Range vs Sim for coaching/classes?

[jimmie]

I'm just getting back into golf after a few years away and I'm considering taking a few lessons with a coach to help get me back into it and hopefully help get me to a better level than I was when I left. The two options I'm looking at both come highly recommended from friends, but are pretty different.

 

The first is a club pro at a very nice local course, lessons would be a fairly typical 1 hour session at the driving range or at the short game practice facility.

 

Option 2 is at a shop, 1.50 Golf, in a simulator, still a 1 hour session, but all indoors. They're very tech driven with full 3d swing analysis and everything.

 

Which would you pick. My gut says stick with the club pro, he has a deal where if you buy 5 lessons you get one free, and my short game is probably the weakest part of my game. I'm not sure how they'd be able to do any short game work in the Sim, but I've never been in one other than just messing around.

 

Any advice?

[bluedot]

Ok…

 

Imo, anybody teaching golf in 2023 without video and Trackman has one hand tied behind their back.  These are GREAT teaching tools IN THE RIGHT HANDS.  

 

And there’s the rub, and your answer.  The better TEACHER is where you should go.  I’d much prefer that the pro at my club had video, etc, but he doesn’t.  He is, however, a GREAT teacher, which consists of a lot of skills beyond just knowing the golf swing and having access to technology.

 

Find people that have been to the club pro, and see what they think.  Find out the same about SPECIFIC instructors at the other place.  Go with the best teacher.

Edited July 5, 2023 by bluedot

[getitdaily]

If you're going to be doing more than just long game then go with the outdoors guy so long as he uses video. 

 

I think the 3d motion stuff is really good but really for more advanced players. There are a lot of basic things that many people don't do correctly that don't need 3d motion capture that can be taught easily. 

 

So, unless you're sub 5 handicap then I wouldn't worry too much about motion capture stuff...but video is an absolute must. Trackman is a plus...

[jimmie]

Thanks for the tips, that definitely gives me some direction. I may end up doing both eventually, the sim setup for swing mechanics and take a few short game classes with the pro. Ill find out about what both coaches have to offer, I know people that have taken classes with both.

[againstthegrain]

As a hack 3D opened my eyes to exactly how bad my swing was so I wouldn't discourage anyone from using it at least once.  The information was eye opening and forced an internal and external reckoning.  However trying to match some ideal swing models numbers w a poor coach was a waste of time and money.  (Golf-tec)

 

My ideal situation turned out to be a club pro that stayed north in the winter and gave lessons on a sim.  I could stay on track in the summer w range, short game, and on course work every few weeks and during the winter accomplish major changes and playing a few simulated holes at end of each lesson.  He was a tremendous coach, imho, at either venue.  

 

Presumably OP wants to play now so I'd opt for the club pro which would probably  lead to more effective playing this season and re-evaluate in the off season.

Edited July 5, 2023 by againstthegrain

[iacas]

All else equal… most of the time (not all the time), I prefer working indoors. You never have to worry about the weather or the wind, and you can focus at first more easily on making a change, not immediately worrying about where the ball is going or how far.

 

With launch monitors, 3D, etc. you can still see the ball flight, get actual numbers, etc.

 

But, like someone else said above… go with the better instructor.

[Forged4ever]

As has been stated before me, go with the better Teacher

 

All things being equal, go with the Club Pro🤙

 

Being out doors in a more natural realistic environment is icing on the cake🎂😊

 

All The Best🍻

RP

Edited July 7, 2023 by Forged4ever

[bluedot]

On 7/5/2023 at 7:55 PM, iacas said:

All else equal… most of the time (not all the time), I prefer working indoors. You never have to worry about the weather or the wind, and you can focus at first more easily on making a change, not immediately worrying about where the ball is going or how far.

 

With launch monitors, 3D, etc. you can still see the ball flight, get actual numbers, etc.

 

But, like someone else said above… go with the better instructor.

And use your own ball instead of range balls, no matter how good the range balls are.

[dvq9654]

I've experienced both and although I much prefer hitting off grass , I would take a teacher with video and trackman inside vs. someone outside without either, assuming all else relatively equal.

 

The data trackman shows you is invaluable, not only because it tells you what you are doing wrong, but also because it shows you when your change is right - even if it feels absolutely horrible and the result is garbage. I think many people, including myself, struggle to fully believe what a teacher is telling them if the results are awful. Data eliminates or limits that effect and allows you to suck it up and listen. I also don't think the point of a lesson is to feel pure strikes off well-manicured grass; the purpose is to change your swing for the better and contact is usually secondary in situations where you're truly making change. 

[MonteScheinblum]

You go with the better, more knowledgeable guy.  The indoor guy can teach you short game indoors or can find somewhere to do it on grass, as he should have a connect.  That’s what I have.
 

However, both being equal indoors is actually better for lessons.  Ball flight stunts people’s ability to change their motor pattern. “This feels weird and I hit a lot of bad shots, I’m not doing this.”
 

The greatest affect I have ever had on handicaps was during the lockdown.  I was giving 30 face time lessons a week to people in their garages and yards hitting into $50 nets they hit on Amazon.  People didn’t care where the ball went and all they did was work on better motor patterns.

 

One guy went from a 21 to a 10 in 5 months.

[Kuuuch]

4 hours ago, MonteScheinblum said:

You go with the better, more knowledgeable guy.  The indoor guy can teach you short game indoors or can find somewhere to do it on grass, as he should have a connect.  That’s what I have.
 

However, both being equal indoors is actually better for lessons.  Ball flight stunts people’s ability to change their motor pattern. “This feels weird and I hit a lot of bad shots, I’m not doing this.”
 

The greatest affect I have ever had on handicaps was during the lockdown.  I was giving 30 face time lessons a week to people in their garages and yards hitting into $50 nets they hit on Amazon.  People didn’t care where the ball went and all they did was work on better motor patterns.

 

One guy went from a 21 to a 10 in 5 months.

Made some of my best improvements from FaceTime lessons. Garage setups with no ball flight feedback are so underrated too. As long as you’re working on the right thing, you can make some serious changes very fast. I honestly prefer to work on my swing in my garage vs the range these days. 

[SNIPERBBB]

My thought is that I prefer most everything to be on the range. If you have a student or you are the student that needs things laid out for them in more graphic detail to beat it into their head with a piledriver that they are doing/not doing what they think they are doing, the studio sessions would be of greater value.

[jimmie]

6 hours ago, MonteScheinblum said:

You go with the better, more knowledgeable guy.  The indoor guy can teach you short game indoors or can find somewhere to do it on grass, as he should have a connect.  That’s what I have.
 

However, both being equal indoors is actually better for lessons.  Ball flight stunts people’s ability to change their motor pattern. “This feels weird and I hit a lot of bad shots, I’m not doing this.”
 

The greatest affect I have ever had on handicaps was during the lockdown.  I was giving 30 face time lessons a week to people in their garages and yards hitting into $50 nets they hit on Amazon.  People didn’t care where the ball went and all they did was work on better motor patterns.

 

One guy went from a 21 to a 10 in 5 months.

That makes a lot of sense, I did buy a 5x5 hitting mat and a net to set up in my shop so I can work on whatever I pick up from my lessons. A launch monitor/sim setup is in the future. I was flirting with a single digit handicap before my hiatus and hope to get back to that as quickly as I can.

 

As far as the connect that the indoor coach would have for a short game guy it turns out that the two coaches I'm looking at actually play as a team in some tournaments, so that may work out perfectly.

[MonteScheinblum]

51 minutes ago, jimmie said:

That makes a lot of sense, I did buy a 5x5 hitting mat and a net to set up in my shop so I can work on whatever I pick up from my lessons. A launch monitor/sim setup is in the future. I was flirting with a single digit handicap before my hiatus and hope to get back to that as quickly as I can.

 

As far as the connect that the indoor coach would have for a short game guy it turns out that the two coaches I'm looking at actually play as a team in some tournaments, so that may work out perfectly.

I meant connect for a short game area to use, but sounds like you’re good.