UST Axivcore Tour Green Launching Too High

[Slack Hacker]

Need lower launching Shaft with comparable spin

I'm currently gaming a R11 10.5 set at standard loft with a closed face and I'm playing a 65g Stiff UST Axivcore Tour Green. I'm nailing this combo, but in the pursuit of a lower ball flight I'm trying to decide on a lower launching shaft with comparable spin characteristics of The Tour Green shaft. I'm relucatant to change the loft on the driver as I find I need to have my driver set with a closed face to maintain the best flight direction for me. I prefer not to go for a shaft over 75g in weight and don't really want to go to an X flex. I'm thinking of trying one of the following shafts: GD Throttle, Project X 7C3, or Harrison Mugen Proto. I would be grateful if anyone had any suggestions on my potential choices or if there is another option I might consider.

[MtlJeff]

it's an oldie but check out the speeder 757, on the cusp of your weight limit and lower launching then the green. Also available for under 75$ on ebay. I've used the Axiv Green for 2 years now and i can tell you the speeder is lower launching. It will feel a bit harsher.

a voodoo SVS7 would be a solid choice too. I played an XVS7 that launched lower than a 96g green. So in the same weight you would see a difference for sure

[MadGolfer76]

It is the loft of your driver.

[Slack Hacker]

I agree the best way to lower the launch would be to buy a 9 degree R11, however do you think a lower launching shaft may be the next best option for me?[quote name='MadGolfer76' timestamp='1310243004' post='3377608']
It is the loft of your driver.
[/quote]

[MadGolfer76]

[quote name='Slack Hacker' timestamp='1310244003' post='3377643']
I agree the best way to lower the launch would be to buy a 9 degree R11, however do you think a lower launching shaft may be the next best option for me?[quote name='MadGolfer76' timestamp='1310243004' post='3377608']
It is the loft of your driver.
[/quote]
[/quote]

Perhaps. I don't know much about the adjustability of the R11, but can you dial the loft down a bit with that? In any case, you could go with a heavier Tour Green. I have an 85 gram version now (2.2 torque) and it provides a great trajectory.

[Slack Hacker]

Yeah, I have tried dialing it down to 9.5 degrees and launch is much better, however when I do this, it opens the face further than what works for me, and I loose too many right (even with the ASP set closed). I guess I'm hoping too find a less expensive middle ground by the contemplation of a comparable weight lower launching shaft. I think I'll get a GD Throttle and experiment a little. [quote name='MadGolfer76' timestamp='1310244684' post='3377666']
[quote name='Slack Hacker' timestamp='1310244003' post='3377643']
I agree the best way to lower the launch would be to buy a 9 degree R11, however do you think a lower launching shaft may be the next best option for me?[quote name='MadGolfer76' timestamp='1310243004' post='3377608']
It is the loft of your driver.
[/quote]
[/quote]

Perhaps. I don't know much about the adjustability of the R11, but can you dial the loft down a bit with that? In any case, you could go with a heavier Tour Green. I have an 85 gram version now (2.2 torque) and it provides a great trajectory.
[/quote]

[driverwedge]

[quote name='Slack Hacker' timestamp='1310244003' post='3377643']
I agree the best way to lower the launch would be to buy a 9 degree R11, however do you think a lower launching shaft may be the next best option for me?[quote name='MadGolfer76' timestamp='1310243004' post='3377608']
It is the loft of your driver.
[/quote]
[/quote]


+1 on your head being too high lofted- especially if you've closed the face, making the loft even higher. If you really didn't want to go with a lower lofted head, you can look for a ProtoPype 70s or 80s. Keep in mind that a shaft can only do so much and the head controls the show. While others can spin less, it's still a low spin shaft that is one of the lowest launchers out there. Pulls can be had for cheap.

