Chasing speed; the road to 190mph

[getitdaily]

On 11/11/2023 at 6:33 PM, Valtiel said:

Unfortunately I think that is out of reach without a conscious effort on some serious fitness, hah. My session last night peaked at 182mph and I sit on way too much a** for work to push that ceiling any higher, hah. Appreciate the kind words though. 💪
 

Thats a serious 7, hah! I've messed around with weighted and unweighted things a bit, but honestly focusing on the proper sequencing is easily the most beneficial but also the most difficult to ingrain so i've been staying on that. The feels when I know i'm doing it properly are the sense of my trail side being unweighted by the time i'm transitioning and that my back stays to the target longer during that move. My main tendency being the opposite; to linger on the trail side a little too long and to get the shoulders going a little too early. 

Here is a good swing (and one take!) from last night (cc @getitdaily). While nothing earth shattering speed wise (181mph) it was still controlled and very well struck with pretty optimum launch conditions and shape (tiny pull fade). Even though I only peaked at 182mph I was extremely happy with the fact I was consistently middling a 46.5" driver which would have been unheard of for me a year ago. 

FullSizeRender.MOV 5.89 MB · 24 downloads  

What's your miss with driver and how's your iron game? 

[Valtiel]

1 hour ago, getitdaily said:

What's your miss with driver and how's your iron game? 

Both have changed recently with the mechanical improvements i've made actually and i'm spending a lot of time grinding on it to get . My "old" pattern was always anti-left. My hands were shallower and my shoulders opened earlier which was always an "outside" pattern. My clubface was more shut at the top and it was a sort of hold off/turn and burn kind of feeling. It was great when it worked but never felt as mechanically sound as it should, it was basically a couple compensations slapped together that could get me around the course decently well. Draws however always felt like a manipulation and the moment the cut stopped cutting i'd feel a bit lost. There was also always this feeling that I was just a couple small tweaks away from getting to the next level so to speak as I felt like I was sequencing well, but not with power or intention which can make distance control an issue with a more outside pattern. Things would get weak and wipey on off days.

Now with a stronger implementation of the re-centering/hip fall concepts with the feeling of my back being to the target that fraction longer, this is now stock:



That is my "practice" 4-iron which is the one in my avator; a J15MB @24* with the old school Geoff Ogilvy shaft, the stepped OG Precision Rifle 7.3 playing about 1/2" long. Just a buttery soft club to hit that is my go to "get right" tool on the range. My path without any manipulation shifted from slightly out to slightly in, and more consistently so. Both paths were a product of mechanics, the newer one just being more technically sound and repeatable. The more I lean into exaggerating it, the more the ball draws. I've now been trying to relearn how to hit a cut properly and it's feeling like the straight ball is the most "neutral" feeling with the lean into the new mechanics producing a draw, but cuts now feeling like a manipulation. 

Overall though what i'm feeling like is that both misses and shapes are smaller. Tighter draws/cuts etc. Driver is generally a straight flight, irons are a small draw, and cuts are slightly inconsistent manipulations at the moment with the double cross there being the most common "miss" i'm seeing. 

[getitdaily]

28 minutes ago, Valtiel said:

Both have changed recently with the mechanical improvements i've made actually and i'm spending a lot of time grinding on it to get . My "old" pattern was always anti-left. My hands were shallower and my shoulders opened earlier which was always an "outside" pattern. My clubface was more shut at the top and it was a sort of hold off/turn and burn kind of feeling. It was great when it worked but never felt as mechanically sound as it should, it was basically a couple compensations slapped together that could get me around the course decently well. Draws however always felt like a manipulation and the moment the cut stopped cutting i'd feel a bit lost. There was also always this feeling that I was just a couple small tweaks away from getting to the next level so to speak as I felt like I was sequencing well, but not with power or intention which can make distance control an issue with a more outside pattern. Things would get weak and wipey on off days.

Now with a stronger implementation of the re-centering/hip fall concepts with the feeling of my back being to the target that fraction longer, this is now stock:



That is my "practice" 4-iron which is the one in my avator; a J15MB @24* with the old school Geoff Ogilvy shaft, the stepped OG Precision Rifle 7.3 playing about 1/2" long. Just a buttery soft club to hit that is my go to "get right" tool on the range. My path without any manipulation shifted from slightly out to slightly in, and more consistently so. Both paths were a product of mechanics, the newer one just being more technically sound and repeatable. The more I lean into exaggerating it, the more the ball draws. I've now been trying to relearn how to hit a cut properly and it's feeling like the straight ball is the most "neutral" feeling with the lean into the new mechanics producing a draw, but cuts now feeling like a manipulation. 

Overall though what i'm feeling like is that both misses and shapes are smaller. Tighter draws/cuts etc. Driver is generally a straight flight, irons are a small draw, and cuts are slightly inconsistent manipulations at the moment with the double cross there being the most common "miss" i'm seeing. 

Have you done anything to change ball position? Has AoA gotten more shallow on irons?

[Valtiel]

9 minutes ago, getitdaily said:

Have you done anything to change ball position? Has AoA gotten more shallow on irons?

I've always worked to stay shallow as someone that was steeper/diggier in the past. I'd say its naturally shallow now as opposed to manufactured shallow before. I used to have more of a thinner miss previously as a result of shallowing AoA via more vertical forces in the downswing and better sequencing and loading of the lead side feels like it has removed the need for that compensation. Ball position is generally unchanged, although my strike locations are feeling a little higher on the face these days which is having me rethink my irons a bit.

