PGA Tour Players Who Swing Like Hogan

[golfbulldog]

Borrowing from Brady Quinn, "Now Chad's done ! "

 

Good work Dariusz.

 

:)

I agree, good observations...but there is still something else about Chad's motion that gives it a Hoganesque look - Johnny Miller and jp12g are neither blind or stupid...there is something in Chad that gives him a look...and it may depend a bit on which frames you pick...again a reason not to copy a "look" ...

 

What it does allow us to do is develop a check list of hogan qualities to objectively assess a "pretender"...

 

Go ahead Darius, maybe new thread for the checklist that a "young pretender" would have to match in order to qualify.

 

Something concrete coming out of a thread is rare!

[iteachgolf]

Borrowing from Brady Quinn, "Now Chad's done ! "

 

Good work Dariusz.

 

:)

I agree, good observations...but there is still something else about Chad's motion that gives it a Hoganesque look - Johnny Miller and jp12g are neither blind or stupid...there is something in Chad that gives him a look...and it may depend a bit on which frames you pick...again a reason not to copy a "look" ...

 

What it does allow us to do is develop a check list of hogan qualities to objectively assess a "pretender"...

 

Go ahead Darius, maybe new thread for the checklist that a "young pretender" would have to match in order to qualify.

 

Something concrete coming out of a thread is rare!

The tempo and arm swing is similar, not the same, giving the look that in full speed is somewhat similar to Hogan. Other than that they pivot completely differently which cause the big difference in their ball flights.

[jp12g]

The main differences I see are down to two things.

 

1. The swing photos are not all taken at the same point in the swing or the same angles. For example there is one where you compare a shot of Hogan's past impact with one of Campbell before impact.

 

2. He wont look exactly the same if his body type is substantially different. Hogan was short with very long arms and broard shoulders. Campbell is tall, narrow shouldered and heavy and stands narrower.

 

Those visual differences dont mean he doesnt swing like Hogan.

 

So I reiterate, I beleive the question was, which Tour player swings or tries to swing [most] like Hogan, and I say Campbell.

 

You still havent told us why Johnny Miller, Open champion in 1976 and US Open champion in 63 or whenever, is completely wrong in his assessment. You put yourself above him in analysing swings by saying in effect that he is wrong. What are your credentials for doing so?

 

Are you Butch Harmon or Peter Kostis or David leadbeater in disguise?

[D'KRUSHER]

Yippee ! We get to talk about the HOGAN mystique/swing/the man/pivots/DTL/Impact - whew- again !

 

It's a Combo Platter- Trevor I. + Sergio G. ! Can someone tell me why nobody on tour can swing at the Hogan reported speed of 132 mph ? Let the heated discussion continue.

[Dariusz J.]

Go ahead Darius, maybe new thread for the checklist that a "young pretender" would have to match in order to qualify.

 

A very good idea, GB - l believe that such a thread would really be more productive for everyone than this one. Say, necessary conditions to consider a motion as Hoganesque and sufficient ones to claim that one swings like Hogan :)

 

 

 

The main differences I see are down to two things.

 

1. The swing photos are not all taken at the same point in the swing or the same angles. For example there is one where you compare a shot of Hogan's past impact with one of Campbell before impact.

 

2. He wont look exactly the same if his body type is substantially different. Hogan was short with very long arms and broard shoulders. Campbell is tall, narrow shouldered and heavy and stands narrower.

 

Those visual differences dont mean he doesnt swing like Hogan.

 

So I reiterate, I beleive the question was, which Tour player swings or tries to swing [most] like Hogan, and I say Campbell.

 

You still havent told us why Johnny Miller, Open champion in 1976 and US Open champion in 63 or whenever, is completely wrong in his assessment. You put yourself above him in analysing swings by saying in effect that he is wrong. What are your credentials for doing so?

 

Are you Butch Harmon or Peter Kostis or David leadbeater in disguise?

 

Ask Johnny Miller, not me :) You provoked me to bring valid arguments - so I did. If you do not want or can't see their merits - fine by me. My world won't ruin if you still believe that Campbell swings like Hogan.

 

Cheers

[jp12g]

You wont admit it, but I bet most rational people here would see now that the pompous dismissive :good: statement in your first reply to me was incorrect.

 

Finish this sentence. There is none so blind, as he who..............!

[xiaoxiong]

You wont admit it, but I bet most rational people here would see now that the pompous dismissive :good: statement in your first reply to me was incorrect.

 

Finish this sentence. There is none so blind, as he who..............!

