Mizuno isn't JDM?

[Bad9]

I don't have much knowledge on this subject but can never understand the correlation that gets made from Katana to forged golf club. As I understand it the Katana was made by hand forging with a hammer, multiple layers of differnet types of steel to form a strong, flexible blade. How this equates to a forged golf club which is hit 2-5 times by a mechanical press is beyond me.

[Arafel]

[quote name='Bad9' timestamp='1418324809' post='10579297']
I don't have much knowledge on this subject but can never understand the correlation that gets made from Katana to forged golf club. As I understand it the Katana was made by hand forging with a hammer, multiple layers of differnet types of steel to form a strong, flexible blade. How this equates to a forged golf club which is hit 2-5 times by a mechanical press is beyond me.
[/quote]

It doesn't. That's one of the romanticized parts so many of us start rolling our eyes about.

[HiSpeed48]

One thing I like about most JDM clubs is the fact that they usually don't care much about manufacturing costs, instead they focus on building the best product and charge what they want. Most USDM manufacturers are very focused on profit, and I think that's why we're beginning to see them drop the ball on some of their designs. Callaway is a good example, the finishes on their Apex line of irons was terrible. I bet they saved some money using that finish instead of a normal brushed chrome finish. This is just my opinion from my observations over the last few years, ymmv.

[jholz]

One of the things that I think people often overlook in this debate is the clear difference between the markets for golf clubs in Japan and the United States. While in the U.S. golf has been marketed as an "everyman" sport, this is not the case in many Asian countries. As a result, golf equipment is marketed to a different and much more affluent segment of society in Japan, and thus the product must appeal to that demographic. In part this marketing might stress quality and craftsmanship, but it also uses exclusivity and prestige as a major theme as well. Thus, JDM may in many cases actually provide higher quality, but what they want more than anything is to promote the idea that what they are selling is somehow different and exclusive. This is why OEMs that sell to the global market have to offer specific models to the Japanese (if not wider Asian market) that differ from their global (or U.S.) product.

[Jamboy72]

[quote name='jholz' timestamp='1418325399' post='10579341']
One of the things that I think people often overlook in this debate is the clear difference between the markets for golf clubs in Japan and the United States. While in the U.S. golf has been marketed as an "everyman" sport, this is not the case in many Asian countries. As a result, golf equipment is marketed to a different and much more affluent segment of society in Japan, and thus the product must appeal to that demographic. In part this marketing might stress quality and craftsmanship, but it also uses exclusivity and prestige as a major theme as well. Thus, JDM may in many cases actually provide higher quality, but what they want more than anything is to promote the idea that what they are selling is somehow different and exclusive. This is why OEMs that sell to the global market have to offer specific models to the Japanese (if not wider Asian market) that differ from their global (or U.S.) product.
[/quote]

And to this point, IMO....you really need to understand the role golf and it's impact on social standing plays in Japanese culture -

[Bad9]

So do the JDM buyers equate a forged golf club to the notion of a master Katana maker pounding away by hand on a red hot chunk of metal as happens here at times?

[Soloman1]

[quote name='Jamboy72' timestamp='1418325985' post='10579377']
[quote name='jholz' timestamp='1418325399' post='10579341']
One of the things that I think people often overlook in this debate is the clear difference between the markets for golf clubs in Japan and the United States. While in the U.S. golf has been marketed as an "everyman" sport, this is not the case in many Asian countries. As a result, golf equipment is marketed to a different and much more affluent segment of society in Japan, and thus the product must appeal to that demographic. In part this marketing might stress quality and craftsmanship, but it also uses exclusivity and prestige as a major theme as well. Thus, JDM may in many cases actually provide higher quality, but what they want more than anything is to promote the idea that what they are selling is somehow different and exclusive. This is why OEMs that sell to the global market have to offer specific models to the Japanese (if not wider Asian market) that differ from their global (or U.S.) product.
[/quote]

And to this point, IMO....you really need to understand the role golf and it's impact on social standing plays in Japanese culture -
[/quote]

Please tell us about that role and its impact.

