Penalty relief on putting green

[Nels55]

There is a green on our course where taking 2 club lengths no nearer the hole from a lateral penalty area can allow part of the relief area to be on the green.  Is the ball dropped or placed on the green?  

[Colin L]

Dropped.

 

 Don't forget  that the dropped ball must come to rest in the same area of the course that it first touched when dropped and so if the ball first touches the putting green and the rolls off it, it must be dropped again

[Newby]

2 hours ago, Colin L said:

Dropped.

 

 Don't forget  that the dropped ball must come to rest in the same area of the course that it first touched when dropped and so if the ball first touches the putting green and the rolls off it, it must be dropped again

And placed on the spot on the green  it hit if it happens again.

[Nels55]

Okay, is a cart path also a separate part of the course with the same procedure as the putting green?

[sui generis]

1 hour ago, Nels55 said:

Okay, is a cart path also a separate part of the course with the same procedure as the putting green?

 

Areas of the Course

The five defined areas that make up the course:

 

The general area,

The teeing area the player must play from in starting the hole they are playing,

All penalty areas,

All bunkers, and

The putting green of the hole the player is playing.

 

https://www.usga.org/rules/rules-and-clarifications/rules-and-clarifications.html#!ruletype=fr&section=definitions&subrulenum=5

[Colin L]

3 hours ago, Nels55 said:

Okay, is a cart path also a separate part of the course with the same procedure as the putting green?

As you see from the above, it isn't a defined area of the course.  But if after taking relief from a penalty area, your ball is in or on an abnormal course condition  such as an artificially surfaced path, or the condition  interferes with stance or intended area of swing,  you can choose to take relief  without penalty.

[antip]

13 hours ago, Colin L said:

Dropped.

 

 Don't forget  that the dropped ball must come to rest in the same area of the course that it first touched when dropped and so if the ball first touches the putting green and the rolls off it, it must be dropped again

And when it is re-dropped, there is no requirement to drop in the same area of the course where the first drop landed.

[betarhoalphadelta]

On 7/15/2023 at 9:16 PM, Colin L said:

As you see from the above, it isn't a defined area of the course.  But if after taking relief from a penalty area, your ball is in or on an abnormal course condition  such as an artificially surfaced path, or the condition  interferes with stance or intended area of swing,  you can choose to take relief  without penalty.

 

So a cart path would be defined as part of general area (assuming it's not marked as being a penalty area, and obviously nobody builds cart paths through the teeing area, bunker, or putting green), and happens to be an ACC within the general area then? 

 

Which means if your relief option has you dropping a ball on the cart path, and it rolls into the rough--but remains within the allowable relief area--there is no re-drop or placement where it first hit if it occurs a second time? 

[rogolf]

46 minutes ago, betarhoalphadelta said:

 

So a cart path would be defined as part of general area (assuming it's not marked as being a penalty area, and obviously nobody builds cart paths through the teeing area, bunker, or putting green), and happens to be an ACC within the general area then? 

 

Which means if your relief option has you dropping a ball on the cart path, and it rolls into the rough--but remains within the allowable relief area--there is no re-drop or placement where it first hit if it occurs a second time? 

Yes, that is correct.

[Newby]

10 hours ago, betarhoalphadelta said:

 

So a cart path would be defined as part of general area (assuming it's not marked as being a penalty area, and obviously nobody builds cart paths through the teeing area, bunker, or putting green), and happens to be an ACC within the general area then? 

 

Which means if your relief option has you dropping a ball on the cart path, and it rolls into the rough--but remains within the allowable relief area--there is no re-drop or placement where it first hit if it occurs a second time? 

But you could get free relief from the path if there was interference from it.

[betarhoalphadelta]

3 hours ago, Newby said:

But you could get free relief from the path if there was interference from it.

 

Right. 

 

However my understanding is that because the cart path is in the general area, circumstances may dictate that you drop your ball on the cart path. When your drop is completed, if the ball still remains on the cart path (or if the ball rolls off, remains within the allowable relief area, but the path still interferes) you then take ACC relief as a separate drop from whatever caused the drop in the first place. 

 

You can't say "I can't drop on the cart path because it's an ACC", because it's still within the course and defined as general area. 

[LeoLeo99]

26 minutes ago, betarhoalphadelta said:

 

Right. 

 

However my understanding is that because the cart path is in the general area, circumstances may dictate that you drop your ball on the cart path. When your drop is completed, if the ball still remains on the cart path (or if the ball rolls off, remains within the allowable relief area, but the path still interferes) you then take ACC relief as a separate drop from whatever caused the drop in the first place. 

 

You can't say "I can't drop on the cart path because it's an ACC", because it's still within the course and defined as general area. 

That is correct.  You would have to drop twice to do it the right way.  

[Newby]

1 hour ago, betarhoalphadelta said:

 

Right. 

 

However my understanding is that because the cart path is in the general area, circumstances may dictate that you drop your ball on the cart path. When your drop is completed, if the ball still remains on the cart path (or if the ball rolls off, remains within the allowable relief area, but the path still interferes) you then take ACC relief as a separate drop from whatever caused the drop in the first place. 

 

You can't say "I can't drop on the cart path because it's an ACC", because it's still within the course and defined as general area. 

Not quite. Your last sentence is correct but the words in red need adjusting.

 

you then take ACC relief as a separate drop from whatever caused the drop in the first place. from the cart path.

 

However, sometimes an area of GUR may be incorporated with an adjacent cart path (by Local Rule) to make one integrated area of ACC. I which case your original words in red are correct.

Edited July 18, 2023 by Newby