NFL Rookie of the year?

[JBurns]

Who ya got, obviously RGIII, Luck, and Wilson are the top 3 candidates, but for the fun of it I'm throwing Doug Martin in myself just because they call him the Muscle Hamster and had 1454 total yards on the season. Not too bad for a rookie.

[SilverBullets]

Alfred Morris has got to be ahead of Martin...more yards and around the same TD numbers... Plus a playoff team.... I'd prob give ROY to Morris given he finished like 2nd in rushing... Then it would be Wilson, RGIII, Luck and then Martin.... At least IMO

[esketores]

Russell Wilson

[highergr0und]

It'll go to Griffin or Luck. Luck did more with less (IMO) but he had a lot of turnovers. Griffin showed a lot of grit and is a gifted player. Sucks he hurt his knee again.

Then Morris and Martin can fight it out. Morris will get some people saying he had the luxury of being behind Griffin while Martin is behind Josh Freeman who doesn't require a spy.

[cdnglf]

[quote name='esketores' timestamp='1357521302' post='6180631']
Russell Wilson
[/quote]

I'd agree, if it included the playoffs. But its a regular season award, and I think RG3 has the edge there (mostly due to better running numbers).
Both were very impressive, and IMO clearly better than Luck (who threw too many INTs).

Morris and Martin were very good too, but its much easier to make an impact as a first year RB.

[JBurns]

[quote name='SilverBullets' timestamp='1357520905' post='6180609']
Alfred Morris has got to be ahead of Martin...more yards and around the same TD numbers... Plus a playoff team.... I'd prob give ROY to Morris given he finished like 2nd in rushing... Then it would be Wilson, RGIII, Luck and then Martin.... At least IMO
[/quote]

Yeah I should of included Morris in there as well, sucks RGIII kind of takes away some attention from him. He'll have a great career along RGIII as long as both of them stay healthy and keep putting up the numbers.

As far as Wilson goes he came out of nowhere and went above and beyond his expectations. While Luck and RGIII definitely had alot to live up too.

[JBurns]

[quote name='cdnglf' timestamp='1357522059' post='6180719']
[quote name='esketores' timestamp='1357521302' post='6180631']
Russell Wilson
[/quote]

I'd agree, if it included the playoffs. But its a regular season award, and I think RG3 has the edge there (mostly due to better running numbers).
Both were very impressive, and IMO clearly better than Luck (who threw too many INTs).

Morris and Martin were very good too, but its much easier to make an impact as a first year RB.
[/quote]

I agree he had too many interceptions but Luck is a different style of QB, more a gunslinger. Like Ryan Fitzpatrick but a x10000000 skill level lol

[SilverBullets]

[quote name='cdnglf' timestamp='1357522059' post='6180719']
[quote name='esketores' timestamp='1357521302' post='6180631']
Russell Wilson
[/quote]

I'd agree, if it included the playoffs. But its a regular season award, and I think RG3 has the edge there (mostly due to better running numbers).
Both were very impressive, and IMO clearly better than Luck (who threw too many INTs).

Morris and Martin were very good too, but its much easier to make an impact as a first year RB.
[/quote]

I struggle with putting Morris behind these guys because he was a critical part of a playoff team.... He finished 2nd in the league rushing behind only APete. Pretty impressive.

[One_Putt_Blunder]

Andrew Luck, not because of stats, but because he did more with much less than wilson or rg3 had to work with. That team had no business being as good as they were. Luck set an nfl record for 4th qtr comebacks in his rookie season.

[poizster]

It's obviously Russell Wilson. Only rookie QB to win a playoff game, only QB to win a playoff game on the road thus far, most wins by a rookie QB, tied Peyton Manning's rookie TD pass record with 26 while having 100 less pass attempts then Andrew Luck and the best QB rating in the NFL over the past 8 weeks. With that being said, being a Seattle fan and knowing how the east coast views us it will still go to Andrew Luck. Our coast to coast to coast to coast trips will probably cost us against Atlanta.

