Driver length. PGA and lpga

I have been playing around with driver length for at least a couple of years now.

I am 76 years old and over the past three years or more I have lost considerable distance. At least 50 yards and at times nearer 70 yards. This I accept is partly due to age and Ill health over the past couple of years. Five years ago I was on a single figure index but now I am almost out to 18. Most of my bad scoring is caused by not being able to reach par 4’s in two. Hence the experimenting with longer and shorter driver shafts. As I do not have access to the measuring equipment (spin etc) most of my experimenting is done by trial and error.

While researching I found that the average PGA pro’s driver is often quoted as 44.5 inches. Now doing more research I find that the average LPGA driver length is 45.25 inches.

The women generally have slower swing speeds than the men. Yet they opt for a longer shaft. I wonder why this is. Also my swing speed would be much lower again so I am thinking maybe I should look more into the longer shaft. I hit my good drives about 220 yards. Today I used a 44.5 length Ping G30 driver which I hit well but did not gain anything in distance. I have always been a good driver hitting 12 of 14 fairways or better. On a bad day this may be 10 of 14. Because of the lack of length I do not miss many fairways. I also use a Taylormade M1 driver that gives me another 3 to 5 yards but not quite as accurate.

I am interested in those who have been down this path and what they finally decided to use. Shorter, standard, or longer. Also comments from experienced fitters who must deal with this problem frequently.

I have read most if not all the postings here on driver length but have not found anything on why the LPGA drivers were longer.

Ive made quite a few drivers for both PGA and LPGA players, and the average for those i have build clubs for is 44.50" for PGA and 44.00" for LPGA (longest driver for Golf ive ever made was 45.00") Seems like you look at LPGA in ASIA where longer clubs is quite common.

Only if we have a natural flat swing plane, and a really good eye to hand coordination we can take advantage of a longer club, but i have not seen that player yet, so if you want to keep the average good, and the numbers of fairway hits high, going longer is hardly ever the way to go.

You dont tell specs of the clubs you got, neither for length or weight,(one of them was 44.50") so its hard to suggest anything else than that you read my DIY driver tune up who have helped lots of player to improve distance and accuracy on the club they got, or to figure out where to go if a change is better. It might be a few grams added head weight thats needed, a lighter shaft, or a shaft with more weight.

https://forums.golfwrx.com/discussion/909991/diy-driver-tune-up-diy-fitting/p1

Thanks Howard.

I have read your driver tune up several times and use parts of it when I can. Due to illness and operations I have not been able to have any range sessions. I use a mobility scooter on the course to get around. I hope to be able to do some range sessions early next year when I am more recovered and I can do more extensive testing. Most of the testing done now is actual play and noting any change of where I am on the course.

I cannot recall where I got the LPGA driver length from but thought it was from an American golf magazine on the internet. I will keep experimenting as I do enjoy trying to push the boundaries of equipment.

Rexroh,

Go to the Ping website and you can lookup all of their staff players specs. Interestingly there is only woman who is playing a driver under 45". All of the rest are playing 45" and longer. There are 5 women playing clubs 46" and longer.

Try a longer club, it may work for you.

> @rybo said:

> Rexroh,

>

> Go to the Ping website and you can lookup all of their staff players specs. Interestingly there is only woman who is playing a driver under 45". All of the rest are playing 45" and longer. There are 5 women playing clubs 46" and longer.

>

> Try a longer club, it may work for you.

We never know before its tried, but without LM numbers its hard to judge this.

His good drives seems to be 220, so if we assume he has 85 Mpg club speed, it might look like this.

1 inch longer (44.50" to 45.50") gives a theoretical potential of 4 mpg club speed, and if we set smash to 1.50 its 6 Mph ball speed and average 12 yards "all else equal"

If his smash factor NOW is as low as 1.43 (not unusual), and improves that to 1.5, he get the same 6 mph ball speed and 12 yards.

The question is, what gives the highest average ball speed, and highest number of fairway hits or decent dispersion sideways?

It might be worth a try with a longer club, but not before he is certain that the club he has cant deliver more than it does, sometimes a few grams added head weight makes wonders

IF a longer club is on the list, he should go a see a club fitter, that might improve it all for him

Don't disagree with you, the issue is sometimes things on paper just don't work out the same in real life and he may see greater gains (or losses) then expected.

Also Ping knows how to fit golf clubs, and their female staff is playing clubs on the longer side (so are the men). The Tour does not use shorter drivers, again look at what the men on Ping's staff are using, a couple are under 45" and the majority are longer then 45", with some using 46"+. With a bit of practice and acclimation it's pretty easy to hit a longer club. Rory who is arguably the best current driver of the golf ball uses a 45 1/2" driver and he's about 5' 6" on a good day.

