Do you have to epoxy tip weights?

[GloriousGlory]

Hello everyone,

 

Is it necessary to epoxy tip weights inside a graphite shaft?  I've read a few different things when it comes to extension and  tip weights, but I have found that if I have a tight fit with an extension, no epoxy is needed at all.  Can the same be said for the tip weights?  Can I use masking tape to secure a tight fit and just proceed with the club building as usual?  I don't want to glue tip weights into the graphite shaft because of how much of a pain it might be to remove it if I end up ever repulling the shaft for another set of iron heads.

 

Thanks!

[ChristopherMcDonald]

I would still do it, IMO.

[semarlor]

I've had a lot of guys come in with a rattle that ended up being a loose tip weight. It might not rattle right away but seems like it could cause some issues down the line. I'd still glue it even if it was a tight fit. I'd prob still glue an extension for the same reason. 

[AmateurAmateur]

You don’t epoxy extensions? Is that a typo? 

[596]

4 minutes ago, AmateurAmateur said:

You don’t epoxy extensions? Is that a typo? 

I've done a few with no epoxy. 1/2" extension without epoxy works fine. As long as it's a tight fit.

[CTG77]

I'm of the mind that if it can come loose, secure it.  For golf club parts, that means use the epoxy...

[AmateurAmateur]

48 minutes ago, 596 said:

I've done a few with no epoxy. 1/2" extension without epoxy works fine. As long as it's a tight fit.

Can’t think of a single value that not epoxying it offers compared to epoxying it, but to each their own. 

[st1800e]

Could probably glue the tip weight in with some hot melt or glue gun glue before epoxying the shaft.  Would make removal easier.   
 

 

 

Edited June 18 by st1800e

[third-times-a-charm]

1 hour ago, AmateurAmateur said:

Can’t think of a single value that not epoxying it offers compared to epoxying it, but to each their own. 

A 1/4-1/2" extension isnt going anywhere. I dont epoxy those, either. But I also dont ever extend over .5", so I guess I never epoxy extensions.

[GloriousGlory]

9 hours ago, AmateurAmateur said:

You don’t epoxy extensions? Is that a typo? 

Not a typo, but these are extensions that are 1/2" or under.  I have a very tight fit in the shaft itself and wrap them with a layer of masking tape before using grip tape.  I don't see how that could come loose given that the extension is so minimal.

Edited June 18 by GloriousGlory

[Port and Starboard]

Most tip rattles I've come across were from heavier gram weights that go a little further into the shaft tip.  Coating the weight with a little epoxy isn't going to hurt anything.

 

I like to use plastic extensions and give them a light sanding to create a "interference fit"  where a light tap sets them snug.  No epoxy needed.

[Stuart_G]

19 hours ago, GloriousGlory said:

Is it necessary to epoxy tip weights inside a graphite shaft? 

 

No.  Sometimes it happens anyway but I NEVER intentionally try to epoxy tip weights into graphite shafts.

 

However, steel shafts is another story.

 

 

19 hours ago, GloriousGlory said:

 I don't want to glue tip weights into the graphite shaft because of how much of a pain it might be to remove it if I end up ever repulling the shaft for another set of iron heads.

 

That certainly is a legit concern - but really only for brass tip weights.    If the brass tip weights get glued into the shaft you can easily damage the shaft trying to get them out if you ever want to reuse the shaft in a different head.

 

And for the longer brass tip weights for graphite, gluing them in isn't any guarantee that it will prevent rattles.  Masking tape usually is a better solution to that problem.

 

Lead and the rubber-tungsten tip weights are actually very easy to drill out.  And they are not prone to rattling as well.   So whether they get glued in place (or not) really doesn't matter.

 

 

Edited June 18 by Stuart_G

[GloriousGlory]

3 hours ago, Stuart_G said:

 

No.  Sometimes it happens anyway but I NEVER intentionally try to epoxy tip weights into graphite shafts.

 

However, steel shafts is another story.

 

 

 

That certainly is a legit concern - but really only for brass tip weights.    If the brass tip weights get glued into the shaft you can easily damage the shaft trying to get them out if you ever want to reuse the shaft in a different head.

 

And for the longer brass tip weights for graphite, gluing them in isn't any guarantee that it will prevent rattles.  Masking tape usually is a better solution to that problem.

 

Lead and the rubber-tungsten tip weights are actually very easy to drill out.  And they are not prone to rattling as well.   So whether they get glued in place (or not) really doesn't matter.

 

 

Thanks for the info.  I read that about the brass weights which is why I ended up ordering lead tip weights from Australia.  They were the only ones I could find that would fit the inner diameter of the recoil shafts.

 

My line of thinking was that if the weights have a snug fit in the shaft and then you build the club, it should be wedged into the club head and shaft with no space to get loose anyways.  And the epoxy used for connecting the club head and shaft should at the very least coat the outside of the tip weight and add some adhesion.  Wasn't sure if the epoxy inside the shaft would even be necessary but this is my first go at building clubs.

[Socrates]

15 hours ago, 596 said:

I've done a few with no epoxy. 1/2" extension without epoxy works fine. As long as it's a tight fit.

