Could a 12 handicapper....

[DeNinny]

[quote name='govols' timestamp='1427848199' post='11257071']
[quote name='Nine Miler' timestamp='1427847011' post='11256915']Is it possible that you guys are misinterpreting your own experience? I wouldn't put it past you. [/quote]

They want to play blades so bad that they will twist logic and reasoning to try and justify why they do. In the end they're free to play whatever they wanna buy.
[/quote]
And you cannot bring any personal blades experience into your own logic so you resort to mocking posts like this one.

I'm just sharing my experience to answer the OP first post myself. I don't need to justify my choices in club to a bunch of anonymous people. It's pretty straight forward for me: I can shoot my personal bests with my blades and they don't hurt my score. That's about all the logic I need.

[Exactice808]

[quote name='govols' timestamp='1427848199' post='11257071']
[quote name='Nine Miler' timestamp='1427847011' post='11256915']Is it possible that you guys are misinterpreting your own experience? I wouldn't put it past you. [/quote]

They want to play blades so bad that they will twist logic and reasoning to try and justify why they do. In the end they're free to play whatever they wanna buy.
[/quote]


What logic?

That a club manufacture came about designed a "new type" of club and stated it was Game Improvements and Super Game Improvements. And now anyone with a 10+ handicap and below should be playing with ONLY those clubs....

are you one to believe that X driver gives you 17 more yards every release..... We should all be at 400 yard drives.

Logic, that there was only 1 type of iron design for some time and that everyone played that same design. Because they had no choice.

Logic, that with all this so called technical advancement the average score for a amateur is still the same as 50 years ago. 80% of people cannot break 90's

Logic, says I have played the same sets 2 years extensively to come up with my own personal ideas.......


There is no twisted logic, just people unwilling to break free of the mold that holds you down..... let it go.... realize that its still a 4 inch by 3 inch piece of metal that hits a 2 inch ball.......

[knock it close]

I play with a pretty good player a fair bit, ex minitour guys, shot 59 last year, also our nike rep. Anyways I'm playing with him right after Rors won The Open, he had the blades back in the bag saying he wanted to try em again after Rory ran people over with them. Go out for the front nine he hacks it around shoots 33, heads back to his car after 9 grabs his PC's out of his car and says to me "I don't know why I bother, it just isn't worth it."

[DeNinny]

[quote name='govols' timestamp='1427849232' post='11257223']
[quote name='DeNinny' timestamp='1427849022' post='11257171'][quote name='Nine Miler' timestamp='1427847011' post='11256915']
Is it possible that you guys are misinterpreting your own experience? I wouldn't put it past you.
[/quote]
Is it possible you are? I've had 8 years using the same two clubs. I'm pretty confident with mine. If you ask that question you need to consider the same for yourself.

BTW nice avatar change and thank you for not mocking those you may disagree with.[/quote]

How do you have confidence in anything if you're gonna shoot anything from high 70s to mid 90s?
[/quote]
Because I'm confident that the club is not the reason for why I shot what I did.

How can you be so confident about how bad a blade is for a 12 cap, and you don't play them, and you never did as a 12? Where is the untwisted logic behind this?

[govols]

[quote name='Exactice808' timestamp='1427849482' post='11257253'][quote name='govols' timestamp='1427848199' post='11257071']
[quote name='Nine Miler' timestamp='1427847011' post='11256915']Is it possible that you guys are misinterpreting your own experience? I wouldn't put it past you. [/quote]

They want to play blades so bad that they will twist logic and reasoning to try and justify why they do. In the end they're free to play whatever they wanna buy.
[/quote]


What logic?

That a club manufacture came about designed a "new type" of club and stated it was Game Improvements and Super Game Improvements. And now anyone with a 10+ handicap and below should be playing with ONLY those clubs....

are you one to believe that X driver gives you 17 more yards every release..... We should all be at 400 yard drives.

Logic, that there was only 1 type of iron design for some time and that everyone played that same design. Because they had no choice.

Logic, that with all this so called technical advancement the average score for a amateur is still the same as 50 years ago. 80% of people cannot break 90's

Logic, says I have played the same sets 2 years extensively to come up with my own personal ideas.......


There is no twisted logic, just people unwilling to break free of the mold that holds you down..... let it go.... realize that its still a 4 inch by 3 inch piece of metal that hits a 2 inch ball.......[/quote]


More twisted "logic".