[idrive]

A lot of good comments here.

This will be the closest ballot in the history of the ROY award.

the new blood this year was very good for the game

And I'm going with RG3

[masyankees]

I'd go with RGIII, I might be biased because he was on my fantasy team. Playoffs are irrelevant here, but it's great to see such an incredible rookie class that can create this sort of discussion. RGIII, Luck, Wilson, and Morris would be my top 4, but I don't know in what order, a good argument can be made for any of them. Luck's stats may be a little lacking comparatively, but looking at the situations he was in and how well he did, he deserves consideration as much as any of them.

[poizster]

[size=7][b]Dear Indianapolis and Washington,[/b][/size]
[attachment=1479177:rw.png]

[idrive]

True ^^^

But, the post season does not count.

[poizster]

[quote name='idrive' timestamp='1357535150' post='6181941']
True ^^^

But, the post season does not count.
[/quote]

Fine, we'll make the regular season count. Russell Wilson ties Petyon Manning's rookie record with 26 TD passes while having 234 fewer pass attempts then Andrew Luck and having a QB rating 24 points higher. Russell Wilson is Rookie of the year, although, most likely he'll get screwed.

[JBurns]

[quote name='poizster' timestamp='1357538279' post='6182095']
[quote name='idrive' timestamp='1357535150' post='6181941']
True ^^^

But, the post season does not count.
[/quote]

Fine, we'll make the regular season count. Russell Wilson ties Petyon Manning's rookie record with 26 TD passes while having 234 fewer pass attempts then Andrew Luck and having a QB rating 24 points higher. Russell Wilson is Rookie of the year, although, most likely he'll get screwed.
[/quote]

All very good reasons for why he should be favoured for the award, but One_Putt makes some very good points about how luck had very very little to work with other than Reggie Wayne. Luck also had to work with a terrible defense while Seattle had one of the best defenses in the league. They had the fewest points allowed per game so in that regard Wilson wasn't tested as much as Luck with the game on the line.

That being said he is the only rookie to win a playoff game unforturnately as mentioned that doesnt count

[poizster]

[quote name='JBurns' timestamp='1357547068' post='6182263']
[quote name='poizster' timestamp='1357538279' post='6182095']
[quote name='idrive' timestamp='1357535150' post='6181941']
True ^^^

But, the post season does not count.
[/quote]

Fine, we'll make the regular season count. Russell Wilson ties Petyon Manning's rookie record with 26 TD passes while having 234 fewer pass attempts then Andrew Luck and having a QB rating 24 points higher. Russell Wilson is Rookie of the year, although, most likely he'll get screwed.
[/quote]

All very good reasons for why he should be favoured for the award, but One_Putt makes some very good points about how luck had very very little to work with other than Reggie Wayne. Luck also had to work with a terrible defense while Seattle had one of the best defenses in the league. They had the fewest points allowed per game so in that regard Wilson wasn't tested as much as Luck with the game on the line.

That being said he is the only rookie to win a playoff game unforturnately as mentioned that doesnt count
[/quote]


The argument made against Wilson was the quality of his defense. Which as anyone would agree is not the Quarterbacks fault, only an opportunity to take advantage of. Wilson clearly took his opportunity and lead his team to the playoffs. When you compare the stats between Wilson and Luck it isn't even close. Wilson has a better QBR, more touchdowns and fewer interceptions. In every statistical category Wilson outperformed Luck except yards which can be attributed to Luck's 234 addittional attempts (And Yet Wilson has a higher completion percentage too).

Its easy to go with the conventional prototypical quarterback/ #1 draft pick or a flashy exciting player like RG3. But if you're really concerned with the integrity of the vote and giving the best performing player the award its clearly Russell Wilson.

