New Review in on New Hogan Book!

[dlygrisse]

Schleeman, I bought your book and went to the range to give it a try. I have owned a copy of 5 lessons for 20 years and could never get it right. I have to say that the left elbow trick really made it all work better. I started hitting power fades just as Hogan wanted. If I didnt make the left elbow work right I hit a big push fade. I am still working with it becasue I have been drawing the ball for many years, but it feels pretty good. There is one thing that I cant get the feel for. I cant get the ball to draw with this technique, even if I close the club face at address as you suggest. I feel like I am swinging straight down the line and there is no way to get more of an inside out swing and make it curve right to left. Any adivce? I am a 5 handicap and usually can control the club pretty well but I cant get the feel for this.

[Schleeman]

dlygrisse,

 

Thanks for picking up the book. I'm glad you understand that you still have to work on the left elbow move. The more you practice it, the more comfortable it will become.

When you practice with a closed clubface, make sure you go to the extreme first and hit a big hook. The body has a tendency to compensate when we alter our swing slightly, so go overboard, close the face more, and hook it, and then back off by decreasing the closed clubface angle until you get the draw you desire. Be sure to maintain proper turning actions and you will get the results you desire. Also remember, the clubs of today do not allow as much "working the ball" as clubs in years past.

 

Good Luck,

Tom Bertrand

[dlygrisse]

Thanks, when playing a draw should the left wrist be more flat, and with a fade do you apply the "little twist". or do you cup your left wrist for all shots?

[bakin]

After George Knudson's 'balance' and Homer Kelley's 'right forearm and elbow',

this 'little twist' gave me my third 'A ha!!!' moment. Now I know

what a real draw is... Before this, all I was doing was hitting pull draws.

With the 'little twist' my shots starts to the right of target and move gently to

the left... real draw!!! Today at the driving range I hit 3 iron after 3 iron and

all the shots had the same nice flight pattern... 10 yards added distance to

my 3 iron was the gravy... Funny thing is I didn’t even read the book yet… I just read

the ‘secret’ from Jeffy’s post… I sure will get the book and read it cover to cover…

 

Thx a lot Schleeman!!!

[Ducky]

I'm currently up to chapter four, I will post my thoughts once I finish the book.

[golfer.61]

just thinking out loud......I wonder if the elbows close together was the connection of the left and right elbow against the core of the body during the swing????????and not so much in relation to one another in a literal sense out in front or on top of the chest....also in the Mystic Of Hogan Venturi talks about how hogan hit a draw or fade it had to do with the release of his hands from impact to the finish....johnny miller has talked about this several times on some of his comments about great ball strikers.....hogan's left wrist was cupped at the top for a draw or finish ...it appears that he pronated the right wrist in order to lay the club off at the top and then went back to a supinated right wrist into the ball????kind of like a duel between the two wrists...supinated pronated supinated pronated ...ect...throughout the whole swing...Hogan did go into detail about the grip in the video footage at the estate....I wonder if the grip is often an overlooked part of the whole mystic....

[dlygrisse]

A cupped left wrist opens the club face and a flat left wrist closes the club face, it seems to me that if you want to draw the ball you should have a flat left wrist at the top and if you want to fade you cup the left wrist at the top, much as Hogan said in his Time magazine article.

 

I think that Hogans secret is that he wanted to eliminate the hook and play the power fade, he did this by cupping his left wrist. He did all of this with a weak grip, which would cause anyone to push slice the ball. The secret that is expalned in the book is how to square the club with the left elbow, which makes the whole thing work. (in a nut shell)

[golfer.61]

thank you for your insight....what about the connection of the elbows???close together not close....hardys thoughts on a one planner and elbows ect....???

[Schleeman]

dlygrisse,

You make a great point and great observation.

In the beginning, Hogan discovered he could fade the ball with his "little twist" to start the backswing with no loss of distance. He then believed he shouldn't use the "little twist"when he wanted to hit a draw. He later found that not cupping was too unpredictable and the hook would flare up some times. So, he taught himself to use the 'twist' all the time, no matter what ball flight he wanted.

Hogan had stated in the past he could hook the ball even with a weak grip and that's what led him to the 'twist', because you can not employ the 'twist' with a strong grip. The strong grip already has the twist built in, if you catch my drift. So to explain it a little better, I like to say coil the hands and then let them uncoil. That's why when Hogan said he hit the ball straighter, the harder he would swing, this let you know his hands could not uncoil fast enough to hook the ball.

So for most people, dlygrisse, you can cup to fade and no cup to draw. I just think it takes too much thought on the course, when your mind should be on the target.

 

golfer.61

If hogan didn't want the arms together throughout the swing, but just close to the body, he would have bound the arms to the body in his illustration in Five Lessons instead of together.

 

Later

Tom B

[eddie3392]

Schleeman,

Did Mr. Hogan have hyperflexion in his wrist which was causing the hooks? My other question is why didn't he just pre-set the cup in his left wrist to take the timing out of it? I hope to pick the book up soon. I too fight the dreaded hooks and have for yrs. Every teacher says the opposite of each other and I have become frustrated. I have a buddy who had the same problem and just got back from a well know teacher which had him do this cupping of the left wrist to take the left side out of his game. This instructor seems to apply the same theory as what Mr. Hogan was trying to teach. Thanks for your time.

[Schleeman]

Not that I know of. The problem is, the hands work in 3 different ways and the takeaway with the hands is a combination of all 3 (In the book I explain the 3 movements in more detail).

Unfortunately, the golf world has too many differing opinions, but then again it makes it interesting to see who can prove what and who can't.

Remember, the cupping is just one factor that has to be trained in your golf swing. The body spin has to work properly and the arms have to work properly as well. The cupping should add to the wristcock and not take away anything from the swing itself. I believe the left side should be the guide and the right side the power source.

Hope this helps.

 

Tom B

[eddie3392]

There lays the problems how to get the right side to work without creating the hooks. I don't use my right side at all because when I do the hooks creep in. The only time I have messed around with the right hand delivering the power I had to feel like I was holding off the club through impact to get the call to start straight and finish a little right. (almost sounds like an early release problem- huh!) I will pick up the book and give it a good read. The whole right hand thing in Hogans book with the supinated pronated thing did not register real well. Hard to copy interpretations.

Thanks again

Eddie

[Schleeman]

I think you'll understand my explanation of the hands. You sound like you may be off on one key point that's making you hook the ball with your right side power. I'm also coming out shortly with my Legendary Golf Workbook that has specific practice programs to follow and drills and exercises to better feel the movements stressed in "The Secret of Hogan's Swing".

 

Later,

Tom B

[ultra45]

I bought the book and found it pretty interesting... only problem is since it's about 0 degrees celcius and the courses/ranges are closed i can't really go out and try the stuff...i've taken a few lessons but i'm basically self taught and have a pretty flat "one plane" swing... i think i already do a lot of the stuff in the book except the grip...

 

when the book talks about a weaker grip does that include both hands or only a weaker right hand? trying to picture my grip i can usually see 2+ knuckles on my left hand but my right hand is basically in a neutral position... it seems to work ok for now but i'm open to suggestions