[Exactice808]

[quote name='govols' timestamp='1427849706' post='11257307']
[quote name='Exactice808' timestamp='1427849482' post='11257253'][quote name='govols' timestamp='1427848199' post='11257071']
[quote name='Nine Miler' timestamp='1427847011' post='11256915']Is it possible that you guys are misinterpreting your own experience? I wouldn't put it past you. [/quote]

They want to play blades so bad that they will twist logic and reasoning to try and justify why they do. In the end they're free to play whatever they wanna buy.
[/quote]


What logic?

That a club manufacture came about designed a "new type" of club and stated it was Game Improvements and Super Game Improvements. And now anyone with a 10+ handicap and below should be playing with ONLY those clubs....

are you one to believe that X driver gives you 17 more yards every release..... We should all be at 400 yard drives.

Logic, that there was only 1 type of iron design for some time and that everyone played that same design. Because they had no choice.

Logic, that with all this so called technical advancement the average score for a amateur is still the same as 50 years ago. 80% of people cannot break 90's

Logic, says I have played the same sets 2 years extensively to come up with my own personal ideas.......


There is no twisted logic, just people unwilling to break free of the mold that holds you down..... let it go.... realize that its still a 4 inch by 3 inch piece of metal that hits a 2 inch ball.......[/quote]


More twisted "logic".
[/quote]

Great response you have to all my post....... Not a single rebuttal not a single response just some silly weak response..... I am done with you sir as you have nothing in my opinion........

[Nine Miler]

I'm having a hard time keeping up. Y'all are quick with these responses. Everyone slow down a little so I can follow along. Lol!

[govols]

[quote name='DeNinny' timestamp='1427849702' post='11257305'][quote name='govols' timestamp='1427849232' post='11257223']
[quote name='DeNinny' timestamp='1427849022' post='11257171'][quote name='Nine Miler' timestamp='1427847011' post='11256915']
Is it possible that you guys are misinterpreting your own experience? I wouldn't put it past you.
[/quote]
Is it possible you are? I've had 8 years using the same two clubs. I'm pretty confident with mine. If you ask that question you need to consider the same for yourself.

BTW nice avatar change and thank you for not mocking those you may disagree with.[/quote]

How do you have confidence in anything if you're gonna shoot anything from high 70s to mid 90s?
[/quote]
Because I'm confident that the club is not the reason for why I shot what I did.

How can you be so confident about how bad a blade is for a 12 cap, and you don't play them, and you never did as a 12? Where is the untwisted logic behind this?[/quote]

Because I know unless I flush every shot I have no business playing them and I don't flush every shot. There's absolutely no benefit otherwise. That is undeniable yet some of you are stuck in denial. Handicap is irrelevant. It's odd that the mindset of a 12 handicap that is a less than average ball striker, that rarely pures a shot, would defend playing them where most scratch golfers that are good ball strikers with an occasional miss would find that reason enough not to.

[govols]

[quote name='Exactice808' timestamp='1427849791' post='11257319'][quote name='govols' timestamp='1427849706' post='11257307']
[quote name='Exactice808' timestamp='1427849482' post='11257253'][quote name='govols' timestamp='1427848199' post='11257071']
[quote name='Nine Miler' timestamp='1427847011' post='11256915']Is it possible that you guys are misinterpreting your own experience? I wouldn't put it past you. [/quote]

They want to play blades so bad that they will twist logic and reasoning to try and justify why they do. In the end they're free to play whatever they wanna buy.
[/quote]


What logic?

That a club manufacture came about designed a "new type" of club and stated it was Game Improvements and Super Game Improvements. And now anyone with a 10+ handicap and below should be playing with ONLY those clubs....

are you one to believe that X driver gives you 17 more yards every release..... We should all be at 400 yard drives.

Logic, that there was only 1 type of iron design for some time and that everyone played that same design. Because they had no choice.

Logic, that with all this so called technical advancement the average score for a amateur is still the same as 50 years ago. 80% of people cannot break 90's

Logic, says I have played the same sets 2 years extensively to come up with my own personal ideas.......


There is no twisted logic, just people unwilling to break free of the mold that holds you down..... let it go.... realize that its still a 4 inch by 3 inch piece of metal that hits a 2 inch ball.......[/quote]


More twisted "logic".
[/quote]

Great response you have to all my post....... Not a single rebuttal not a single response just some silly weak response..... I am done with you sir as you have nothing in my opinion........[/quote]

You said mis-hits with your blades were better that with cavities. lol

[Marand]

I guess it would be unkind to point out that a 12 handicaper is really much better than the average amatuer. Has been for 50 years now.

[tatertot]

10 pages of this?

[Nine Miler]

[quote name='Marand' timestamp='1427850276' post='11257389']
I guess it would be unkind to point out that a 12 handicaper is really much better than the average amatuer. Has been for 50 years now.
[/quote]

True, but let's not try to fool ourselves that it's anywhere close to "good." I guess if you look at all the golfers that go into those stats that say the average guy doesn't break 100, it is. But that's not really out demographic on this site, is it?

[tmanker]

[DeNinny]

[quote name='govols' timestamp='1427850046' post='11257357']
[quote name='DeNinny' timestamp='1427849702' post='11257305'][quote name='govols' timestamp='1427849232' post='11257223']
[quote name='DeNinny' timestamp='1427849022' post='11257171'][quote name='Nine Miler' timestamp='1427847011' post='11256915']
Is it possible that you guys are misinterpreting your own experience? I wouldn't put it past you.
[/quote]
Is it possible you are? I've had 8 years using the same two clubs. I'm pretty confident with mine. If you ask that question you need to consider the same for yourself.

BTW nice avatar change and thank you for not mocking those you may disagree with.[/quote]

How do you have confidence in anything if you're gonna shoot anything from high 70s to mid 90s?
[/quote]
Because I'm confident that the club is not the reason for why I shot what I did.

How can you be so confident about how bad a blade is for a 12 cap, and you don't play them, and you never did as a 12? Where is the untwisted logic behind this?[/quote]

Because I know unless I flush every shot I have no business playing them and I don't flush every shot. There's absolutely no benefit otherwise. That is undeniable yet some of you are stuck in denial. Handicap is irrelevant. It's odd that the mindset of a 12 handicap that is a less than average ball striker, that rarely pures a shot, would defend playing them where most scratch golfers that are good ball strikers with an occasional miss would find that reason enough not to.
[/quote]
LOL you "know" you have no business playing something yet you haven't even tried them. It's odd that you can have the mindset that you are totally right about something you don't have personal experience with and call folks with personal experience twisted with their logic. Odd indeed.

[govols]

If I don't hit a CB solid every time what would make me think I would a blade? That's logic. I've HIT muscle backs plenty of times I just don't game them. There's no benefit if I don't hit them dead solid every time.

[Exactice808]

[quote name='Exactice808' timestamp='1427841406' post='11256289']
I am going to try and not derail it but to educate from my perspective and my own experiences.


For me the Blade misses are actually better than the GI misses.....


[size=7][i][u][b]Again... for my game I am 2/10 Pure strikes... 9/10 Acceptable strikes.[/b][/u][/i][/size]

Lets use an easy straight forward par3

150 Yards,

I hit a 7 Iron Blade lands on green we are good

I hit a 7 iron GI same....

I thin a 7 Iron Blade it lands short but straight still straight forward.

I thin a 7 iron GI, that thing is hot and could roll off.

I Toe a 7iron Blade, still short, but generally straight might be leaking but short and playable

I Toe a 7iron GI, and that thing can be a hot screamer left, those I have stated before are those hot fliers I get out of the GI's..... cant explain it but it happens that thing goes 160+ low and fast.


etc etc etc.... while they are still good strikes the are not quite pure... but the results get masked or Enhanced



the misses on a blade while minute COULD be a better miss than a masked GI that forgives mistakes but could put you in a worse predicament.
[/quote]
[quote name='govols' timestamp='1427850139' post='11257369']
You said mis-hits with your blades were better that with cavities. lol
[/quote]

Read I said 9/10 is acceptable.... not all pure

and 1 miss hit that is probably pretty bad.... but other than that 9/10....


[quote name='govols' timestamp='1427850965' post='11257501']
If I don't hit a CB solid every time what would make me think I would a blade? That's logic. I've HIT muscle backs plenty of times I just don't game them. There's no benefit if I don't hit them dead solid every time.
[/quote]

I hit my irons pretty solid.....

I dont want to type it all over again... but....

Turf interaction, ball flight and workability [u][i][b]out weighs[/b][/i][/u] forgiveness i my book......so MBs work.... and there is benefits .... .LOGIC?..... Yes it works.... for me......

[StarFleetGolfer]

[quote name='tatertot' timestamp='1427850379' post='11257399']
10 pages of this?
[/quote]

It's only the second day. 40 pages or locked by tomorrow

[Graymulligan]

[quote name='gmangolf' timestamp='1427749218' post='11247565']
This is a long-standing debate covered in many threads with much heated argument on both sides.

The answer is basically... maybe.

I tried going to blades as a 2 handicapper and quickly went back to cavity back irons, but that's just me.
[/quote]

Exactly this. ^^^^^^^^

I took a set of blade for a spin as a 7 handicap and hated it. I'm a pretty fair ballstriker, but I don't move the ball a ton. (with my xtd forged, I play just a tiny little draw) With the blades, I didn't like the varying movement I was getting. Could I have made it work if I'd stuck with it? Probably. Would they make me a better player, or make the game more enjoyable? Nope. So I went back to a middle ground.

Play what makes you happy, what helps your game, or what looks cool when you're in the bar after a round, whatever is most important to you.

[knock it close]

The blade people are acting like anything not a blade is an SGI. The ball flight and workability between a blade and a players cb, is quite close imo

[Exactice808]

[quote name='knock it close' timestamp='1427851491' post='11257569']
The blade people are acting like anything not a blade is an SGI. The ball flight and workability between a blade and a players cb, is quite close imo
[/quote]

Yes, I did agree that with a players CB difference is like 80%..... You can move it around pretty decent.... But we are talking Burner 1.0 and MP4s...... Not Titleist CB and MB....or the MP64s & MP4s those are essentially the same club just one goes a little higher!

[govols]

Lol. Why are double digit handicapper average ball strikers concerned with workability? I just don't get it.

[Exactice808]

[quote name='govols' timestamp='1427851908' post='11257625']
Lol. Why are double digit handicapper average ball strikers concerned with workability? I just don't get it.
[/quote]

Because its a tool in the toolbox to become as efficient of a golfer as possible.......Why would you not take as much advantage of learning and becoming better at golf and become a well rounded player. Regardless what your handicap is.....


How do you get better? You learn more thing so you can get past a double digit......


when you were shooting 100, you learned to keep the ball in play.....

When you are shooting 90's you learned about your short game

when you are in the 80's you learn about ball manipulation

when you are in the 70's you learn mental control

when you are pro.... you have all of the above......

Pro's dont have just one of the above.... so why should a 12 handicapper stop learning if they know how to only hit the ball straight...... thats pretty stupid......



Its like a tennis player.... oh why do I need to learn a back hand I have the best forehand in the world.... thats just ignorant

[DeNinny]

[quote name='knock it close' timestamp='1427851491' post='11257569']
The blade people are acting like anything not a blade is an SGI. The ball flight and workability between a blade and a players cb, is quite close imo
[/quote]
I've stated that the tweener is going to perform just like a blade in workability and forgiveness. That plastic they now put in those tweeners is making the face react just like a blade. The feel will be different but the face no longer flexes as much because of the insert. Since the face is the same as a blades, you can work the ball the same and it has the same forgiveness.

If a 12 cap can play blades they can play tweeners.

I think a lot of CB folks think all CBs are the same workability and forgiveness. There were huge difference between my mp fli hi and mp60 CBs.

[knock it close]

Can someone teach me how to hit a reliable fade?

[Nessism]

[quote name='Exactice808' timestamp='1427846875' post='11256901']
[quote name='govols' timestamp='1427841710' post='11256331']
If you say so
[/quote]
[quote name='Nessism' timestamp='1427846554' post='11256855']
This sums up the discussion in it's entirety. Any reasonable person would realize that GI clubs can help a person improve their misses but you dismiss it. I've got nothing more to say to you.
[/quote]

Nessim..... Sorry not picking anything.... but.....


I just explained in detail what has happned with MY game, to explain. I think I am pretty reasonable and I put legit basic info to many threads....

Govels responded only with "If you say so" no rebuttal to TRUE on course fact......

Nessim it would be ignorant (lack of a better term) to ignore the facts that myself and DeNinny from on course experience is to deny? How can you deny what we are actually doing? You are stating DATA facts.......


SO agree to disagree but understand that FOR SOME PEOPLE NOT ALL, blades will help on misses and actually be better for a percentage of golfers? How much I have no Idea, who on Golf WRX I dont know either but I would be safe to assume that DeNInny and I are not the ONLY ones......
[/quote]

Sorry, but I just can't read all the crazy justifications people try to place on their choices. I'll go back and read yours but with regards to DeNinny, it's hopeless. The guy is comparing two clubs with almost the exact same physical properties, and yet he insists they are in different catagories. The fact that he plays better with his blades is CASE IN POINT that he's misinterpreting the information. It's completely crazy. That would be like me trying to say Ping G25's are more forgiving compared to G30's, and providing my subjective opinion and claiming my scores are better with the 25's. Any reasonable person would know I'm completely crazy if I were to make such a claim but yet we continue...

[govols]

[quote name='Exactice808' timestamp='1427852273' post='11257671'][quote name='govols' timestamp='1427851908' post='11257625']
Lol. Why are double digit handicapper average ball strikers concerned with workability? I just don't get it.
[/quote]

Because its a tool in the toolbox to become as efficient of a golfer as possible.......Why would you not take as much advantage of learning and becoming better at golf and become a well rounded player. Regardless what your handicap is.....


How do you get better? You learn more thing so you can get past a double digit......


when you were shooting 100, you learned to keep the ball in play.....

When you are shooting 90's you learned about your short game

when you are in the 80's you learn about ball manipulation

when you are in the 70's you learn mental control

when you are pro.... you have all of the above......

Pro's dont have just one of the above.... so why should a 12 handicapper stop learning if they know how to only hit the ball straight...... thats pretty stupid......[/quote]

I think most pros play their natural shot, especially with irons, unless they're hand is forced to do otherwise. If anything they may tend to shape the ball more off the tee.

[quote name='knock it close' timestamp='1427852492' post='11257701']Can someone teach me how to hit a reliable fade?[/quote]

I can't. Not with my irons anyway.

[Mr. Grumpy]

Bah! Sweetspotting within 3 in, sweetspotting within 2 in, sweetspotting within 1 in.... Which are you...

[Nine Miler]

[quote name='knock it close' timestamp='1427852492' post='11257701']
Can someone teach me how to hit a reliable fade?
[/quote]

Lol! Not me man. My shots go right to left. Even to right pins. Imagine that.

[knock it close]

[quote name='govols' timestamp='1427852562' post='11257713']
[quote name='Exactice808' timestamp='1427852273' post='11257671'][quote name='govols' timestamp='1427851908' post='11257625']
Lol. Why are double digit handicapper average ball strikers concerned with workability? I just don't get it.
[/quote]

Because its a tool in the toolbox to become as efficient of a golfer as possible.......Why would you not take as much advantage of learning and becoming better at golf and become a well rounded player. Regardless what your handicap is.....


How do you get better? You learn more thing so you can get past a double digit......


when you were shooting 100, you learned to keep the ball in play.....

When you are shooting 90's you learned about your short game

when you are in the 80's you learn about ball manipulation

when you are in the 70's you learn mental control

when you are pro.... you have all of the above......

Pro's dont have just one of the above.... so why should a 12 handicapper stop learning if they know how to only hit the ball straight...... thats pretty stupid......[/quote]

I think most pros play their natural shot, especially with irons, unless they're hand is forced to do otherwise. If anything they may tend to shape the ball more off the tee.

[quote name='knock it close' timestamp='1427852492' post='11257701']Can someone teach me how to hit a reliable fade?[/quote]

I can't. Not with my irons anyway.
[/quote] Welp, I guess I'll stick to slapping it around with a little draw

[Exactice808]

[quote name='govols' timestamp='1427852562' post='11257713']
[quote name='Exactice808' timestamp='1427852273' post='11257671'][quote name='govols' timestamp='1427851908' post='11257625']
Lol. Why are double digit handicapper average ball strikers concerned with workability? I just don't get it.
[/quote]

Because its a tool in the toolbox to become as efficient of a golfer as possible.......Why would you not take as much advantage of learning and becoming better at golf and become a well rounded player. Regardless what your handicap is.....


How do you get better? You learn more thing so you can get past a double digit......


when you were shooting 100, you learned to keep the ball in play.....

When you are shooting 90's you learned about your short game

when you are in the 80's you learn about ball manipulation

when you are in the 70's you learn mental control

when you are pro.... you have all of the above......

Pro's dont have just one of the above.... so why should a 12 handicapper stop learning if they know how to only hit the ball straight...... thats pretty stupid......[/quote]

I think most pros play their natural shot, especially with irons, [b]unless they're hand is forced to do otherwise[/b]. If anything they may tend to shape the ball more off the tee.

[/quote]

Yes so if they are forced to do so they have the available means to do so as they have practiced and put that tool in the toolbox. How hard is that to understand. You are telling me....that after you learned to hit the ball straight...... and this goes for all the scratch and + handicaps. NONE of you learned to work that ball after the fact? You just stuck with your stock shot? ONLY Stock shot.....

I think not...NO scratch / + HDCP knows how to flight the ball up or down????? These are relevant tools to the game while not widely used, the practice it so when its time to use it, they are able to perform....even at the highest level.