Could a 12 handicapper....

[Titleist 670]

[quote name='knock it close' timestamp='1427855133' post='11258073']
[quote name='Marand' timestamp='1427855007' post='11258055']
I'm still patiently waiting for one of our preeminent SGI advocates to explain why, if 90%+ (maybe even 95%+?) of all amateur golfers play game-improvement golf clubs surrounded by high-tech game improvement teaching technology, their average golf scores are no lower than those of the amateur players of 1960 playing only blades without any technological assistance.

Where is the statistical proof they help you score better? Guys? Hello? Is this mike on?
[/quote]I think I explained this earlier. The type of golfer that played in the 60's is much different than todays golfer. Most golfers in the 60's were members at a club, played more regularly, took lessons, clubs create a more competitive atmosphere, people took more steps to improve and had more time to do so. That isn't the scenario today.
[/quote]

I also think the people who benefit from technology are oftentimes the really good golfers because they've played to a point where a small tweak here or there can make a difference. Your average joe who hits the range once a week needs about a billion things on the list ahead of new equipment to get better. I've never seen a crappy golfer get a new set of irons and magically get 5 shots better. Practice, practice, practice.

[govols]

[quote name='Exactice808' timestamp='1427854273' post='11257951'][quote name='govols' timestamp='1427853984' post='11257925']
I can hook a Big Bertha iron as much as any blade and when it comes to left to right it'd probably be the same too.
[/quote]

OK MR. DATA Man.....


Tell me why the manufacture says this then???


http://www.mizunousa.com/golf/products/jpx-ez-iron#.VRtS-vnF-So

SGI Iron, Massive sweet area for max forgivenss, low and deep cog for easy launch, increased accuracy...... NOTHING ABOUT WORKABILITY


now same manufacture

http://www.mizunousa.com/golf/products/mp-4-iron#.VRtTXPnF-So
[color=#484848]
The MP-4 is the purest of forged muscle backs for shot-makers seeking the ultimate control over their ball flight. [/color]

The manufacture states that X club has more control over ball flight......than the other.......MR. Data Man![/quote]


Just to add one caters to a golfer that needs forgiveness and doesn't hit the ball that solidly and the other to a golfer that strikes every shot pure. Which one are you?

[govols]

[quote name='Marand' timestamp='1427855007' post='11258055']I'm still patiently waiting for one of our preeminent SGI advocates to explain why, if 90%+ (maybe even 95%+?) of all amateur golfers play game-improvement golf clubs surrounded by high-tech game improvement teaching technology, their average golf scores are no lower than those of the amateur players of 1960 playing only blades without any technological assistance.

Where is the statistical proof they help you score better? Guys? Hello? Is this mike on? [/quote]

Is this your justification?

[Titleist 670]

[quote name='Nine Miler' timestamp='1427855395' post='11258109']
It's different for you 670. It doesn't matter. Really. I only get worked up because I know internally how much one more stroke a round means to me in some of the stuff I play.

I might project that onto others games when they really don't care about that stroke. They'd rather have fun hitting the wrong shots and hitting them poorly and shooting 85. I don't really care, we all are trying to get something different out of the game. A guy like me is trying desperately to get in the Masters through the Mid-Am, because I have acquaintances and peers that have, and I think I can do it.

A guy that wants to just have a good time and squirrel sizzler cuts and drop kick hooks, knock yourself out. Whatever blows your hair back, man.
[/quote]

Yeah, for good golfers it certainly does matter. I'd never argue that.

But if someone came up to me at the range and said I shouldn't be hitting my irons, I would laugh at them. You have to be insanely insecure to do that - I'm not saying that's you, but it seems like a lot of people are obsessed with the gear other people play.

Now, if I was playing blades and telling you how they were saving me 10 strokes a round and how I was hitting a sweet baby fade all the time, and then you saw me post an 87, you could certainly laugh at me.

[Marand]

[quote name='govols' timestamp='1427855690' post='11258161']
[quote name='Marand' timestamp='1427855007' post='11258055']I'm still patiently waiting for one of our preeminent SGI advocates to explain why, if 90%+ (maybe even 95%+?) of all amateur golfers play game-improvement golf clubs surrounded by high-tech game improvement teaching technology, their average golf scores are no lower than those of the amateur players of 1960 playing only blades without any technological assistance.

