Hogan had a baseball swing

[TeeAce]

Someone please help Ray Ray, the master of lacrosse to understand this. I cant find any words to help him.

[PingG10guy]

LOL Guys... you really make this funny.

 

When I say it, it's BS and just got no sense. When one of your idol players is doing it, its the greatest thing in the world.

 

 

He got small problem with his hip area, but I don't think it matters anything.

 

Just one great low and left swing as we all can see

 

That man is trying to move the arms, hands and clubhead as DTL as possible with his pivot.

 

You've evaded the important questions that will make people learn. Now you say you teach tailbone release, and you know how Hogan's pivot, which is not unique you say, works.

 

So, how does a tailbone release and Hogan's normal pivot works? And assuming you know it, how does it affect the other parts of the body and ultimately the clubhead and clubface?

 

...For the sake of "reading" how all this works on a forum I think you guys are both slightly off here.

 

If the hands stay on the shirt buttons then the release cant be "Low and Left" although it looks that way

 

And to say the player pictured is trying to swing the arm triangle/handle/clubhead with his pivot doesnt really explain it as you have to do some very active things with your arms to get correct alignments

[ray ray]

[quote name='TeeAce' timestamp='1349120413' post='5732255']
Someone please help Ray Ray, the master of lacrosse to understand this. I cant find any words to help him.
[/quote]



lacrosse?? wrong sport, have no idea what you're reference means, you can't explain that's basically the answer, you have no answers to any of the questions i raised. if anyone is a master it's you master at avoiding answering legit questions.

post up your Hogan handpath graph or any of the measurements you have from Hogan so we can see the comparisons you have done to your students and those 2d still pics you posted. that should make for a good discussion, i'm all ears and eyes.

[ray ray]

LOL Guys... you really make this funny.

 

When I say it, it's BS and just got no sense. When one of your idol players is doing it, its the greatest thing in the world.

 

 

He got small problem with his hip area, but I don't think it matters anything.

 

Just one great low and left swing as we all can see

 

That man is trying to move the arms, hands and clubhead as DTL as possible with his pivot.

 

You've evaded the important questions that will make people learn. Now you say you teach tailbone release, and you know how Hogan's pivot, which is not unique you say, works.

 

So, how does a tailbone release and Hogan's normal pivot works? And assuming you know it, how does it affect the other parts of the body and ultimately the clubhead and clubface?

 

...For the sake of "reading" how all this works on a forum I think you guys are both slightly off here.

 

If the hands stay on the shirt buttons then the release cant be "Low and Left" although it looks that way

 

And to say the player pictured is trying to swing the arm triangle/handle/clubhead with his pivot doesnt really explain it as you have to do some very active things with your arms to get correct alignments

 

 

 

 

exactly, the golfer has to line it up at some point. and the pivot alone cannot do that.

[TeeAce]

[quote name='ray ray' timestamp='1349120985' post='5732323']
[quote name='TeeAce' timestamp='1349120413' post='5732255']
Someone please help Ray Ray, the master of lacrosse to understand this. I cant find any words to help him.
[/quote]



lacrosse?? wrong sport, have no idea what you're reference means, you can't explain that's basically the answer, you have no answers to any of the questions i raised. if anyone is a master it's you master at avoiding answering legit questions.

post up your Hogan handpath graph or any of the measurements you have from Hogan so we can see the comparisons you have done to your students and those 2d still pics you posted. that should make for a good discussion, i'm all ears and eyes.
[/quote]

Only one person around the world has asked something so stupid than posting Hogans hand path. There just cant be two of that kind.

[Ben Hogan Swing Project]

PingG10 and others, not sure why you guys don't understand the meaning of "low n left." Doesn't matter if its in 2d vid either.


Low and left:
Hands disapper low and left, at left hip, while clubshaft still magically there.

[attachment=1368079:low and left.jpg]


[b]Not [/b]low and left. I am now naming this "high n left."
Hands fly out away from body and exit under left armpit or near the face.
Hmmmm, do Lexi and Fowler have the same swing instructor???

[attachment=1368081:not low and left.jpg]

[TeeAce]

LOL Guys... you really make this funny.

 

When I say it, it's BS and just got no sense. When one of your idol players is doing it, its the greatest thing in the world.