[Jamboy72]

[quote name='Soloman1' timestamp='1418327842' post='10579559']
[quote name='Jamboy72' timestamp='1418325985' post='10579377']
[quote name='jholz' timestamp='1418325399' post='10579341']
One of the things that I think people often overlook in this debate is the clear difference between the markets for golf clubs in Japan and the United States. While in the U.S. golf has been marketed as an "everyman" sport, this is not the case in many Asian countries. As a result, golf equipment is marketed to a different and much more affluent segment of society in Japan, and thus the product must appeal to that demographic. In part this marketing might stress quality and craftsmanship, but it also uses exclusivity and prestige as a major theme as well. Thus, JDM may in many cases actually provide higher quality, but what they want more than anything is to promote the idea that what they are selling is somehow different and exclusive. This is why OEMs that sell to the global market have to offer specific models to the Japanese (if not wider Asian market) that differ from their global (or U.S.) product.
[/quote]

And to this point, IMO....you really need to understand the role golf and it's impact on social standing plays in Japanese culture -
[/quote]

Please tell us about that role and its impact.
[/quote]

I'd invite you to do your own research and dig a bit deeper, but the crux of the matter is that the type of clubs one has (and the expense therein) is in part a status symbol - When you start purchasing items more for their form than their function, you really start to bifurcate the conversation and elevate the importance of perception...sometimes at the expense of performance...

[jholz]

[quote name='Soloman1' timestamp='1418327842' post='10579559']
[quote name='Jamboy72' timestamp='1418325985' post='10579377']
[quote name='jholz' timestamp='1418325399' post='10579341']
One of the things that I think people often overlook in this debate is the clear difference between the markets for golf clubs in Japan and the United States. While in the U.S. golf has been marketed as an "everyman" sport, this is not the case in many Asian countries. As a result, golf equipment is marketed to a different and much more affluent segment of society in Japan, and thus the product must appeal to that demographic. In part this marketing might stress quality and craftsmanship, but it also uses exclusivity and prestige as a major theme as well. Thus, JDM may in many cases actually provide higher quality, but what they want more than anything is to promote the idea that what they are selling is somehow different and exclusive. This is why OEMs that sell to the global market have to offer specific models to the Japanese (if not wider Asian market) that differ from their global (or U.S.) product.
[/quote]

And to this point, IMO....you really need to understand the role golf and it's impact on social standing plays in Japanese culture -
[/quote]

Please tell us about that role and its impact.
[/quote]

I am not sure what Jamboy is precisely speaking to, but golf is very certainly an upper class pastime in Japan and other Asian countries. As a result, in the Japanese market, OEMs market themselves the way Rolex, Maybach, and other high roller items are marketed while at the same time charging higher relative prices for their goods. Now the people who buy these things will always tell you they are expensive and coveted because of the craftsmanship that goes into them, but at least part of their appeal is the fact that ownership signifies affluence. Specific JDMs will accentuate one side of this marketing puzzle to a greater degree - Miura obviously goes with craftsmanship while Maruman accentuates affluence - but at the end of the day, one can't deny the fact that owning golf clubs in Japanese culture signifies wealth and social prestige. All OEMs must appeal to that idea (to one degree or another) in order to sell equipment in the Asian market.

[Soloman1]

[quote name='Jamboy72' timestamp='1418329843' post='10579705']
[quote name='Soloman1' timestamp='1418327842' post='10579559']
[quote name='Jamboy72' timestamp='1418325985' post='10579377']
[quote name='jholz' timestamp='1418325399' post='10579341']
One of the things that I think people often overlook in this debate is the clear difference between the markets for golf clubs in Japan and the United States. While in the U.S. golf has been marketed as an "everyman" sport, this is not the case in many Asian countries. As a result, golf equipment is marketed to a different and much more affluent segment of society in Japan, and thus the product must appeal to that demographic. In part this marketing might stress quality and craftsmanship, but it also uses exclusivity and prestige as a major theme as well. Thus, JDM may in many cases actually provide higher quality, but what they want more than anything is to promote the idea that what they are selling is somehow different and exclusive. This is why OEMs that sell to the global market have to offer specific models to the Japanese (if not wider Asian market) that differ from their global (or U.S.) product.
[/quote]