Where is the statistical proof they help you score better? Guys? Hello? Is this mike on? [/quote]

Is this your justification?
[/quote]

As they say, "show me the money". You're one of the guys claiming players score better with SGI golf technology versus playing with blades. So....?

[BMC]

[quote name='Titleist 670' timestamp='1427855508' post='11258131']
[quote name='knock it close' timestamp='1427855133' post='11258073']
[quote name='Marand' timestamp='1427855007' post='11258055']
I'm still patiently waiting for one of our preeminent SGI advocates to explain why, if 90%+ (maybe even 95%+?) of all amateur golfers play game-improvement golf clubs surrounded by high-tech game improvement teaching technology, their average golf scores are no lower than those of the amateur players of 1960 playing only blades without any technological assistance.

Where is the statistical proof they help you score better? Guys? Hello? Is this mike on?
[/quote]I think I explained this earlier. The type of golfer that played in the 60's is much different than todays golfer. Most golfers in the 60's were members at a club, played more regularly, took lessons, clubs create a more competitive atmosphere, people took more steps to improve and had more time to do so. That isn't the scenario today.
[/quote]

I also think the people who benefit from technology are oftentimes the really good golfers because they've played to a point where a small tweak here or there can make a difference. Your average joe who hits the range once a week needs about a billion things on the list ahead of new equipment to get better. I've never seen a crappy golfer get a new set of irons and magically get 5 shots better. Practice, practice, practice.
[/quote]

Phil Mickelson has probably played at least 20 different sets of irons in his pro career. Has that ever changed his game? NO.

Rory was #1 with Titleist and #1 with Nike. Irons just don't make much difference in scoring, Tour Pro or 15 hdcp.

Irons are overated.

[Nine Miler]

[quote name='Titleist 670' timestamp='1427855789' post='11258171']
[quote name='Nine Miler' timestamp='1427855395' post='11258109']
It's different for you 670. It doesn't matter. Really. I only get worked up because I know internally how much one more stroke a round means to me in some of the stuff I play.

I might project that onto others games when they really don't care about that stroke. They'd rather have fun hitting the wrong shots and hitting them poorly and shooting 85. I don't really care, we all are trying to get something different out of the game. A guy like me is trying desperately to get in the Masters through the Mid-Am, because I have acquaintances and peers that have, and I think I can do it.

A guy that wants to just have a good time and squirrel sizzler cuts and drop kick hooks, knock yourself out. Whatever blows your hair back, man.
[/quote]

Yeah, for good golfers it certainly does matter. I'd never argue that.

But if someone came up to me at the range and said I shouldn't be hitting my irons, I would laugh at them. You have to be insanely insecure to do that - I'm not saying that's you, but it seems like a lot of people are obsessed with the gear other people play.

Now, if I was playing blades and telling you how they were saving me 10 strokes a round and how I was hitting a sweet baby fade all the time, and then you saw me post an 87, you could certainly laugh at me.
[/quote]

That's essentially what we are doing at all the guys in this thread that are saying and doing just that. You seem like a reasonable blade player. Hahaha.

[Nine Miler]

Now they are all going to post that they don't save ten strokes, it just doesn't cost them any shots. Watch. Here it comes...

[govols]

[quote name='Marand' timestamp='1427855886' post='11258179'][quote name='govols' timestamp='1427855690' post='11258161']
[quote name='Marand' timestamp='1427855007' post='11258055']I'm still patiently waiting for one of our preeminent SGI advocates to explain why, if 90%+ (maybe even 95%+?) of all amateur golfers play game-improvement golf clubs surrounded by high-tech game improvement teaching technology, their average golf scores are no lower than those of the amateur players of 1960 playing only blades without any technological assistance.

Where is the statistical proof they help you score better? Guys? Hello? Is this mike on? [/quote]

Is this your justification?
[/quote]

As they say, "show me the money". You're one of the guys claiming players score better with SGI golf technology versus playing with blades. So....?[/quote]

Is Bridgestone J40 sgi?

[govols]

[quote name='BMC' timestamp='1427855892' post='11258181'][quote name='Titleist 670' timestamp='1427855508' post='11258131']
[quote name='knock it close' timestamp='1427855133' post='11258073']
[quote name='Marand' timestamp='1427855007' post='11258055']
I'm still patiently waiting for one of our preeminent SGI advocates to explain why, if 90%+ (maybe even 95%+?) of all amateur golfers play game-improvement golf clubs surrounded by high-tech game improvement teaching technology, their average golf scores are no lower than those of the amateur players of 1960 playing only blades without any technological assistance.