 

 

He got small problem with his hip area, but I don't think it matters anything.

 

Just one great low and left swing as we all can see

 

That man is trying to move the arms, hands and clubhead as DTL as possible with his pivot.

 

You've evaded the important questions that will make people learn. Now you say you teach tailbone release, and you know how Hogan's pivot, which is not unique you say, works.

 

So, how does a tailbone release and Hogan's normal pivot works? And assuming you know it, how does it affect the other parts of the body and ultimately the clubhead and clubface?

 

...For the sake of "reading" how all this works on a forum I think you guys are both slightly off here.

 

If the hands stay on the shirt buttons then the release cant be "Low and Left" although it looks that way

 

And to say the player pictured is trying to swing the arm triangle/handle/clubhead with his pivot doesnt really explain it as you have to do some very active things with your arms to get correct alignments

 

They can if they first move away from the body (straight out) and then body rotation drags them in.

 

That going left is not an illusion and it took a while before I met first guy doing that really. Then another.. and few more. And damn... they were all swedish, not even one finnish guy at that group.

 

One more 3D measurement about that as the red line indicates the distance from the target line. As you can see, it's not after impact, it's much before, just like McNary. The blue line is right shoulder path.

 

 

And bigger view also with height, lateral orientation and path

 

 

And yes.... I was telling people so many years to swing to the target or even right field. I hope other instructors doesn't need to do same mistakes I did before this understanding, cause it has changed the learning process and also better players ball flight and accuracy so much.

 

Just take it or leave it, but it's shared here for free

[dpb5031]

[quote name='Ben Hogan Swing Project' timestamp='1349122756' post='5732597']
PingG10 and others, not sure why you guys don't understand the meaning of "low n left." Doesn't matter if its in 2d vid either.


Low and left:
Hands disapper low and left, at left hip, while clubshaft still magically there.

[attachment=1368079:low and left.jpg]


[b]Not [/b]low and left. I am now naming this "high n left."
Hands fly out away from body and exit under left armpit or near the face.
Hmmmm, do Lexi and Fowler have the same swing instructor???

[attachment=1368081:not low and left.jpg]
[/quote]

BHSP, I don't get what all the fuss is about either. I too see the hands going low and left in a Hogan-type body release swing. It's relative terminology for sure, but seems so obvious I'm not sure why it is even argued otherwise.

BTW - Keep up the good work!

[ray ray]

[quote name='TeeAce' timestamp='1349122640' post='5732577']
[quote name='ray ray' timestamp='1349120985' post='5732323']
[quote name='TeeAce' timestamp='1349120413' post='5732255']
Someone please help Ray Ray, the master of lacrosse to understand this. I cant find any words to help him.
[/quote]



lacrosse?? wrong sport, have no idea what you're reference means, you can't explain that's basically the answer, you have no answers to any of the questions i raised. if anyone is a master it's you master at avoiding answering legit questions.

post up your Hogan handpath graph or any of the measurements you have from Hogan so we can see the comparisons you have done to your students and those 2d still pics you posted. that should make for a good discussion, i'm all ears and eyes.
[/quote]

Only one person around the world has asked something so stupid than posting Hogans hand path. There just cant be two of that kind.
[/quote]



??? what's stupid about that? the only one in the world...lol! i guess you checked with all the billion's of people did you , now that's stupid ,what's stupid is claiming what you claim about Hogan and 2d still pics been used as proof and your students " look" when you don't have anything from Hogan to compare these to. that's stupid and it comes from you and you still haven't answered any of my questions and are d-plane ignorant.

also what's stupid is this notion that i'm someone else, i noticed you do this with anyone that asks you hard questions or disagrees with you, now that's really stupid and shows you cannot answer questions when you put out some ridiculous claims with no solid proof except some 2d still pics and regard them as some kind of untouchable proof, now that's just plain stupid.

so far you are winning in the stupidity contest.

[ray ray]

LOL Guys... you really make this funny.

 

When I say it, it's BS and just got no sense. When one of your idol players is doing it, its the greatest thing in the world.

 

 

He got small problem with his hip area, but I don't think it matters anything.

 

Just one great low and left swing as we all can see

 

That man is trying to move the arms, hands and clubhead as DTL as possible with his pivot.

