Marking a golf ball

[2bGood]

how far away can your mark be?

I have always placed my mark 2" behind my ball. Is this legal? The way read rule 20-1 it leaves allot of option for how you mark your ball (I have even heard it is legal to place you mark in front of the ball)

the end of the rule states:



"Note: The position of a ball to be lifted should be marked by placing a ball-marker, a small coin or other similar object immediately behind the ball. If the ball-marker interferes with the play, stance or stroke of another player, it should be placed one or more clubhead-lengths to one side"

I read the note a suggestion rather than a rule?

[BogeyDog11]

To me "immediately behind" does not mean two inches away. I once played with a guy who would place his mark a good two inches IN FRONT of the ball, then replace the ball a good two inches in front of his mark. Not good.
I drop my mark behind the ball and slid it forward under the ball to the point it is almost touching but not.

[Newby]

20-1/20 Player Places Ball-Marker Approximately Two Inches Behind Ball

 

Q. A player consistently places his ball-marker approximately two inches behind the ball on the green. He says that he does so to ensure that he does not accidentally move the ball. Does such a procedure comply with the Rules?

 

A. No. A player who places a ball-marker two inches behind his ball cannot be considered to have marked the position of the ball with sufficient accuracy. Accordingly, each time he does so, the player incurs a penalty of one stroke, as provided in Rule 20-1, and must place the ball as near as possible to the spot from which it was lifted — Rule 20-3c.

 

The player's action was unnecessary because Rule 20-1 states that no penalty is incurred if a ball is accidentally moved in the process of marking or lifting it under a Rule.

 

 

[dan360]

The marker is to be placed directly behind the ball. 2" is too far away and could get you a penalty in competition.

[BogeyDog11]

20-1/20 Player Places Ball-Marker Approximately Two Inches Behind Ball

 

Q. A player consistently places his ball-marker approximately two inches behind the ball on the green. He says that he does so to ensure that he does not accidentally move the ball. Does such a procedure comply with the Rules?

 

A. No. A player who places a ball-marker two inches behind his ball cannot be considered to have marked the position of the ball with sufficient accuracy. Accordingly, each time he does so, the player incurs a penalty of one stroke, as provided in Rule 20-1, and must place the ball as near as possible to the spot from which it was lifted — Rule 20-3c.

 

The player's action was unnecessary because Rule 20-1 states that no penalty is incurred if a ball is accidentally moved in the process of marking or lifting it under a Rule.

 

 

 

Good find!

[2bGood]

20-1/20 Player Places Ball-Marker Approximately Two Inches Behind Ball

 

Q. A player consistently places his ball-marker approximately two inches behind the ball on the green. He says that he does so to ensure that he does not accidentally move the ball. Does such a procedure comply with the Rules?

 

A. No. A player who places a ball-marker two inches behind his ball cannot be considered to have marked the position of the ball with sufficient accuracy. Accordingly, each time he does so, the player incurs a penalty of one stroke, as provided in Rule 20-1, and must place the ball as near as possible to the spot from which it was lifted — Rule 20-3c.

 

The player's action was unnecessary because Rule 20-1 states that no penalty is incurred if a ball is accidentally moved in the process of marking or lifting it under a Rule.

 

 

 

Great find. I guess I need to go back and add about 30 strokes to each of my rounds. - My buddies will be pissed when my cap goes from 12 to 40 overnight, but I will be the big winner for a while :rolleyes:

[2bGood]

To me "immediately behind" does not mean two inches away. I once played with a guy who would place his mark a good two inches IN FRONT of the ball, then replace the ball a good two inches in front of his mark. Not good.

I drop my mark behind the ball and slid it forward under the ball to the point it is almost touching but not.

 

 

My read of the note in the rule says you "should" - not that you must, so I read the note as a suggestion. Anyhow according to the ruling I am wrong.

 

Still this ruling seems to support that the note is only a recommendation:

 

20-1/16 Method Used to Mark Position of Ball

 

Q. The Note to Rule 20-1 provides that "the position of a ball to be lifted should be marked by placing a ball-marker, a small coin or other similar object immediately behind the ball." Is a player penalized if he uses an object that is not similar to a ball-marker or small coin to mark the position of his ball?

 

A. No. The provision in the Note to Rule 20-1 is a recommendation of best practice, but there is no penalty for failing to act in accordance with the Note.

[Newby]

[quote name='2bGood' timestamp='1287370563' post='2747599']


My read of the note in the rule says you "should" not you [b][u]must,[/u][/b] so I read the note as a suggestion. Anyhow according to the ruling I am wrong.