[getitdaily]

2 minutes ago, Valtiel said:

I've always worked to stay shallow as someone that was steeper/diggier in the past. I'd say its naturally shallow now as opposed to manufactured shallow before. I used to have more of a thinner miss previously as a result of shallowing AoA via more vertical forces in the downswing and better sequencing and loading of the lead side feels like it has removed the need for that compensation. Ball position is generally unchanged, although my strike locations are feeling a little higher on the face these days which is having me rethink my irons a bit.

Interesting. 

 

When I first started working on the earlier lead side pressure I saw shallower AoA. But I was really steep prior. You seem to have some room for steepening then...little less upright with that torso in the downswing...?

[JamesFoote]

Can we get an update on how this is going? What’s the top ball speed through the holiday period?

[Jlocke22]

Glad I found this thread. Been hitting the gym, digesting info, and using the Stack. 190 BS is also my goal - I hit 183.4 in the spring before the season started but been making plenty of improvements across the board. May push to hit the local Trackman at the end of the month for a try! 

[Valtiel]

11 hours ago, JamesFoote said:

Can we get an update on how this is going? What’s the top ball speed through the holiday period?

Top ball speed through the holiday period? Take the 190 and strap several turkeys, a bottle of whiskey, and two dozen cookies to it. 😆

In all seriousness the efforts were primarily just to push myself and to raise my ceiling so that I cruise faster on the course. I wanted to add 5mph ball speed to my average so that my short/heavy driver (44.5") cruises at 176-178mph and my longer driver (45.5") is 180-183mph which is where i'm sitting now. Any further speed chases will require some equipment tweaking and that isn't high on my priority list right now. I've actually been doing mostly 20-40y practice these days. 

Edited January 5 by Valtiel

[JamesFoote]

30 minutes ago, Valtiel said:

Top ball speed through the holiday period? Take the 190 and strap several turkeys, a bottle of whiskey, and two dozen cookies to it. 😆

In all seriousness the efforts were primarily just to push myself and to raise my ceiling so that I cruise faster on the course. I wanted to add 5mph ball speed to my average so that my short/heavy driver (44.5") cruises at 176-178mph and my longer driver (45.5") is 180-183mph which is where i'm sitting now. Any further speed chases will require some equipment tweaking and that isn't high on my priority list right now. I've actually been doing mostly 20-40y practice these days. 

Ah, I understand those handicaps perfectly. I myself am wearing an entire Christmas ham and a few cartons of beer. Not ideal for my upcoming wedding.

 

I’m heading to the range this afternoon to begin my sequencing reprogramming. I know I sit around 165-170, so I can’t wait to see where I might be in a few months.

 

Cheers for all the resources again, they’ve been incredibly helpful

[Nels55]

9 minutes ago, JamesFoote said:

Ah, I understand those handicaps perfectly. I myself am wearing an entire Christmas ham and a few cartons of beer. Not ideal for my upcoming wedding.

 

I’m heading to the range this afternoon to begin my sequencing reprogramming. I know I sit around 165-170, so I can’t wait to see where I might be in a few months.

 

Cheers for all the resources again, they’ve been incredibly helpful

Congrats on your impending doom!  Just kidding, I wish you a successful and happy lifetime of marital bliss!

[Valtiel]

15 minutes ago, JamesFoote said:

Ah, I understand those handicaps perfectly. I myself am wearing an entire Christmas ham and a few cartons of beer. Not ideal for my upcoming wedding.

 

I’m heading to the range this afternoon to begin my sequencing reprogramming. I know I sit around 165-170, so I can’t wait to see where I might be in a few months.

 

Cheers for all the resources again, they’ve been incredibly helpful

Cheers! Sorry I didn't have anything more interesting to add hah. My previous cruising range was 170-172mph with the driver so you're starting from a similar place. Be prepared for a potential cascade of mechanical elements depending on what you're dealing with swing wise currently. Getting your pressure shifting sequenced correctly can have both the effect of increasing speed but also exposing flaws. I'm dealing with the persistent pattern of losing tilt in my backswing which subsequently seems to limit proper right hip depth increase in said backswing. I do this move that I *hate* seeing that currently I have to feel like my shoulders are rotating perpendicular to the ground to simply *not* do, so be prepared for that depending on how deep your "feel vs. real" disconnects are. 

Edited January 5 by Valtiel

[JamesFoote]

10 hours ago, Nels55 said:

Congrats on your impending doom!  Just kidding, I wish you a successful and happy lifetime of marital bliss!

Cheers Nels. The commiserations should probably be sent to her. Poor lady

[JamesFoote]

10 hours ago, Valtiel said:

Cheers! Sorry I didn't have anything more interesting to add hah. My previous cruising range was 170-172mph with the driver so you're starting from a similar place. Be prepared for a potential cascade of mechanical elements depending on what you're dealing with swing wise currently. Getting your pressure shifting sequenced correctly can have both the effect of increasing speed but also exposing flaws. I'm dealing with the persistent pattern of losing tilt in my backswing which subsequently seems to limit proper right hip depth increase in said backswing. I do this move that I *hate* seeing that currently I have to feel like my shoulders are rotating perpendicular to the ground to simply *not* do, so be prepared for that depending on how deep your "feel vs. real" disconnects are. 

It’s certainly going to take some time to get right again. I did a lot of work on this early last year, but it’s fallen by the way side a fair bit. On review of my video from the session, my lead knee is way too bent, a result of trying to get too much hip fall I feel. The strike improved, but the other things I’d been working on fell apart. Arm structure and the like.

 

I didn’t see any increases in ball speed or clubhead speed, but I think it’s going to take a few sessions before I start to move correctly, and especially before I can get the arm structure and sequence to work together.

 

The fun of it all