2017 NFL Draft

[dan360]

Being picked by the Browns is akin to being sentenced to Siberia IMO.

 

Very, very few veteran roll models to guide the youngsters to maximize their potentials.

 

I like the Cowboy's pick - they need help with pass defense, and other than a QB, there's no more valuable player than a pass rusher who can get to the QB in the 4th quarter when everyone knows a pass is coming.

 

Texsport

 

As far as role models go, Joe Thomas is worth 11x ...

 

That man alone makes up for a decade of Johnny Football. JMHO

 

 

[Texsport]

To me, the biggest clown making a living on the NFL Draft is Mel Kiper!

 

He runs his mouth so much, and changes his rankings so often, I think he completely is without credibility.

 

For instance, in September 2016, just 6 months before the 2017 draft, Kiper rated Jacksonville's eventual 1st, 2nd, and 3rd Round picks as the #2, #12, and #24th best players overall. All 1st Round Picks.

 

Yet, after the Draft of those players, Kiper rates the Jaguar's Draft as a C+ WHAT?

 

Idiot is not worth listening to, and certainly not paying for "Insider" information from.

 

If he was a great evaluator of NFL talent, he'd be working for an NFL team!

 

BTW - I think John Gruden made Kiper look like a fool on Draft day.

 

Texsport

[SilverBullets]

To me, the biggest clown making a living on the NFL Draft is Mel Kiper!

 

He runs his mouth so much, and changes his rankings so often, I think he completely is without credibility.

 

For instance, in September 2016, just 6 months before the 2017 draft, Kiper rated Jacksonville's eventual 1st, 2nd, and 3rd Round picks as the #2, #12, and #24th best players overall. All 1st Round Picks.

 

Yet, after the Draft of those players, Kiper rates the Jaguar's Draft as a C+ WHAT?

 

Idiot is not worth listening to, and certainly not paying for "Insider" information from.

 

If he was a great evaluator of NFL talent, he'd be working for an NFL team!

 

BTW - I think John Gruden made Kiper look like a fool o Draft day.

 

Texsport

 

I think all of the draft analysts are fools. Back in September they had Kizer rated as the best or second best QB prospect. A guy who wasn't even a starter yet and hadn't really put together a single good game of film.

 

I also hate Gruden's QB camp show. Watson was rated as the number 1 QB prospect after the season. Watson is a guy who torched the 3 best defenses in the last 2 years in major, prime time, season on the line games (Bama in '16, Ohio State in '17 and Bama in '17). He won 2 of those games and in the first game against Bama he looked fantastic albeit the team came up short. He has the size, has the quick release, and can make most of the throws. Watson goes to the combine and has a great weekend. He has a great pro day. And then he goes on Gruden's football camp and struggles to call some whacky play that a bat**** crazy ex football coach wants him to call and suddenly he's the 3rd or 4th best QB prospect? Meanwhile, Gruden raves about Trubisky, a guy who played 13 games in a weak conference and throws a deep ball about as good as JT Barrett (that's really bad in the event you haven't watched Barrett throw a deep ball) and he is suddenly 'the guy'.

 

I really hope teams do not put stock into the gimmicks and talking points that ESPN creates. These teams has infinite more information available to them about these players and frankly, in the time it took me to make this post, they have hopefully forgotten more information than I even know about each of these guys. Unfortunately, it seems like these teams actually are putting in stock in Gruden's stupid show.

[new2g0lf]

The analysts create problems for teams because fans base all their opinions on what the analysts report. These guys do some of their own research but most of the analysis is based on what some scouts tell them. It makes sense for active scouts to not sure a lot of actual data and opinions because you don't want to tip off other teams to the direction you're going. Time will tell if the Bears made a bad decision to move up and draft Trubinsky.

 

We've seen a lot of athletic QB's who could throw the ball a mile through a brick wall fail in the NFL because they can't read defenses and throw touch passes.

[bubbagump]

People need to understand what the point of these prognosticators and mock drafters etc is. First off, its a entertainment factor to keep football relevant in the offseason. Everybody an their mother with an internet connection can make one. Second, legit mock drafts aren't about best players straight up, they are determining fits, falls, teams decision makings and other things and the guys are trying to predict all that. A lot of the analysts on TV have been in scouting departments, GMs, etc of NFL teams…..so thinking just because they are on tv and not on a team, means they don't know anything….is missing the boat.