Specs:

70s: [url="http://cgi.ebay.com/NEW-Aldila-NV-ProtoPype-70-S-Flex-Wood-Shaft-335-/310041289212?pt=Golf_Clubmaking_Products_US&hash=item482fe6a1fc"]http://cgi.ebay.com/...=item482fe6a1fc[/url]

80s: [url="http://cgi.ebay.com/NEW-Aldila-NV-ProtoPype-80-S-Flex-Wood-Shaft-335-/310041289226?pt=Golf_Clubmaking_Products_US&hash=item482fe6a20a"]http://cgi.ebay.com/...=item482fe6a20a[/url]

[Nessism]

Closing the face reduces the loft.

A worthwhile experiment might be to remove the shaft tip adapter and trim the shaft 1/2" or so, then reinstall the adapter. The overall length of the club will be reduced but that would be a good thing for a slicer anyway.

[golfnhack]

Does the green spin a lot, i.e. is it high launch high spin?

[da_boys]

[quote name='Nessism' timestamp='1310313278' post='3379221']
Closing the face reduces the loft.

A worthwhile experiment might be to remove the shaft tip adapter and trim the shaft 1/2" or so, then reinstall the adapter. The overall length of the club will be reduced but that would be a good thing for a slicer anyway.
[/quote]

Actually closing the face increases loft. If the head is square at impact, the face will have opened a bit, which increases loft.

The original poster will have better success getting a lower lofted head, say a 9*, have it closed a bit, and when squared at impact the loft will be around 10*. Most of the lower launching shafts are way too boardy, which will make the issue of missing right even more pronounced.

I'm in the exact same situation, and went with a lower lofted head. Best decision I made, and was less expensive that buying numerous shafts trying to see which one might work.

[Nessism]

[quote name='da_boys' timestamp='1310315002' post='3379277']
[quote name='Nessism' timestamp='1310313278' post='3379221']
Closing the face reduces the loft.

A worthwhile experiment might be to remove the shaft tip adapter and trim the shaft 1/2" or so, then reinstall the adapter. The overall length of the club will be reduced but that would be a good thing for a slicer anyway.
[/quote]

Actually closing the face increases loft. If the head is square at impact, the face will have opened a bit, which increases loft.

[/quote]

No disrespect intended but I don't understand your logic. Opening the club face, whether at address or when coming into the ball, will increase loft. The opposite is true of closing the face.

Regardless of this semantics debate, I agree that a loft change is the best way to address the problem. I'd try the shaft manipulation before buying a new club though.

[driverwedge]

[quote name='Nessism' timestamp='1310318316' post='3379378']
[quote name='da_boys' timestamp='1310315002' post='3379277']
[quote name='Nessism' timestamp='1310313278' post='3379221']
Closing the face reduces the loft.

A worthwhile experiment might be to remove the shaft tip adapter and trim the shaft 1/2" or so, then reinstall the adapter. The overall length of the club will be reduced but that would be a good thing for a slicer anyway.
[/quote]

Actually closing the face increases loft. If the head is square at impact, the face will have opened a bit, which increases loft.

[/quote]

No disrespect intended but I don't understand your logic. Opening the club face, whether at address or when coming into the ball, will increase loft. The opposite is true of closing the face.

Regardless of this semantics debate, I agree that a loft change is the best way to address the problem. I'd try the shaft manipulation before buying a new club though.
[/quote]

No disrespect taken and I know this can be confusing. It's totally counter-intuitive, right? There are folks here WAY more in the know than I am about this and it's been mentioned quite often: A face that's open has [b][i]lower[/i][/b] effective loft than one that sits square. From what I've learned here from club makers/fitters and pros is, for every degree open a face is, you [b][i]reduce[/i][/b] loft by about .6*. I know it's opposite of what you'd think it should be, but it is what it is.

[MadGolfer76]

[quote name='driverwedge' timestamp='1310329479' post='3379772']
[quote name='Nessism' timestamp='1310318316' post='3379378']
[quote name='da_boys' timestamp='1310315002' post='3379277']
[quote name='Nessism' timestamp='1310313278' post='3379221']
Closing the face reduces the loft.

A worthwhile experiment might be to remove the shaft tip adapter and trim the shaft 1/2" or so, then reinstall the adapter. The overall length of the club will be reduced but that would be a good thing for a slicer anyway.
[/quote]

Actually closing the face increases loft. If the head is square at impact, the face will have opened a bit, which increases loft.