And to this point, IMO....you really need to understand the role golf and it's impact on social standing plays in Japanese culture -
[/quote]

Please tell us about that role and its impact.
[/quote]

I'd invite you to do your own research and dig a bit deeper, but the crux of the matter is that the type of clubs one has (and the expense therein) is in part a status symbol - When you start purchasing items more for their form than their function, you really start to bifurcate the conversation and elevate the importance of perception...sometimes at the expense of performance...
[/quote]

I'm in the golf business and have lived in Japan for the last 22 years.

You have no idea what you're talking about.

[jholz]

[quote name='Soloman1' timestamp='1418336713' post='10580257']
[quote name='Jamboy72' timestamp='1418329843' post='10579705']
[quote name='Soloman1' timestamp='1418327842' post='10579559']
[quote name='Jamboy72' timestamp='1418325985' post='10579377']
[quote name='jholz' timestamp='1418325399' post='10579341']
One of the things that I think people often overlook in this debate is the clear difference between the markets for golf clubs in Japan and the United States. While in the U.S. golf has been marketed as an "everyman" sport, this is not the case in many Asian countries. As a result, golf equipment is marketed to a different and much more affluent segment of society in Japan, and thus the product must appeal to that demographic. In part this marketing might stress quality and craftsmanship, but it also uses exclusivity and prestige as a major theme as well. Thus, JDM may in many cases actually provide higher quality, but what they want more than anything is to promote the idea that what they are selling is somehow different and exclusive. This is why OEMs that sell to the global market have to offer specific models to the Japanese (if not wider Asian market) that differ from their global (or U.S.) product.
[/quote]

And to this point, IMO....you really need to understand the role golf and it's impact on social standing plays in Japanese culture -
[/quote]

Please tell us about that role and its impact.
[/quote]

I'd invite you to do your own research and dig a bit deeper, but the crux of the matter is that the type of clubs one has (and the expense therein) is in part a status symbol - When you start purchasing items more for their form than their function, you really start to bifurcate the conversation and elevate the importance of perception...sometimes at the expense of performance...
[/quote]

I'm in the golf business and have lived in Japan for the last 22 years.

You have no idea what you're talking about.
[/quote]

Then please, educate us. I would love to know more about it.

[T.Beau]

[quote name='Soloman1' timestamp='1418336713' post='10580257']
[quote name='Jamboy72' timestamp='1418329843' post='10579705']
[quote name='Soloman1' timestamp='1418327842' post='10579559']
[quote name='Jamboy72' timestamp='1418325985' post='10579377']
[quote name='jholz' timestamp='1418325399' post='10579341']
One of the things that I think people often overlook in this debate is the clear difference between the markets for golf clubs in Japan and the United States. While in the U.S. golf has been marketed as an "everyman" sport, this is not the case in many Asian countries. As a result, golf equipment is marketed to a different and much more affluent segment of society in Japan, and thus the product must appeal to that demographic. In part this marketing might stress quality and craftsmanship, but it also uses exclusivity and prestige as a major theme as well. Thus, JDM may in many cases actually provide higher quality, but what they want more than anything is to promote the idea that what they are selling is somehow different and exclusive. This is why OEMs that sell to the global market have to offer specific models to the Japanese (if not wider Asian market) that differ from their global (or U.S.) product.
[/quote]

And to this point, IMO....you really need to understand the role golf and it's impact on social standing plays in Japanese culture -
[/quote]

Please tell us about that role and its impact.
[/quote]

I'd invite you to do your own research and dig a bit deeper, but the crux of the matter is that the type of clubs one has (and the expense therein) is in part a status symbol - When you start purchasing items more for their form than their function, you really start to bifurcate the conversation and elevate the importance of perception...sometimes at the expense of performance...
[/quote]

I'm in the golf business and have lived in Japan for the last 22 years.

