Michelle Wie Fires her caddie today

CLEVELAND59 · August 10, 2006

No big deal. Players and caddies change dance partners all the time.

Now back to regular programming...

The best post in three pages.

What is the big deal. Johnson was payed well for what he did and it's time for him to find a new job.

People get fired every day. He's lucky he didn't get fired by TEXT MESSAGE.

Why is everyone getting worked up over a matter they have no idea about. For all we know Johnson touched her innappropriately. Pure nonsense on my part, but so is the majority of comments I've read with absolutely no factual evidence in the firing. Of course it's easy to blame the parents, so many kids have been led astray by their pushy parents. BJ...oh yeah...overbearing. :D On one hand the family is called rich and spoiled....save a few bucks and caddy for your daughter and you're overbearing. Then to top it off the comparisons to Capriati, Tryon...what next...Barbaro? Ridiculous....the girls summer is spent golfing. Just like most other kids....except she's winning thousands to do it. Then she goes back to school. A regular school, not home schooled ala Morgan. No offense but basing your not being a fan on the way a caddy was fired is laughable.

The caddy got fired. Who care's. It's just one of dozens that happen every year on the tour. Did we say it was the end of Tiger when Fluff got fired??? Ridiculous. There's a line of caddies wishing to be on her bag. Just like there is a bunch of teachers wanting to be associated with her swing.

Move on fellers....the PGA's next week! :D

Your post is laughable. If you don't think a split between an elite player (or at least one of the most recognized faces in the sport at the moment) and their caddie isn't news worthy or a big deal, then you truly do not understand, nor do you respect, the relationship between player and caddie and the role that many caddies play in a players success, in particular that of young players. Why do you think that Fluff Cowan was handpicked to carry Tiger's bag when he first came out? Because Cowan had been out there for nearly 20 years, had seen every course tons of times, been in tons of situations, and could offer good advice and information to Tiger. Why do you think Adam Scott has Tony Navarro on the bag? Look what having a sober Steve Duplantis did for Rich Beem. Look at young players who have thrived when they have someone like Andy Martinez on the bag (Andy did 1 week carries for 2 players at the US Am over the past 10 years, and those players both won, conicidence? I think not). When Tiger and Fluff split, Tiger obviously had gained enough experience that he could have likely chosen from a wide variety of caddies and been fine, but notice he grabbed the guy who was easily the best available at the time in Steve Williams. If the best player in the world can recognize the improtance of the caddie in the equation, its probably time that you wrapped your mind around the notion of it too.

Yes, dozens of caddies leave bags and pick up new ones over the course of a season, but notice how precious few involve the games top players. Outside of Vijay, look at the top 10 in the world or even the top 20 and look at how long they have been with the same caddie. And when a successful player/caddie relationship does split, look at how often it gets back together. We saw a great example just 2 weeks ago when Corey Pavin won. His old caddie had returned after a split, 3 weeks later Corey wins for the first time in a decade. After winning 2 majors with Jerry Higginbothom on the bag in 98, O'Meara fired him in the spring of 99, and hasn't been heard from since. The evidence is too strong to ignore in terms of what a top caddie can do, even for an elite player.

When Tiger fired Fluff, the questions were out there. Does he have enough experience? Should he have stayed longer with Fluff? Is this a bad move? The discussion was out there in magazines, golf forums, and grill rooms across the country. You apparently missed those, but how I'll never know. He hired Stevie and the rest is history.

You seem so eager to say that "well he didn't get fired by text message". Just because some moron found a way to do something with even less class then the Wie family did doesn't excuse their actions as both classless and gutless. Since you seem to be concerned with the facts of the firing, the following was reported on Golf Central last night and comes directly from Ross Berlin, the agent for MW:

1. The Wie family left the course immediately after the round had ended to travel to London for a corporate appearance for Nike.

2. Berlin had dinner with Johnston on Sunday evening (they are friends). After dinner, Berlin got a call from BJ Wie telling him to fire Johnston.

3. Johnston met with Berlin at the airport on Monday morning where Berlin informed him he was fired.

Those are the facts as reported by her agent, and it seems to me that just stinks of unprofessional business behavior.

The reasons for the comparisons to Capriati, etc. is not without merit. All the athletes mentioned turned professional at VERY young ages, virtually all of them had parents that put themselves in the spotlight as much as the kids were, and virtually all of them dealt with the troubles that fame and fortune can bring. Try as you might, this is not some 16 year old high schooler spending a summer vacation golfing and will return to the normal life of a high school girl in the fall, this is someone who has declared themselves a professional, signed endoresement contracts worth millions of dollars and chosen to put themselves out in the public eye as a result. When you do that, you get all that goes with that, good and bad and part of that is the understanding that the way you must conduct yourself changes.

Your little shot at Morgan Pressel is a joke. So she and her family chose for her to be home schooled. Big deal. Hundreds of thousands of kids are home schooled in the US every year for various reasons. Its not a big deal. She obviously knew the demands of working towards turning professional and everything it entailed required a different approach for her, she found it, executed it, and turned pro. She got a high school education, a US Am, and a nice endorsement deal with Callaway when she turned pro.

