Feedback

[Negncic]

Hello, 

Today I received negative feedback from a member here. I would like that feedback removed or be given the ability to address the negative feedback. The member made an offer on an item I was selling and I accepted. I have been told other times by different members that they wanted to buy my item and never heard back so, While waiting for his payment, I accepted a different offer and politely told him the item was no longer available. He got mad and left me negative feedback. We did not have a completed transaction so I am unsure how he is able to leave any feedback at all. Is it possible for people to just randomly leave feedback with no recourse from the affected person? Is there a time limit that we should wait to receive payment before moving on? I appreciate any assistance you can provide. 
Thank you

[j4663535]

How long did you wait before accepting the other offer?

[D0ch0l1d4y]

If this timing is accurate (I'm guessing not quite, but there's always 3 sides to the story), you may have to accept the negative feedback.

 

 

At an absolute minimum, if I have a second offer on something I'm selling, I'll notify the original offer, then give the same amount of time I took to respond to the first offer.

 

So in this case it took you 10 hours to respond. Once I got another offer, I'd let the 2nd offer know that I have a deal in place, but will let them know if the original falls through. I would then immediately notify the original, accepted offer that I have another offer, and he has 10 hours to send payment.

 

If it was 10 minutes and not hours, then it's more of a judgement call on timing - but notifying both parties is always necessary.

Edited February 26 by D0ch0l1d4y
spelling

[dcmidnight]

Sellers can be completely unrealistic when it comes to expected response times - I say that not just as a mod but as someone thats probably done close to 300 transactions here. Maybe the guy was sleeping or god forbid, took some time away from the forums.

 

It looks to me like you committed to sell to Buyer 1, got antsy and then sold to Buyer 2? And Buyer 1 left the negative feedback?

 

At a bare minimum I give buyers 24 hours to pay before I PM them - and then give them time to respond. Sorry but thats just the way it is, if you want to sell on BST you have to accept that a certain % of times, buyers are going to ghost you.

 

I'm fine with the negative feedback in this case.

 

[zip7111]

15 minutes ago, dcmidnight said:

Sellers can be completely unrealistic when it comes to expected response times - I say that not just as a mod but as someone thats probably done close to 300 transactions here. Maybe the guy was sleeping or god forbid, took some time away from the forums.

 

It looks to me like you committed to sell to Buyer 1, got antsy and then sold to Buyer 2? And Buyer 1 left the negative feedback?

 

At a bare minimum I give buyers 24 hours to pay before I PM them - and then give them time to respond. Sorry but thats just the way it is, if you want to sell on BST you have to accept that a certain % of times, buyers are going to ghost you.

 

I'm fine with the negative feedback in this case.

 

How can a negative feedback be given when no money exchanged hands?  Yes, losing out on the clubs sucks but it happens.  No way would I give someone 24 hours to respond.  If money was never sent, a deal never happened, thus no feedback.

Edited February 26 by zip7111

[dcmidnight]

2 minutes ago, zip7111 said:

How can a negative feedback be given when no money exchanged hands?  Yes, losing out on the clubs sucks but it happens.  No way do I give someone 24 hours to respond.  If money was never sent, a deal never happened.

 

If you have a sller who is constantly accepting offers then turning around and selling to other people because - maybe - they got a better offer from the second buyer, buyers absolutely have a right to know that.

 

Just my opinion.

Edited February 26 by dcmidnight

[jacob7071]

When I have something for sale, first one to pay gets it.  I won't refuse to accept payment from the 2nd offeror when all I have from the first guy is an agreement to pay at some undetermined time in the future.  

[Anser3]

22 minutes ago, zip7111 said:

How can a negative feedback be given when no money exchanged hands?  Yes, losing out on the clubs sucks but it happens.  No way would I give someone 24 hours to respond.  If money was never sent, a deal never happened, thus no feedback.

 

You wouldn't give somebody 24 hours to respond?  Not everybody is logged on here 24 hours a day constantly checking messages.  Including me.  I am not mastered by this site.   Once you received a second offer, you should have notified the first potential buyer that you have another offer pending and that he has 12 hours, 24 hours, whatever to pay.  You also have an obligation to notify the second potential buyer that there is a pending sale already.  If it falls through, Buyer 2 gets the option.  If the buyere said  "let me think on it", then no agreement is in place and that is another matter. 

 

  Once a person says they will take an item, I take that as an agreement.  They have my word the item is theirs assuming payment is made within a reasonable amount of time  (sometimes this requires a follow-up message to them).  If payment is not made within that timeframe, the deal is off.  I sold items yesterday and was in contact with my buyers prior to and after payment.  I had a several-hour window I was going to be unavailable and told both buyers that (Sundays are family time after church. I'm not disrupting that by constantly checking golfwrx messages).   I understand you want to move your items.  Courtesy goes a long way.   And I get it.  getting ghosted by a potential buyer stinks.  But it goes with selling on here (ebay is far worse for tire kickers). 

 

I have zero problem with the negative feedback you received. 

Edited February 26 by Anser3

[Anser3]

36 minutes ago, dcmidnight said:

Sellers can be completely unrealistic when it comes to expected response times - I say that not just as a mod but as someone thats probably done close to 300 transactions here. Maybe the guy was sleeping or god forbid, took some time away from the forums.

 

It looks to me like you committed to sell to Buyer 1, got antsy and then sold to Buyer 2? And Buyer 1 left the negative feedback?

 

At a bare minimum I give buyers 24 hours to pay before I PM them - and then give them time to respond. Sorry but thats just the way it is, if you want to sell on BST you have to accept that a certain % of times, buyers are going to ghost you.

 

I'm fine with the negative feedback in this case.

 

 

 

Thank you for this.

[zip7111]

2 minutes ago, Anser3 said:

 

You wouldn't give somebody 24 hours to respond?  Not everybody is logged on here 24 hours a day constantly checking messages.  Including me.  I am not mastered by this site.   Once you received a second offer, you should have notified the first potential buyer that you have another offer pending and that he has 12 hours, 24 hours, whatever to pay.  You also have an obligation to notify the second potential buyer that there is a pending sale already.  If it falls through, Buyer 2 gets the option.  If the buyere said  "let me think on it", then no agreement is in place and that is another matter. 

 

I appreciate your input and graciousness, but you are certainly in the minority.  I cant count how many BST ads I see that say "first to pay gets the item."  If someone has money ready and can pay, I am not waiting on someone else that needs 24 hours.  I have had way too many people disappear without even a courtesy message saying they changed their mind.

[Anser3]

2 minutes ago, zip7111 said:

I appreciate your input and graciousness, but you are certainly in the minority.  I cant count how many BST ads I see that say "first to pay gets the item."  If someone has money ready and can pay, I am not waiting on someone else that needs 24 hours.  I have had way too many people disappear without even a courtesy message saying they changed their mind.

 

Yes, folks who change their minds without notifying you are annoying. 

[Neo1]

48 minutes ago, dcmidnight said:

Sellers can be completely unrealistic when it comes to expected response times - I say that not just as a mod but as someone thats probably done close to 300 transactions here. Maybe the guy was sleeping or god forbid, took some time away from the forums.

 

It looks to me like you committed to sell to Buyer 1, got antsy and then sold to Buyer 2? And Buyer 1 left the negative feedback?

 

At a bare minimum I give buyers 24 hours to pay before I PM them - and then give them time to respond. Sorry but thats just the way it is, if you want to sell on BST you have to accept that a certain % of times, buyers are going to ghost you.

 

I'm fine with the negative feedback in this case.

 

 

IMHO I don't think that's right...if money never exchanged hands what are we leaving feedback for? verbal agreements? intent? interest shown? I agree with you there should be a reasonable amount of time before a seller moves on but 24hrs is beyond that time. more like 4 to 6 hrs after buyer says they commit I'll move on....true story one time I listed some balls for sale and a buyer agreed to buy the item, 2 hrs later he pm'd me saying "hey sorry to be that guy, but I just realized these balls aren't comparable to ProV1X's I like" I replied "ok no problem, but it's ironic because they're exactly like a ProV1X etc..." he says ok I'll take them than and pays me another 2hrs later apologizing for the delay....I check PayPal and he shorted me $10 from our agreed price...I msg back you shorted me $10 and he goes ok I'll pay you in a few hrs when I'm back home...needless to say I refunded him and sold the balls to someone else who was patiently waiting...so by your logic does he leave me a negative for not selling to him and do I leave him a negative as well for backing out of the deal and then jumping back in just to short me $???

Edited February 26 by golf_junkie_85

[Anser3]

2 minutes ago, golf_junkie_85 said:

 

IMHO I don't think that's right...if money never exchanged hands what are we leaving feedback for? verbal agreements? intent? interest shown? I agree with you there should be a reasonable amount of time before a seller moves on but 24hrs is beyond that time. more like 4 to 6 hrs after buyer says they commit I'll move on....true story one time I listed some balls for sale and a buyer agreed to buy the item, 2 hrs later he pm'd me saying "hey sorry to be that guy, but I just realized these balls aren't comparable to ProV1X's I like" I replied "ok no problem, but it's ironic because they're exactly like a ProV1X etc..." he says ok I'll take them than and pays me another 2hrs later apologizing for the delay....I check PayPal and he shorted me $10 from our agreed price...I msg back you shorted me $10 and he goes ok I'll pay you in a few hrs when I'm back home...needless to say I refunded him and sold the balls to someone else who was patiently waiting...so by your logic does he leave me a negative for not selling to him and do I leave him a negative as well for backing out of the deal and then backing back in just to short me $???

 

 

Negative feedback for the buyer was warranted.  He underpaid what you agreed.   Buyers also have an obligation to be up front if they make an agreement to pay and cannot pay right away.  Communication is necessary on both ends. 

[Neo1]

 

19 minutes ago, Anser3 said:

 

You wouldn't give somebody 24 hours to respond?  Not everybody is logged on here 24 hours a day constantly checking messages.  Including me.  I am not mastered by this site.   Once you received a second offer, you should have notified the first potential buyer that you have another offer pending and that he has 12 hours, 24 hours, whatever to pay.  You also have an obligation to notify the second potential buyer that there is a pending sale already.  If it falls through, Buyer 2 gets the option.  If the buyere said  "let me think on it", then no agreement is in place and that is another matter. 

 

  Once a person says they will take an item, I take that as an agreement.  They have my word the item is theirs assuming payment is made within a reasonable amount of time  (sometimes this requires a follow-up message to them).  If payment is not made within that timeframe, the deal is off.  I sold items yesterday and was in contact with my buyers prior to and after payment.  I had a several-hour window I was going to be unavailable and told both buyers that (Sundays are family time after church. I'm not disrupting that by constantly checking golfwrx messages).   I understand you want to move your items.  Courtesy goes a long way.   And I get it.  getting ghosted by a potential buyer stinks.  But it goes with selling on here (ebay is far worse for tire kickers). 

 

I have zero problem with the negative feedback you received. 

 

buyers can take the time to log on to WRX, check out the classifieds and go back and forth with pm's with the seller but once committed to pay they should have 24hrs to do so?? sorry that's just abusive to the seller to adhere by those standards...just like it's wrong for a seller to take a week to ship out your clubs. 

[dcmidnight]

5 minutes ago, golf_junkie_85 said:

 

 

buyers can take the time to log on to WRX, check out the classifieds and go back and forth with pm's with the seller but once committed to pay they should have 24hrs to do so?? sorry that's just abusive to the seller to adhere by those standards...just like it's wrong for a seller to take a week to ship out your clubs. 

 

Sorry but yes, there is a reasonable amount of time that is OK. Abusive to the seller is...a stretch.

 

If I agree to buy something and I send the seller a PM agreeing to buy something at their set price - if they are not online then yes, there should be some time allowed. People sleep. People have jobs and families.

 

If it was up to me, we'd use feedback way more than we do. I cant tell you how many disputes we try to mediate and the result is that there were underlying issues everyone would have known if feedback was used more liberally.

Edited February 26 by dcmidnight

[LPSISCO]

DC, there seems to be a disconnect between how sellers are treated and how buyers are historically treated. I have heard over and over that a seller can’t leave negative feedback for a buyer who says “I’ll take it” then vanishes, because money didn’t change hands. OK.

 

But then, how does this seller get a negative because he agreed to a deal then pulled out of it before money changed hands?

 

Personally, I’m fine with a negative in either case. But it can’t be “money didn’t change hands” is the requirement for the buyer but not the seller.

Edited February 26 by LPSISCO

[dcmidnight]

If you have specific transactions you are concerned with, you can always report them for further review.

[LPSISCO]

I don’t have a specific transaction in mind, just the general “rule” that one can’t leave negative feedback for a member who agreed to buy something and then vanished. But perhaps that has changed. 

[dcmidnight]

To me - in my opinion - these are two very different things.

 

1 - Buyer says I'll take it, ghosts seller, doesnt respond to PMs. This happens all the time. If its me and I know the buyer has been online, I PM them telling them they have another say 12 hours to pay or I'm moving on. I move on.

 

2 - Seller agrees to sell to a buyer at a set price. While waiting on payment - assuming its a reasonable amount of time - seller turns around and sells it to another buyer. I cant tell you how many disputes we've had where the seller has sold to Buyer 2 for a higher price and makes up some excuse as to why.

 

So I do not see these as equally "bad". #1 is part of the deal of selling on BST.

 

Again - in my opinion.

 

I'm cutting myself off here, dont want to derail the thread.

[Neo1]

16 minutes ago, dcmidnight said:

 

Sorry but yes, there is a reasonable amount of time that is OK. Abusive to the seller is...a stretch.

 

If I agree to buy something and I send the seller a PM agreeing to buy something at their set price - if they are not online then yes, there should be some time allowed. People sleep. People have jobs and families.

 

If it was up to me, we'd use feedback way more than we do. I cant tell you how many disputes we try to mediate and the result is that there were underlying issues everyone would have known if feedback was used more liberally.

 

No stretch, different definitions....Abusive = Not Fairly Treated

 

the sleeping part I understand, our time zones are usually set apart 3 hrs max, if a buyer says they'll buy something and the seller is sleeping it's understandable. what's not understandable is when the buyer says they'll take it at midnight and I respond literally minutes later and they reply back "I'll send payment in the morning" most often than not that's a tire kicker and I won't see payment...jobs and families don't get in the way of a potential buyer window shopping but jobs and families can get in the way of sending a digital payment that takes less than a minute? that's the definition of  "you can't have your cake and eat it too"

 

 

 

 

[dcmidnight]

You have a free website where it is free for you to post items for sale to 100s of thousands of members and sell to them without a fee of any kind.

 

Please save your "abusive" talk for something else.

[LPSISCO]

I understand what you are saying. For me, either both offenses can trigger a negative or neither can. I would opt for both can trigger a negative - as you say, the vanishing buyer happens all the time. But as I like to say about parenting….you get the behavior you allow….

 

I bet it would not happen nearly as often if the vanishing buyer got a negative, because then people wouldn’t sell to them 🤷🏻‍♂️

[dcmidnight]

Locking this up. OP you have any questions, feel free to reach out to gwrxmod or myself directly and I'll be happy to help you out.