[One_Putt_Blunder]

Yeah no it is clearly not that easy. Wilson had a fine season no doubt. How many wins does sea have without him 8-9? Now RG3 how many wins do the Redskins get 6-7? In Lucks case that team would have been lucky to win 4 games. He was asked to carry the burden of his team much more than the other 2. He didn't have the d/running game of Sea or the running game of Redskins. Nope Luck carried that team.

[cdnglf]

[quote name='poizster' timestamp='1357549929' post='6182301']
The argument made against Wilson was the quality of his defense. Which as anyone would agree is not the Quarterbacks fault, only an opportunity to take advantage of. Wilson clearly took his opportunity and lead his team to the playoffs. When you compare the stats between Wilson and Luck it isn't even close. Wilson has a better QBR, more touchdowns and fewer interceptions. In every statistical category Wilson outperformed Luck except yards which can be attributed to Luck's 234 addittional attempts (And Yet Wilson has a higher completion percentage too).

Its easy to go with the conventional prototypical quarterback/ #1 draft pick or a flashy exciting player like RG3. But if you're really concerned with the integrity of the vote and giving the best performing player the award its clearly Russell Wilson.
[/quote]

How is it "clearly" Russell Wilson? RG3 led Wilson in almost all of the stats you cite - better QBR, fewer interceptions, higher completion percentage, and (slightly) more yards passing. He threw for fewer touchdowns, but that's more than offset by TD/INT ratio (20/5 vs 26/10) and a big edge in rushing numbers.

[poizster]

[quote name='cdnglf' timestamp='1357555180' post='6182361']
[quote name='poizster' timestamp='1357549929' post='6182301']
The argument made against Wilson was the quality of his defense. Which as anyone would agree is not the Quarterbacks fault, only an opportunity to take advantage of. Wilson clearly took his opportunity and lead his team to the playoffs. When you compare the stats between Wilson and Luck it isn't even close. Wilson has a better QBR, more touchdowns and fewer interceptions. In every statistical category Wilson outperformed Luck except yards which can be attributed to Luck's 234 addittional attempts (And Yet Wilson has a higher completion percentage too).

Its easy to go with the conventional prototypical quarterback/ #1 draft pick or a flashy exciting player like RG3. But if you're really concerned with the integrity of the vote and giving the best performing player the award its clearly Russell Wilson.
[/quote]

How is it "clearly" Russell Wilson? RG3 led Wilson in almost all of the stats you cite - better QBR, fewer interceptions, higher completion percentage, and (slightly) more yards passing. He threw for fewer touchdowns, but that's more than offset by TD/INT ratio (20/5 vs 26/10) and a big edge in rushing numbers.
[/quote]

I think it's clearly Russell Wilson because he played against RG3 tonight and we all saw how that turned out.

[poizster]

[quote name='One_Putt_Blunder' timestamp='1357554990' post='6182355']
Yeah no it is clearly not that easy. Wilson had a fine season no doubt. How many wins does sea have without him 8-9? Now RG3 how many wins do the Redskins get 6-7? In Lucks case that team would have been lucky to win 4 games. He was asked to carry the burden of his team much more than the other 2. He didn't have the d/running game of Sea or the running game of Redskins. Nope Luck carried that team.
[/quote]

I agree Luck was asked to do a lot for that team but he still has a QB rating of 76 while Wilson's is 100. As I said before Wilson beats Luck in almost every statistical category.

[cdnglf]

[quote name='One_Putt_Blunder' timestamp='1357554990' post='6182355']
Yeah no it is clearly not that easy. Wilson had a fine season no doubt. How many wins does sea have without him 8-9? Now RG3 how many wins do the Redskins get 6-7? In Lucks case that team would have been lucky to win 4 games. He was asked to carry the burden of his team much more than the other 2. He didn't have the d/running game of Sea or the running game of Redskins. Nope Luck carried that team.
[/quote]

I think the supporting cast thing is overplayed a bit with Luck. Reggie Wayne is quite a bit better than anyone Wilson or RG3 had. Also, Indy had a pretty easy schedule.

[cdnglf]

[quote name='poizster' timestamp='1357555939' post='6182373']
I think it's clearly Russell Wilson because he played against RG3 tonight and we all saw how that turned out.
[/quote]

As has been mentioned several times already in this thread, rookie of the year is based on regular season play. The voting is done before the playoffs start.

[poizster]

[quote name='cdnglf' timestamp='1357557138' post='6182409']
[quote name='poizster' timestamp='1357555939' post='6182373']
I think it's clearly Russell Wilson because he played against RG3 tonight and we all saw how that turned out.
[/quote]

As has been mentioned several times already in this thread, rookie of the year is based on regular season play. The voting is done before the playoffs start.
[/quote]

To me the playoff game solidifies Wilson as Rookie of the Year but for the voters I'm sure beating the Bears, Cowboys, Packers*, Vikings, Patriots, 49ers, and a record whooping at the Bills will be good enough. Seattle has the NFL's best strength of victory percentage (.534) and with that, Wilson still had more wins then Luck or RG3. I guess we'll find out around the Superbowl, I think that's when they announce the awards.

[chickenpotpie]

RGIII had help.

Luck managed to beat the Lions. Wilson did not. I mean, HOW CAN YOU NOT BEAT THE LIONS!!!! They wouldn't be traveling cross country twice otherwise... Just sayin

[poizster]

[quote name='chickenpotpie' timestamp='1357558856' post='6182433']
RGIII had help.

Luck managed to beat the Lions. Wilson did not. I mean, HOW CAN YOU NOT BEAT THE LIONS!!!! They wouldn't be traveling cross country twice otherwise... Just sayin
[/quote]

Ha! This made me laugh. I'm assuming you're a jaded Lions fan? Luck lost to the Jets, the Seahawks beat the Jets, I mean how can you lose to the jets? The back to back cross country trips definitely sucks, at least they get to fly in Paul Allen's luxury jet.

[bubbagump]

I think it should be Wilson, but not sure he will beat out the hype and sensationalism of Rg3....

Im glad Wilson hasnt taken on the dirty imagine that a handful of the Seahawks really enjoy filling.

[hebron1427]

it's gotta be RG3. he's been one of the few faces of the league, let alone the franchise, in 2012. By the numbers, wilson is impressive. but i haven't turned on the TV or radio in the last month without someone talking about how great RG3 is. i'm pretty sure the award is not "rookie with the best stats." It's Rookie of the Year. If you could pick one rookie player who you think was the highlight of the year, it's RG3.

my opinion.

[chickenpotpie]

[quote name='poizster' timestamp='1357559450' post='6182441']
[quote name='chickenpotpie' timestamp='1357558856' post='6182433']
RGIII had help.

Luck managed to beat the Lions. Wilson did not. I mean, HOW CAN YOU NOT BEAT THE LIONS!!!! They wouldn't be traveling cross country twice otherwise... Just sayin
[/quote]

Ha! This made me laugh. I'm assuming you're a jaded Lions fan? Luck lost to the Jets, the Seahawks beat the Jets, I mean how can you lose to the jets? The back to back cross country trips definitely sucks, at least they get to fly in Paul Allen's luxury jet.
[/quote]

Not jaded, just very disgruntled. You make a strong case for the Jets though.

[bubbagump]

[quote name='hebron1427' timestamp='1357569404' post='6182829']
it's gotta be RG3. he's been one of the few faces of the league, let alone the franchise, in 2012. By the numbers, wilson is impressive. but i haven't turned on the TV or radio in the last month without someone talking about how great RG3 is. i'm pretty sure the award is not "rookie with the best stats." It's Rookie of the Year. If you could pick one rookie player who you think was the highlight of the year, it's RG3.

my opinion.
[/quote]

Thats what I was talking about. The media has worn RG3 kneepads since day one and have been raving about it all year. Wilson wont win it though I think he deserves it because he plays out west and nobody talked about him all year. Often time rookie with the best stats coincide with rookie of the year.