I gave a wrong ruling.

[jobin]

No harm done, not any sort of competition and the player was well prepared to lose many balls on this course.

 

Dan was 100 yards to the front edge of the green, plus 30 yrds to the flag.  The green was steeply elevated and from the front edge a long tongue of general area extended to the water. Dan needed to fly the ball at least 80 yrds to clear the pond directly in front of him and land on the apron. He twice already failed. The long apron peninsula  of dry ground was surrounded by water and all the water was marked with yellow stakes.

 

Dan hit the ball which cleared the first patch of pond, bounced on the dry tongue of land and flew over the 2nd set of markers and into the water. He then asked me what he ought do.

 

I had only one thought which was 'where did the ball last cross the margin'?  And that was from the dry land which lay in front of the green.  So i told Dan to drop 2 club lengths near the water on the tongue of land.  He did that.

 

But now i have boned up on yellow stakes and believe Dan should have dropped a ball from the original spot 100 yrds from the green.  I don't think there was any possible place to drop 'back on the line' since nothing but water was back of the place the ball last crossed the margin. (Well there was, but 180 yrds away).

 

i guess i prefer RED stakes.

 

 

 

 

[Colin L]

I'm not quite getting a picture of this..    Dan's line of play seems to be crossing part of a pond, some ground and then another stretch of pond.  We need to know how the penalty area is marked.  Do the stakes/line define an oval surrounding both the pond  and the ground part dividing it, or do they mark out a sort of jig-saw puzzle shape by following the line of the pond's edge all the way round  so that it  excludes the tongue of land his ball bounced on?

[Mr. Bean]

53 minutes ago, Colin L said:

I'm not quite getting a picture of this..    Dan's line of play seems to be crossing part of a pond, some ground and then another stretch of pond.  We need to know how the penalty area is marked.  Do the stakes/line define an oval surrounding both the pond  and the ground part dividing it, or do they mark out a sort of jig-saw puzzle shape by following the line of the pond's edge all the way round  so that it  excludes the tongue of land his ball bounced on?

 

The OP said "a long tongue of general area extended to the water". I suppose that explains the picture.

 

Edited October 9, 2022 by Mr. Bean

[Colin L]

29 minutes ago, Mr. Bean said:

 

The OP said "a long tongue of general area extended to the water". I suppose that explains the picture.

 

That would be the "peninsula" that's surrounded by water?  

[Newby]

3 hours ago, jobin said:

  I don't think there was any possible place to drop 'back on the line' since nothing but water was back of the place the ball last crossed the margin. (Well there was, but 180 yrds away).

 

Where it last crossed the margin from the land side into the water.  If it crossed land before entering the water, that is the land he could 'drop back on the line'.

[Mr. Bean]

1 hour ago, Colin L said:

That would be the "peninsula" that's surrounded by water?  

 

That's how I understood it.

[Fuscinator]

Sounds like golf might not be Dan's cup of tea.

[Mr. Bean]

1 hour ago, Fuscinator said:

Sounds like golf might not be Dan's cup of tea.

 

Why on earth did you say so?? We all have been beginners, you as well. And we all have our bad days when balls do not obey.

[Colin L]

4 hours ago, Mr. Bean said:

 

That's how I understood it.

It's not why I have difficulty picturing the situation but a peninsula cannot be surrounded by water.  It it were, it would be an island.  My comment was a somewhat ironic aside.

 

It seems likely that the Dan's line of play was across one part of the pond,  over a bit of ground and then over another part of the pond.

 

 If the penalty area is marked around the perimeter of the pond, then the bit of ground is not in the PA and so his ball crossed the first part of the pond , bounced on the ground and moved forward into the next part of the pond.  He would likely be able to drop back on the line on the ground his ball had bounced off.  I can't picture why that wasn't possible but would mention that the  two club lengths measure doesn't come into back on the line relief.

 

If on the other hand, the whole area of pond and intruding ground is defined as the penalty area, the first  margin his ball crossed was also the last one crossed and relief would be back on the line from there or stroke and distance.  Had his ball stayed on the tongue of ground in the penalty area, he could have played it from there without penalty.

 

 

Edited October 9, 2022 by Colin L

[Colin L]

Duplicate post.

Edited October 9, 2022 by Colin L

[nsxguy]

FWIW, below is how I picture the situation.

 

(Not to scale)

 

[antip]

You are right that red stakes are friendlier. That lateral relief option is commonly much friendlier than back on line.