 

Not sure I am a rational people here or not, but I do think Dariusz's pompous dismissive statement in his first reply to you is CORRECT.... :rolleyes:

 

Cheers,

[martinez]

Finish this sentence. There is none so blind, as he who..............after being shown the obvious still invokes Johnny Miller's name as gospel!

 

:clapping:

[xiaoxiong]

Finish this sentence. There is none so blind, as he who..............after being shown the obvious still invokes Johnny Miller's name as gospel!

 

:clapping:

 

 

Martinez, that is a GOOD one :clapping:

[Kerry_Bunker]

Finish this sentence. There is none so blind, as he who..............after being shown the obvious still invokes Johnny Miller's name as gospel!

 

:clapping:

 

 

Beauty !

[hoganfan924]

Finish this sentence. There is none so blind, as he who..............after being shown the obvious still invokes Johnny Miller's name as gospel!

 

:clapping:

 

LOL!

 

Campbell has a flat backswing and a fast tempo, and those things alone evoke comparisons to Hogan when viewed with the naked eye. As pointed out by Dariusz and Iteach, that's about the only similarity to Hogan. Not a rip on Campbell, I like him quite a bit.

 

Johnny Miller is very hit or miss with swing analysis. Sometimes he says things that are quite insightful and sometimes he seems way off base. Frankly, I think Johnny has gotten a little lazy in doing his prep work over the last couple of years and shoots from the hip much more frequently than he used to when he started, especially when discussing swings. To 99.999% of viewers, it doesn't make one damn bit of difference. Combine that with the fact that a lot of players won't even talk to him anymore let alone share with him what they're working on in their swings, and it's understandable he occasionally suffers "foot in mouth disease" when discussing swings.

[JD3]

in context.

 

Nevertheless, those two additional videos dont alter my view that Campbell swings more like Hogan than any current Tour player. As I said, not exactly, but there are the beforementioned similarities and an overall sense of sameness about everything from the waggles to the acceleration in the swing. In fact, the first time I saw Campbell swing quite a few years ago now I remember thinking to myself that this guy was a Hogan disciple. It would be interesting to find any interviews he has given on whom, if anyone, he modelled his action.

 

As for biomechanics, well its lovely to make broad brush statements with non specific labels, but what specifically is so different that rules him out? Where are the differences and how singificant are they? I can see a few minor ones , one of which is that I think his preferred ball flight is a draw, but that doesn't change my view, and I doubt it would change the view of Johnny Miller, who has been paid by NBC is it? to analyse swings for at least 20 years now. With that much practice at it, maybe he just knows a thing or two, doncha think?

 

Here you are - the most important differences:

 

1. Differences in setup:

 

 

 

Campbell - low hands, narrow stance, strong RH grip, over-plane takeaway, sway of the hips

 

 

 

Hogan - high hands, wide diagonal stance, biokinetically correct grip, no sway of the hips

 

 

2. Differences at the top:

 

 

 

 

 

Completely different pelvis area motion and CoG shift resulting in further differences in the impact zone

 

 

3. Differences in the impact zone:

 

 

 

Campbell - shaft impact plane much above shaft address plane, much less open hips, shoulders not open at all, rear arm in front of the body, tush line lost, changes in the spine angle, lead knee joint straightened, lead heel in the air, etc. etc.

 

 

 

Hogan - shaft impact plane matches shaft address plane, open hips and upper body, perfectly maintained tush line, perfectly maintained rear arm bend, perfectly maintained spine angle, lead knee joint rotated, lead heel on the ground, etc., etc.

 

I think it's enough time to spend talking about Chad Campbell on the Hogan Forum - at least for me :)

 

Cheers

Nice work D. A while back I put Campbell into my "could be better player if he stopped with the pseudo-Hogan swing" category and of course got many jumping down my throat about how Chad's swing was genuine Hogan. Again, nice work dispensing with that theory.

[grlichti]

Craig Parry looks exactly like Ben Hogan...when you look only at the toe of his left foot right before he takes the club out of the bag. :cheesy:

[thefuture37]

sean ohair. the next greatest ballstriker on tour.

[iteachgolf]

sean ohair. the next greatest ballstriker on tour.

please tell me you are joking

[JD3]

sean ohair. the next greatest ballstriker on tour.

please tell me you are joking

looks like he might be trying to shallow his backswing plane. he doesn't always do it in his full swing though. always seemed like his upright backswing and drop-move downswing created inconsistent distance control. maybe he's trying to address that?

[iteachgolf]

sean ohair. the next greatest ballstriker on tour.

please tell me you are joking

looks like he might be trying to shallow his backswing plane. he doesn't always do it in his full swing though. always seemed like his upright backswing and drop-move downswing created inconsistent distance control. maybe he's trying to address that?