 

Also consider the strength of this draft, it was defense heavy and had been for a while, in particular secondary and DL/rush early on in the draft with great value deeper. So naturally, the strength of the draft lead to other offensive prospects being pushed down the board because teams were plucking the top end defensive talent. Also factor in that the Bears grasped by taking QB at 2 which may have forced the hands of some teams who were eyeing Qbs and waiting to move up and take them earlier than expected which also forces other prospects down.

 

The values of guys, especially 6 months out lol….changes drastically…..I feel that is fairly obvious to understand. The draft is also about projection down the road, so physical skillsets like Kizer are going to be more valued (right or wrong) over others that have more production or experience. This happens in every sport. These guys are operating an imperfect science and the majority of the time are wrong, thats just how the percentage works out. So more often then not, they go with the higher ceiling physical set….then the undersized/skilled production guy. Lets be real, 8 out of 10 times, each player on the field at any given time is more on the physical specimen side then an under talented or sized guy. There are only going to be so many Pedroias, Bradys, Sproles etc that can actually defy odds.

 

You have to understand the 24/7 cycle the NFL has been operating on and the need for entertainment. Most evaluators, for a long time was saying this was a weak draft for QB and none were really 1st round talents……but fully knowing the importance of the position, figured about 4 or so would go in the first. But teams reach, do dumb things, panic and make bad picks. Happens all the time, and will continue to happen all the time. Its more often than not, why the same teams are up toward the front of the draft and the same teams are toward the back.

 

Lastly, lets be real…..when guys are on Grudens show, do you really expect him to sit there, grill the kid and say man Trubisky will suck at the next level as he's sitting across from him? Nope….every guy that comes through there is pumped up to a certain degree deservedly or not. Gruden is going over highlight film for the most part, which are going to showcase the best a prospect has to offer. Plus they are shows….for the average joe, who doesn't watch film. Get people steamed up for the draft, boost ratings and go from there. If you actually think teams scouting departments are sitting around putting stock into what Gruden says on ESPN or McShay says……….yikes

[SilverBullets]

People need to understand what the point of these prognosticators and mock drafters etc is. First off, its a entertainment factor to keep football relevant in the offseason. Everybody an their mother with an internet connection can make one. Second, legit mock drafts aren't about best players straight up, they are determining fits, falls, teams decision makings and other things and the guys are trying to predict all that. A lot of the analysts on TV have been in scouting departments, GMs, etc of NFL teams…..so thinking just because they are on tv and not on a team, means they don't know anything….is missing the boat.

 

Also consider the strength of this draft, it was defense heavy and had been for a while, in particular secondary and DL/rush early on in the draft with great value deeper. So naturally, the strength of the draft lead to other offensive prospects being pushed down the board because teams were plucking the top end defensive talent. Also factor in that the Bears grasped by taking QB at 2 which may have forced the hands of some teams who were eyeing Qbs and waiting to move up and take them earlier than expected which also forces other prospects down.

 

The values of guys, especially 6 months out lol….changes drastically…..I feel that is fairly obvious to understand. The draft is also about projection down the road, so physical skillsets like Kizer are going to be more valued (right or wrong) over others that have more production or experience. This happens in every sport. These guys are operating an imperfect science and the majority of the time are wrong, thats just how the percentage works out. So more often then not, they go with the higher ceiling physical set….then the undersized/skilled production guy. Lets be real, 8 out of 10 times, each player on the field at any given time is more on the physical specimen side then an under talented or sized guy. There are only going to be so many Pedroias, Bradys, Sproles etc that can actually defy odds.

 

You have to understand the 24/7 cycle the NFL has been operating on and the need for entertainment. Most evaluators, for a long time was saying this was a weak draft for QB and none were really 1st round talents……but fully knowing the importance of the position, figured about 4 or so would go in the first. But teams reach, do dumb things, panic and make bad picks. Happens all the time, and will continue to happen all the time. Its more often than not, why the same teams are up toward the front of the draft and the same teams are toward the back.

