at the range), but I still have a long way to go. :-)

And yes, the par 60 I play is over 3000 yards.

[Sawgrass]

It seems to me that the only way around your problem it to skip the short course that's causing your handicap to stay down, and play only longer courses. Your handicap will go up to an appropriate level, and perhaps you'll improve your driver direction issues while you're at it.

Another alternative which I believe would be technically fair is to deliberately play the short course in some manner which doesn't comply with the rules of golf, thereby enabling you to legally avoid posting the scores you get when playing there, and thereby having your handicap go up to an appropriate level for a long course.

Your question (and some of my points above) raises an interesting ethical issue though, because it seems that with your particular game you could legally manipulate your handicap -- playing long courses until it goes up and then competing with an advantage on short courses. I suppose though that that advantage would be quickly addressed when posting tournament scores from the short course.

[KevCarter]

[quote name='Sawgrass' date='25 February 2010 - 01:20 PM' timestamp='1267125656' post='2276699']
...

[b]Another alternative which I believe would be technically fair is to deliberately play the short course in some manner which doesn't comply with the rules of golf, thereby enabling you to legally avoid posting the scores you get when playing there, and thereby having your handicap go up to an appropriate level for a long course.
[/b]
...
[/quote]

I think Sawgrass nailed it right here. Play two balls off the tee, or around the greens. Consider it as "practice." I think that is very doable and responsible. I would be interested in how others feel about this, but the prospect of your handicap being determined by a few rounds on a par 3 course just doesn't sit right with me.

Kevin

[Pepperturbo]

[quote name='Sean2' date='25 February 2010 - 08:22 AM' timestamp='1267107757' post='2276110']
Last year my overall handicap was a 13.2, however during tournaments I'd get my lunch handed to me. As a senior I like to play par three courses, in addition to regulation courses. I went over all my rounds and on par three/executive courses my HI was a 5.8. On regulation courses my HI was a 17.7. All the tournaments I play in are on regulation courses.

I was wondering for this year if I should just not post my par three scores since they are so out of whack from my regulation course scores? For example, last year on a par 60 I shot a 59. Yet, the best I shot on a regulation course was an 82 (par 70). I want to follow the rules, yet at the same time I don't want to be way behind the 8-ball in any tournament before I even tee the ball up. It's discouraging.

I'm perplexed and would appreciate any comments.
[/quote]
What affects your index is the course rating/slope and your score.  If the course has a rating you should post "all" scores.  I play in regulation tournaments on courses sloped 134-143, and visit two executive courses (56.4/89 and 63.1/106) with my wife around twice every two months for short game practice.  The only way your scores from an executive course will influence your overall index is if you play them way more often then more difficult regulation courses.

If you don't post, and your seen playing a course but there's no score posted, the consequences of being seen as a sand bagger, even though you're not won't feel good.

ps.. all par 3's totally under 3000yds might be one thing; over 3k which is what executive courses typically are, having some short par 4's have course ratings.

[mark m]

FYI - from the USGA Handicap System Manual - section 8-4c:

[b](v) Player Manipulates Round[/b]
The [i][url="http://www.usga.org/workarea/linkit.aspx?linkidentifier=id&itemid=14370#HandicapCommittee"]Handicap Committee[/url][/i] must adjust or withdraw the [i][url="http://www.usga.org/workarea/linkit.aspx?linkidentifier=id&itemid=14370#HandicapIndex"]Handicap Index[/url][/i] of a player who manipulates scores. (See Section [url="http://www.usga.org/workarea/linkit.aspx?linkidentifier=id&itemid=14385#8-4"]8-4f[/url].) Examples of manipulating scores include the following:

(a) Posting erroneous scores;

(b) Stopping play after 6 holes to avoid posting scores;

©[u][b] Repeatedly playing more than one ball to avoid posting scores;[/b][/u]

(d) Not adjusting hole scores under Section [url="http://www.usga.org/workarea/linkit.aspx?linkidentifier=id&itemid=14377"]4[/url];

(e) Deliberately reporting more or fewer strokes than actually scored;

(f) Deliberately taking extra strokes to inflate a score.