Still this ruling seems to support that the note is only a recommendation:
[/quote]

The note is primarily a recommendation about the method (ie how and with what, not about where ).

The decision clearly states that 2" is insufficiently close to guarantee the absolute requirement that the ball is replaced in its original position.

[BogeyDog11]

To me "immediately behind" does not mean two inches away. I once played with a guy who would place his mark a good two inches IN FRONT of the ball, then replace the ball a good two inches in front of his mark. Not good.

I drop my mark behind the ball and slid it forward under the ball to the point it is almost touching but not.

 

 

My read of the note in the rule says you "should" not you must, so I read the note as a suggestion. Anyhow according to the ruling I am wrong.

 

Still this ruling seems to support that the note is only a recommendation:

 

20-1/16 Method Used to Mark Position of Ball

 

Q. The Note to Rule 20-1 provides that "the position of a ball to be lifted should be marked by placing a ball-marker, a small coin or other similar object immediately behind the ball." Is a player penalized if he uses an object that is not similar to a ball-marker or small coin to mark the position of his ball?

 

A. No. The provision in the Note to Rule 20-1 is a recommendation of best practice, but there is no penalty for failing to act in accordance with the Note.

 

 

 

 

See reply #3. Looks to me like the question has been answered.

[Hateto3Putt]

[quote name='BogeyDog11' timestamp='1287352460' post='2747156']
I once played with a guy who would place his mark a good two inches IN FRONT of the ball, then replace the ball a good two inches in front of his mark. Not good.
[/quote]

I've seen that guy!

http://www.ehow.com/how_3310_mark-golf-ball.html

[mozgolf]

[quote name='Hateto3Putt' timestamp='1287403808' post='2747876']
[quote name='BogeyDog11' timestamp='1287352460' post='2747156']
I once played with a guy who would place his mark a good two inches IN FRONT of the ball, then replace the ball a good two inches in front of his mark. Not good.
[/quote]

I've seen that guy!

http://www.ehow.com/how_3310_mark-golf-ball.html
[/quote]

he gets around

[jjj912]

Another Decision, for further clarity with respect to the size of the marker.

The Rules seems to leave much leeway, but the Decisions go in to detail about what is acceptable. Looks like an instance where over time some golfers have ignored the intent of the Rule and focused solely on the wording and the Decisions were made to bring everyone back in line.

I can't help but think that Rule 20 needs some rewriting. You have this note to the Rule that says how marking should be done, but doesn't require anything specific. Then you have all these Decisions saying don't do this and don't do that.

[i][b]20-2a/7 Whether Glove Used as Indicating Mark Is Equipment[/b]
Q. A player entitled to drop a ball marks with his glove the spot on which the ball is to be dropped or the outer limit of the area within which the ball is to be dropped. The dropped ball then strikes the glove.
If the glove is a "small object," it is not equipment of the player, and the ball would not be re-dropped. Otherwise, the glove is equipment and the ball must be re-dropped under Rule 20-2a.
What is the status of the glove?
A. A glove is not a "small object" within the meaning of that term in the Definition of "Equipment." Therefore, it is equipment and the ball must be re-dropped. [/i]

[LUMA]

You put your marker directly behind the ball. Period. I usually just slip my quarter slowly behind the ball and when I feel the quarter touch the ball, I drop it and grab my ball.

When I set it down, I set the ball down on the edge of the quarter so it falls just touching it, then remove and putt.

[2bGood]

[quote name='mLuMaN83' timestamp='1287426044' post='2748322']
You put your marker directly behind the ball. Period. I usually just slip my quarter slowly behind the ball and when I feel the quarter touch the ball, I drop it and grab my ball.

When I set it down, I set the ball down on the edge of the quarter so it falls just touching it, then remove and putt.
[/quote]


I don't want my marker touching the ball at all, as this may knock it slightly from the line I have set for it.

I get that 2" is to far as the ruling says so, but is 1" too far is .5" too far? I took my ruler out the day and measure and it turned out I am about 1" behind the ball.

I think the rules needs some work as the rule itself is very open, the notes section that give some guideince is ment only to be a recomendation.

[Newby]

If you can demonstrate that you manage to get the ball back exactly on its spot every time you should have no problem.

[RJRJRJ]

[quote name='mLuMaN83' timestamp='1287426044' post='2748322']
You put your marker directly behind the ball. Period. I usually just slip my quarter slowly behind the ball and when I feel the quarter touch the ball, I drop it and grab my ball.

[/quote]

You sure about this? I was under the impression that although behind is common practice. that left, right, front etc was perfectly legal as long as you replaced the ball in the same spot.