> @rybo said:

> Don't disagree with you, the issue is sometimes things on paper just don't work out the same in real life and he may see greater gains (or losses) then expected.

>

> Also Ping knows how to fit golf clubs, and their female staff is playing clubs on the longer side (so are the men). The Tour does not use shorter drivers, again look at what the men on Ping's staff are using, a couple are under 45" and the majority are longer then 45", with some using 46"+. With a bit of practice and acclimation it's pretty easy to hit a longer club. Rory who is arguably the best current driver of the golf ball uses a 45 1/2" driver and he's about 5' 6" on a good day.

I took a peak into PINGs LPGA players, and they are generous with specs, Kudos for that. It seems like shorter the player was, longer the driver is (did not make stats, just the impression i got), and ive seen this years ago on the Asian tour, but have not noticed this as a trend i Europe.

Doesn't Brooke play @48"?

> @animalgolfs said:

> Doesn't Brooke play @48"?

>

>

According to the Ping website she does.

Women also make better swings and contact than men just from a purely anatomical standpoint (both flexibility and body shape), so they're better suited to get away with a longer club.

Get implants and do yoga and then play the longest driver you can find.

Brooke Henderson grips down on her driver which was 48 inches. Played about 46 inches but hard to be exact. I will have another look at the Ping site and possibly others. I am also re reading Tom Wishon's book on the search for the perfect club. His suggestion appears to be shorter still.

Currently Howards Driver tune up guide appears to be best but I will keep experiments going.

> @rexroh said:

> Brooke Henderson grips down on her driver which was 48 inches. Played about 46 inches but hard to be exact. I will have another look at the Ping site and possibly others. I am also re reading Tom Wishon's book on the search for the perfect club. His suggestion appears to be shorter still.

>

> Currently Howards Driver tune up guide appears to be best but I will keep experiments going.

I'm afraid your only recourse is going to be longer in regards to gaining back some distance.

I speak from witness - seen many of members lose distance due to age. Most were solid sticks - just like you. Couple experimented going longer & had success -

Good Luck

I agree. If you haven't already at least tried a extended length driver, why not give it a whirl? You say you like to experiment right? I think the key is to not only go long, but go light as well. Try to find a driver head no heavier than 185 grams and a shaft no heavier than 50 grams. The recipe is to stay under 285 grams total including grip. Start at 48" and adjust down as necessary in 1/2" increments. I'm sure some will scoff at this notion but I've seen it work for a lot of older seniors including myself.

If you go way back they is an article in the Shoptalk archive written by Bernie Baymiller who advocated a long(48"+) driver for seniors to regain lost distance. It was written in the late 90's but his concept should work as well or better today with the larger driver heads. I think he was a reason the Chicago Golf 966SD driver became a cult favourite. In my view it was a better head than the Big Bertha and one of the best of the era. I still have an 11° that I play.

My Dad had similar struggles when he got into his 70's. Ultimately he just moved up to the forward tees. At 220 off the tee you probably should be looking to play the course at 6000 yards.

> @animalgolfs said:

> Doesn't Brooke play @48"?

>

>

Yes and picked up 25 yards when she switched.

> @rexroh said:

> Brooke Henderson grips down on her driver which was 48 inches. Played about 46 inches but hard to be exact. I will have another look at the Ping site and possibly others. I am also re reading Tom Wishon's book on the search for the perfect club. His suggestion appears to be shorter still.

>

> Currently Howards Driver tune up guide appears to be best but I will keep experiments going.

She chokes down on every club including driver before she switched to 48”

I've wondered whether the PGA average is still < 45 inches. I have no firsthand knowledge like Howard but other than Bubba I can't recall a WITB that was less than 45 in recent times (of course, these specs could be wrong too). I totally get that for many players strike will be much better with a shorter club. Bu the pros are already extremely gifted to begin with, so if anyone can handle it they would be the people to do so. I don't know but my guess is that most of the younger pros today started (at least in a grown teenage/adult body frame) when all the divers you could pick up were 45+. Hence, it's the only thing they've swung an they just figured out how to hit it. In contrast, in prior years there were probably a lot of players that started when drivers were less than 45 inches so that's what they were accustomed to.

I've never been able to figure out why the LPGA players are using clubs that are so long (relatively speaking). Clearly it works and they have some swing characteristics that may help, but logically I've never heard what seemed like an overly compelling reason.

> @agolf1 said:

> I've wondered whether the PGA average is still < 45 inches. I have no firsthand knowledge like Howard but other than Bubba I can't recall a WITB that was less than 45 in recent times (of course, these specs could be wrong too). I totally get that for many players strike will be much better with a shorter club. Bu the pros are already extremely gifted to begin with, so if anyone can handle it they would be the people to do so. I don't know but my guess is that most of the younger pros today started (at least in a grown teenage/adult body frame) when all the divers you could pick up were 45+. Hence, it's the only thing they've swung an they just figured out how to hit it. In contrast, in prior years there were probably a lot of players that started when drivers were less than 45 inches so that's what they were accustomed to.