I would still epoxy a short extension. 

 

I have a short extension in my driver shaft (1/2") and on a trip to Palm Springs, one year, the bond let go.  I couldn't figure it out because I would hit squirrelly drives unless I choked down on the grip.  Figured that I was just crappy.  Popped the grip off when I got home and the butt end was just loose enough to have some movement.  Re-epoxied the extension and problem solved.  Learned the hard way to make sure everything is bonded together.

[Stuart_G]

8 minutes ago, GloriousGlory said:

Thanks for the info.  I read that about the brass weights which is why I ended up ordering lead tip weights from Australia.  They were the only ones I could find that would fit the inner diameter of the recoil shafts.

 

FYI - Drilling out the ID slightly is fine to allow other options to work - although not suggesting there is a need to do that if you have an alternative.

 

But IMO, lead is much better to use compared to brass if that is an option.   As I said before, even if they do get glued in, it's easy to drill them out if you want to remove the tip weight later or for a different head.

 

 

8 minutes ago, GloriousGlory said:

My line of thinking was that if the weights have a snug fit in the shaft and then you build the club, it should be wedged into the club head and shaft with no space to get loose anyways.  And the epoxy used for connecting the club head and shaft should at the very least coat the outside of the tip weight and add some adhesion.  Wasn't sure if the epoxy inside the shaft would even be necessary but this is my first go at building clubs.

 

Depends on the design of the tip weight and what you might be worried about.  With graphite shafts that's usually true - but I can't say it will always be true.  I haven't seen or used every possible option of graphite tip weight.  Just the more common ones from golfworks or billy bob's golf.

 

Just as an example, for lead tip weights for steel shafts, the flange keeping the weight from going up into the shaft is actually pretty small and therefore weak.  Combine that with the much sharper edges on the shaft tip, then repeated impact can actually damage the flange to the point where it can break loose and end up rattling around inside the shaft - both up and down as well as side to side.   It's even worse in a tapered tip steel shaft since there will not be a close fit between the diameter of the weight and the inside of the shaft.

 

With tip weights for graphite shafts the flanges are usually bigger and the edge of the shaft tip are anything but sharp.  So the tip weight breaking away and going up the shaft is usually rare (at least with the tip weight designs I see).   It still might be an issue if, for example, you making your own tip weight out of lead or copper wire and you don't create a sufficient flange at the end.

 

So that leaves the potential issue of the tip weight staying in place - but being loose enough to rattling around at the bottom of the hosel.   Lead "rattling" against graphite(really epoxy) is nothing like lead rattling against steel - it's much more muted so not a common issue - especially if the fit is tight as you say but it is still potentially possible if the weight is long enough, since the ID will expand above the reinforced tip section.   But I've never seen or used a lead tip weight long enough for that to be a problem.    The longer brass tip weights, on the other hand, can rattle like crazy if you're not careful.  But something like masking tape to pad them is a much better option than gluing them in due to question about being able to remove them if you want to reuse the shaft in another set.

[Stuart_G]

31 minutes ago, Socrates said:

Popped the grip off when I got home and the butt end was just loose enough to have some movement.  Re-epoxied the extension and problem solved.  Learned the hard way to make sure everything is bonded together.

 

I certainly agree that if there is any wiggle room, epoxy should always be used.

 

But the other solution would be to make sure the fit is tight enough that it's not loose enough to have any movement in the first place.

 

Don't get me wrong.  If I'm building a club for someone else - I would ALWAYS use epoxy on the extension.   But I don't always when building my own clubs - in case I change my mind about if or how long I might want the extension.  In those case I used these:

 

https://www.golfworks.com/universal-golf-shaft-extensions/p/gw1047/

 

You fit the extension such that it's actually a little bigger than the ID of the shaft and it is in compression when inside the shaft.  Then you add the plug which increases the tension a bit more.   As long as the extension itself does not break - there will never be any movement even without any glue.

Edited June 18 by Stuart_G

[GloriousGlory]

2 hours ago, Stuart_G said:

Depends on the design of the tip weight and what you might be worried about.  With graphite shafts that's usually true - but I can't say it will always be true.  I haven't seen or used every possible option of graphite tip weight.  Just the more common ones from golfworks or billy bob's golf.

 

Awesome, thank you.  I'll evaluate once I receive the lead weights from Australia.  The ones I ordered (3g and 5g weights) have an ID of 0.135" (about 3.5mm) and will fit inside the recoils.  The head also seem like the same thickness as what I've seen on OEMs (around 1/16"). 

 

[Stuart_G]

12 minutes ago, GloriousGlory said:

The ones I ordered (3g and 5g weights) have an ID of 0.135" (about 3.5mm) and will fit inside the recoils. 

 

 

What's the heaviest weight available?

[GloriousGlory]

Just now, Stuart_G said:

 

What's the heaviest weight available?

They had 3g, 5g, and 8g.  Once you get into the 8g territory the ID increases to 0.165" (about 4mm).

 

For the most part I plan to stay around OEM swing weight give or take a point, so 3g and 5g seems just fine for me based on current dry weight.