The Stack System

[CMCSGolf]

2 hours ago, Cameaux said:

I don't know, I'd almost rather be in your shoes @CMCSGolf  haha.  From my perspective, I feel like attempting to make contact when a ball is present (even when I'm trying to go all out on the range with no care where it ends up) adds some kind of subconscious governor on my speed, which is why my swings with a ball stay minimum ~5 mph slower than my driver swings with no ball.  My intuition would say that if you just kept with the Stack protocols, the block you have on your "no ball" swings would dissipate, and you'd then see a significant bump in your training speeds.  

I would hope you're right.  However, I'm 1 year in without a difference.  I'll probably do one more course and hope for the best.

 

My best guess on the explanation for my situation - The prospect of hitting a ball increases my intent so my muscles work harder/faster when there is a know objective that I've been training myself on for 30 years.  I've made 1000x as many swings with the ball as without trying to go fast, so I assume it's just a mental block that haven't overcome yet.

[outfitter]

Add me to the list of people that have ordered! Looking forward to seeing some results next season.

[B_of_H]

I'm on my 9th session of 18 for foundation.  I did my baseline after practicing one afternoon (outdoors).  For whatever reason I was much faster that day than I would be for the next 6 sessions.  So it would tell me I was 'making gains' but also say '-17 yards' which was kind of comical as I knew it was simply due to a fast baseline.  I considered starting over with a new baseline/program but didn't.  I've now posted 2 sessions in a row where I actually have positive yardage and speed.  (3mph/7yards). I have made a conscious decision to lengthen my swing and create a bigger turn in recent sessions. 

 

FWIW I am not only doing the stack program.  I joined a crossfit club near my house and i'm doing a mix of crossfit, yoga, and what they call 'swingfit'.  

[dcmidnight]

After doing this for a few months last winter I think I said the same thing. I'm not sure if this is a magic bullet or not, in fact, I'm not sure if its positively affecting my on course swing all that much since I don't do it during the season.

 

BUT - I'm 100% convinced its better for my body/health than doing nothing in the offseason. I'm "swinging" 3-4 days a week with a goal in mind. If I cant hit balls for a couple weeks for some reason, at least I know in that time I am still doing swing work.

 

Speed aside, I think thats an overall positive.

[Retsof2021]

Received mine tonight! Hoping to do the baseline tonight! My current driver swing speed on my bushnell launch pro is 115-118. Haven’t compared to the PRGR but will be interesting to see if it’s consistent. 

 

15% off link for those interested!! 

https://www.thestacksystem.com/checkouts/cn/c1-ef5c7c1744e4a60dd94e4c93736467c9?auto_redirect=false&discount=LXy3nqKxAfZiTtyNxyVhv65IToq1&edge_redirect=true&ew_m=f&locale=en-US&skip_shop_pay=true

[B_of_H]

16 hours ago, Retsof2021 said:

Received mine tonight! Hoping to do the baseline tonight! My current driver swing speed on my bushnell launch pro is 115-118. Haven’t compared to the PRGR but will be interesting to see if it’s consistent. 

 

15% off link for those interested!! 

https://www.thestacksystem.com/checkouts/cn/c1-ef5c7c1744e4a60dd94e4c93736467c9?auto_redirect=false&discount=LXy3nqKxAfZiTtyNxyVhv65IToq1&edge_redirect=true&ew_m=f&locale=en-US&skip_shop_pay=true

 

my advice is to make sure you understand the difference between 'full' and 'max' swings before you do it and be sure to use the same device (radar) for your baseline and sessions.  

 

I did my latest session today with a group who all use the prgr while I use a ssr.  So we set up both and there can be huge differences between the 2.  I had one that said 97 on the SSR and 114 on the prgr then 104 on the SSR/ 98 on the prgr a few swings later.  usually they were close but the prgr was consistently a mph or 2 faster.  perhaps this is due to where they are positioned?  either way if you jump between 2 different devices I could see it kind of throwing off your program.  

[PAndaemonium89]

Is it possible to do two programs at same time? Started heavy hitter but also want to do lead arm enhancer 

Edited December 14, 2023 by PAndaemonium89

[PAndaemonium89]

On 12/8/2023 at 7:23 PM, CMCSGolf said:

I would hope you're right.  However, I'm 1 year in without a difference.  I'll probably do one more course and hope for the best.

 

My best guess on the explanation for my situation - The prospect of hitting a ball increases my intent so my muscles work harder/faster when there is a know objective that I've been training myself on for 30 years.  I've made 1000x as many swings with the ball as without trying to go fast, so I assume it's just a mental block that haven't overcome yet.

you’re not the only one. I haven’t made any gains either. Did a TPI assessment and definitely had strength deficiencies, but flexibility was good. Kinda set aside the stack and focused on squats, RDLs, and box jumps based on the assessment 

[PAndaemonium89]

Also, anybody compare gains from FSS and Heavy hitter? I’m not making any gains on any program. Did FSS, Neural Drive and trying HH. 

Edited December 14, 2023 by PAndaemonium89

[dcmidnight]

Honestly, I dont love Heavy Hitter so far. I'm halfway through and its basically just four sets of max swings.

[PureStrikes54]

3 hours ago, PAndaemonium89 said:

Is it possible to do two programs at same time? Started heavy hitter but also want to do lead arm enhancer 

 

Probably not a great idea as this is mainly a central nervous system training system to get your brain used to producing higher levels of force. Running two programs would likely be too high a level of volume and might stunt your progress unless you are extremely fit and strong (well above average strength levels in the weightroom)

 

Would work on lead arm in your normal golf practice or just run a program with lead arm workouts in it instead of the stacks recommendation.

[dcmidnight]

On 12/14/2023 at 9:57 AM, dcmidnight said:

Honestly, I dont love Heavy Hitter so far. I'm halfway through and its basically just four sets of max swings.

 

OK maybe I'm an idiot because I averaged 111.2 today on TM, 112.8 max. I'll keep it up this winter LOL.

[ucdan5]

On 11/1/2021 at 9:38 AM, dillardiv said:

I'll be the token "don't buy new clubs, improve your speed and you'll benefit throughout the entire bag" guy

I mean, this makes a ton of sense and when you think about it, extremely logical… almost common sense-like for people…  you need to self-improve the other aspects of the game to really benefit from a new club and frankly, people who don’t think like this are just about the dumbest peo- {just bought a new TSR2 Driver head}…
 

wait… what were we talking about? 😂

[Jlocke22]

Few sessions left in my program and even though my 195 g speed hasn’t been progressing a bunch like previously and plateauing a bit, my weaknesses (lighter weights) have been getting better. Even the 0g weight previously I think I got up to 132 mph once. Tried it the other day and had several at 134/135 mph which was cool to see! 

[true8]

I found something interesting not sure if everyone else experienced this as well. I've done 9 sessions and went to the range today for the first time and my Ping driver felt so heavy. Debating if I should buy a lighter driver now haha.

[Jlocke22]

12 hours ago, true8 said:

I found something interesting not sure if everyone else experienced this as well. I've done 9 sessions and went to the range today for the first time and my Ping driver felt so heavy. Debating if I should buy a lighter driver now haha.

Ping is notoriously a bit heavier in head. This is an entire black hole discussion to begin with. Probably would have to do some testing and see what your tendencies shift to as far as path, impact, face, and spin. Then you would get into the whole Swing Weight debate vs Counter balance vs head weight and what works for you. 
 

Could mess with counterbalancing with butt weights or lead tape under grip to make head “feel” less heavy. CB shaft could be an option - removal of some head weight could work but mess with numbers a bit more. 
 

All I can say is Good Luck!!! Or get through the offseason a bit more and another program or two and get re-fit in the spring next year somewhere with some solid options/experience. 

[true8]

2 hours ago, Jlocke22 said:

Ping is notoriously a bit heavier in head. This is an entire black hole discussion to begin with. Probably would have to do some testing and see what your tendencies shift to as far as path, impact, face, and spin. Then you would get into the whole Swing Weight debate vs Counter balance vs head weight and what works for you. 
 

Could mess with counterbalancing with butt weights or lead tape under grip to make head “feel” less heavy. CB shaft could be an option - removal of some head weight could work but mess with numbers a bit more. 
 

All I can say is Good Luck!!! Or get through the offseason a bit more and another program or two and get re-fit in the spring next year somewhere with some solid options/experience. 

Thank you for your advice, I do plan on getting refit in the spring as I'm currently taking lessons as well. My irons are 7 years old and my swing/speed has improved massively over that time.

[Cameaux]

To that end, I listened to Sasho on a podcast recently where he discussed that, through a user's Stack data, they can tell whether a person would be a good candidate for a heavier driver head (which was a person that did not experience significant speed drop offs moving from 195g to slightly heavier training weights) vs. a person who would be more sensitive to driver head weight (a person that does have more of a drop off when increasing training weights above 195g).  I guess you could maybe figure that out yourself looking at your data, but it would be a cool feature to add to the app, to tell you what headweight/swingweight might be ideal for you to maximize speed

[Jlocke22]

21 hours ago, Cameaux said:

To that end, I listened to Sasho on a podcast recently where he discussed that, through a user's Stack data, they can tell whether a person would be a good candidate for a heavier driver head (which was a person that did not experience significant speed drop offs moving from 195g to slightly heavier training weights) vs. a person who would be more sensitive to driver head weight (a person that does have more of a drop off when increasing training weights above 195g).  I guess you could maybe figure that out yourself looking at your data, but it would be a cool feature to add to the app, to tell you what headweight/swingweight might be ideal for you to maximize speed

I heard the same thing (can’t remember which one it was though)! Would be pretty interesting to play the head weight that would be the most efficient in terms of weight, speed, and MOI in that 195-1215g range. Then just dial in launch conditions/swing weight a bit and let it fly.
 

I would assume it will eventually get to that point. With the AI behind it and PING, I’m sure it could spit out some pretty solid recommendations.

[jas0nmacisaac]

After a 2 year hiatus from speed training and pretty much golfing I am back on the stack with a goal of touching 130 chs with the driver.

 

Results have been good but harder to come by compared to when I was 36. These are all being done on a gym floor though.

 

I just started resistance band training as well (today) to increase the speed of my arms.

 

 

[Tfb003]

57 minutes ago, jas0nmacisaac said:

After a 2 year hiatus from speed training and pretty much golfing I am back on the stack with a goal of touching 130 chs with the driver.

 

Results have been good but harder to come by compared to when I was 36. These are all being done on a gym floor though.

 

I just started resistance band training as well (today) to increase the speed of my arms.

 

 

what kind of resistance band training are you going to do to speed up arms?

[jas0nmacisaac]

11 hours ago, Tfb003 said:

what kind of resistance band training are you going to do to speed up arms?

Isometric holds at the top of the backswing, halfway down and impact with as much resistance as I can possibly hold. Borden’s beginner speed program. Below is an article that he does.

 

https://www.golfwrx.com/329714/6-exercises-using-resistance-bands-for-more-distance/

[jas0nmacisaac]

On 12/7/2023 at 10:49 AM, dcmidnight said:

 

Again - I'm not an expert so take this all FWIW.

 

But for me swinging harder and swinging faster are opposites. The harder I actually tried, the worse I got. For me it was about working on a legitimate weight shift, better shoulder turn and a longer hand path.

 

Listen I think part of using the Stack is that you can experiment with what works for you and get instant feedback on radar. If you try something that bumps you up a bit - keep pushing.

 

I also now spend 10-15 minutes stretching before I start, doing some light dumbell work and making sure my shoulders are good and stretched out.

Two things I do is grip the club loose and have my wrists almost uncontrollably loose. Then I do the Colin Montgomery takeaway to get even more whip in the swing. From there, especially with light weights, I find each set I can just get one swing with an extra 5mph on a swing. Consistently obviously isn’t there but it shows the potential.

Edited December 20, 2023 by jas0nmacisaac

[bcc624]

Just got the stack. Anyone else have trouble with swinging different intent (full intent vs max intent) I feel like I’m ignoring that and only focusing on trying to put up a higher swing speed. 

Edited December 20, 2023 by bcc624

[Retsof2021]

3 sessions into Foundation. Really enjoy the app so far. I’ve tried speed training before and never caught on. I love the motivation the app gives you. 
 

Biggest issue I have is PRGR misreads.  Not sure if it’s been noted earlier on this thread but the most frustrating part is a gross misread on a swing (talking 20-30 mph).  Anyone else notice this? 
 

I’m also struggling on max vs full intent. For me, it all feels like max in order to get these numbers. For reference, 117 is very close to my real speed. I have a bushnell launch pro and typically see 115-118 cruising speed and 120-121 max effort. 
 

Results so far are below. Gains are only from getting adjusted to swinging the stack. So far I’m loving it! Hopefully results are coming!

[jas0nmacisaac]

4 hours ago, bcc624 said:

Just got the stack. Anyone else have trouble with swinging different intent (full intent vs max intent) I feel like I’m ignoring that and only focusing on trying to put up a higher swing speed. 

I go max intent all the time and I got great results. Always going max allows you to tinker with small things to increase speed by a mph or two. An example is the way John Daly spreads his right index finger apart from his middle. Somehow that added 2 mph on max intent swings.

[leegee38]

6 hours ago, Retsof2021 said:

 

Biggest issue I have is PRGR misreads.  Not sure if it’s been noted earlier on this thread but the most frustrating part is a gross misread on a swing (talking 20-30 mph).  Anyone else notice this? 

 

I was getting similar misreads at first.  What worked for me was keeping the unit about 3.5 feet behind the theoretical ball, and I raised the until about about 2 inches off the ground.  FWIW, I think you'll find someone else in this thread who said he got more accurate results by putting on the ground and farther away, so ....  ?  Putting the unit on a little box seemed to help the accuracy for me.  No more 20 mph drops.  Good luck!

 

Edited December 21, 2023 by leegee38

[Augster]

8 hours ago, bcc624 said:

Just got the stack. Anyone else have trouble with swinging different intent (full intent vs max intent) I feel like I’m ignoring that and only focusing on trying to put up a higher swing speed. 

The reason he has you go “full intent” first is so you don’t hurt yourself going max. By slowly building up the muscles, you’ll be able to swing higher weights sooner. 
 

Going max intent from the start is a good recipe to pull/tear something. 
 

What a lot of people think is their “max”, isn’t max at all. Max is max. Nothing left in the tank. 
 

Just follow the program and stay with full intent. You’ll be doing max soon enough. And, hopefully, won’t get hurt doing it. 

[mstuewe]

Doesn’t he say something like, max should be hard enough that you are almost falling over?  Whereas I consider full intent to be, you’re the 4th guy in a scramble with a carry over water 10 yards further than your typical drive.  You’re playing partners are safe and you didn’t come here to knit, so give it a full intentioned swing.

[Retsof2021]

12 hours ago, leegee38 said:

I was getting similar misreads at first.  What worked for me was keeping the unit about 3.5 feet behind the theoretical ball, and I raised the until about about 2 inches off the ground.  FWIW, I think you'll find someone else in this thread who said he got more accurate results by putting on the ground and farther away, so ....  ?  Putting the unit on a little box seemed to help the accuracy for me.  No more 20 mph drops.  Good luck!

 

Thanks for the tips.  I'll try those out.  I have it on the box now but I'm also swinging on a mat in my garage which is about 2 inches off the ground.  I've also got bright LED lights right above it, but not sure if that would affect it.