You have no idea what you're talking about.
[/quote]

not to put words in the guys mouth, but what i believe he is saying is that folks buy golf clubs (irons) for more than one reason...at least in the US.
one reason being max performance for their game/level
another being for the perception of status (as someone else said)/being a poser/elitism/snobbery/etc.
often the above two reasons do not seem to combine

things kind of break down around here when how a club looks or the perceived status of owning the club trumps the performance of the club

guess you are saying folks dont invest in golf gear in Japan for status reasons

[xxio]

I've said it before I'll say it again I buy JDM gear, Bettinardi putters and wedges, and nice golf bags-shoes because I like a little bling. I like to have something noone else has, I do try to get the best deals. It may make me a snob but I like appreciate nice things once in awhile. Resale doesn't matter much to me so no worries about devaluation/investment.

Nothing wrong with that, nothing wrong with admitting it either.

[dunn]

Mizuno is probably the biggest JDM Co not credited for being JDM.....Most of JDM clubs aren't even made in Japan anymore.....

Mizuno is japanese, made and sold in japan but not JDM, LOL.....whateves

I bet if they spent $2500 on a set of mp4 they would be calling em JDM

it's based on cost now.....if you didn't spend 2k on your irons than doesn't qualify....haha

Its a snob thing 4 sure...

[Shambles]

[quote name='dunn' timestamp='1418347076' post='10580935']
Mizuno is probably the biggest JDM Co not credited for being JDM.....Most of JDM clubs aren't even made in Japan anymore.....

Mizuno is japanese, made and sold in japan but not JDM, LOL.....whateves

I bet if they spent $2500 on a set of mp4 they would be calling em JDM

it's based on cost now.....if you didn't spend 2k on your irons than doesn't qualify....haha

Its a snob thing 4 sure...
[/quote]

Mystique is not to be underestimated. It makes a tremendous difference in marketing any product. Likewise, JDM is not a snob thing even if you take it to the extreme of demanding that it be made by a wizened Japanese craftsman who only produces what his hands can make. Wealthy people do not become wealthy, some, in any case, except by seeing more than the common run. Their best also have the characteristic of spending wisely, not blindly, regardless that they are not afraid to spend. With ten sets in my current inventory, I have not been wise.

Personally, I have never seen or tried a Mizuno that I didn't like regardless that I doubt I'll be spending any money for that product. A friend blasted out of a sand trap and found himself gifted with a rice grain sized chip off the face of his sand wedge. Metal that soft should not be allowed on a golf club. I decided that I did not want one and he happily went off to buy two more. Different people.

There really is a reason to patronize JDM products. Back in the 70's and into the 80's, the Japanese Yen had become so valuable and so taxed that Japanese became world travelers acquiring Japanese products in places like Hong Kong, Los Angeles and New York, almost any country they arrived at, rather than buying those same products in Japan. They left Japan with empty suitcases and filled them abroad with Japanese products because those very same products cost less in New York than they did in Tokyo. Apparently the heavy taxes in Japan were not imposed on their export products. Japanese manufacturers were not able to persuade their government to lower their local taxes so they resorted to releasing their latest and most advanced products only for domestic consumption for at least a year or two, if only to protect their domestic market from being stolen by cheaper imports. I do not know if Japan continues to enforce those marketing policies but the habit and mystique of getting the latest and greatest of Japan does help the marketing of JDM even to markets they were not intended for. The trick is to pay enough attention to identify the latest and greatest and be willing to pay the high cost.