Where is the statistical proof they help you score better? Guys? Hello? Is this mike on?
[/quote]I think I explained this earlier. The type of golfer that played in the 60's is much different than todays golfer. Most golfers in the 60's were members at a club, played more regularly, took lessons, clubs create a more competitive atmosphere, people took more steps to improve and had more time to do so. That isn't the scenario today.
[/quote]

I also think the people who benefit from technology are oftentimes the really good golfers because they've played to a point where a small tweak here or there can make a difference. Your average joe who hits the range once a week needs about a billion things on the list ahead of new equipment to get better. I've never seen a crappy golfer get a new set of irons and magically get 5 shots better. Practice, practice, practice.
[/quote]

Phil Mickelson has probably played at least 20 different sets of irons in his pro career. Has that ever changed his game? NO.

Rory was #1 with Titleist and #1 with Nike. Irons just don't make much difference in scoring, Tour Pro or 15 hdcp.

Irons are overated.[/quote]

Why hasn't Rory switched to the new vapor irons? Why did Nike have to outsource Tiger's irons in the beginning?

[quote name='Nine Miler' timestamp='1427855987' post='11258199']Now they are all going to post that they don't save ten strokes, it just doesn't cost them any shots. Watch. Here it comes...[/quote]

They already have

[Marand]

[quote name='Titleist 670' timestamp='1427855508' post='11258131']
....
I also think the people who benefit from technology are oftentimes the really good golfers because they've played to a point where a small tweak here or there can make a difference. Your average joe who hits the range once a week needs about a billion things on the list ahead of new equipment to get better. I've never seen a crappy golfer get a new set of irons and magically get 5 shots better. [size=5][b] Practice, practice, practice.[/b][/size]
[/quote]

Yes, if you want to get better you won't find your answer in the golf shop after presenting your credit card, the answer is on the range and on the course.

[Marand]

[quote name='govols' timestamp='1427856030' post='11258205']
[quote name='Marand' timestamp='1427855886' post='11258179'][quote name='govols' timestamp='1427855690' post='11258161']
[quote name='Marand' timestamp='1427855007' post='11258055']I'm still patiently waiting for one of our preeminent SGI advocates to explain why, if 90%+ (maybe even 95%+?) of all amateur golfers play game-improvement golf clubs surrounded by high-tech game improvement teaching technology, their average golf scores are no lower than those of the amateur players of 1960 playing only blades without any technological assistance.

Where is the statistical proof they help you score better? Guys? Hello? Is this mike on? [/quote]

Is this your justification?
[/quote]

As they say, "show me the money". You're one of the guys claiming players score better with SGI golf technology versus playing with blades. So....?[/quote]

Is Bridgestone J40 sgi?
[/quote]

Is that an average golf score?

[govols]

[quote name='Marand' timestamp='1427856257' post='11258239'][quote name='govols' timestamp='1427856030' post='11258205']
[quote name='Marand' timestamp='1427855886' post='11258179'][quote name='govols' timestamp='1427855690' post='11258161']
[quote name='Marand' timestamp='1427855007' post='11258055']I'm still patiently waiting for one of our preeminent SGI advocates to explain why, if 90%+ (maybe even 95%+?) of all amateur golfers play game-improvement golf clubs surrounded by high-tech game improvement teaching technology, their average golf scores are no lower than those of the amateur players of 1960 playing only blades without any technological assistance.

Where is the statistical proof they help you score better? Guys? Hello? Is this mike on? [/quote]

Is this your justification?
[/quote]

As they say, "show me the money". You're one of the guys claiming players score better with SGI golf technology versus playing with blades. So....?[/quote]

Is Bridgestone J40 sgi?
[/quote]

Is that an average golf score?[/quote]

Huh?

[knock it close]

[quote name='Marand' timestamp='1427855406' post='11258111']
[quote name='knock it close' timestamp='1427855133' post='11258073']
[quote name='Marand' timestamp='1427855007' post='11258055']
I'm still patiently waiting for one of our preeminent SGI advocates to explain why, if 90%+ (maybe even 95%+?) of all amateur golfers play game-improvement golf clubs surrounded by high-tech game improvement teaching technology, their average golf scores are no lower than those of the amateur players of 1960 playing only blades without any technological assistance.

Where is the statistical proof they help you score better? Guys? Hello? Is this mike on?
[/quote]I think I explained this earlier. The type of golfer that played in the 60's is much different than todays golfer. [size=5][i][b]Most golfers in the 60's were members at a club, played more regularly, took lessons. That isn't the scenario today.[/b][/i][/size]
[/quote]

You do have a source for those assertions. Yes?
[/quote]No I'm sure I could find some though. Golf was much more of a rich mans came, typically played at country clubs. These guys had more time on there hands to play more golf and take lessons.

Do you have sources that say I'm wrong? yes?

Seems like common sense to me if you have any knowledge of the socio-economic landscape of the game of golf.

[Marand]

[quote name='knock it close' timestamp='1427856350' post='11258259']
[quote name='Marand' timestamp='1427855406' post='11258111']
[quote name='knock it close' timestamp='1427855133' post='11258073']
[quote name='Marand' timestamp='1427855007' post='11258055']
I'm still patiently waiting for one of our preeminent SGI advocates to explain why, if 90%+ (maybe even 95%+?) of all amateur golfers play game-improvement golf clubs surrounded by high-tech game improvement teaching technology, their average golf scores are no lower than those of the amateur players of 1960 playing only blades without any technological assistance.

Where is the statistical proof they help you score better? Guys? Hello? Is this mike on?
[/quote]I think I explained this earlier. The type of golfer that played in the 60's is much different than todays golfer. [size=5][i][b]Most golfers in the 60's were members at a club, played more regularly, took lessons. That isn't the scenario today.[/b][/i][/size]
[/quote]

You do have a source for those assertions. Yes?
[/quote]No I'm sure I could find some though. Golf was much more of a rich mans came, typically played at country clubs. These guys had more time on there hands to play more golf and take lessons.

Do you have sources that say I'm wrong? yes?

Seems like common sense to me if you have any knowledge of the socio-economic landscape of the game of golf.
[/quote]

You're going to have to do better than make an assertion without any source to back it up and then ask me to prove you're wrong. The ball is in [i][u]your[/u][/i] court. Source please. Surely you have one.....

As far as my knowledge of the socio-economic landscape of the game of golf, we're not talking about the beginning of the 20th century, we're talking about the [i]end[/i] of it. In my personal experience, I started playing golf in 1957 and have played public course golf since. My dad belonged to a couple of country clubs in the 1960's, but his clubs were a whole lot less crowded than any public course I ever played. And there were always many more public courses in the areas I lived than private throughout the time I've played golf.

[T.Beau]

[quote name='knock it close' timestamp='1427856350' post='11258259']
[quote name='Marand' timestamp='1427855406' post='11258111']
[quote name='knock it close' timestamp='1427855133' post='11258073']
[quote name='Marand' timestamp='1427855007' post='11258055']
I'm still patiently waiting for one of our preeminent SGI advocates to explain why, if 90%+ (maybe even 95%+?) of all amateur golfers play game-improvement golf clubs surrounded by high-tech game improvement teaching technology, their average golf scores are no lower than those of the amateur players of 1960 playing only blades without any technological assistance.

Where is the statistical proof they help you score better? Guys? Hello? Is this mike on?
[/quote]I think I explained this earlier. The type of golfer that played in the 60's is much different than todays golfer. [size=5][i][b]Most golfers in the 60's were members at a club, played more regularly, took lessons. That isn't the scenario today.[/b][/i][/size]
[/quote]

You do have a source for those assertions. Yes?
[/quote]No I'm sure I could find some though. Golf was much more of a rich mans came, typically played at country clubs. These guys had more time on there hands to play more golf and take lessons.

Do you have sources that say I'm wrong? yes?

Seems like common sense to me if you have any knowledge of the socio-economic landscape of the game of golf.
[/quote]

c'mon man..there is no place for common sense and good logic..this is a blades thread.

some people seem to define themselves as golfers by the gear they play rather than how well they play the game.

i agree w. your reasons for scores not going lower, but im thinking there isnt going to be statistical info anywhere as to why.

-people now (in general) are unable/unwilling to put the time into golf to become good at it..its hard to get good at and the new american way is to either become quickly good at it or move on to something else,, happened in the tennis industry..tennis is a hard sport to get good at...people figured that out, so racquetball became popular for a while because that is much easier to get proficient at.....then people started saying 'you mean i;m suppose to run for the ball' and they left that and decided on the gym.....

-golf courses have become harder and longer. dont know about you guys, but the courses i play are much tougher and longer than in years gone by...this has kind of leveled out some of the advantages in technology

-guys often play the wrong tees. their egos tell them to play from the tips but they suck and cant break 100 from back there

-around here based on this thread, people get stuffed by choosing gear which is too demanding for their skillsets driving up their scores. have also seen on the course the posers hacking away w. their blades and slicing their pro v1's into the next fairway over..guess that is a form of working the ball aye?

The Bladinati ™ ® ©
"Blinded by the blade"

[Titleist 670]

[quote name='Nine Miler' timestamp='1427855923' post='11258187']
[quote name='Titleist 670' timestamp='1427855789' post='11258171']
[quote name='Nine Miler' timestamp='1427855395' post='11258109']
It's different for you 670. It doesn't matter. Really. I only get worked up because I know internally how much one more stroke a round means to me in some of the stuff I play.

I might project that onto others games when they really don't care about that stroke. They'd rather have fun hitting the wrong shots and hitting them poorly and shooting 85. I don't really care, we all are trying to get something different out of the game. A guy like me is trying desperately to get in the Masters through the Mid-Am, because I have acquaintances and peers that have, and I think I can do it.

A guy that wants to just have a good time and squirrel sizzler cuts and drop kick hooks, knock yourself out. Whatever blows your hair back, man.
[/quote]

Yeah, for good golfers it certainly does matter. I'd never argue that.

But if someone came up to me at the range and said I shouldn't be hitting my irons, I would laugh at them. You have to be insanely insecure to do that - I'm not saying that's you, but it seems like a lot of people are obsessed with the gear other people play.

Now, if I was playing blades and telling you how they were saving me 10 strokes a round and how I was hitting a sweet baby fade all the time, and then you saw me post an 87, you could certainly laugh at me.
[/quote]

That's essentially what we are doing at all the guys in this thread that are saying and doing just that. You seem like a reasonable blade player. Hahaha.
[/quote]

Yeah I mean what irons I play are so insanely far away as far as what I need to do to get better it's not even funny. It's fun buying new clubs every now and then but I have had some great, great rounds with my current irons and love their look and feel that searching for something better and dropping $1,000 seems kind of silly - I'd be much better off paying for lessons and practing more.

Before joining WRX it never occured to me that someone might look at my irons and think I was making a statement that the pro tour is in my future; but I guess there are people who actually do play certain clubs and talk a game that is 20 strokes better than it actually is.

[dog flog]

Yes, you absolutely can play those clubs. With the reasonable expectation the scorecard will reflect your affection for them? Nope. It's like butter, I suppose. Some folks have a metabolism that would benefit from more of it but for most of us, our scorecard would be better off with bigger and far less buttery irons.

[dog flog]

I play Mizuno JPX 800 HD almost exclusively. Seems to keep my score and pulse rate lower. If Cleveland 588 MBs are butter, maybe JPX 800 HD are high fibre cereal.

[Titleist 670]

[quote name='dog flog' timestamp='1427857599' post='11258393']
Yes, you absolutely can play those clubs. With the reasonable expectation the scorecard will reflect your affection for them? Nope. It's like butter, I suppose. Some folks have a metabolism that would benefit from more of it but for most of us, our scorecard would be better off with bigger and far less buttery irons.
[/quote]

Going off topic here, but what are some irons that have the nice, clean simple look of a blade with more forgiveness?

[govols]

[quote name='Marand' timestamp='1427857358' post='11258373'][quote name='knock it close' timestamp='1427856350' post='11258259']
[quote name='Marand' timestamp='1427855406' post='11258111']
[quote name='knock it close' timestamp='1427855133' post='11258073']
[quote name='Marand' timestamp='1427855007' post='11258055']
I'm still patiently waiting for one of our preeminent SGI advocates to explain why, if 90%+ (maybe even 95%+?) of all amateur golfers play game-improvement golf clubs surrounded by high-tech game improvement teaching technology, their average golf scores are no lower than those of the amateur players of 1960 playing only blades without any technological assistance.

Where is the statistical proof they help you score better? Guys? Hello? Is this mike on?
[/quote]I think I explained this earlier. The type of golfer that played in the 60's is much different than todays golfer. [size=5][i][b]Most golfers in the 60's were members at a club, played more regularly, took lessons. That isn't the scenario today.[/b][/i][/size]
[/quote]

You do have a source for those assertions. Yes?
[/quote]No I'm sure I could find some though. Golf was much more of a rich mans came, typically played at country clubs. These guys had more time on there hands to play more golf and take lessons.

Do you have sources that say I'm wrong? yes?

Seems like common sense to me if you have any knowledge of the socio-economic landscape of the game of golf.
[/quote]

You're going to have to do better than make an assertion without any source to back it up and then ask me to prove you're wrong. The ball is in [i][u]your[/u][/i] court. Source please. Surely you have one.....

As far as my knowledge of the socio-economic landscape of the game of golf, we're not talking about the beginning of the 20th century, we're talking about the [i]end[/i] of it. In my personal experience, I started playing golf in 1957 and have played public course golf since. My dad belonged to a couple of country clubs in the 1960's, but his clubs were a whole lot less crowded than any public course I ever played. And there were always many more public courses in the areas I lived than private throughout the time I've played golf.[/quote]

Not sure I get what you're saying. What does the majority of people not being good at golf have to do with what you play and your ability?

[govols]

[quote name='Titleist 670' timestamp='1427857944' post='11258435'][quote name='dog flog' timestamp='1427857599' post='11258393']
Yes, you absolutely can play those clubs. With the reasonable expectation the scorecard will reflect your affection for them? Nope. It's like butter, I suppose. Some folks have a metabolism that would benefit from more of it but for most of us, our scorecard would be better off with bigger and far less buttery irons.
[/quote]

Going off topic here, but what are some irons that have the nice, clean simple look of a blade with more forgiveness?[/quote]

AP2 & J40 (DPC). I'm sure others can add more models.

[Nine Miler]

J15 cb
Srixon 545 or 745
Nike vapor pro combo
TM RSI tp
Wilson staff Fg v4
TM tp cb or mc
Ping s55, 56
Many mizuno models
Etc etc

[Titleist 670]

[quote name='govols' timestamp='1427858189' post='11258451'] [quote name='Titleist 670' timestamp='1427857944' post='11258435'][quote name='dog flog' timestamp='1427857599' post='11258393'] Yes, you absolutely can play those clubs. With the reasonable expectation the scorecard will reflect your affection for them? Nope. It's like butter, I suppose. Some folks have a metabolism that would benefit from more of it but for most of us, our scorecard would be better off with bigger and far less buttery irons. [/quote] Going off topic here, but what are some irons that have the nice, clean simple look of a blade with more forgiveness?[/quote] AP2 & J40 (DPC). I'm sure others can add more models. [/quote]

Thanks. I really like the look of the ap2.

Truth be told, even though I said I haven't changed irons in many many years, I did ditch my 3-iron for an easier to hit hybrid. Part of me was thinking perhaps getting a different 4-iron might be worthwhile as well.

The remarks on here about the long irons being more difficult to hit with blades I find to be true, particularly the 3/4.

[Marand]

[quote name='Titleist 670' timestamp='1427857488' post='11258383']
Yeah I mean what irons I play are so insanely far away as far as what I need to do to get better it's not even funny. It's fun buying new clubs every now and then but I have had some great, great rounds with my current irons and love their look and feel that searching for something better and dropping $1,000 seems kind of silly - I'd be much better off paying for lessons and practing more.

Before joining WRX it never occured to me that someone might look at my irons and think I was making a statement that the pro tour is in my future; but I guess there are people who actually do play certain clubs and talk a game that is 20 strokes better than it actually is.
[/quote]

Yes, it's really very simple, if you want to get better practice more, practice smarter, don't be satisfied with 'ok'. It'll go faster if you can find a good instructor (beware a poor one though). It won't matter in the slightest which clubs you use to do that, in the end no club design will hold you back, whether you're swinging a Mizuno MP-4, or a Ping G30, or a Callaway any iron. The results come from digging it out of the dirt.