 

Lastly, lets be real…..when guys are on Grudens show, do you really expect him to sit there, grill the kid and say man Trubisky will suck at the next level as he's sitting across from him? Nope….every guy that comes through there is pumped up to a certain degree deservedly or not. Gruden is going over highlight film for the most part, which are going to showcase the best a prospect has to offer. Plus they are shows….for the average joe, who doesn't watch film. Get people steamed up for the draft, boost ratings and go from there. If you actually think teams scouting departments are sitting around putting stock into what Gruden says on ESPN or McShay says……….yikes

 

I get all that. But you also have to realize I am a Bengals fan... Do the Bengals even have scouts? I think last I read they had 1 scout and a couple of 'consultants' lol

[SmiterOfPv1x]

Lol. 15 years or more ago I scored Bengals tickets for free. Dad and I went down to watch the game. Beautiful stadium. Fans were non existent. Their RB set the single game NFL record for rushing that game. The best rushing game ever at that point. No one even knew or cared.

 

Contrast that to going to a Browns game. The Browns can be 0-6 and if they get a lead in the first half you start hearing whispers of the playoffs. If they're up going into the 4th those whispers become shouts. If they're leading with 5 minutes to go, those shouts start having the odd "Super Bowl!" Mixed in.

 

Total contrasts in fanbases. I'm sure it's probably changed since then as the Bengals have been decent for the most part the last decade and they were god awful back then. But stil it blew my mind that their game was just a social event and no one followed it all.

[new2g0lf]

People need to understand what the point of these prognosticators and mock drafters etc is. First off, its a entertainment factor to keep football relevant in the offseason. Everybody an their mother with an internet connection can make one. Second, legit mock drafts aren't about best players straight up, they are determining fits, falls, teams decision makings and other things and the guys are trying to predict all that. A lot of the analysts on TV have been in scouting departments, GMs, etc of NFL teams…..so thinking just because they are on tv and not on a team, means they don't know anything….is missing the boat.

 

Also consider the strength of this draft, it was defense heavy and had been for a while, in particular secondary and DL/rush early on in the draft with great value deeper. So naturally, the strength of the draft lead to other offensive prospects being pushed down the board because teams were plucking the top end defensive talent. Also factor in that the Bears grasped by taking QB at 2 which may have forced the hands of some teams who were eyeing Qbs and waiting to move up and take them earlier than expected which also forces other prospects down.

 

The values of guys, especially 6 months out lol….changes drastically…..I feel that is fairly obvious to understand. The draft is also about projection down the road, so physical skillsets like Kizer are going to be more valued (right or wrong) over others that have more production or experience. This happens in every sport. These guys are operating an imperfect science and the majority of the time are wrong, thats just how the percentage works out. So more often then not, they go with the higher ceiling physical set….then the undersized/skilled production guy. Lets be real, 8 out of 10 times, each player on the field at any given time is more on the physical specimen side then an under talented or sized guy. There are only going to be so many Pedroias, Bradys, Sproles etc that can actually defy odds.

 

You have to understand the 24/7 cycle the NFL has been operating on and the need for entertainment. Most evaluators, for a long time was saying this was a weak draft for QB and none were really 1st round talents……but fully knowing the importance of the position, figured about 4 or so would go in the first. But teams reach, do dumb things, panic and make bad picks. Happens all the time, and will continue to happen all the time. Its more often than not, why the same teams are up toward the front of the draft and the same teams are toward the back.

 

Lastly, lets be real…..when guys are on Grudens show, do you really expect him to sit there, grill the kid and say man Trubisky will suck at the next level as he's sitting across from him? Nope….every guy that comes through there is pumped up to a certain degree deservedly or not. Gruden is going over highlight film for the most part, which are going to showcase the best a prospect has to offer. Plus they are shows….for the average joe, who doesn't watch film. Get people steamed up for the draft, boost ratings and go from there. If you actually think teams scouting departments are sitting around putting stock into what Gruden says on ESPN or McShay says……….yikes

 

I get all that. But you also have to realize I am a Bengals fan... Do the Bengals even have scouts? I think last I read they had 1 scout and a couple of 'consultants' lol

Not sure why they drafted Mixon unless they don't think Bernard will be 100% after hurting his knee or they are planning on dumping Hill. Seems they needed more help on defense but a lot of teams go for the best player available which could explain why they picked Mixon.