 

You've evaded the important questions that will make people learn. Now you say you teach tailbone release, and you know how Hogan's pivot, which is not unique you say, works.

 

So, how does a tailbone release and Hogan's normal pivot works? And assuming you know it, how does it affect the other parts of the body and ultimately the clubhead and clubface?

 

...For the sake of "reading" how all this works on a forum I think you guys are both slightly off here.

 

If the hands stay on the shirt buttons then the release cant be "Low and Left" although it looks that way

 

And to say the player pictured is trying to swing the arm triangle/handle/clubhead with his pivot doesnt really explain it as you have to do some very active things with your arms to get correct alignments

 

They can if they first move away from the body (straight out) and then body rotation drags them in.

 

That going left is not an illusion and it took a while before I met first guy doing that really. Then another.. and few more. And damn... they were all swedish, not even one finnish guy at that group.

 

One more 3D measurement about that as the red line indicates the distance from the target line. As you can see, it's not after impact, it's much before, just like McNary. The blue line is right shoulder path.

 

 

And bigger view also with height, lateral orientation and path

 

 

And yes.... I was telling people so many years to swing to the target or even right field. I hope other instructors doesn't need to do same mistakes I did before this understanding, cause it has changed the learning process and also better players ball flight and accuracy so much.

 

Just take it or leave it, but it's shared here for free

 

 

 

swing what to the target? you can't swing to the right? path can't be to the right?

[tylerdurden]

Lol golfwrx is funny - it's like a Hogan documentary with a splash of reality TV drama and bickering thrown in to spice things up.

[tylerdurden]

Your stupid..

no, your stupid!!!

no, your soooo stupid!!!!!!!!!

you don't even know Physics!!

Oh yeah? you don't even know Chemistry!! What about metorology?!?!? What about the moon's gravitational pull and how it changes Hogan's hand path!!!

[tylerdurden]

YOU STILL BELIEVE IN THE EASTER BUNNY!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

[tylerdurden]

[quote name='Ben Hogan Swing Project' timestamp='1349122756' post='5732597']
PingG10 and others, not sure why you guys don't understand the meaning of "low n left." Doesn't matter if its in 2d vid either.


Low and left:
Hands disapper low and left, at left hip, while clubshaft still magically there.

[attachment=1368079:low and left.jpg]


[b]Not [/b]low and left. I am now naming this "high n left."
Hands fly out away from body and exit under left armpit or near the face.
Hmmmm, do Lexi and Fowler have the same swing instructor???

[attachment=1368081:not low and left.jpg]
[/quote]

Agreed. I just don't know about the intent but I agree completely that that's the look and hands are lower and more left than others. What causes it is another issue and debatable.

[ray ray]

[quote name='tylerdurden' timestamp='1349124802' post='5732927']
YOU STILL BELIEVE IN THE EASTER BUNNY!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
[/quote]


only at easter. he looks a little like tapio, but that's just stupid...lol!

[drewspin]

[quote name='TeeAce' timestamp='1349123401' post='5732725']

They can if they first move away from the body (straight out) and then body rotation drags them in.

[/quote]

^^

This is what you teach now?

Honest question.

[dairic]

[quote name='drewspin' timestamp='1349126834' post='5733207']
[quote name='TeeAce' timestamp='1349123401' post='5732725']

They can if they first move away from the body (straight out) and then body rotation drags them in.

[/quote]

^^

This is what you teach now?

Honest question.
[/quote]

Isn't that the same thing as OTT?

[tylerdurden]

your head is fat!!!!!!!!

ok sorry I'm done now. I've always wanted to say that.

[Pinsplitter59]

looks like a circle
TW 2000

[chrisgilly09]

Lol what a s*** storm, nice topic tyler. I think he had some baseball moves for the record

[ray ray]

[quote name='tylerdurden' timestamp='1349128130' post='5733397']
your head is fat!!!!!!!!

ok sorry I'm done now. I've always wanted to say that.
[/quote]


which one?...lol! i always wanted to say that, thanks for the opportunity.

[svsvincenzo]

[quote name='tylerdurden' timestamp='1349124752' post='5732917']
Your stupid..

no, your stupid!!!

no, your soooo stupid!!!!!!!!!

you don't even know Physics!!