[govols]

[quote name='Titleist 670' timestamp='1427858421' post='11258485'][quote name='govols' timestamp='1427858189' post='11258451'] [quote name='Titleist 670' timestamp='1427857944' post='11258435'][quote name='dog flog' timestamp='1427857599' post='11258393'] Yes, you absolutely can play those clubs. With the reasonable expectation the scorecard will reflect your affection for them? Nope. It's like butter, I suppose. Some folks have a metabolism that would benefit from more of it but for most of us, our scorecard would be better off with bigger and far less buttery irons. [/quote] Going off topic here, but what are some irons that have the nice, clean simple look of a blade with more forgiveness?[/quote] AP2 & J40 (DPC). I'm sure others can add more models. [/quote]

Thanks. I really like the look of the ap2.

Truth be told, even though I said I haven't changed irons in many many years, I did ditch my 3-iron for an easier to hit hybrid. Part of me was thinking perhaps getting a different 4-iron might be worthwhile as well.

The remarks on here about the long irons being more difficult to hit with blades I find to be true, particularly the 3/4.[/quote]

I have J40 4-PW. I prefer a set GW which Bridgestone doesn't offer so I went with an AP2 GW. J40 is a little longer heel to toe but the actual clubface (grooved area) is identical.

[Titleist 670]

[quote name='Marand' timestamp='1427858518' post='11258489']
[quote name='Titleist 670' timestamp='1427857488' post='11258383']
Yeah I mean what irons I play are so insanely far away as far as what I need to do to get better it's not even funny. It's fun buying new clubs every now and then but I have had some great, great rounds with my current irons and love their look and feel that searching for something better and dropping $1,000 seems kind of silly - I'd be much better off paying for lessons and practing more.

Before joining WRX it never occured to me that someone might look at my irons and think I was making a statement that the pro tour is in my future; but I guess there are people who actually do play certain clubs and talk a game that is 20 strokes better than it actually is.
[/quote]

Yes, it's really very simple, if you want to get better practice more, practice smarter, don't be satisfied with 'ok'. It'll go faster if you can find a good instructor (beware a poor one though). It won't matter in the slightest which clubs you use to do that, in the end no club design will hold you back, whether you're swinging a Mizuno MP-4, or a Ping G30, or a Callaway any iron. The results come from digging it out of the dirt.
[/quote]

I certainly wish I had more time to do so - but with a young family it's tough, and I also like to work out a ton which cuts into practice time. I'm hoping in 5 to 10 years I can start playing and practicing more.

My wife doesn't care how much I play, but I'm not going to ditch her and my daughter for 6 hours every weekend day during the summer, that's for sure.

[Marand]

[quote name='govols' timestamp='1427858064' post='11258443']
[quote name='Marand' timestamp='1427857358' post='11258373']
You're going to have to do better than make an assertion without any source to back it up and then ask me to prove you're wrong. The ball is in [i][u]your[/u][/i] court. Source please. Surely you have one.....

As far as my knowledge of the socio-economic landscape of the game of golf, we're not talking about the beginning of the 20th century, we're talking about the [i]end[/i] of it. In my personal experience, I started playing golf in 1957 and have played public course golf since. My dad belonged to a couple of country clubs in the 1960's, but his clubs were a whole lot less crowded than any public course I ever played. And there were always many more public courses in the areas I lived than private throughout the time I've played golf.[/quote]

Not sure I get what you're saying. What does the majority of people not being good at golf have to do with what you play and your ability?
[/quote]

I'm not the guy claiming the reason average golf scores haven't dropped in 50 years because the golf world has replaced rich guys who had lessons which offset their lousy equipment with poor guys who can't afford lessons, so, in spite of technological advances, scores haven't improved. That is your argument, right?

Or do I have that wrong?

[Nine Miler]

Marand and govols, the street lights are on, it's time to go home.

[dog flog]

[quote name='govols' timestamp='1427858189' post='11258451']
[quote name='Titleist 670' timestamp='1427857944' post='11258435'][quote name='dog flog' timestamp='1427857599' post='11258393']
Yes, you absolutely can play those clubs. With the reasonable expectation the scorecard will reflect your affection for them? Nope. It's like butter, I suppose. Some folks have a metabolism that would benefit from more of it but for most of us, our scorecard would be better off with bigger and far less buttery irons.
[/quote]

Going off topic here, but what are some irons that have the nice, clean simple look of a blade with more forgiveness?[/quote]

AP2 & J40 (DPC). I'm sure others can add more models.
[/quote]It seems that almost every maker offers the transitional GI/Players' clubs and any given model will cross the line on on side or the other. Personally, I'd look to err on the forgiving side, so I'd say something like XR Pro or JPX 850 over something like TM CB or Srixon 745.