>

> I've never been able to figure out why the LPGA players are using clubs that are so long (relatively speaking). Clearly it works and they have some swing characteristics that may help, but logically I've never heard what seemed like an overly compelling reason.

Time is running fast, and its about 3 years now since i made the last driver for a PGA or LPGA pro, so i im simply not "up to date" with the trend changes that might be out there. The heads we play has changed from about 2016, with way more varieties to VCOG and RCOG, the area of the face with "high ball speed" has become larger, and as a sum, this might allow for more varieties to impact than it did before. Again, only testing can tell whats the best for each player, so i might be "old school", advocating drivers of 44.00" for those who plays "standard" length irons, max 44.50", but that could be "outdated" knowledge now,

> @"Howard Jones" said:

> > @agolf1 said:

> > I've wondered whether the PGA average is still < 45 inches. I have no firsthand knowledge like Howard but other than Bubba I can't recall a WITB that was less than 45 in recent times (of course, these specs could be wrong too). I totally get that for many players strike will be much better with a shorter club. Bu the pros are already extremely gifted to begin with, so if anyone can handle it they would be the people to do so. I don't know but my guess is that most of the younger pros today started (at least in a grown teenage/adult body frame) when all the divers you could pick up were 45+. Hence, it's the only thing they've swung an they just figured out how to hit it. In contrast, in prior years there were probably a lot of players that started when drivers were less than 45 inches so that's what they were accustomed to.

> >

> > I've never been able to figure out why the LPGA players are using clubs that are so long (relatively speaking). Clearly it works and they have some swing characteristics that may help, but logically I've never heard what seemed like an overly compelling reason.

>

> Time is running fast, and its about 3 years now since i made the last driver for a PGA or LPGA pro, so i im simply not "up to date" with the trend changes that might be out there. The heads we play has changed from about 2016, with way more varieties to VCOG and RCOG, the area of the face with "high ball speed" has become larger, and as a sum, this might allow for more varieties to impact than it did before. Again, only testing can tell whats the best for each player, so i might be "old school", advocating drivers of 44.00" for those who plays "standard" length irons, max 44.50", but that could be "outdated" knowledge now,

Interesting comment on the driver heads. I also don't think "old school" means outdated or inferior. For many, especially average players, my guess is that it results in better outcomes.

I currently play a 45 inch driver and grip down 1/2 inch or so. I've never been able to hit something longer than 45 well when playing at full length. But the truth is that I give up after about 5-10 swings as well. The timing and contact is not good and I just revert to what is comfortable. If I could practice everyday, maybe I could get some net benefit from the longer club (or maybe not, as my swing is only so good).

I have tried longer as well as shorter. To control accuracy I cannot swing as hard with a 48 inch driver. As the shaft gets shorter I can swing harder and still have control. I suspect swing speed stayed the same. I tried a ladies’ driver head (Ping) to get a lighter head and shaft. This head was less than 460cc (an older model) but that seemed to be worse than a standard head. I had no control of the club head.

I have tried to source a shaft that is less than 50 grams. To get a Ping Distanza shaft here (New Zealandj I have been quoted about $200 usd. This is well beyond what I want to pay for experiments. I search local auctions regularly but lighter shafts are very rare here.

My last round with ping g30 head and regular Ping shaft (44.5”) felt good but as I was playing back tees it was hard to see if there was an improvement in distance. Tomorrow should help when I play the front tees (white - normal mid week tees). I play 3 times a week from those tees.

I will try and sort the best combination of short shaft and head and long shaft and head then have a shoot out.

Off to do some more searching.

Obviously this is an equipment forum but.....

I have a somewhat unique background being a personal trainer for 8+ years and a fitter for about the same amount of time. The answer to significant distance loss is NOT going to be found in your equipment unfortunately. The answer is a combination of getting into better shape (both strength AND flexibility) and taking some lessons to learn how to create better "lag" on the downswing.

> @"Lacey Underall" said:

> Obviously this is an equipment forum but.....

>

> I have a somewhat unique background being a personal trainer for 8+ years and a fitter for about the same amount of time. The answer to significant distance loss is NOT going to be found in your equipment unfortunately. The answer is a combination of getting into better shape (both strength AND flexibility) and taking some lessons to learn how to create better "lag" on the downswing.

While I tend to agree with you my other injuries from the past (mainly back) prevent flexibility to some extent, Lessons can also help but I need to practice after lessons and at the moment that is also out of the equation.

Currently a shaft at 47.5 inches (soft regular) has increased distance if I keep the swing smooth. I will keep testing on the course. It is fun.