Shambles

[Jamboy72]

[quote name='Soloman1' timestamp='1418336713' post='10580257']
[quote name='Jamboy72' timestamp='1418329843' post='10579705']
[quote name='Soloman1' timestamp='1418327842' post='10579559']
[quote name='Jamboy72' timestamp='1418325985' post='10579377']
[quote name='jholz' timestamp='1418325399' post='10579341']
One of the things that I think people often overlook in this debate is the clear difference between the markets for golf clubs in Japan and the United States. While in the U.S. golf has been marketed as an "everyman" sport, this is not the case in many Asian countries. As a result, golf equipment is marketed to a different and much more affluent segment of society in Japan, and thus the product must appeal to that demographic. In part this marketing might stress quality and craftsmanship, but it also uses exclusivity and prestige as a major theme as well. Thus, JDM may in many cases actually provide higher quality, but what they want more than anything is to promote the idea that what they are selling is somehow different and exclusive. This is why OEMs that sell to the global market have to offer specific models to the Japanese (if not wider Asian market) that differ from their global (or U.S.) product.
[/quote]

And to this point, IMO....you really need to understand the role golf and it's impact on social standing plays in Japanese culture -
[/quote]

Please tell us about that role and its impact.
[/quote]

I'd invite you to do your own research and dig a bit deeper, but the crux of the matter is that the type of clubs one has (and the expense therein) is in part a status symbol - When you start purchasing items more for their form than their function, you really start to bifurcate the conversation and elevate the importance of perception...sometimes at the expense of performance...
[/quote]

I'm in the golf business and have lived in Japan for the last 22 years.

You have no idea what you're talking about.
[/quote]

Is that so? I live right next door to two Japanese families, both of which would refute your statement. Does that mean you have no idea what you're talking about? If you're the authority on all of this JDM stuff, then please enlighten us.

[Nessism]

I worked for a Japanese company for 21 years and traveled there a number of times. In my experience internationally known name branded goods are VERY popular in Japan. Expensive goods are a status symbol as well. When Japanese visitors would come on a trip to the US a LOT of them wanted to hit places like Tiffany's and the like for a momento. They had no problem paying exorbitant prices for high status good. I can't imagine golf clubs are any different.

[SatelliteGuy]

I like carrots.

[Shambles]

[quote name='SatelliteGuy' timestamp='1418356539' post='10581629']
I like carrots.



[/quote]

Me too.



Shambles

[jholz]

[quote name='Shambles' timestamp='1418356981' post='10581661']
[quote name='SatelliteGuy' timestamp='1418356539' post='10581629']
I like carrots.



[/quote]

Me too.

Shambles
[/quote]

The Japanese like daikon radishes and they look a lot like carrots except they are white instead of orange. They are also willing to pay a premium price for such exotic, high performance, tubers.

[SatelliteGuy]

Soooooo....

I like JDM Carrots?

[golfnutjp]

[quote name='T.Beau' timestamp='1418251252' post='10574633']
[quote name='golfnutjp' timestamp='1418230694' post='10572601'][list]
[*]Japanese forging head history is not older than USA forging head. Power Built, Wilson sports Macgreagor they started around 1890. I have products catalog.
[*]USA forging house stop their production around 1982. I was selling forging head to Japan then.
[*]Mizuno Golf started 1933 for golf products but it was not Iron heads.
[*]The most golf Iron clubs were imported from USA before 1980 .
[*]Miura Golf established 1977. They have 30employee today( from his website) I have met Miura family at PGA show Florida.
[/list]
I would like to say JDM products are As T.Beau. said there are master craftsmen involved with the best forgings in small company.
Working in golf industry, Golf club head division is very small company, (10~100worker) and some time their golf business is side business.
Even Mizuno golf made a team for JDM products with 8~10 certified craft man.

The reason of company locations are KOBE steel, NIppon steel such big Iron Factory with monster furnace, and finest material availability.
In Japanese Industrial high school, Casting and Forging class and mandatory subject class for student. They become craft man and engineer I Japan.
[/quote]

you are providing the forum with good information. acknowledged and appreciated.

i am wondering if these small premium forging houses use modern high end equipment like CAD and CNC milling, and if they employ design engineers?

or if they are more about making a pleasing looking iron with very tight tolerances? thanks
[/quote]

Hi..

Small forging house do not have capability to use CAD an CNC machine, They are craftman. The customer of forging house provide Drawing and design, some time Die and Master equipment.

Experienced craft man with many years. He have capability to make club head' shape with detailed curbs without deep buffing.
Human's capability is better than any super machine. This is the reason that Japanese craftman win SKILL Olympic. The most of gold medals are occupied by Japanese Craftman using, Hand grinding, rathemachine, Speed and accuracy. The master hard die tool for cellphone is good example that Only Japanese craft man can make it. If Japan don't have these craft man, we did not have smart phone today. This is Japanese calture.. Human's hand is incredible.. I am witness as Quality Assurance working with USA milspec 38510..

Thanks.

[golfnutjp]

[quote name='xxio' timestamp='1418211206' post='10571449']
Your Japanese history is much appreciated. So are you saying only those products of the small makers are JDM?

Personally I would not because the term JDM is also used in the car tuning as well as other industries. I don't think those car parts were forged by these same people.

There was an informative post by Shambles on how the culture of JDM came to be based on an economic standpoint.

Can provide us your opinion about Mizuno products that are available in both Japan and International markets? Would you consider those MP 33s, MP 32s, MP 60s, MP 58s.... and so on as JDM products? Even the MX23 regardless of it's construction.
[/quote]

HI.

I think the criteria of JDM must be specified. Actually The word of JDM is very new to me( maybe 10 years since I heard in Golf Industry.) And I think that JDM came from this web sites in golfers community.

I feel we must specify JDM GOLF with category.

Parts Categoriy #1:Golf Clubs Head finished in japan for International Market.using Japanese material by Certified Craft man.( MIzuno MP series)
Parts Categoriy #2:Golf Clubs Head finished in japan for International Market.using Japanese material by mass production. ( Mizuno MX series)
Parts Categoriy #3:Golf Clubs Head finished in japan for Japanese Market only. using Japanese material by Certified Craft man.(Miura, Kururi, Takei,
Parts Category #4: Golf Clubs Head finishedJapan for Japanese Market only. using Japanese material by mass production. (Big company like Tourstage, Dunlop Japan)
Parts Category #5: Golf Clubs Head finished in Japan for Japanese Market only. using OEM parts( Taiwan, China by mass production. ( Taylormade Japan, Callaway Japan,)

So Mizuno MP series belong to #1 categories.

The most od big company do not have Iron head forging manufacture except Mizuno Golf. The most of forging manufacture are located IChikawa City, Kobe.
They are the vendor for all of Golf manufacture such as Dunlop, Bridgestone, and PGA Tour Items for custom from USA.
All of Tiger Woods irons were manufactured in Japan with Titleist, Nike brands Name.( Desiged by Them)

[xxio]

I thought there was a set that Hoffman forged that unfortunately had chrome issues because Titleist chose to have the irons chromed outside of the Hoffman chain. Story is it greatly contributed to Hoffman's demise because less orders after even if it wasn't their fault.

[Vegaman]

[quote name='dunn' timestamp='1418347076' post='10580935']
Mizuno is probably the biggest JDM Co not credited for being JDM.....Most of JDM clubs aren't even made in Japan anymore.....

Mizuno is japanese, made and sold in japan but not JDM, LOL.....whateves

I bet if they spent $2500 on a set of mp4 they would be calling em JDM

it's based on cost now.....if you didn't spend 2k on your irons than doesn't qualify....haha

Its a snob thing 4 sure...
[/quote]

JDM means Japan Domestic MARKET.
That means that if something is made and sold with that particular market (the japanese) in mind, it's JDM. Doesn't matter where it's made. Is it really so difficult to understand? Mizuno sells and markets it's stuff worldwide, so is not JDM. Although they DO have JDM clubs, the Craft series. Not available in the US.

[xxio]

So since Epon no longer distinguishes and has distributors/retailers everywhere Epon is not JDM? Maybe they should have different lines as well like Mizuno and Miura.

[xxio]

Sorry but I think machines are better, it is the level of quality of machine production that may be issues. Just as you pay more for the more experienced Japanese craftsmen, you should expect to pay more when Bettinardi uses a $600k machine versus the $350k machine that everyone else uses.

[golfnutjp]

[quote name='Nessism' timestamp='1418220119' post='10571723']
[quote name='golfnutjp' timestamp='1418204674' post='10571373']
MX-23 Iron head are Forging but it was 3piease assembly with welding plus Grind process. And production workers are not certified handcraft man.
[/quote]

I believe this is incorrect. MX-23 is a one piece forging. Forged in Japan.

Honestly, I'm okay with you guys that say mass produced Mizuno's aren't JDM. What is and what isn't JDM is obviously defined by the people using the term (including me), and my eye's are open now. It's not an exact science. I do find it ironic that [size=4]JDM aficionados seem perfectly okay with Endo forged in Thailand, but the mere suggestion of a Chinese head being worthy of being called JDM will draw snears. Where are all these JDM driver heads being made? China would be my guess but I'm not sure.[/size]

[size=4]Oh, and regarding forging, [/size]despite[size=4] the romance many [/size]associate[size=4] with the process it's actually quite [/size]rudimentary[size=4]. 1000 year old [/size]samurai sword[size=4] tradition [/size]notwithstanding[size=4]. [/size]
[/quote]


MX 23 was assembled with 3 piece of Neck, and Body and Sole to manage Cavity Back. That I head forom mizuno Engineer, So I am just informoing what I was explained.
All 3piece material were forged in separately and

As [url="http://www.golfwrx.com/forums/user/183106-forged4ever/"][color="#353535"]Forged4ever[/color][/url] said.

"""And FWIW, the 23 was a one-piece grain flow forged head design from 1035 mild carbon steel, and then the pocket was milled to create the low COG and a wider hitting area, as Nessism stated.

Have a nice day ""

His comment shows proof of 3piece assembly.. because Pocket milling cannot be done without welding.. Milling machine Blade cannot cut the pocket with out space for round blade.
They milled pocket first , then They weld sole potion.

[golfnutjp]

[quote name='HiSpeed48' timestamp='1418325323' post='10579333']
One thing I like about most JDM clubs is the fact that they usually don't care much about manufacturing costs, instead they focus on building the best product and charge what they want. Most USDM manufacturers are very focused on profit, and I think that's why we're beginning to see them drop the ball on some of their designs. Callaway is a good example, the finishes on their Apex line of irons was terrible. I bet they saved some money using that finish instead of a normal brushed chrome finish. This is just my opinion from my observations over the last few years, ymmv.
[/quote]

Hi..

Callaway Apex Iron belong to Categorie #A. They are not JDM.

Parts Categoriy #1:Golf Clubs Head finished in japan for International Market.using Japanese material by Certified Craft man.( MIzuno MP series)
Parts Categoriy #2:Golf Clubs Head finished in japan for International Market.using Japanese material by mass production. ( Mizuno MX series)
Parts Categoriy #3:Golf Clubs Head finished in japan for Japanese Market only. using Japanese material by Certified Craft man.(Miura, Kururi, Takei,
Parts Category #4: Golf Clubs Head finishedJapan for Japanese Market only. using Japanese material by mass production. (Big company like Tourstage, Dunlop Japan)
Parts Category #5: Golf Clubs Head finished in Japan for Japanese Market only. using OEM parts( Taiwan, China by mass production. ( Taylormade Japan, Callaway Japan,)

Parts Category #A: Golf Clubs Head finished in Taiwan Or China for International Market . using OEM parts( Taiwan, China by mass production. ( Taylormade, Callaway,Cobra, Excetra)

[golfnutjp]

[quote name='Nessism' timestamp='1418355731' post='10581583']
I worked for a Japanese company for 21 years and traveled there a number of times. In my experience internationally known name branded goods are VERY popular in Japan. Expensive goods are a status symbol as well. When Japanese visitors would come on a trip to the US a LOT of them wanted to hit places like Tiffany's and the like for a momento. They had no problem paying exorbitant prices for high status good. I can't imagine golf clubs are any different.
[/quote]

Hi.
Yes, I agree .
But these day, market situation is separated to Rich people and Poor peoples. The most of golfers in Japan are group of rich people .Poor people ( $1500/ Month salary) donot play golf.