[Mainlinegolfer]

I don't quite understand why the OP persists. His question is asked and answered (see post#3) with a USGA decision that seems to exactly answer his question. He then confirms the legitimacy of the USGA's decision by writing, "I took my ruler out the day and measure (sic) and it turned out I am about 1" behind the ball" (i.e., not 2" as he thought).

[grabthepin]

[quote name='RJRJRJ' timestamp='1287482954' post='2749330']
[quote name='mLuMaN83' timestamp='1287426044' post='2748322']
You put your marker directly behind the ball. Period. I usually just slip my quarter slowly behind the ball and when I feel the quarter touch the ball, I drop it and grab my ball.

[/quote]

You sure about this? I was under the impression that although behind is common practice. that left, right, front etc was perfectly legal as long as you replaced the ball in the same spot.
[/quote]

You can mark to the left, right etc as long as you have marked with sufficient accuracy.

[BogeyDog11]

[quote name='Mainlinegolfer' timestamp='1287491519' post='2749413']
I don't quite understand why the OP persists. His question is asked and answered (see post#3) with a USGA decision that seems to exactly answer his question. He then confirms the legitimacy of the USGA's decision by writing, "I took my ruler out the day and measure (sic) and it turned out I am about 1" behind the ball" (i.e., not 2" as he thought).
[/quote]

+2

[misterlau]

[quote name='2bGood' timestamp='1287438425' post='2748606']
I don't want my marker touching the ball at all, as this may knock it slightly from the line I have set for it.
[/quote]

You really can't place your marker right behind the ball without moving it? Touching the ball doesn't necessarily mean moving it, but if you're so worried, then put it 1 or 2mm behind. If you really have shaky/unsteady hands due to some physical or medical condition, then keeping the line you set your ball on should be the least of your worries.

[Pweb44]

I kind of wondered about when you mark your ball and someone decides that your mark may be in their line of putt and would like you to move it just to be safe what would be the best way to remark your spot. If I hadn't pick up my ball yet I would use my putter head beside my ball on either the left or right side of the ball and place a marker down. Then I would use my putter head again to realign where my ball was originally when it's my turn to putt. If I had picked up my ball I would put it back down in the correct spot and use my putter head as above and remark my position (again use my putter to put the ball back in it's original spot).

Anyone know if your balls moves while using your putter head to mark a spot off someones line, is there any penality? Would it be better to mark the spot first then used the putter head to remark your position and keep your ball in your pocket.

[Newby]

[quote name='Pweb44' timestamp='1287497792' post='2749569']

Anyone know if your balls moves while using your putter head to mark a spot off someones line, is there any penality? Would it be better to mark the spot first then used the putter head to remark your position and keep your ball in your pocket.
[/quote]

There is no penalty if you move your ball in the action of marking or replacing it.

[jjj912]

[quote name='Pweb44' timestamp='1287497792' post='2749569']
...
Anyone know if your balls moves while using your putter head to mark a spot off someones line, is there any penality? Would it be better to mark the spot first then used the putter head to remark your position and keep your ball in your pocket.
[/quote]

From Rule 20
[i]If a ball or ball-marker is accidentally moved in the process of
lifting the ball under a Rule or marking its position, the ball
or ball-marker must be replaced. There is no penalty, provided
the movement of the ball or ball-marker is directly attributable
to the specific act of marking the position of or lifting the ball.[/i]

So, there is not penalty and either method is fine. I personally don't replace a ball after lifting it unless it's my turn to play.

[BogeyDog11]

[quote name='Pweb44' timestamp='1287497792' post='2749569']
I kind of wondered about when you mark your ball and someone decides that your mark may be in their line of putt and would like you to move it just to be safe what would be the best way to remark your spot. If I hadn't pick up my ball yet I would use my putter head beside my ball on either the left or right side of the ball and place a marker down. Then I would use my putter head again to realign where my ball was originally when it's my turn to putt. If I had picked up my ball I would put it back down in the correct spot and use my putter head as above and remark my position (again use my putter to put the ball back in it's original spot).
Anyone know if your balls moves while using your putter head to mark a spot off someones line, is there any penality? Would it be better to mark the spot first then used the putter head to remark your position and keep your ball in your pocket.
[/quote]

All you simply have to do is, with your mark in place, is place your putter head on the green with the toe of the head at the mark, lift the mark and place it at the heal of the head. Very simple process. Don't make things too complicated.