[SilverBullets]

People need to understand what the point of these prognosticators and mock drafters etc is. First off, its a entertainment factor to keep football relevant in the offseason. Everybody an their mother with an internet connection can make one. Second, legit mock drafts aren't about best players straight up, they are determining fits, falls, teams decision makings and other things and the guys are trying to predict all that. A lot of the analysts on TV have been in scouting departments, GMs, etc of NFL teams…..so thinking just because they are on tv and not on a team, means they don't know anything….is missing the boat.

 

Also consider the strength of this draft, it was defense heavy and had been for a while, in particular secondary and DL/rush early on in the draft with great value deeper. So naturally, the strength of the draft lead to other offensive prospects being pushed down the board because teams were plucking the top end defensive talent. Also factor in that the Bears grasped by taking QB at 2 which may have forced the hands of some teams who were eyeing Qbs and waiting to move up and take them earlier than expected which also forces other prospects down.

 

The values of guys, especially 6 months out lol….changes drastically…..I feel that is fairly obvious to understand. The draft is also about projection down the road, so physical skillsets like Kizer are going to be more valued (right or wrong) over others that have more production or experience. This happens in every sport. These guys are operating an imperfect science and the majority of the time are wrong, thats just how the percentage works out. So more often then not, they go with the higher ceiling physical set….then the undersized/skilled production guy. Lets be real, 8 out of 10 times, each player on the field at any given time is more on the physical specimen side then an under talented or sized guy. There are only going to be so many Pedroias, Bradys, Sproles etc that can actually defy odds.

 

You have to understand the 24/7 cycle the NFL has been operating on and the need for entertainment. Most evaluators, for a long time was saying this was a weak draft for QB and none were really 1st round talents……but fully knowing the importance of the position, figured about 4 or so would go in the first. But teams reach, do dumb things, panic and make bad picks. Happens all the time, and will continue to happen all the time. Its more often than not, why the same teams are up toward the front of the draft and the same teams are toward the back.

 

Lastly, lets be real…..when guys are on Grudens show, do you really expect him to sit there, grill the kid and say man Trubisky will suck at the next level as he's sitting across from him? Nope….every guy that comes through there is pumped up to a certain degree deservedly or not. Gruden is going over highlight film for the most part, which are going to showcase the best a prospect has to offer. Plus they are shows….for the average joe, who doesn't watch film. Get people steamed up for the draft, boost ratings and go from there. If you actually think teams scouting departments are sitting around putting stock into what Gruden says on ESPN or McShay says……….yikes

 

I get all that. But you also have to realize I am a Bengals fan... Do the Bengals even have scouts? I think last I read they had 1 scout and a couple of 'consultants' lol

Not sure why they drafted Mixon unless they don't think Bernard will be 100% after hurting his knee or they are planning on dumping Hill. Seems they needed more help on defense but a lot of teams go for the best player available which could explain why they picked Mixon.

 

The Bengals almost always go best available (according to their draft board). They have used this strategy for a long time (at least since the Carson Palmer pick). It gets a little frustrating because sometimes, like this year, because sometimes they seemingly don't address needs. It's also the reason why you saw the Bengals take a DB in back to back first rounds (Leon Hall and J. Joseph and why they took Grasham and then Eifert 2 years later (or Dre Kirkpatrick, Dennard, William Jackson so close together).

 

I actually kind of like the Mixon pick the more I think about it. I think he absolutely was the best available at that point. The incident happened 3 years ago and he has kept his head clean since (unless you consider ripping a parking ticket in half and 'looking' at a officer in an intimidating way or whatever that crap was, a big deal). The Mixon story line is a bit frustrating because, while what he was did was truly horrible, it happened 3 years ago. Everyone acts like this just happened and he has to prove he has changed and now a 'good' guy.... The context that isn't talked about is how IT WAS 3 YEARS AGO. It wasn't 6 months ago when the tape was released, it wasn't during his final season at OU, it was as a 17 year old entering his freshman year in college. Yes, its inexcusable. But what is this country without second chances and being able to prove you have better yourself? Mixon has kept his nose clean for the 3 years and that should count for something.

 

But as for the pick, I just don't think they are confident in Hill and Gio. They both are one dimensional backs. Gio can't stay healthy and Hill can't break tackles (which is what he is supposed to be good at). I believe both are also coming up on contract years. RBs have a short shelf life in the nfl and my guess is the bengals aren't planning on bringing back Hill as he seems to be digressing. Who knows with Gio. If he is healthy, I think they carve out a role for him. Getting Mixon in the second round could be an absolute steal as he very well may have been the second best back in the draft.

 

EDIT - Hill is a UFA after this season. And Gio has 2 years left after this season but the bengals can cut him after the season and save a few million dollars. Mixon will undoubtedly replace one or both of them.

[new2g0lf]

People need to understand what the point of these prognosticators and mock drafters etc is. First off, its a entertainment factor to keep football relevant in the offseason. Everybody an their mother with an internet connection can make one. Second, legit mock drafts aren't about best players straight up, they are determining fits, falls, teams decision makings and other things and the guys are trying to predict all that. A lot of the analysts on TV have been in scouting departments, GMs, etc of NFL teams…..so thinking just because they are on tv and not on a team, means they don't know anything….is missing the boat.

 

Also consider the strength of this draft, it was defense heavy and had been for a while, in particular secondary and DL/rush early on in the draft with great value deeper. So naturally, the strength of the draft lead to other offensive prospects being pushed down the board because teams were plucking the top end defensive talent. Also factor in that the Bears grasped by taking QB at 2 which may have forced the hands of some teams who were eyeing Qbs and waiting to move up and take them earlier than expected which also forces other prospects down.

 

The values of guys, especially 6 months out lol….changes drastically…..I feel that is fairly obvious to understand. The draft is also about projection down the road, so physical skillsets like Kizer are going to be more valued (right or wrong) over others that have more production or experience. This happens in every sport. These guys are operating an imperfect science and the majority of the time are wrong, thats just how the percentage works out. So more often then not, they go with the higher ceiling physical set….then the undersized/skilled production guy. Lets be real, 8 out of 10 times, each player on the field at any given time is more on the physical specimen side then an under talented or sized guy. There are only going to be so many Pedroias, Bradys, Sproles etc that can actually defy odds.

 

You have to understand the 24/7 cycle the NFL has been operating on and the need for entertainment. Most evaluators, for a long time was saying this was a weak draft for QB and none were really 1st round talents……but fully knowing the importance of the position, figured about 4 or so would go in the first. But teams reach, do dumb things, panic and make bad picks. Happens all the time, and will continue to happen all the time. Its more often than not, why the same teams are up toward the front of the draft and the same teams are toward the back.

 

Lastly, lets be real…..when guys are on Grudens show, do you really expect him to sit there, grill the kid and say man Trubisky will suck at the next level as he's sitting across from him? Nope….every guy that comes through there is pumped up to a certain degree deservedly or not. Gruden is going over highlight film for the most part, which are going to showcase the best a prospect has to offer. Plus they are shows….for the average joe, who doesn't watch film. Get people steamed up for the draft, boost ratings and go from there. If you actually think teams scouting departments are sitting around putting stock into what Gruden says on ESPN or McShay says……….yikes

 

I get all that. But you also have to realize I am a Bengals fan... Do the Bengals even have scouts? I think last I read they had 1 scout and a couple of 'consultants' lol

Not sure why they drafted Mixon unless they don't think Bernard will be 100% after hurting his knee or they are planning on dumping Hill. Seems they needed more help on defense but a lot of teams go for the best player available which could explain why they picked Mixon.

 

The Bengals almost always go best available (according to their draft board). They have used this strategy for a long time (at least since the Carson Palmer pick). It gets a little frustrating because sometimes, like this year, because sometimes they seemingly don't address needs. It's also the reason why you saw the Bengals take a DB in back to back first rounds (Leon Hall and J. Joseph and why they took Grasham and then Eifert 2 years later (or Dre Kirkpatrick, Dennard, William Jackson so close together).

 

I actually kind of like the Mixon pick the more I think about it. I think he absolutely was the best available at that point. The incident happened 3 years ago and he has kept his head clean since (unless you consider ripping a parking ticket in half and 'looking' at a officer in an intimidating way or whatever that crap was, a big deal). The Mixon story line is a bit frustrating because, while what he was did was truly horrible, it happened 3 years ago. Everyone acts like this just happened and he has to prove he has changed and now a 'good' guy.... The context that isn't talked about is how IT WAS 3 YEARS AGO. It wasn't 6 months ago when the tape was released, it wasn't during his final season at OU, it was as a 17 year old entering his freshman year in college. Yes, its inexcusable. But what is this country without second chances and being able to prove you have better yourself? Mixon has kept his nose clean for the 3 years and that should count for something.

 

But as for the pick, I just don't think they are confident in Hill and Gio. They both are one dimensional backs. Gio can't stay healthy and Hill can't break tackles (which is what he is supposed to be good at). I believe both are also coming up on contract years. RBs have a short shelf life in the nfl and my guess is the bengals aren't planning on bringing back Hill as he seems to be digressing. Who knows with Gio. If he is healthy, I think they carve out a role for him. Getting Mixon in the second round could be an absolute steal as he very well may have been the second best back in the draft.

 

EDIT - Hill is a UFA after this season. And Gio has 2 years left after this season but the bengals can cut him after the season and save a few million dollars. Mixon will undoubtedly replace one or both of them.

Makes sense, Mixon would have gone first round if not for his past. I don't think they have long term plans for Hill and Gio has to prove he can be the running back he was before tearing up his knee. Mixon might get suspended by the NFL but overall he's going to be fine if he stays out of trouble. I personally feel college players should start off fresh in the NFL unless they do something between the off season and start of NFL season.

[SilverBullets]

The bengals play the browns twice, have Jax, Tennessee, and Chicago. They also have Denver, who has an aging D and no real QB. They also have Minnesota whom I still don't believe in even with last year. Both of those games should be toss ups.

 

By virtue of schedule, the Bengals should be primed to win more than 5 games. The bengals aren't gonna be a playoff team. I'll admit that. But I don't think they will be the doormat.

 

What's wager?

.

 

Six wins? That the wager. They win more than 6 and you win? They win less than six and I win? If that's the case, I'd propose the following bet. Loser wears the winners hat for a WRX pic post. 6 would be a push allowing you to not have to wear the greatest pro football hat of all time and I also wouldn't have to wear one where the color is roughly right but something about it just isn't quite great. I'll take that bet. Game?

 

Haha yeah I'm in for that. Sounds like a deal to me! Now let's hope Mixon can punch his way to 7 wins....

 

Too bad Smiter is banned... Bengals hit 7 wins today. While not good by any means, the bengals were far from a doormat.

 

And Smiter’s Browns went 0-16 hahaha

[deadsolid...shank]

The bengals play the browns twice, have Jax, Tennessee, and Chicago. They also have Denver, who has an aging D and no real QB. They also have Minnesota whom I still don't believe in even with last year. Both of those games should be toss ups.

 

By virtue of schedule, the Bengals should be primed to win more than 5 games. The bengals aren't gonna be a playoff team. I'll admit that. But I don't think they will be the doormat.

 

What's wager?

.

 

Six wins? That the wager. They win more than 6 and you win? They win less than six and I win? If that's the case, I'd propose the following bet. Loser wears the winners hat for a WRX pic post. 6 would be a push allowing you to not have to wear the greatest pro football hat of all time and I also wouldn't have to wear one where the color is roughly right but something about it just isn't quite great. I'll take that bet. Game?

 

Haha yeah I'm in for that. Sounds like a deal to me! Now let's hope Mixon can punch his way to 7 wins....

 

Too bad Smiter is banned... Bengals hit 7 wins today. While not good by any means, the bengals were far from a doormat.

 

And Smiter’s Browns went 0-16 hahaha

 

I think he's back under a different name. Although I haven't seen any recent posts. The style was eerily similar. Wish I could remember the newer name. If I remember the correctly the new account was Ohio based also.

 

Maybe found out and banned again.