[/quote]

No disrespect intended but I don't understand your logic. Opening the club face, whether at address or when coming into the ball, will increase loft. The opposite is true of closing the face.

Regardless of this semantics debate, I agree that a loft change is the best way to address the problem. I'd try the shaft manipulation before buying a new club though.
[/quote]

No disrespect taken and I know this can be confusing. It's totally counter-intuitive, right? There are folks here WAY more in the know than I am about this and it's been mentioned quite often: A face that's open has [b][i]lower[/i][/b] effective loft than one that sits square. From what I've learned here from club makers/fitters and pros is, for every degree open a face is, you [b][i]reduce[/i][/b] loft by about .6*. I know it's opposite of what you'd think it should be, but it is what it is.


[/quote]

This.

[Nessism]

[quote name='driverwedge' timestamp='1310329479' post='3379772']
[quote name='Nessism' timestamp='1310318316' post='3379378']
[quote name='da_boys' timestamp='1310315002' post='3379277']
[quote name='Nessism' timestamp='1310313278' post='3379221']
Closing the face reduces the loft.

A worthwhile experiment might be to remove the shaft tip adapter and trim the shaft 1/2" or so, then reinstall the adapter. The overall length of the club will be reduced but that would be a good thing for a slicer anyway.
[/quote]

Actually closing the face increases loft. If the head is square at impact, the face will have opened a bit, which increases loft.

[/quote]

No disrespect intended but I don't understand your logic. Opening the club face, whether at address or when coming into the ball, will increase loft. The opposite is true of closing the face.

Regardless of this semantics debate, I agree that a loft change is the best way to address the problem. I'd try the shaft manipulation before buying a new club though.
[/quote]

No disrespect taken and I know this can be confusing. It's totally counter-intuitive, right? There are folks here WAY more in the know than I am about this and it's been mentioned quite often: A face that's open has [b][i]lower[/i][/b] effective loft than one that sits square. From what I've learned here from club makers/fitters and pros is, for every degree open a face is, you [b][i]reduce[/i][/b] loft by about .6*. I know it's opposite of what you'd think it should be, but it is what it is.


[/quote]



Yes, I get all that, but you are assuming the player is going to square up the face at impact. Many players that like an open face also have an in-to-out swing path and they don't square it up at impact. Conversely, many players that fight a slice come out-to-in, so they need a face that sits closed...and stays closed though impact.

[storm319]

[quote name='Nessism' timestamp='1310332087' post='3379883']
[quote name='driverwedge' timestamp='1310329479' post='3379772']
[quote name='Nessism' timestamp='1310318316' post='3379378']
[quote name='da_boys' timestamp='1310315002' post='3379277']
[quote name='Nessism' timestamp='1310313278' post='3379221']
Closing the face reduces the loft.

A worthwhile experiment might be to remove the shaft tip adapter and trim the shaft 1/2" or so, then reinstall the adapter. The overall length of the club will be reduced but that would be a good thing for a slicer anyway.
[/quote]

Actually closing the face increases loft. If the head is square at impact, the face will have opened a bit, which increases loft.

[/quote]

No disrespect intended but I don't understand your logic. Opening the club face, whether at address or when coming into the ball, will increase loft. The opposite is true of closing the face.

Regardless of this semantics debate, I agree that a loft change is the best way to address the problem. I'd try the shaft manipulation before buying a new club though.
[/quote]

No disrespect taken and I know this can be confusing. It's totally counter-intuitive, right? There are folks here WAY more in the know than I am about this and it's been mentioned quite often: A face that's open has [b][i]lower[/i][/b] effective loft than one that sits square. From what I've learned here from club makers/fitters and pros is, for every degree open a face is, you [b][i]reduce[/i][/b] loft by about .6*. I know it's opposite of what you'd think it should be, but it is what it is.