He is obviously flattening out his backswing but to say it looks like Hogan is a little far fetched. Hogan had the smallest plane shift possible while Sean is at the polar opposite end of the spectrum. Not saying it isn't a good swing but not Hogan

[thefuture37]

sean ohair. the next greatest ballstriker on tour.

please tell me you are joking

 

why? why cant somebody have an opinion without getting jumped all over?

[JD3]

sean ohair. the next greatest ballstriker on tour.

please tell me you are joking

looks like he might be trying to shallow his backswing plane. he doesn't always do it in his full swing though. always seemed like his upright backswing and drop-move downswing created inconsistent distance control. maybe he's trying to address that?

He is obviously flattening out his backswing but to say it looks like Hogan is a little far fetched. Hogan had the smallest plane shift possible while Sean is at the polar opposite end of the spectrum. Not saying it isn't a good swing but not Hogan

jason goe flattening his lie by 6 degrees is crazy! i cant imagine trying to adjust to that. also thought miller butchered the explanation of reason why some players go to shallower swing plane

[Dariusz J.]

sean ohair. the next greatest ballstriker on tour.

please tell me you are joking

 

why? why cant somebody have an opinion without getting jumped all over?

 

Because the thread has a title that the OP set and that all posts should rationally refer to. O'Hair's swing is very far away from Hogan's.

 

Cheers

[thefuture37]

sean ohair. the next greatest ballstriker on tour.

please tell me you are joking

 

why? why cant somebody have an opinion without getting jumped all over?

O'Hair's swing is very far away from Hogan's.

 

Cheers

I disagree.

[iteachgolf]

Then I want to hear why and what you think is similar.

[thefuture37]

Then I want to hear why and what you think is similar.

 

please tell me you are joking...

[ipak17]

+1 on Chad Campbell...

 

For those critiquing via naked eye analyses, good job. BUT Campbell is instructed via a Hogan instructional teacher. So those that say nay on his Hogan-esque swing, sorry but he does follow the Hogan methodoligy.

 

For Jonathan Byrd, not sure about his swing coach, but to my naked eye all things point to a Hogan based instruction for the golf swing.

 

Hope my input helps.

[iteachgolf]

Opinions can be supported with observations and fact. I explain why it is different. O'Hair very upright and has a large drop plane shift when Hogan worked OVER his backswing plane. Are you an instructor? Just wondering.

[thefuture37]

+1 on Chad Campbell...

 

For those critiquing via naked eye analyses, good job. BUT Campbell is instructed via a Hogan instructional teacher. So those that say nay on his Hogan-esque swing, sorry but he does follow the Hogan methodoligy.

 

For Jonathan Byrd, not sure about his swing coach, but to my naked eye all things point to a Hogan based instruction for the golf swing.

 

Hope my input helps.

who is/was campbell's coach?

[Dariusz J.]

+1 on Chad Campbell...

 

For those critiquing via naked eye analyses, good job. BUT Campbell is instructed via a Hogan instructional teacher. So those that say nay on his Hogan-esque swing, sorry but he does follow the Hogan methodoligy.

 

For Jonathan Byrd, not sure about his swing coach, but to my naked eye all things point to a Hogan based instruction for the golf swing.

 

Hope my input helps.

 

 

How one can be claimed that he follows Hogan's methodology if he even performs the fundamentals differently than recommended by Hogan ?

 

IMO, the very notion 'Hoganesque' is imprecise as hell. For someone it is enough to find one element in the whole swing motion that is being performed similarily just to use this word. Others feel justified to use it to all rotary swingers. Others want to find the majority of elements that are similar, etc., etc.

 

As regards O'Hair - not only fundamentals disqualify him, but also his swing plane height. No one who breaks the pane of glass (one of the most important things in Hogan's methodology) can be even compared to Hogan, IMo.

 

Cheers

[downtoscratch]

D,

A little help with the language here.......... "Noone who breaks the pane of glass"

 

dts

[thefuture37]

Tiger putts like Hogan hit it. His putting is going to be more of a mystery than Hogan's swing in due time.

[dream_stryker]

Opinions can be supported with observations and fact. I explain why it is different. O'Hair very upright and has a large drop plane shift when Hogan worked OVER his backswing plane. Are you an instructor? Just wondering.

 

 

Mr iteachgolf,

 

Sorry to digress from the topic but does this mean Mr Hogan came "over the top" but still hit from the inside? I thought over the top always implied a wipe. Are there any other pros who use this concept (if I interpreted what you said correctly) or is this unique to Mr Hogan? How can one come over the top of the plane....without casting?!! Doesn't one imply the other? :beruo: