Vintage McGregor Help - What do I have here?

[rmc26]

Hello,

 

Took a chance on some clubs as I could not find any info on them.

 

They are Diamonndback blades 2-SW. The SW is not a Diamonndback but matching. The diamonds do have some shaping on the bottom and straight on top.

 

They say By Nicklaus and Custom Limited on the backs. I've seen Custom Tourney sets but nothing like these.

 

 

Please let me know the history on these.

 

Thank you all!

[Davewn]

What does the script say on the backs? It's pretty tough to read, especially upside down and with that PIA watermark.

[ClayJ]

It says "custom limited." There was a set on ebay recently. My uneducated shot in the dark guess is that these were a limited edition sort of like the "tourney custom" sets of old, but from the late 80's, early 90's?

[rex235]

rmc-

 

You seek information and history.

 

Your photos are of MacGregor Custom Limited (by Nicklaus) irons.

 

Are there photos of the club faces?

 

Custom grind faces are different due to custom order- some have diamond framed scoring lines, while others do not.

 

What is the Reg No on the ferrules?

 

In most cases, the Sand Wedge does not have diamond back pad design, though some RH SW models from the 1950s did have the "MT Wingback" grind.

 

Note- (LH MacGregor models stopped the diamond back grind at the 9 iron- no PW, or SW.)

 

MacGregor closed it's doors in 2009, taking all the information on their custom grinds with them.

 

Don White had worked for MacGregor since 1971, but he now does custom ground irons for National Golf Works.

 

Depending on the year (early '70s), it is likely Don White or Art Emerson who did the work on this set.

 

Clay Long, a noted club designer who did work for MacGregor, would also be a great source to answer your questions.

 

Good Luck.

[rmc26]

I took the plunge on said eBay listing...

 

I'll share more information when they arrive.

[wkuo3]

2-SW is a nice set.

What shaft is in the set ?

[Texsport]

Jack Nicklaus played a MacGregor diamond back set of irons early in his career.

 

Don White makes a similar custom set now.

 

Texsport

[HoganApexBlades]

Jack Nicklaus played a MacGregor diamond back set of irons early in his career.

 

Don White makes a similar custom set now.

 

Texsport

 

Jack played '59 Diamondback MAC Tommy Armour SS1 irons until he replaced them with the coveted '67 VIP bY_Nicklaus forged blades.

[rex235]

...and "Jack Nicklaus" was stamped on each of his irons.

 

-And MacGregor...

 

 

 

...even made LH Diamondback model irons, with FC 4000 faces.

[birly-shirly]

I have a hunch that the shape of the muscle pad on any decent forged blade is more cosmetic than functional. But if that's the case, you might as well have a really cool looking design - and to my eyes there's none cooler than those old diamond backs.

[wkuo3]

I have a hunch that the shape of the muscle pad on any decent forged blade is more cosmetic than functional. But if that's the case, you might as well have a really cool looking design - and to my eyes there's none cooler than those old diamond backs.

 

IMO the design of the back of the MB blades has something to do with weight distribution. This is before the parameter weight design came out. The older MB had the weight bar across the back, moving the bar to lower side to elevate the long irons and the middle for the mid irons and to the higher spot across the back for short irons to control the trajectory.

The diamond shaped design is to move more weight into the center of the head ( power spot ? ). Not sure but some of the older irons had the different shape of the design .

[birly-shirly]

 

IMO the design of the back of the MB blades has something to do with weight distribution. [...]

 

I agree, but my hunch is that the effect is smaller than you'd expect. The muscle back design is visually obvious. Less conspicuous are the other factors like blade height, hosel length, and the thickness of the blade as it varies from topline to sole.Once you factor in ALL of those, you seem to end up with a CoG that moves maybe a quarter of an inch in any direction and, in my hands at least, plays pretty similarly.

[jmck]

Looks like something out of the custom catalog to me. I'd guess mid to late 80s based on the ferrules.

[BIG STU]

IMO the design of the back of the MB blades has something to do with weight distribution. [...]

 

I agree, but my hunch is that the effect is smaller than you'd expect. The muscle back design is visually obvious. Less conspicuous are the other factors like blade height, hosel length, and the thickness of the blade as it varies from topline to sole.Once you factor in ALL of those, you seem to end up with a CoG that moves maybe a quarter of an inch in any direction and, in my hands at least, plays pretty similarly.

All Diamond backs are balanced with most of the weight behind the sweet spot. Trust me the ball comes off hot on those compared to other designs or at least for me it does. I know I hit my stock 57s with stock Pro Pel 2 shafts higher than I do either set of my 62 FC-4000s with the same shafts. Go figure that? Of course everyone's AOA is different

[BIG STU]

It says "custom limited." There was a set on ebay recently. My uneducated shot in the dark guess is that these were a limited edition sort of like the "tourney custom" sets of old, but from the late 80's, early 90's?

Yep straight out of the custom shop

[birly-shirly]

IMO the design of the back of the MB blades has something to do with weight distribution. [...]

 

I agree, but my hunch is that the effect is smaller than you'd expect. The muscle back design is visually obvious. Less conspicuous are the other factors like blade height, hosel length, and the thickness of the blade as it varies from topline to sole.Once you factor in ALL of those, you seem to end up with a CoG that moves maybe a quarter of an inch in any direction and, in my hands at least, plays pretty similarly.