And if you think that the phone at the William Morris agency is ringing off the hook with caddies looking to pick up that bag, you are probably right. But what I am certain of is that of the caddies on the other end of that phone, there are VERY few, if any elite ones who want that bag right now.

samm980 · August 10, 2006

So how many people think Tiger called Fluff Cowan to tell him he was fired??

That was my earlier question, I wonder if Hughes Norton, then Tiger's agent fired Fluff. I am pretty sure Hughes Norton was still Tiger's agent at the time.

maguy1970 · August 10, 2006

Many people have experience firing people/employees? It's not something a 16 year old could do IMO.

gjones77 · August 10, 2006

Many people have experience firing people/employees? It's not something a 16 year old could do IMO.

You're right, but her father should of been the one letting Johnson know.

samm980 · August 10, 2006

Many people have experience firing people/employees? It's not something a 16 year old could do IMO.

You're right, but her father should of been the one letting Johnson know.

I think someone from the family probably should have spoken with him but I don't think the agent firing him is the worst offense. I do think he deserved it face to face not in the Manchester Airport, but these are the growing pains that Michelle must endure. She will learn with time.

maguy1970 · August 10, 2006

2nd question to ponder from me... How much of this decision was actually made by Michelle? I think the main difference between Tiger and MANY child prodigies/talents is that you never got the sense that Tiger was not controlling his career, but in the case of Capriati/Tryon/et al, it just seems like they do as told with no real passion for what they do.

I see this all the time with some of the guys I knew/know from hockey. Some guys have a tremendous amount of talent they just do not LOVE to play it.

Anyways, this is just another instance for people to jump on MW. Caddies come and go all the time.

gjones77 · August 10, 2006

Many people have experience firing people/employees? It's not something a 16 year old could do IMO.

You're right, but her father should of been the one letting Johnson know.

I think someone from the family probably should have spoken with him but I don't think the agent firing him is the worst offense. I do think he deserved it face to face not in the Manchester Airport, but these are the growing pains that Michelle must endure. She will learn with time.

The question is, will she ever learn?

At her age most of what she learns is through her parents, and her parents seem to be even more clueless than her.

It comes down to common courtesy, treating people well, taking responsibility for your actions, and being respectful.

Her parents seem completely devoid of these basic human traits

samm980 · August 10, 2006

Many people have experience firing people/employees? It's not something a 16 year old could do IMO.

You're right, but her father should of been the one letting Johnson know.

I think someone from the family probably should have spoken with him but I don't think the agent firing him is the worst offense. I do think he deserved it face to face not in the Manchester Airport, but these are the growing pains that Michelle must endure. She will learn with time.

The question is, will she ever learn?

At her age most of what she learns is through her parents, and her parents seem to be even more clueless than her.

It comes down to common courtesy, treating people well, taking responsibility for your actions, and being respectful.

Her parents seem completely devoid of these basic human traits

I am sure she will learn let's give her some time and I am by no means a B.J. Wie defender I don't care for the man but I think the last sentence might be a bit over the top.

Once again I am curious to see how we would all react in the same situation.

sandy · August 10, 2006

So how many people think Tiger called Fluff Cowan to tell him he was fired??

That was my earlier question, I wonder if Hughes Norton, then Tiger's agent fired Fluff. I am pretty sure Hughes Norton was still Tiger's agent at the time.

You're right, it wasn't Earl either for those that say her father should have done it.

And no there wasn't anywhere near this hand wringing over that as there is with Michelle. Most of the know it all posts, LPGA player critics, and the media interest is rooted in pure jealousy. Just looking for any opportunity to tear down a 16 year old who has had more monetary success at 16 than they will in their whole lifetimes. I haven't looked lately but how is Morgan Pressel doing compared to Michelle---seems she was a big critic of Michelle not following the same amateur route she did and winning tournaments. If I recall correctly neither has won a LPGA event but Morgan ain't doing so well in the $$$$ department when compared to Michelle.

If companies are willing to give/throw away/invest their money in unproven/proven talents it is their business.

NPVWhiz · August 10, 2006

Many people have experience firing people/employees? It's not something a 16 year old could do IMO.

You're right, but her father should of been the one letting Johnson know.

There's always the chance that BJ thought "Man, I've been the middle of it too much. I should just step aside and allow Michelle's agent, who is paid hundreds of thousands of dollars, to handle this routine task of a touring golfer's business".

And, if he did, I think his instincts were probably good on that one.

Had BJ done it, some would have been posting that he did it by phone, or he was rude, or he used broken english, or he didn't shake his hand.

This is a routine task that an agent should handle. A caddie is an employee, not a beloved family pet.

mth1081 · August 10, 2006

Its unfortunate that Greg got fired in the way that he did. I think it was rather crummy to do that to him. I have caddied in a couple of groups with him when he was with Inkster and I think he is one of the nicest caddies I have ever met. He's going to be working for someone soon I would only imagine. He's nothing like Duplantis or those guys. Michelle's problem is she didn't let Greg help her read her putts and give any advice. Her putting is terrible and it really shows that she's only 16.