[2bGood]

[quote name='Mainlinegolfer' timestamp='1287491519' post='2749413']
I don't quite understand why the OP persists. His question is asked and answered (see post#3) with a USGA decision that seems to exactly answer his question. He then confirms the legitimacy of the USGA's decision by writing, "I took my ruler out the day and measure (sic) and it turned out I am about 1" behind the ball" (i.e., not 2" as he thought).
[/quote]

I am not really persisting, I said in my second post I was wrong 2" is clearly outside the rules per the decision. I not sure that my measurment was anything other then I can't estimate distances. When I posted I just guessed that the distance I mark my ball is 2" but it turns out I am marking my ball more like 1" as I have never measured it before. If I had said I measured for entire round and I had 1" variance, then you may have a point.

But as the rule does not specify how close you marker needs to be all I really know is 2" is too far. Is 1" too far? is 1/2"? My marker is 3/4" wide if I place my marker 3/4" away each time I feel I can do that with 1/18" each time. What is the acceptable level of error, as know golfer as no marking method will be 100%

[Sawgrass]

The only thing that matters here is that you replace the ball as close as you can to the original spot. Clearly, marking two inches away doesn't allow the precision the rules demand. If the rules said you have to be no more than 1/8 inch away, then you'd have people with rulers out there calling foul.

Just put the mark next to the ball. Simple. The rules even allow you to shake the ball or move it by mistake without penalty. Problem solved.

I like to view from directly above the ball and slide my mark towards it until it looks like it's touching the side of the ball viewed from above (but isn't actually touching since the sphere's curve keeps the bottom of the ball away from the mark). I never actually touch the ball, but I'm accurate to a hair's width.

[LUMA]

Yes you can mark it to the left or right but I was saying it needs to be close. thats what I meant by nehind.

Golf is a gentleman's/lady's game and should be treated as such. Reading a rule book then finding loop holes and "technicalities" isnt very gentlemanly.

Thats just my opinion tho. Not saying any of you are doing this at all. Just saying, mark the dam ball as close as possible and move on with the game.

Again, no offense meant to anyone.

[2bGood]

[quote name='mLuMaN83' timestamp='1287544477' post='2750665']
Yes you can mark it to the left or right but I was saying it needs to be close. thats what I meant by nehind.

Golf is a gentleman's/lady's game and should be treated as such. Reading a rule book then finding loop holes and "technicalities" isnt very gentlemanly.

Thats just my opinion tho. Not saying any of you are doing this at all. Just saying, mark the dam ball as close as possible and move on with the game.

Again, no offense meant to anyone.
[/quote]

I am offended:rolleyes:. Not really.

Just a side note: I measured the difference between having your marker touching the ball (needs to be underneath the ball to do this unless it is [b]very[/b] thick) and lined up with the outer edge of the ball and if you have a thin marker and a hard surface it is 1/2" difference. So if you are like me and don't slide your marker under the ball to touch it, then right off the bat you have 1/8" to 1/4" of play pretty easy.

Of course does 1/8" really matter in golf???

[media]http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=I1I55z-x6zc&feature=related[/media]

[grabthepin]

[quote name='Newby' timestamp='1287501865' post='2749655']
[quote name='Pweb44' timestamp='1287497792' post='2749569']
Anyone know if your balls moves while using your putter head to mark a spot off someones line, is there any penality? Would it be better to mark the spot first then used the putter head to remark your position and keep your ball in your pocket.
[/quote]

There is no penalty if you move your ball in the action of marking or replacing it.
[/quote]

I'm glad there's no penalty for moving your ball when replacing it

[bignose]

[quote name='BogeyDog11' timestamp='1287537700' post='2750485']
[quote name='Pweb44' timestamp='1287497792' post='2749569']
I kind of wondered about when you mark your ball and someone decides that your mark may be in their line of putt and would like you to move it just to be safe what would be the best way to remark your spot. If I hadn't pick up my ball yet I would use my putter head beside my ball on either the left or right side of the ball and place a marker down. Then I would use my putter head again to realign where my ball was originally when it's my turn to putt. If I had picked up my ball I would put it back down in the correct spot and use my putter head as above and remark my position (again use my putter to put the ball back in it's original spot).
Anyone know if your balls moves while using your putter head to mark a spot off someones line, is there any penality? Would it be better to mark the spot first then used the putter head to remark your position and keep your ball in your pocket.
[/quote]

All you simply have to do is, with your mark in place, is place your putter head on the green with the toe of the head at the mark, lift the mark and place it at the heal of the head. Very simple process. Don't make things too complicated.
[/quote]

BogeyDog11 has it exactly right. Simply saying "2 inches" is insufficient accuracy because while we all have an idea of how far 2 inches are, it isn't exact. But, if you have something that measures about 2 inches -- like the head of the putter, that measurement is accurate.