All Diamond backs are balanced with most of the weight behind the sweet spot. Trust me the ball comes off hot on those compared to other designs or at least for me it does. I know I hit my stock 57s with stock Pro Pel 2 shafts higher than I do either set of my 62 FC-4000s with the same shafts. Go figure that? Of course everyone's AOA is different

 

Hey Stu - that I don't doubt. For one thing, you might be one of the relative few who strikes the ball consistently enough to see a difference in flight from relatively small design changes. (Me, not so much :lol: )

 

The other possible factor, and I have not had diamond backs in my hand to see for myself, but I have a set of Tourney MT FC4000s that are deep faced and relatively thick in the top half of the blade. Compared to a set of VIPs or Muirfields, there's a bunch of design aspects that would tend towards a lower launch, of which the muscle pad design and placement is just one.

 

I did once pass up on a part set of Paul Azinger signature diamond backs. I figured that I'd never fill the gaps and that would drive me nuts. I certainly haven't seen that model for real ever since - although I'm more often playing a short set these days so the gaps might not have been such an issue.

[rmc26]

Got them in today. Man are they sweet and tiny in the long irons. They are in darn good shape too.

 

Please see the serial number below and let me know if anyone has more info.

 

May be taking them to the course for an evening nine.

 

 

 

 

 

[BIG STU]

IMO the design of the back of the MB blades has something to do with weight distribution. [...]

 

I agree, but my hunch is that the effect is smaller than you'd expect. The muscle back design is visually obvious. Less conspicuous are the other factors like blade height, hosel length, and the thickness of the blade as it varies from topline to sole.Once you factor in ALL of those, you seem to end up with a CoG that moves maybe a quarter of an inch in any direction and, in my hands at least, plays pretty similarly.

All Diamond backs are balanced with most of the weight behind the sweet spot. Trust me the ball comes off hot on those compared to other designs or at least for me it does. I know I hit my stock 57s with stock Pro Pel 2 shafts higher than I do either set of my 62 FC-4000s with the same shafts. Go figure that? Of course everyone's AOA is different

 

Hey Stu - that I don't doubt. For one thing, you might be one of the relative few who strikes the ball consistently enough to see a difference in flight from relatively small design changes. (Me, not so much :lol: )

 

The other possible factor, and I have not had diamond backs in my hand to see for myself, but I have a set of Tourney MT FC4000s that are deep faced and relatively thick in the top half of the blade. Compared to a set of VIPs or Muirfields, there's a bunch of design aspects that would tend towards a lower launch, of which the muscle pad design and placement is just one.

 

I did once pass up on a part set of Paul Azinger signature diamond backs. I figured that I'd never fill the gaps and that would drive me nuts. I certainly haven't seen that model for real ever since - although I'm more often playing a short set these days so the gaps might not have been such an issue.

Not that I consider myself a good ball striker but any of the copper faces seem hotter to me than a FC face. Where it really get hot for me is on a bump and run the ball seems to come of hotter on a copper faced 7 iron than it does any of my VIPs or Muirfields or FCs for that matter. It is darn sure a sight hotter than my Mizuno 68s. I actually had the same problem with the M-85 reissue Colorkroms I had. Loved it on the long irons but hated it on the short irons. In fact for about 6 months I played a "combo set" of VIP w thru 6 iron and 2 thru 5 with the M-85s. But then again it may be just me

[BIG STU]

Got them in today. Man are they sweet and tiny in the long irons. They are in darn good shape too.

 

Please see the serial number below and let me know if anyone has more info.

 

May be taking them to the course for an evening nine.

 

 

 

 

 

Beautiful just beautiful. Can you say "buttah knife"? of course they look natural to me. I do not have a Kaplan Catalog so I can't be of any help on the numbers

[birly-shirly]

Those look great. I think the serial number starting "SO" indicates a custom or special order. Are there shaft bands? That might help date them. The fact that they're stamped with Nicklaus will give you a "made before" date. Certain shafts or bands may give you a "made after" date and a likely window.

[rmc26]

I did not think about shafts as a date indicator.

 

They are TT DG S300

[birly-shirly]

So, assuming those are the original shafts, those are most likely from the 1980s. I think Jack left MacGregor and took his name with him in 1991. TTDG came out in 1980. I would guess it was the standard shaft for high end irons through the mid and late 80s. Early '80s Muirfield irons were plain Dynamic. But yours being custom order means you can't be too specific. Curious to hear how they play once you've hit them, and also how you came to find them in such great shape.

[oldschoolrocker]

Great looking irons!!!

[bullrambler]

Awesome set of irons. Probably not too common and your set is in great shape...!

[wkuo3]

It also looks like brand spanking new ( or refinished but I think it is mint ).

Play it only if you are not thinking of resale value and could enjoy the blade design. Otherwise, store it properly.

[Guest]

These irons are custom ordered models, but I'm not sure if they are from the Ohio or Georgia days. They are not Diamondbacks in the strict sense of the word. Their shape is more reminiscent of the PT irons from the late 1950's, with the scooped shape on the top of the blades as shown in the pics of the PT3's or the Paul Azinger models. true Diamondbacks have straight cuts top and bottom like TA SS1's.

[TourneyCustom]

I agree with MacGregorPro, on the shapes. Here are a couple of pics to show the difference between the scoop back and straight cut muscles.