Back From First Lesson And...

[Collegefbfan]

Well, back from first lesson.  Man, it was a $h!+ show for sure.  I putted decently, I chipped halfway mediocre, and pitching was downright horrible.  Didn't even get to full swing which I thought would be the case anyway.  No big deal there.  At 3 lessons for $135, I feel this instructor is going to be $2,000 richer before I get the ball out of the tee box.  Impact with the hands in front of the ball and shaft angled slightly is going to be a major challenge.  My body and brain together don't want to let that happen yet.  Next lesson is in two weeks.

[Collegefbfan]

Anyone have drill or video of the sequence of the downswing?  Like hips, trunk , shoulders, arms?  Is that correct?  Also any tips on getting to that impact position to have hands in front of the ball?  Thanks.  I have two weeks to practice.

[glk]

So no putting or pitching practice or drills?     Did you ask to practice full swing or did instructor determine what the lesson was about?

 

I have to say unless this was preplanned with your approval, I've not seen or heard of the instructor determining the focus of the lesson - if you wanted to work on full swing then the lesson should have been full swing - and if the instructor refused then end of relationship and find a new instructor.    That said nothing wrong with doing some putting and short game but only if you were driving the bus (or setting the bus' destination), so to speak.

Edited May 27, 2021 by glk

[Collegefbfan]

He said he teaches from the hole out.  My putting was actually the best part for me.  Chipping was okay.  I let him determine the lesson as I am a beginner.  Many here said to trust him and the process.  He knows more than I do, which is so true.

We focused on grip and posture before moving on to pitching.  He really wanted to spend most of the time on point of impact in relation to the position of the body, and, man, I tell you that is one weird position.  Feels totally awkward.   I let the instructor decide the focus of the lesson because I don't really have a set swing.  In my "not worked on swing", I was handsy.  I need to find a way to uncoil and have the club meet the ball with hands past the ball.  Thanks for the reply.

[glk]

So it was agreed.  
 

Working on chipping and pitching is a good place to start.    They are more or less short version of a full swing.    Don’t involve the entire body as much nor require much shaft lean or speed

can be a good building block to be able to hit good 30 yard pitches.    

would have expected him to give you drills to practice - asking for video and tips here might get you crossed up with this instructors plans with you.   Sounds like you should follow up with him to make sure you understand what he expected you to practice for the next two weeks. 

 

[Hawkeye77]

1 hour ago, Collegefbfan said:

Anyone have drill or video of the sequence of the downswing?  Like hips, trunk , shoulders, arms?  Is that correct?  Also any tips on getting to that impact position to have hands in front of the ball?  Thanks.  I have two weeks to practice.

If you didn't deal with full swing, I wouldn't start watching random videos. No point trying to learn what he's supposed to be teaching before he does if you are having another lesson in two weeks. In this non-coach's opinion you get to proper impact with good setup and sequencing of your swing, not trying to guess at what gets you there which you would be doing just watching vids and listening to advice that may not apply to you. As a total beginner and based on the posts before the lesson and now, I'd just work on what he is telling you to work on and see what happens from there and, lol, not look to the forum to supplement, substitute for or spot check your coach.  Nobody saw your swing or knows all of what you discussed and in what context.

 

If it isn't working out you will know in a few weeks, you aren't out much and you can go from there.

Edited May 27, 2021 by Hawkeye77

[Collegefbfan]

Oh I totally agree with that.  Yes, I plan on practicing what he provided which was bring the club back at about the 9:00 position and swing through to the 3:00 position or a little above, but place a lot of emphasis on pushing off from the right foot with some hip/torso turn and having that point of impact were the hands are about the right thigh or a little past with the club shaft angled and hands in front of ball.  That last part is really tough for my brain and body to get reach that position.  It is such an odd, awkward feeling.  He said that I am using arms/hands too much.  It's like i have to get it in my head that the power is coming from the rotation and not the arms.  In all my years of watching golf, I never really noticed golfers having the club shaft angled at impact or lag or whatever and hands in front of the ball when hitting.  

[jmevox]

100% agree with the post above. I started playing last year. Watched countless videos and switched my swing every other week. Would play great then play like I’ve never swung a club before. Finally gave up and had a lesson and man did that simplify things. 
 

Going on lesson 3 now im much better and when things go wrong i have one or two swing thoughts,  not 10. Only listen to the instructor or it’s a waste of money. 

[nlk10010]

My $.02, I like that approach. I know of a few instructors (i.e. schools of thought) that teach "from the hole out". Full swing then simply builds on the putt, chip, pitch. Impact position is something I wish I'd learned a long time ago, none of my instructors bothered with it. IF you go on YT (and I agree, don't) you will see a number of videos on doing impact position first, even apart from the SP swings. To get there, from what I understand and among other things, you need to keep rotating the body. If you get the idea of rotation on the pitch shot then it hopefully carries over to the full swing.

 

The above said, if you told your instructor you wanted to work on your full swing and he insisted on this scheme, then I agree, I would be outta' there. But if you told him, either explicitly or implicitly, that there was no part of your game you were happy with well, then, I think this could be a good plan.

 

Good Luck.

[Collegefbfan]

Yeah, when we talked on the phone, I told him I was a total beginner.  I didn't really have a full swing that needed tweaked.  I needed a full swing that would be complete built from the ground up.  He also told me to be patient with the process.  He seems to be a nice guy and listens to my concerns and questions and addresses them.  I honestly think this is his way of teaching the swing, building up to the full swing with a focus on impact.

[glk]

2 hours ago, Collegefbfan said:

Oh I totally agree with that.  Yes, I plan on practicing what he provided which was bring the club back at about the 9:00 position and swing through to the 3:00 position or a little above, but place a lot of emphasis on pushing off from the right foot with some hip/torso turn and having that point of impact were the hands are about the right thigh or a little past with the club shaft angled and hands in front of ball.  That last part is really tough for my brain and body to get reach that position.  It is such an odd, awkward feeling.  He said that I am using arms/hands too much.  It's like i have to get it in my head that the power is coming from the rotation and not the arms.  In all my years of watching golf, I never really noticed golfers having the club shaft angled at impact or lag or whatever and hands in front of the ball when hitting.  

Try doing it slowly.  The brain learns new motions better at slower speeds and you can also have a better feel of what you are doing.   At full speed it is tough to train or feel much of anything especially the closer you get to impact.    The best instructors I’ve been to have all emphasized doing slow speed and build up to faster as the motion becomes more incorporated.   And hitting short pitches you don’t need a lot of speed any to hit it 30-60 yards.

[Collegefbfan]

Yeah, I like that approach.  I just feel like I need to get my body and brain on the same level that it is more of a body rotation than an outright swing.

[nlk10010]

50 minutes ago, Collegefbfan said:

Yeah, I like that approach.  I just feel like I need to get my body and brain on the same level that it is more of a body rotation than an outright swing.

 

You will hear conflicting opinions on precisely that topic. In reality it's both, but they have to occur in the right sequence, at the right time (whatever "right" is). For me, and I believe some others, I MUST think first of rotating the pelvis exclusively, or my arms and hands take over and I hit all sorts of awful shots (actually, it's a stretch to even call them shots).

 

Exercises which allow you to practice separating the turn of the hips/pelvis from the torso will help enormously.

 

Once you convince yourself that you CAN learn new things and improve I think you'll have more confidence in this process.

 

 

[acekun]

10 hours ago, Collegefbfan said:

 Yes, I plan on practicing what he provided which was bring the club back at about the 9:00 position and swing through to the 3:00 position or a little above, but place a lot of emphasis on pushing off from the right foot with some hip/torso turn and having that point of impact were the hands are about the right thigh or a little past with the club shaft angled and hands in front of ball.  

He is teaching you the full swing. You just don't know it yet. 

[Collegefbfan]

Can anyone give me a shortcut way of thinking about this movement?  Like, I teach 6th grade math.  I provide my students with strategies, tips, hints, etc. so they can remember procedures as steps and vocabulary.  Does anyone have a way to remember the process of unwinding this rotation, having hands and arms in the right position, and so forth?  Thanks for all the help.

[Collegefbfan]

36 minutes ago, acekun said:

He is teaching you the full swing. You just don't know it yet. 

Oh, I totally agree.  I kinda do know it.  Just impact position has my stuck in brain freeze mode.

Edited May 28, 2021 by Collegefbfan

[acekun]

30 minutes ago, Collegefbfan said:

Can anyone give me a shortcut way of thinking about this movement?  Like, I teach 6th grade math.  I provide my students with strategies, tips, hints, etc. so they can remember procedures as steps and vocabulary.  Does anyone have a way to remember the process of unwinding this rotation, having hands and arms in the right position, and so forth?  Thanks for all the help.

Each swing, have a single thought. Like where he told you to push off your back foot. Just practice that until you can't get it wrong (not until you get it right). Doesn't matter if you mess up every other part of the swing. Just focus on the back foot. 

 

Once you get that down, focus on something else. Like the hip turn. Practice that until you can't get it wrong. 

 

The key is not to try and remember everything at once. You can't do it -- no one can. Focus on one thing and then move to the next. 

 

Think through the progression he taught you. I would practice the swing in that order. (grip, takeaway, etc). If you get the backswing correct, it's easier to have a correct backswing (i.e., I wouldn't start with pushing off with the back foot, I was just using that as an example)

 

[iteachgolf]

47 minutes ago, Collegefbfan said:

Can anyone give me a shortcut way of thinking about this movement?  Like, I teach 6th grade math.  I provide my students with strategies, tips, hints, etc. so they can remember procedures as steps and vocabulary.  Does anyone have a way to remember the process of unwinding this rotation, having hands and arms in the right position, and so forth?  Thanks for all the help.

Reach out to your coach.  Not to strangers. Think about what he wants you to think about and only what he wants you to work on.  Biggest reason people don’t get better is poop prioritization

[MonteScheinblum]

23 minutes ago, iteachgolf said:

Reach out to your coach.  Not to strangers. Think about what he wants you to think about and only what he wants you to work on.  Biggest reason people don’t get better is poop prioritization

Freudian slip.  They prioritize $h!t.  I agree 100%

 

I agree with the non typo version as well.

Edited May 28, 2021 by MonteScheinblum