[/quote]



Yes, I get all that, but you are assuming the player is going to square up the face at impact. Many players that like an open face also have an in-to-out swing path and they don't square it up at impact. Conversely, many players that fight a slice come out-to-in, so they need a face that sits closed...and stays closed though impact.
[/quote]

Agreed but this has nothing to do with loft. Opening the face decreases loft.

[swanry30]

OP - lower loft driver - the 9* should work better.

Open 1* decreases loft by approximately .6*
Closed 1* increases loft by approximately .6*

If someone tries to use the analogy that when they open there lob wedge to hit a flop shot it increases the loft so it is the same with the driver too we will have problems our hands. Vijay at one time played a 10.5* driver bent open some 4+* - guarentee that didnt increase the loft

Physics are often counterintuitive.

[Nessism]

Well guys, guess we are just going to have to agree to disagree. I'll bet you dollars to donuts that Vijay was rolling his hands over and squaring that face up, thus closing down the loft like you guys say. At any rate, that's how I see it.

[Boone]

Well guys, guess we are just going to have to agree to disagree. I'll bet you dollars to donuts that Vijay was rolling his hands over and squaring that face up, thus closing down the loft like you guys say. At any rate, that's how I see it.

 

Let's say the loft on my driver is 10* if I set it open at address and then close it back to square at impact, shouldn't the loft be 10*?

[Nessism]

Well guys, guess we are just going to have to agree to disagree. I'll bet you dollars to donuts that Vijay was rolling his hands over and squaring that face up, thus closing down the loft like you guys say. At any rate, that's how I see it.

 

Let's say the loft on my driver is 10* if I set it open at address and then close it back to square at impact, shouldn't the loft be 10*?

 

In in my view... the face will have to close to reach square at impact, and when that happens the loft will read lower than 10 degrees.

[Redhill]

Opening the face does decrease the loft. I know, I know this sounds opposite of what you would think but in the driver it is the case.

Look at the chart that Titleist provides to the golf shops on making adjustments to the 910's and it will confirm this.

I thought that opening the face would increase the loft also but a patience golf shop manager explained it to me using that Titleist chart.

The boys at Titleist do know what the heck they are doing.

[PJ0721]

There seems to be discussion of two different things here:

1. Opening the face of a club by changing how the club is held results in added loft.

2. Changing the setting of an R9/R11 to open the face reduces loft (lower for R11, right for R9).

Numbers 1 and 2 are in no way related. Number 2 does seem counter-intuitive. It is just how the adapter is designed.

PJ

[PJ0721]

Slack,

You could try setting it to lower and putting a heavier weight in the heel to offset the tendency to miss right.

PJ

[chatfieldgolf08]

It's going to need to be a lower lofted head because the axivcore green is a low launch low spin shaft iirc.

[Slack Hacker]

Thanks all for your help with my problems. I think I may try the following solutions in this order:

1) Set the head to lower and add up to 6 grams to the heel weight

2) Try a lower launching low spin shaft

3) Just get a 9 degree head

Best Regards

[Slack Hacker]

Thanks for fixing my problem! Set the head to lower and put a 16g weight in the heel. Ball flight down and I'm not missing right. Most importantly I've picked up a few yards.[quote name='PJ0721' timestamp='1310379382' post='3381293']
Slack,

You could try setting it to lower and putting a heavier weight in the heel to offset the tendency to miss right.

PJ
[/quote]

[pdaero]

That's good news! Heavier weights have been known to bring the ballflight down. How, I don't know, but glad it works.

[rlynham]

Well guys, guess we are just going to have to agree to disagree. I'll bet you dollars to donuts that Vijay was rolling his hands over and squaring that face up, thus closing down the loft like you guys say. At any rate, that's how I see it.

 

 

A 9.5* driver that is square sits flat on the ground when square. If this driver is bent or adjusted 1* open then it's loft is 9.5* when it is 1* open sitting flat on the ground. If the club is squared up at impact then the loft will be roughly 8.9*.

 

Hitting a ball with an open face increases loft. Adjusting/bending the face open decreases the effective loft. Opening a club with your hand is completely different than having it bent/adjusted open.