My guess is that BJ controls her so much and she couldn't do anything on her own. Nothing like having a robot as a player. Not a lot of fun as a former professional caddie.

risingsungolf · August 10, 2006

Your post is laughable. If you don't think a split between an elite player (or at least one of the most recognized faces in the sport at the moment) and their caddie isn't news worthy or a big deal, then you truly do not understand, nor do you respect, the relationship between player and caddie and the role that many caddies play in a players success, in particular that of young players. Why do you think that Fluff Cowan was handpicked to carry Tiger's bag when he first came out? Because You seem so eager to say that "well he didn't get fired by text message".
Your little shot at Morgan Pressel is a joke
And if you think that the phone at the William Morris agency is ringing off the hook with caddies looking to pick up that bag, you are probably right. .

That's a lot of "You's". Don't take it personal sir. I mean you no harm and I'm done with this thread, but don't you think you've said enough with 11 post in one topic. You've only got 40+ post but have chosen to make this topic your high point or your forum career. Now that's what I really find laughable now. I think we all know where you are coming from already. But you seem to think that you must keep repeating yourself to us or posting your opine that hasn't been said enough. But I guess you shouldn't feel bad, that guy JD has more post then you in here.

Okay, I'll stand back so you can tear my post down line by line with your 12th post in this topic. Unfortunately I won't be able to read it since I'm heading out to the golf course. But you're still lurking at the bottom of the screen. Have fun....maybe in your 12th post, you'll tell us why you've taken this topic so close to your heart. Let me guess....you're a caddie, you have close friends who caddie, or you're a caddie groupie.

PS.....I've yet to see a loop hit a ball in a tournament, and the best teams I've ever seen that you failed to mention was Jack and Angelo and Lee and Herman. Relationships that were built up over years not ten tournaments.

PPS...Moderators, please delete this post if it's gone beyond the rules of forum etiquette or if 59 goes off on me and makes/takes it more personal then he has already. I'd hate to be the reason for this topics demise.

xiaoxiong · August 10, 2006

That's a lot of "You's". Don't take it personal sir. I mean you no harm and I'm done with this thread, but don't you think you've said enough with 11 post in one topic. You've only got 40+ post but have chosen to make this topic your high point or your forum career. Now that's what I really find laughable now. I think we all know where you are coming from already. But you seem to think that you must keep repeating yourself to us or posting your opine that hasn't been said enough. But I guess you shouldn't feel bad, that guy JD has more post then you in here.

Okay, I'll stand back so you can tear my post down line by line with your 12th post in this topic. Unfortunately I won't be able to read it since I'm heading out to the golf course. But you're still lurking at the bottom of the screen. Have fun....maybe in your 12th post, you'll tell us why you've taken this topic so close to your heart. Let me guess....you're a caddie, you have close friends who caddie, or you're a caddie groupie.

PS.....I've yet to see a loop hit a ball in a tournament, and the best teams I've ever seen that you failed to mention was Jack and Angelo and Lee and Herman. Relationships that were built up over years not ten tournaments.

PPS...Moderators, please delete this post if it's gone beyond the rules of forum etiquette or if 59 goes off on me and makes/takes it more personal then he has already. I'd hate to be the reason for this topics demise.

It appeared to me you are taking CLEVELAN59's words out of contexts. Yes, a lot of "YOU", but it is a lengthy post to start with. And I happened to think his post is facts-based, reasonable, and not finger-pointing analysis.

Well, what do I know?

It is an interesting thread and hottest topic, that is for sure.

cheers,

Jay

DemolitionMan · August 10, 2006

(thread crapping)

Sorry, I'm just feeling left out... This could almost compete with some of the TW lover threads.

Thanks for a good laugh!

It's the EVIL EMPIRE of Nike causing this! They have ruined golf! First they divide us on child labor, then they divide us on Tiger, now they are polarizing Michelle Wie. When will it end?!?!? Hide the children!

csiachos · August 10, 2006

I just had to fire an assistant two days ago, and I've got to say, it was not an easy thing to do. AND I"M 31 YEARS OLD! Take it easy on the poor girl. I'm not a big fan of her father. I think matters were not handled correctly. We'll see how she acts when she has grown up a bit. But now she is still a CHILD, a minor, whether she plays like one or not. And her parent are still responsible for her, even if she does make millions a year. Her mind and her manners are not fully developed, and possibly the only thing she has full confidence in is her golf game. Would any of you expect a 16 year old to meet with and fire her caddie. If you have anyone to blame, blame BJ.

abewley · August 10, 2006

the horse is now dead..

vanquish007 · August 10, 2006

the horse is now dead..

Agreed!

kurob · August 10, 2006

I haven't looked lately but how is Morgan Pressel doing compared to Michelle---seems she was a big critic of Michelle not following the same amateur route she did and winning tournaments. If I recall correctly neither has won a LPGA event but Morgan ain't doing so well in the $$$$ department when compared to Michelle.

Neither one is worried about adding the $4 virgin pina colada to dinner, and Pressel has the bigger trophy on her mantle.