Handicap Police!!...just kidding.....just want you to to be aware of the rules in the book......to cover yourself you could talk to your Handicap Chairman, Club Pro and/or Handicap expert at your Golf Association and explain what is happening.....ask for advice.....something is not adding up......the system is not perfect and sometimes there are "horses for courses".....but any big differences should be analyzed......maybe this will lead to a rerating......rating short courses is a recent addition to the system.......looks like there are some problems..

We had a guy at my course that was playing the [i]majority[/i] of his rounds using more than one ball or in other ways that were not in line with the rules....obviously, he was not posting those scores.....however, he was consistently doing well in tournaments.....a little chat with him in front of the committee about this rule and his responsibilities fixed the problem......

While "repeatedly" is not defined, I would recommend limiting this practice to less than 10% of rounds played......I am not an absolutist on this and think it is not realistic to prohibit all "practice rounds" or a "playing lesson" with a pro for example.......what really matters is whether or not the player's scores in tournaments are in line with the other scores in his scoring record......hope this helps.....Good Luck

[bdcava]

I have a different but similar problem. I play in a 9 hole league and post those scores. I break 40 every once in a while and it combines those scores and gives me scores <80 on my handicap card. Yet I never break 80 when I play 18 (well I did once). Are those 9 hole scores making my cap lower than it really should be? Just wondering.

[imaplus3wannaplay]

Par 3 courses are not handicapped by the USGA. They are not considered "Championship" or regulation courses. Therefore, you are not required to post scores on a par 3 course.

The course might have a generic slope, rating, and handicap, but it was not done by the USGA.

[KevCarter]

[quote name='imaplus3wannaplay' date='25 February 2010 - 05:20 PM' timestamp='1267140022' post='2277271']
Par 3 courses are not handicapped by the USGA. They are not considered "Championship" or regulation courses. Therefore, you are not required to post scores on a par 3 course.

The course might have a generic slope, rating, and handicap, but it was not done by the USGA.
[/quote]

I think you need to read the thread again. Many rules have been posted here that are not on the same page you are on.

Kevin

[mark m]

bdcava: Maybe....consider a couple of things first:

 

Do you try harder in 9 hole league play than in your 18 hole rounds?

 

Or do you "choke" when you have a chance to break 80 for 18 holes? (Where breaking 40 for 9 isn't the same barrier for you.)

 

Or is there some other reason? Different course, different tees, etc etc

 

Only you really know the answers.......use it as motivation to shoot better 18 hole rounds....you are capable.....I had similiar problems breaking scoring barriers when I was younger....then you do it and you move on to the next one......mental game.....or will make you mental....

 

know you can do it!

 

Good Luck

 

Section 5-2

 

c. Posting Nine-Hole ScoresTo be acceptable for handicap purposes, nine-hole scores must meet the following conditions:

 

(i) The course must have a nine-hole USGA Course Rating and Slope Rating;

(ii) At least seven holes must be played.

 

There is no restriction on the number of nine-hole scores posted to a player's scoring record. Even if a player plays a majority of nine-hole rounds, that player can still utilize a Handicap Index (See Section 10-2) rather than a Handicap Index (N). (See Section 10-5 for computation of a Handicap Index (N).) (See Decision 5-2c/1.)

 

d. Treatment of Nine-Hole Scores

 

Once posted, a nine-hole score will be treated as follows:

 

(i) Nine-hole scores must not be designated as T-Scores;

(ii) When two nine-hole scores are combined, the USGA Course Rating is the sum of each nine-hole USGA Course Rating and the Slope Rating is the average of the Slope Rating of the two nines (if the average is .5, it is rounded upward to the next whole number);

(iii) Two nine-hole scores combined to create an 18-hole score should be designated with the letter C (e.g., 85C). If either of the two nine-hole scores was posted via Internet (See Section 5-2a(vi)), the score should be designated CI;

(iv) Nine-hole scores are combined in the order that they are received into the player's scoring record from any club or from any combination of nines, regardless of score type. For example, a front nine middle tee score could combine with a front nine back tee score made from any course.

 

An 18-hole score created by the combination of two nine-hole scores will display the date and course name (if applicable) of the latest nine hole score (e.g., April 29 and May 4 = May 4).

A nine-hole score will be retained for combination with another nine-hole score until it is older than the twentieth oldest eighteen-hole score in the scoring record, and nine-hole scores will be combined in the order they are received in the player's record, and "not necessarily by date."

 

Edit: added section 5-2

 

 

 

[Sean2]

[quote name='Sawgrass' date='25 February 2010 - 02:20 PM' timestamp='1267125656' post='2276699']
It seems to me that the only way around your problem it to skip the short course that's causing your handicap to stay down, and play only longer courses. Your handicap will go up to an appropriate level, and perhaps you'll improve your driver direction issues while you're at it.

Another alternative which I believe would be technically fair is to deliberately play the short course in some manner which doesn't comply with the rules of golf, thereby enabling you to legally avoid posting the scores you get when playing there, and thereby having your handicap go up to an appropriate level for a long course.

Your question (and some of my points above) raises an interesting ethical issue though, because it seems that with your particular game you could legally manipulate your handicap -- playing long courses until it goes up and then competing with an advantage on short courses. I suppose though that that advantage would be quickly addressed when posting tournament scores from the short course.[/quote]
I've been thinking of doing just that. I want to do the right thing, but I want to be fair to myself at well. When I play a regulation course my HI indicates an ability I do not yet have (almost as if I have, dare I say, a "vanity" HI). The tournaments I play are only on regulation courses, not on the par three/executive courses.

[Sean2]

[quote name='kevcarter ' date='25 February 2010 - 02:27 PM' timestamp='1267126074' post='2276713']
[quote name='Sawgrass' date='25 February 2010 - 01:20 PM' timestamp='1267125656' post='2276699']
...

[b]Another alternative which I believe would be technically fair is to deliberately play the short course in some manner which doesn't comply with the rules of golf, thereby enabling you to legally avoid posting the scores you get when playing there, and thereby having your handicap go up to an appropriate level for a long course.
[/b]
...
[/quote]

I think Sawgrass nailed it right here. Play two balls off the tee, or around the greens. Consider it as "practice." I think that is very doable and responsible. I would be interested in how others feel about this, but the prospect of your handicap being determined by a few rounds on a par 3 course just doesn't sit right with me.

Kevin
[/quote]
It doesn't sit right with me either. :-) But I also want to remain true to the rules of golf.

[Sean2]

[quote name='Pepperturbo' date='25 February 2010 - 03:09 PM' timestamp='1267128591' post='2276813']
[quote name='Sean2' date='25 February 2010 - 08:22 AM' timestamp='1267107757' post='2276110']
Last year my overall handicap was a 13.2, however during tournaments I'd get my lunch handed to me. As a senior I like to play par three courses, in addition to regulation courses. I went over all my rounds and on par three/executive courses my HI was a 5.8. On regulation courses my HI was a 17.7. All the tournaments I play in are on regulation courses.

I was wondering for this year if I should just not post my par three scores since they are so out of whack from my regulation course scores? For example, last year on a par 60 I shot a 59. Yet, the best I shot on a regulation course was an 82 (par 70). I want to follow the rules, yet at the same time I don't want to be way behind the 8-ball in any tournament before I even tee the ball up. It's discouraging.

I'm perplexed and would appreciate any comments.
[/quote]
What affects your index is the course rating/slope and your score.  If the course has a rating you should post "all" scores.  I play in regulation tournaments on courses sloped 134-143, and visit two executive courses (56.4/89 and 63.1/106) with my wife around twice every two months for short game practice.  The only way your scores from an executive course will influence your overall index is if you play them way more often then more difficult regulation courses.

If you don't post, and your seen playing a course but there's no score posted, the consequences of being seen as a sand bagger, even though you're not won't feel good.

ps.. all par 3's totally under 3000yds might be one thing; over 3k which is what executive courses typically are, having some short par 4's have course ratings.
[/quote]
And I definitely do not want to be seen as a sandbagger. I take pride in following the rules.

[imaplus3wannaplay]

[quote name='kevcarter ' date='25 February 2010 - 06:34 PM' timestamp='1267140881' post='2277304']
[quote name='imaplus3wannaplay' date='25 February 2010 - 05:20 PM' timestamp='1267140022' post='2277271']
Par 3 courses are not handicapped by the USGA. They are not considered "Championship" or regulation courses. Therefore, you are not required to post scores on a par 3 course.

The course might have a generic slope, rating, and handicap, but it was not done by the USGA.
[/quote]

I think you need to read the thread again. Many rules have been posted here that are not on the same page you are on.

Kevin
[/quote]

I don't understand what you are saying. He asked if he had to post his par 3 scores. I answered his question point blank. He doesn't have to.

[Sean2]

[quote name='mark m' date='25 February 2010 - 06:01 PM' timestamp='1267138894' post='2277237']
FYI - from the USGA Handicap System Manual - section 8-4c:

[b](v) Player Manipulates Round[/b]
The [i][url="http://www.usga.org/workarea/linkit.aspx?linkidentifier=id&itemid=14370#HandicapCommittee"]Handicap Committee[/url][/i] must adjust or withdraw the [i][url="http://www.usga.org/workarea/linkit.aspx?linkidentifier=id&itemid=14370#HandicapIndex"]Handicap Index[/url][/i] of a player who manipulates scores. (See Section [url="http://www.usga.org/workarea/linkit.aspx?linkidentifier=id&itemid=14385#8-4"]8-4f[/url].) Examples of manipulating scores include the following:

(a) Posting erroneous scores;

(b) Stopping play after 6 holes to avoid posting scores;

©[u][b] Repeatedly playing more than one ball to avoid posting scores;[/b][/u]

(d) Not adjusting hole scores under Section [url="http://www.usga.org/workarea/linkit.aspx?linkidentifier=id&itemid=14377"]4[/url];

(e) Deliberately reporting more or fewer strokes than actually scored;

(f) Deliberately taking extra strokes to inflate a score.


Handicap Police!!...just kidding.....just want you to to be aware of the rules in the book......to cover yourself you could talk to your Handicap Chairman, Club Pro and/or Handicap expert at your Golf Association and explain what is happening.....ask for advice.....something is not adding up......the system is not perfect and sometimes there are "horses for courses".....but any big differences should be analyzed......maybe this will lead to a rerating......rating short courses is a recent addition to the system.......looks like there are some problems..

We had a guy at my course that was playing the [i]majority[/i] of his rounds using more than one ball or in other ways that were not in line with the rules....obviously, he was not posting those scores.....however, he was consistently doing well in tournaments.....a little chat with him in front of the committee about this rule and his responsibilities fixed the problem......

While "repeatedly" is not defined, I would recommend limiting this practice to less than 10% of rounds played......I am not an absolutist on this and think it is not realistic to prohibit all "practice rounds" or a "playing lesson" with a pro for example.......what really matters is whether or not the player's scores in tournaments are in line with the other scores in his scoring record......hope this helps.....Good Luck
[/quote]
And that is what I would like to achieve: to have my tournament scores in line with my other scores. Last season they were not.

[KevCarter]

[quote name='imaplus3wannaplay' date='25 February 2010 - 05:44 PM' timestamp='1267141456' post='2277333']
[quote name='kevcarter ' date='25 February 2010 - 06:34 PM' timestamp='1267140881' post='2277304']
[quote name='imaplus3wannaplay' date='25 February 2010 - 05:20 PM' timestamp='1267140022' post='2277271']
Par 3 courses are not handicapped by the USGA. They are not considered "Championship" or regulation courses. Therefore, you are not required to post scores on a par 3 course.

The course might have a generic slope, rating, and handicap, but it was not done by the USGA.
[/quote]

I think you need to read the thread again. Many rules have been posted here that are not on the same page you are on.

Kevin
[/quote]

I don't understand what you are saying. He asked if he had to post his par 3 scores. I answered his question point blank. He doesn't have to.
[/quote]

OK, point blank, you are wrong. If you read the thread you will understand why. His course is over 3,000 yards and has been rated by the USGA. Please let me know if you have any other questions.

Kevin

[Pepperturbo]

[quote name='bdcava' date='25 February 2010 - 05:12 PM' timestamp='1267139543' post='2277251']
I have a different but similar problem. I play in a 9 hole league and post those scores. I break 40 every once in a while and it combines those scores and gives me scores <80 on my handicap card. Yet I never break 80 when I play 18 (well I did once). Are those 9 hole scores making my cap lower than it really should be? Just wondering.
[/quote]

I am not a handicap expert... Now that I've shed that skin it could be two 9 hole scores are converted into 18. That's what happen at both my last clubs to people that posted 9 holes rounds. They ended up having a both a 18 hole and 9 hole course handicap. If you're playing the same nine holes all the time combining two nines could reveal you're scoring below 80... surprise.

[Pepperturbo]

[quote name='imaplus3wannaplay' date='25 February 2010 - 05:44 PM' timestamp='1267141456' post='2277333']
[quote name='kevcarter ' date='25 February 2010 - 06:34 PM' timestamp='1267140881' post='2277304']
[quote name='imaplus3wannaplay' date='25 February 2010 - 05:20 PM' timestamp='1267140022' post='2277271']
Par 3 courses are not handicapped by the USGA. They are not considered "Championship" or regulation courses. Therefore, you are not required to post scores on a par 3 course.

The course might have a generic slope, rating, and handicap, but it was not done by the USGA.
[/quote]

I think you need to read the thread again. Many rules have been posted here that are not on the same page you are on.

Kevin
[/quote]

I don't understand what you are saying. He asked if he had to post his par 3 scores. I answered his question point blank. He doesn't have to.
[/quote]

He does if the course is over a certain yardage and has par 4's, even short ones. That also means the course has a USGA rating.

[mark m]

Sean: Go to your golf association website and lookup the staff.

Call or e-mail a person in the handicap department or in member services....they tend to be very helpful.....don't be intimidated....they are there to serve you.....I talk with my golf association often....your heart is in the right place and you are entitled to an answer.....Good Luck

[KevCarter]

Sean: Go to your golf association website and lookup the staff.

 

Call or e-mail a person in the handicap department or in member services....they tend to be very helpful.....don't be intimidated....they are there to serve you.....I talk with my golf association often....your heart is in the right place and you are entitled to an answer.....Good Luck

 

Post of the thread. EXCELLENT suggestion.

[mark m]

Thanks.....I help where I can.....you do the best job of all Kev!

BTW: Is that beer in those glasses? I could use one!

[KevCarter]

Thanks.....I help where I can.....you do the best job of all Kev!

 

BTW: Is that beer in those glasses? I could use one!

 

I could too. Are you anywhere near Zimmerman, Minnesota? I'm buying!

 

Kevin

[imaplus3wannaplay]

[quote name='kevcarter ' date='25 February 2010 - 06:46 PM' timestamp='1267141585' post='2277341']
[quote name='imaplus3wannaplay' date='25 February 2010 - 05:44 PM' timestamp='1267141456' post='2277333']
[quote name='kevcarter ' date='25 February 2010 - 06:34 PM' timestamp='1267140881' post='2277304']
[quote name='imaplus3wannaplay' date='25 February 2010 - 05:20 PM' timestamp='1267140022' post='2277271']
Par 3 courses are not handicapped by the USGA. They are not considered "Championship" or regulation courses. Therefore, you are not required to post scores on a par 3 course.

The course might have a generic slope, rating, and handicap, but it was not done by the USGA.
[/quote]

I think you need to read the thread again. Many rules have been posted here that are not on the same page you are on.

Kevin
[/quote]

I don't understand what you are saying. He asked if he had to post his par 3 scores. I answered his question point blank. He doesn't have to.
[/quote]

OK, point blank, you are wrong. If you read the thread you will understand why. His course is over 3,000 yards and has been rated by the USGA. Please let me know if you have any other questions.

Kevin
[/quote]

Oh sorry! I didn't see where he posted that the course in question was over 3000 and had been USGA rated. When I'm wrong I'm wrong. Many pardons!!! Sorry guys.

[KevCarter]

No need to apologize, this stuff gets complicated, and sometimes if you don't start at the beginning it's very easy to lose information in the shuffle.

 

Want to meet Mark and I in Zimmerman for a beer?

 

Kevin

[Sawgrass]

No need to apologize, this stuff gets complicated, and sometimes if you don't start at the beginning it's very easy to lose information in the shuffle.

 

Want to meet Mark and I in Zimmerman for a beer?

 

Kevin

 

 

I wanna come too!

 

(Maybe when it gets a little warmer though.)

 

Just think of it, beer all over the place and no rules to confuse the terminally thirsty.