Oh yeah? you don't even know Chemistry!! What about metorology?!?!? What about the moon's gravitational pull and how it changes Hogan's hand path!!!
[/quote]

For the record, who started it?

[tylerdurden]

lol now i feel like a house wife or middle school teacher.

[drewspin]

Who ate the paste, and liked it?

Fess up.

[hoganfan924]

[quote name='drewspin' timestamp='1349126834' post='5733207']
[quote name='TeeAce' timestamp='1349123401' post='5732725']

They can if they first move away from the body (straight out) and then body rotation drags them in.

[/quote]

^^

This is what you teach now?

Honest question.
[/quote]

I know a "Hogan guy" that teaches just this (not Slicefixer). I don't do it, don't believe in it but it's not quite as awful as it sounds (for the right player). The hands moving out actually flattens the shaft a bit, so for the right guy, it can look way OTT but not produce an OTT result. Can be a helpful corrective thought for a guy that drives the hands straight down and gets stuck. At least for a while.

Depends a lot on how high the hands are at the top of the BS. Snead had a very pronounced "reverse loop shift" in some swings and times in his career.

[doram101]

LOL Guys... you really make this funny.

 

When I say it, it's BS and just got no sense. When one of your idol players is doing it, its the greatest thing in the world.

 

 

He got small problem with his hip area, but I don't think it matters anything.

 

Just one great low and left swing as we all can see

 

That man is trying to move the arms, hands and clubhead as DTL as possible with his pivot.

 

You've evaded the important questions that will make people learn. Now you say you teach tailbone release, and you know how Hogan's pivot, which is not unique you say, works.

 

So, how does a tailbone release and Hogan's normal pivot works? And assuming you know it, how does it affect the other parts of the body and ultimately the clubhead and clubface?

 

...For the sake of "reading" how all this works on a forum I think you guys are both slightly off here.

 

If the hands stay on the shirt buttons then the release cant be "Low and Left" although it looks that way

 

And to say the player pictured is trying to swing the arm triangle/handle/clubhead with his pivot doesnt really explain it as you have to do some very active things with your arms to get correct alignments

 

Nobody said mcnary is not swinging left , in fact he is , the point was that some yahoo was putting up some cf swings of morad guys and saying they stall and flip and basically stating this is what they teach

[ray ray]

[quote name='drewspin' timestamp='1349141699' post='5734775']
Who ate the paste, and liked it?

Fess up.
[/quote]



it tasted like tapioca, yuk!

[drewspin]

[quote name='hoganfan924' timestamp='1349141743' post='5734779']
[quote name='drewspin' timestamp='1349126834' post='5733207']
[quote name='TeeAce' timestamp='1349123401' post='5732725']

They can if they first move away from the body (straight out) and then body rotation drags them in.

[/quote]

^^

This is what you teach now?

Honest question.
[/quote]

I know a "Hogan guy" that teaches just this (not Slicefixer). I don't do it, don't believe in it but it's not quite as awful as it sounds (for the right player). The hands moving out actually flattens the shaft a bit, so for the right guy, it can look way OTT but not produce an OTT result. Can be a helpful corrective thought for a guy that drives the hands straight down and gets stuck. At least for a while.

Depends a lot on how high the hands are at the top of the BS. Snead had a very pronounced "reverse loop shift" in some swings and times in his career.
[/quote]

Yes, OTT can still be from the inside... Just thought it would ask Tapio to explain further... Withholding commentary here, and trying to understand, though I can see how that fits with some of his demonstrations posted on line.

[drewspin]

[quote name='Pinsplitter59' timestamp='1349128932' post='5733495']
looks like a circle
TW 2000
[/quote]

From a face on 2D projection (caddy view), the radius of the hand path is decreasing on the downswing, through impact. Looks more like a golden spiral than a circle.

[hoganfan924]

[quote name='drewspin' timestamp='1349142507' post='5734885']
[quote name='Pinsplitter59' timestamp='1349128932' post='5733495']
looks like a circle
TW 2000
[/quote]

From a face on 2D projection (caddy view), the radius of the hand path is decreasing on the downswing, through impact. Looks more like a golden spiral than a circle.
[/quote]

True for most players but Tiger in 2000 was a circle path delivery player (which is uncommon for elite level players). So from caddy view, his handpath was more rounded rather than "reverse J" shaped.